2024 NASCAR Discussion ThreadNASCAR
- Thread starter Dylan
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- GTP_Eggstor
If memory serves, when NASCAR went to a 4-team limit and Roush had a 5th grandfathered team, they had to shutter the 5th Cup team when Jamie McMurray went to Chip Ganassi even though they had other drivers in the pipeline. Considering Hendrick is less likely to have a driver leave first, the France family will repeat that precedent.
And my memory was a bit hazy. Roush did have an exemption, but it was only for 1 year, and they chose to shutter the 26 driven by Jamie McMurray to get down to 4 for the 2010 season.
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- ScottPuss20
- CheetahsMeow
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There is a difference though. That limit was put in and the only exception was I think a rookie car for a few sparse entries. This time there's no requirement to downsize teams, merely an effort to spread out the charters. In theory, everyone could bring 4 cars each event, but a lot of them would be fighting for 4 spots. It's gonna come down to what the accountants say more likely than not.
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- GTP_Eggstor
The first SHR charter has (all-but-)officially gone to Front Row, which will be a 3-charter Cup team next season. The only thing missing from the announcement is that the charter is currently SHR's, but considering those are the only 4 charters known to be up for grabs, and the further rumor is FRM is moving into one of Haas's race shops, one can put one and one together.
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- Addison,Texas
- GTP_RACECAR
Something I've been pondering about with friends and want to extend to here: Would Xfinity be better going back to effectively being Cup Lite? (AKA, sharing the exact same body and chassis as was done with the Gen 4 car). I say this because look back, I can't but wonder if having Xfinity's own unique cars was really warranted or needed. I know folks complained about Cup teams and/or drivers taking up wins from series regulars, but its also worth pointing out that the draw of the Cup drivers often appeared to factor in higher ratings for a Spring at Xfinity event with at least 4 Cup drivers then the Fall race without Cup drivers (and maybe a former driver getting behind the wheel for their annual one-off).
There's also the fact that the Xfinity cars haven't changed in over a decade underneath while Cup, Truck and even ARCA has in that same time frame (ignore the fact that ARCA still has Composite bodies that are still Gen 6 clones). Just feels like what was the point if all that's happened in that decade to these cars is "Oh, a new Mustang Front Clip." or "Oh, a new Camaro Front Clip" or "A..Supra? Sure ok" while having zero changes underneath. I know there was the rumoured crossover stuff but I'm not sure it'll come anywhere near being embraced and then there's the idea I feel like of expense having to run all these machines. Trucks are well Trucks so I get it but what was wrong with having the same car across ARCA, Busch and Cup? (The good ole ABC route). You had basically the same chassis and body, which was both cheaper AND leant itself to a far more easier learning curve with only the Horsepower and Tires being different (Same thing between the East and West Series, hence why the showdown was such a great idea). I feel like if we want to address the spending, why not simplify things and just return to this formula? You don't have Cup drivers running nearly the whole schedule like you used to (Thanks Harvick, it both is and isn't your fault) so that won't be as nearly a problem (even though technically, you could just assign Each Cup driver 15 races and you'd still have this issue just spread out sooo) and if there is some way to bring down the cost of these parts for the current car, you could make the prospect of an Xfinity series team (or even an ARCA team) moving up to Cup WAY easier since they already have the machinery and its just a matter of swapping the tires out, some parts and upping the power. If this car is supposed to be versatile, why not really lean on that and use that to drive the expenses down between series? Just a random thought.
There's also the fact that the Xfinity cars haven't changed in over a decade underneath while Cup, Truck and even ARCA has in that same time frame (ignore the fact that ARCA still has Composite bodies that are still Gen 6 clones). Just feels like what was the point if all that's happened in that decade to these cars is "Oh, a new Mustang Front Clip." or "Oh, a new Camaro Front Clip" or "A..Supra? Sure ok" while having zero changes underneath. I know there was the rumoured crossover stuff but I'm not sure it'll come anywhere near being embraced and then there's the idea I feel like of expense having to run all these machines. Trucks are well Trucks so I get it but what was wrong with having the same car across ARCA, Busch and Cup? (The good ole ABC route). You had basically the same chassis and body, which was both cheaper AND leant itself to a far more easier learning curve with only the Horsepower and Tires being different (Same thing between the East and West Series, hence why the showdown was such a great idea). I feel like if we want to address the spending, why not simplify things and just return to this formula? You don't have Cup drivers running nearly the whole schedule like you used to (Thanks Harvick, it both is and isn't your fault) so that won't be as nearly a problem (even though technically, you could just assign Each Cup driver 15 races and you'd still have this issue just spread out sooo) and if there is some way to bring down the cost of these parts for the current car, you could make the prospect of an Xfinity series team (or even an ARCA team) moving up to Cup WAY easier since they already have the machinery and its just a matter of swapping the tires out, some parts and upping the power. If this car is supposed to be versatile, why not really lean on that and use that to drive the expenses down between series? Just a random thought.
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- NotThePrez
- NotThePrez
Imo it's frankly ridiculous that it took so long for the waiver to even be confirmed by NASCAR.
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- Blitzbay
- Blitzbay
I am waiting for an instance where they DON'T grant a waiver.
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- NotThePrez
- NotThePrez
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- Blitzbay
- Blitzbay
They granted a waiver to Chase Elliott after he had a snowboarding accident. The waiver system is broken so the fact they HADN'T granted one yet was the surprise.
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- NotThePrez
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Additional Context from Elton Sawyer:
Yeahhh, if it takes them more than a week to come to the above conclusion, then I think the waiver system needs to be either heavily revised or scrapped.
Yeahhh, if it takes them more than a week to come to the above conclusion, then I think the waiver system needs to be either heavily revised or scrapped.
I legit forgot about the Coke 600 incident. That further raises the question of what it would take for NASCAR to say no.
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- Wisconsin
- GTP_Eggstor
For the first time (at least if memory serves), a Front Row Motorsports Cup driver, specifically Todd Gilliland, has a multi-year contract...with the contract being extended mid-season no less.
As for the "full-season" waiver, guess they're considering tightening up on that now that they got rid of the top-30 in drivers' points requirement, which, again if memory serves, they never gave a waiver for. That said, given they have been actively promoting the idea of the Indy/Coca-Cola double, it would have been monumentally stupid to not grant this one.
New 6/6 - The selling price for the charter Front Row got from Stewart Haas was a mere $20-$25 million. The drop has been attributed to upwards of 6 charters on the market (apparently there's at least one other team looking to unload, and if the number of charters changing hands is 6, that would be a record) and the uncertain future of the charter system.
As for the "full-season" waiver, guess they're considering tightening up on that now that they got rid of the top-30 in drivers' points requirement, which, again if memory serves, they never gave a waiver for. That said, given they have been actively promoting the idea of the Indy/Coca-Cola double, it would have been monumentally stupid to not grant this one.
New 6/6 - The selling price for the charter Front Row got from Stewart Haas was a mere $20-$25 million. The drop has been attributed to upwards of 6 charters on the market (apparently there's at least one other team looking to unload, and if the number of charters changing hands is 6, that would be a record) and the uncertain future of the charter system.
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- GTP_Eggstor
You got me. There is the rumor that Kroger (the primary sponsor at the #47) is moving to Gibbs, which has a marketing relationship with Tad Geschickter's brand activation company. Also, the Geschickters have been absent co-owners of the organization they founded to the point neither were mentioned in the press release announcing Ricky Stenhouse's contract extension, with formerly-silent co-owner Gordon Smith labeled as the "owner" (no "co-") and Brad Daughtery also quoted as a "co-owner".
Of course, the fact that Stenhouse did sign that multi-year extension well after the Kroger rumor hit, and that the other 2/3rds of that ownership group are still involved enough to be quoted in that press release (unlike both Gene Haas and Tony Stewart being absent until they announced the end of Stewart-Haas), mitigates against a shutdown.
Another few possibilities (mostly) based on the likelihood of a 3-charter limit:
- Kaulig and RCR (one of the rumored teams vying for the 4th SHR charter) merge, freeing up a charter and solving the #16 part-time driver issue
- Any grandfathering against a 3-charter limit lasts only until the driver lineup changes (which would almost certainly affect Gibbs first)
- There is no grandfathering against a 3-charter limit, and free charter #6 is a Hendrick charter (does Alex Bowman or William Byron become a free agent in that case?)
- The Wood Brothers go back to being a part-time team; their charter was essentially purchased with Menard's money through Penske (with the sponsorship rolling to the #12), and Harrison Burton is on the hot seat
Speaking of charters, Sports Business Journal is saying the latest offer from NASCAR is a 7-year (matching the previous offers and the new visual rights window) plus 7-year option, with the France family and private equity firms officially allowed to get in on the charters, and a cost cap.
New 6/8 - And, right on cue, there are the reasons JR Motorsports still isn't overly interested - money, family, and wanting control despite not putting up a ton of money.
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Fox has been exceptionally terrible this year.
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- DolphDrago
I swear there were monkeys in the truck randomly pushing buttons for different cameras. The number of times the announcers would scream about something major happening on the track, and I would yell, "Show it!!!", while waiting for the slowpoke race director to finally change to the correct camera was ridiculous. Case in point when they got excited about Truex running out of gas. That seems kind of important, no? So what happens? They cut to an in-car shot of Larson who's already crossed the line for the win. It was an eternity before we actually got sight of poor ol' Truex plodding along the main straight, practically stopped by this point.
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Entropy is the natural state of the universe. Guess FOX figures that, with only 12 points races, and having practice/qualifying for only 1 of those plus the 2 non-points races, they don't need to put in the effort anymore.
Speaking of entropy, MBM/Power Source has withdrawn from Iowa due to lack of sponsorship. They were supposed to run David Starr.
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A further update on JR Motorsports and charters - Unless an existing charter owner takes some Dale Earnhardt money (personal, not necessarily JR Motorsports) as a financial partner on a single charter, it's not happening. Earnhardt feels he missed the boat on this year's cycle, even though one of Stewart Haas's charters is very much still on the market, two other Stewart Haas charters are still not officially claimed, and there are potentially other charters on the market.
If there is an agreement between the France family and the team owners, and a 3-team limit is part of that, we'll see if Hendrick Motorsports is still the official team of HenCAR by whether Joe Gibbs Racing also gets grandfathered even though the driver lineup is(reportedly) changing for next season.
If there is an agreement between the France family and the team owners, and a 3-team limit is part of that, we'll see if Hendrick Motorsports is still the official team of HenCAR by whether Joe Gibbs Racing also gets grandfathered even though the driver lineup is
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- 4,032
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Don't look now, but the #51, which should have had its charter repossessed after the end of last year, is actually in the top 30 in owners' points and 49 points (give or take staqe points, better than a race) ahead of the #21 for 34th. In fact, it's ahead of both the Kaulig entries (by the tiebreaker ahead of the #31, and also ahead of the #3.
Of course, the #15 is 35th in points.
Of course, the #15 is 35th in points.
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