A Giant step toward the center

[MrktMkr1986]

It's a step in the right direction... but we're not quite there yet.

 

[Swift]

It's a step in the right direction... but we're not quite there yet.

Meaning what exactly?

 

[Swift]

It's a step in the right direction... but we're not quite there yet.

It's been a week brian. Any chance you will elaborate on this?

 

[YSSMAN]

Well its been more than a week now and the Democrats are already eating their young (see Majority Leader in the House). Sure, they've made up, but with the 110th Congress not yet in session, if small problems are going to become big ones, what exactly is going to happen when something major goes down?

 

[ledhed]

hey they won by running conservatives..NOT Murtha's....the Consevatives want to be sure the party is not hijacked by Pelosi and her radical buddies..thet want to KEEP power. The Dems have been put on notice by the party members that the same old crap isn't going to be acceptable.

 

[MrktMkr1986]

It's been a week brian. Any chance you will elaborate on this?

Yup! With the current setup I think we're looking at the potential for gridlock between Congress and the president. With a democratic president in '08 (likely given the results of the mid-term elections) things should be OK. Just a personal preference... I'm not an expert on politics anymore. I've spent too much time reading charts.

 

[YSSMAN]

Yup! With the current setup I think we're looking at the potential for gridlock between Congress and the president. With a democratic president in '08 (likely given the results of the mid-term elections) things should be OK. Just a personal preference... I'm not an expert on politics anymore. I've spent too much time reading charts.

Well I doubt if gridlock is going to happen on every issue, but I can see a future with Congress and The White House in competition. These are of course a problematic way of running the country, but even with the GOP controlling Congress and The White House, not much got done.

...On the possibility of the White House going Democrat in 2008, it is still too far off to tell. It will largely depend on who ends up running on each ticket, as the key will be moderate candidates for the GOP, and for the Dems, I don't know.

McCain stands a good chance of winning assuming he does run (probably), and the same goes for Guliani, should he run. I'd hope for a McCain/Guliani ticket for the GOP in 2008, or maybe a McCain/Liberman ticket.

Clinton could make or break the Democrats in 2008. There are more than enough mainstream people who don't like her, and that would be a big problem. Someone like Obama could give a strong showing, but I'm not sure if America is ready for an African American as President. Best-case-scenario for the Democrats would probably be someone who has sat behind the curtain in the party, maybe a Al Gore (kinda a stretch) or even John Edwards.

 

[Swift]

Yup! With the current setup I think we're looking at the potential for gridlock between Congress and the president. With a democratic president in '08 (likely given the results of the mid-term elections) things should be OK. Just a personal preference... I'm not an expert on politics anymore. I've spent too much time reading charts.

You have got to be kidding!

The democrats are going to do nothing but increase the size of two things, government and taxes. I'm When is one party government ever good? I'm including the last 6 years in that. a nice 55/45 split is perfect because nobody can do what they want just because they want to. See Maryland for a one party legislaturee ran amuck.

Anyway, I'm very afraid of what will happen to my country of that Hilary Clinton is president with a democratic congress.

 

[ledhed]

There is only one way Billary wins an election...if The Republicans nominate Hitler or Stalin ...or maybe even Yosemite Sam. Even then its a close race.

Obama ? Your joking right ? They Could run one of my cats against him and he wouldn't win.

The Democrats Need to Pick a Moderate to Conservative ..Bob Casey type candidate if they are to stand a remote chance in hell of winning .

Thats how they won seats in the senate and the house ..they ran candidates with the same values ...Consevative..as the republicans and stole the reason to vote AGAINST them ...like they have been doing ...right from under the republicans noses...look at the list of candidates who won...some are more conservative than REPUBLICANS ! If not Just as conservative.
two thirds or more of the winners are moderate to conservative candidates.
the others are from liberal districts that always elect liberals.

Why do you think Pelosi has already gotten spanked ? The Consevative wing of the democratic party KNOWS it is they that have won the election.
Now they want to be recognised and more importantly they want the VOTERS to see a new democratic party thats not full of left wing nuts.

Billary is a guaranteed loss and Obama is about ten years too early to be a candidate.

warner would have made an excellent choice ...but he wanted a life...

 

[Kylehnat]

There is only one way Billary wins an election...if The Republicans nominate Hitler or Stalin ...or maybe even Yosemite Sam. Even then its a close race.

I don't often agree with you, but you have a certain way of cutting through the crap 👍.

 

[MrktMkr1986]

Well I doubt if gridlock is going to happen on every issue, but I can see a future with Congress and The White House in competition. These are of course a problematic way of running the country, but even with the GOP controlling Congress and The White House, not much got done.

Agreed.

...On the possibility of the White House going Democrat in 2008, it is still too far off to tell. It will largely depend on who ends up running on each ticket, as the key will be moderate candidates for the GOP, and for the Dems, I don't know.

Moderation is good.

McCain stands a good chance of winning assuming he does run (probably), and the same goes for Guliani, should he run. I'd hope for a McCain/Guliani ticket for the GOP in 2008, or maybe a McCain/Liberman ticket.

Interesting. Just as long as they do something about the yen, I'm happy.

Clinton could make or break the Democrats in 2008. There are more than enough mainstream people who don't like her, and that would be a big problem. Someone like Obama could give a strong showing, but I'm not sure if America is ready for an African American as President.

Funny you should mention that! That's sad...

Best-case-scenario for the Democrats would probably be someone who has sat behind the curtain in the party, maybe a Al Gore (kinda a stretch) or even John Edwards.

Perhaps... thanks for the reply.

The democrats are going to do nothing but increase the size of two things, government and taxes.

Why is that so bad? I can see why you would be concerned about the taxes, though. My [extremely limited] income is derived from trading at the moment, so my biggest problem is not the money I pay in taxes... it's trying to decide whether or not I should elect out of 988 in favor of 1256.

I'm When is one party government ever good? I'm including the last 6 years in that. a nice 55/45 split is perfect because nobody can do what they want just because they want to. See Maryland for a one party legislaturee ran amuck.

I'll check it out.

Anyway, I'm very afraid of what will happen to my country of that Hilary Clinton is president with a democratic congress.

I think it'll be interesting.

Obama ? Your joking right ? They Could run one of my cats against him and he wouldn't win.

What is that suppose to mean exactly?

 

[Danoff]

I think America is not only ready for an African American presidet, I'd bet they'd vote one in in a landslide if he was a decent candidate. The same for a female candidate.

My bet is that the next black and/or female candidate who wins their party's nomination will win the presidency.

 

[Swift]

Why is that so bad? I can see why you would be concerned about the taxes, though. My [extremely limited] income is derived from trading at the moment, so my biggest problem is not the money I pay in taxes... it's trying to decide whether or not I should elect out of 988 in favor of 1256.

The federal government should not take my money to give it to drug addicts, criminals and other such people. Also, I shouldn't have to pay for other people's food, lodging or education. My father was out of work for about 3 years at one point. We were not able to get any help because we made too much money and lived in a pretty nice neighborhood. It was ludicrous. That's why I hate the current system, the less you put in, the more you can take out. It's unfair, insane, and downright stupid.

I'll check it out.

You do that.

I think it'll be interesting.

No, it will be bad.

 

[Sage]

This is totally off-topic, but I think worth pointing out: one thing that I love about GTP is that people don’t take certain sides just because of previous “alliances”. For example, in this this, we’ve got danoff partially agreeing with Brian (*gasp!*), and Swift partially disagreeing with Brian (*gasp!*) and in effect partially agreeing with danoff. I guess I’m getting jaded from all of the alliances I see forming at other forums I visit, so I really appreciate the maturity shown here. 👍

Anyway, carry on, just ignore me.

 

[Swift]

Anyway, carry on, just ignore me.

We always do. But I've disagreed with Brian in the past.

Anyway, Brian, since you're not currently having your paycheck raped bye the government, more taxes doesn't sound to bad. But when you start working hard for your money and getting things like overtime and bonus, the really ram it up hard. I'm sorry, there's simply no other way to say it. It's insane that I have my bonuses taxed at about 40%, that's just nutz. It's almost not worth working for. Bleh, democrats want to take more of my money and give it to more people NOT earning and that haven't earned. If you can find something about this system that's even remotely fair, please let me know.

 

[Kylehnat]

If you can find something about this system that's even remotely fair, please let me know.

I think it's quite fair. I mean, when a public official uses tax money to buy a new Hummer H2, I know the system is working 👍.

 

[FoolKiller]

Why is that so bad? I can see why you would be concerned about the taxes, though. My [extremely limited] income is derived from trading at the moment, so my biggest problem is not the money I pay in taxes... it's trying to decide whether or not I should elect out of 988 in favor of 1256.

Why is big government bad? It is bad because a business should be able to perform or allow any legal activity its owner chooses. When government steps in to decide how my private property can be used by me it is not good. When government can just take my private property it is not good.

And I'll stop before I step on a soap box and type a couple of pages of rants.

Funny you should mention that! That's sad...

I think America is not only ready for an African American presidet, I'd bet they'd vote one in in a landslide if he was a decent candidate. The same for a female candidate.

My bet is that the next black and/or female candidate who wins their party's nomination will win the presidency.

Yes, it is sad that an African American might not be elected because of his skin color. That doesn't change the fact.

I know from New York and California it seems like a minority or female president could easily happen, but there are many voters between the coasts who just think it shouldn't happen. I mean, midwest states can't even have an African American basketball coach without tons of racist crap being spewed out. If these people refuse to accept the leader of their favorite team to be a minority then what makes you think they would vote one in for the leader of the country?

I am not saying it is good or right, but I see what goes on, I hear the things my dad says, and I have witnessed multiple KKK rallies. I have even seen a cross burning. Mt. Washington, KY had an African American man come out to read the electric meters and the electric company received multiple phone calls saying that if he came back he wouldn't leave alive. They also elected a KKK leader as their constable. This was only ten years ago and these people still vote.

Racism is far from dead in this country, it has just become quiet. If an African American ran for office only the most hateful would make a racist comment but many others would speak their minds in the voting booth.

As for Obama being able to win: He talks a good talk but I think he has yet to show what he can do. I also don't agree with a lot of his politics. I think that given one more generation then a minority or female can easily win the presidency.

Right now the only way I see it happening is if both candidates are a minority and the racists don't have an old white man option.

 

[Swift]

I think it's quite fair. I mean, when a public official uses tax money to buy a new Hummer H2, I know the system is working 👍.

WOOT!

Why is big government bad? It is bad because a business should be able to perform or allow any legal activity its owner chooses. When government steps in to decide how my private property can be used by me it is not good. When government can just take my private property it is not good.

And I'll stop before I step on a soap box and type a couple of pages of rants.

Ahh...I wanted to hear the rant!

Racism is far from dead in this country, it has just become quiet. If an African American ran for office only the most hateful would make a racist comment but many others would speak their minds in the voting booth.

Truth be told, black people are more racist then white.

 

[Danoff]

Yes, it is sad that an African American might not be elected because of his skin color. That doesn't change the fact.

I know from New York and California it seems like a minority or female president could easily happen, but there are many voters between the coasts who just think it shouldn't happen. I mean, midwest states can't even have an African American basketball coach without tons of racist crap being spewed out. If these people refuse to accept the leader of their favorite team to be a minority then what makes you think they would vote one in for the leader of the country?

I am not saying it is good or right, but I see what goes on, I hear the things my dad says, and I have witnessed multiple KKK rallies. I have even seen a cross burning. Mt. Washington, KY had an African American man come out to read the electric meters and the electric company received multiple phone calls saying that if he came back he wouldn't leave alive. They also elected a KKK leader as their constable. This was only ten years ago and these people still vote.

Racism is far from dead in this country, it has just become quiet. If an African American ran for office only the most hateful would make a racist comment but many others would speak their minds in the voting booth.

As for Obama being able to win: He talks a good talk but I think he has yet to show what he can do. I also don't agree with a lot of his politics. I think that given one more generation then a minority or female can easily win the presidency.

Right now the only way I see it happening is if both candidates are a minority and the racists don't have an old white man option.

New York and California carry a lot of electoral weight. So does Florida and several other northeastern states. Yea, a black candidate might not take Idaho. And, as much as it pains me to say, they might not take Texas. But I think independents and moderates will flock to a female or black candidate for the sheer novelty getting that "first".

Truth be told, black people are more racist then white.

Totally true, from everything I can see.

 

[Swift]

Dan, that long quote is from FK, not me.

 

[FoolKiller]

New York and California carry a lot of electoral weight. So does Florida and several other northeastern states. Yea, a black candidate might not take Idaho. And, as much as it pains me to say, they might not take Texas. But I think independents and moderates will flock to a female or black candidate for the sheer novelty getting that "first".

You bring up a good point, which makes me fear that it might not be the best candidate when it happens. Of course, it could be assumed that racists who would otherwise not vote would turn out to prevent such an event.

Ahh...I wanted to hear the rant!

Just copy and paste all my comments in the taxes, smoking bans, minimum wage, healthcare, and eminent domain threads into one document and you'll get the idea.

Truth be told, black people are more racist then white.

But would they be more willing to vote for a "house boy" like Powell and Rice have been accused of being or a white man?

 

[YSSMAN]

White folks would jump at the chance to vote for someone like Condi Rice or Colin Powell, but I would agree that regular black folks probably wouldn't go for it as they are "too white" to be black. But to get a true leader from the black community, you would probably be seeing too much controversy from the more moderate people, be them of minority decent or not. Look at how many times Jessie Jackson has been pushed towards the Presidency, or Al Sharpton's attempt back in 2004.

It would take an Obama or Ford to do anything, but as I see it right now, the power rests in the hands of the white male majority for some time, maybe a white female getting a chance here and there, but I just don't see the top-spot going to minority yet. I think that until our generation truly has the grasp on the government, we won't see many minorities in power.

 

[Omnis]

Truth be told, black people are more racist then white.

Word. I think Obama is a good guy, but I'd wager that lots of black folks would just randomly vote for the black guy. 👎 The biggest problem revolving around a black president would be the media's incessant prolixity regarding race and "how it feels to be the first black president!" Wtf. No, please.

Anyway, I would vote for a McCain/Giuliani ticket if they decided to run. Of course, I would still have to sum up the competition and do my research. 👍