2015 F1 Mechanics/Aero; Design predictions to win the WCC/WDC. READ FIRST POST

[TenEightyOne]

As we'd all expected Red Bull refuse to rule out Renault for next year. I think several of us mentioned a few posts ago that it was possible, at least contractually.

Renault seem a little cooler about the idea though.

 

[Tired Tyres]

Oh I don't know. They could charge Red Bull $100 million for each of the two teams for one more season.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

New Pirelli deal from 2017 to 2019.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Back to the design aspect of this thread:

Here's the current 2016 Model of the Ferrari V6-T, based on a New Engine block that will be used in the final races of the year.

"It is a 2016 treatment, which also requires a new gearbox. In this drawing we can see that on the 2015 engine the oil tank has been moved from the back of the engine to the front (red arrows). The new unit will also have the MGU-K removed from the back to the lower-left side of the block (blue arrows), like all the other manufacturers do.



The objective is to make a narrower rear end to the car for aerodynamic reasons. The suggestion is that Kimi Raikkonen, who is not in championship contention, will use the new unit at the next round in the United States and then Ferrari can test and develop it in the final four races of the season."

 

[catamount39]

And back to the rumors.

Someone get Cosworth on the phone, now.
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/newey-says-red-bull-being-forced-out-of-f1/

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

And back to the rumors.

Someone get Cosworth on the phone, now.
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/newey-says-red-bull-being-forced-out-of-f1/

Already posted on this thread

 

[catamount39]

Already posted on this thread

But this just came out today...

 

[GTPorsche]

Yeah, that's how awful motorsport.com is...

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

But this just came out today...

Maybe on the recycling plant of autosport news known as motorsport.com but check post #503 and you'll see this was reported already and posted here.

 

[catamount39]

Yeah, that's how awful motorsport.com is...

I keep getting them and Autosport mixed up...dang it.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

The FIA have weighed in on the Red Bull engine situation, announcing that customer engines must be of the same specification as works engines:

http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12...-units-to-be-same-specification-as-works-team

 

[[Nor]MclarenF1]

The FIA have weighed in on the Red Bull engine situation, announcing that customer engines must be of the same specification as works engines:

http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12...-units-to-be-same-specification-as-works-team

Definitely a step in the right direction. However, I'm sure we'll still see the factory teams imposing engine mode restrictions on their customers, like what we saw with Lotus at SPA, where they had to go and ask Mercedes nicely if they could use one of the more aggressive modes.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Definitely a step in the right direction.

It's actually always been that way. This is just the FIA nipping a proposed rule change - making year-old engines available for less - im the bud.

 

[Pezzarinho17]

Door may not be closed for good...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121328

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Door may not be closed for good...
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121328
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121328

Reading between the lines, I think they're trying to stop Ferrari from leveraging Red Bull into a year-old engine deal - they will want everyone on level terms before allowing any such regulation changes. Because the last thing they want to see is teams gaming the rule book for political purposes.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Definitely a step in the right direction. However, I'm sure we'll still see the factory teams imposing engine mode restrictions on their customers, like what we saw with Lotus at SPA, where they had to go and ask Mercedes nicely if they could use one of the more aggressive modes.

As I said during the Spa thread, supposedly as Toto claims there seems to be confusion, Mercedes weren't holding them back and no team has to ask to use more power. They just give performance parameters to run in to preserve the engine as long as possible so customer teams don't get penalized sooner in the season.

 

[IforceV8]

So if I read that right article 1.2 trumps article 23.5 unless 23.5 was written on Sept 29th and they forgot to post it.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Definitely a step in the right direction. However, I'm sure we'll still see the factory teams imposing engine mode restrictions on their customers, like what we saw with Lotus at SPA, where they had to go and ask Mercedes nicely if they could use one of the more aggressive modes.

True. What also isn't clear is if it would be legal, for example, for Ferrari to homologate their 2016 engine and then fail to provide the in-season upgrades to customer teams.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

True. What also isn't clear is if it would be legal, for example, for Ferrari to homologate their 2016 engine and then fail to provide the in-season upgrades to customer teams.

I'm pretty sure that under the current system, they have to provide them, but not necessarily straight away. Mercedes updated the 2015 engine with some parts for 2016, but chose to hold upgrade back from the customer teams because those parts were experimental and unproven, and they didn't want to compromise the customer teams with a potentially unreliable engine. The cynics among us will see it as an attempt to hamstring customer teams whilst staying within the letter of the law, but I think it's a valid point - the old-spec engine is a very good one, and while Mercedes themselves are dominating, some of their customers are in close fights with other teams for WCC position. The last thing anyone (least of all Mercedes) wants to happen is for a customer team to get an unproven upgrade, only to blow an engine, take a grid penalty, and lose position to their rivals in the standings.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I'm pretty sure that under the current system, they have to provide them, but not necessarily straight away. Mercedes updated the 2015 engine with some parts for 2016, but chose to hold upgrade back from the customer teams because those parts were experimental and unproven, and they didn't want to compromise the customer teams with a potentially unreliable engine. The cynics among us will see it as an attempt to hamstring customer teams whilst staying within the letter of the law, but I think it's a valid point - the old-spec engine is a very good one, and while Mercedes themselves are dominating, some of their customers are in close fights with other teams for WCC position. The last thing anyone (least of all Mercedes) wants to happen is for a customer team to get an unproven upgrade, only to blow an engine, take a grid penalty, and lose position to their rivals in the standings.

Basically the same reason why Kimi would get the new 2016 engine because if it goes boom due to being unproven, Vettel's slim chance at the championship wont be completely ruined due to an experimental engine failure.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Bernie hath spoken: if it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well. It were done quickly, and ideally behind closed doors.

http://m.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121340/ecclestone-red-bull-future-is-orted

 

[TenEightyOne]

An interesting link in that story that suggests that the team managers' unanimous support for "old-spec" engine supplies could see the new FIA "current-homologation-only" rule superseded.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Engine development permitted in 2016, no second-tier engines:

http://m.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121347/inseason-engine-development-for-2016

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Image of what we will come to know next year as far as exhaust pipes go.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121332

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Toto Wolff reckons Mercedes still have time to prepare a third car. He's pitching it as an eleventh-hour solution to the potential loss of Red Bull, Toro Rosso and/or Lotus, but he's supported a full grid in the past, so I wonder if he wants to run a third car regardless.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Toto Wolff reckons Mercedes still have time to prepare a third car. He's pitching it as an eleventh-hour solution to the potential loss of Red Bull, Toro Rosso and/or Lotus, but he's supported a full grid in the past, so I wonder if he wants to run a third car regardless.

Mercedes seem to be tightening the screws on Red Bull. That's not to say that they won't go through with everything they say... but so far their response to every RB move seems to have been "aaaand screw you". Manor getting Merc lumps, Mercedes happy-and-ready to build third car, Mercedes "allowing" RB engine deal to fall through...

 

[catamount39]

F1 should allow teams to run a 3rd car if they want too. Just have the rules like the WEC and only 2 of the cars can be declared for the championship, or maybe just give points to the 2 highest of the 3. Maybe even allow 1 car teams.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Mercedes seem to be tightening the screws on Red Bull. That's not to say that they won't go through with everything they say... but so far their response to every RB move seems to have been "aaaand screw you". Manor getting Merc lumps, Mercedes happy-and-ready to build third car, Mercedes "allowing" RB engine deal to fall through...

Nah Niki has been saying how much of a tragedy it'd be and that F1 needs RB to stay. So not all of Mercedes is putting the screws down.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Nah Niki has been saying how much of a tragedy it'd be and that F1 needs RB to stay. So not all of Mercedes is putting the screws down.

Good-cop-bad-cop, maybe? And isn't Niki friends with his countryman Mateschitz?

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]