Exacly, GT5P (not as perfect at the CCX model) Still looks damn good, and way ahead any completion. Graphics should stay as it is. Only things to come are the other aspects we should worry about. For GT6, that is the time they should really LASER scan cars and have a gazillion polygons and best reflections and light. As well they should start doing LASER SCANNED TRACKS! Would save them TON of time and be more realistic about it.
A glimpse what GT5 could become?
- Thread starter LANDO
- 121 comments
- 24,157 views
Exacly, GT5P (not as perfect at the CCX model) Still looks damn good, and way ahead any completion. Graphics should stay as it is. Only things to come are the other aspects we should worry about. For GT6, that is the time they should really LASER scan cars and have a gazillion polygons and best reflections and light. As well they should start doing LASER SCANNED TRACKS! Would save them TON of time and be more realistic about it.
Cant see why you are using Simbin I absolutely pitty them, dont see why people buy all their games seeing everything but GTR on the 360 is the same dam thing the only thing they change is a few cars, and here we go again charge us the full price even though the game is using a severly outdated and ugly looking engine .
Zer0
(Banned)
- 1,624
Fixed for better understanding.^^^They better start listening to us Forza fans on other aspects of the game because graphics can only take them so far. They may still be ahead in terms of graphics quality for this console generation but when the next gen systems launch, things will be different. Every other consoles will be capable of rendering this level of graphics or better and PD will be screwed. They're falling behind in the gameplay and sound department, in my opinion.
I wish PD wouldn't be so arrogant and take some pointers from other racing games out there. They should also listen to what the fans want like Turn 10 does. Turn 10 has a great thing going for them with the Forza franchise and I have a feeling Forza 3 may be lapping GT5 around Suzuka, if you know what I mean.
- 38,984
- Application hell
- MP-Omnis
Fixing the wire frame (density) errors that are highlighted on the News feed would go a long way towards making the cars more realistic. Surely those changes can't take up too many resources, can they?
Frankly, I think GT would do itself a favor by getting rid of the obviously unrealistic human figures and fake-looking tools that they put in GT4 and GT5P. Because they don't look nearly as good as the cars, it kind of cheapens the environment and doesn't give a feeling of realism at all. It holds the cars back, in my opinion.
Frankly, I think GT would do itself a favor by getting rid of the obviously unrealistic human figures and fake-looking tools that they put in GT4 and GT5P. Because they don't look nearly as good as the cars, it kind of cheapens the environment and doesn't give a feeling of realism at all. It holds the cars back, in my opinion.
Quiet_Storm
(Banned)
- 495
- xQuietStormx
- xDANOMITEx
Wait, I'm a little confused. Are these your opinions? I don't know if you mentioned it or not in your posts but if these are your opinions then I'll respect that. Now you should learn to respect people who have opinions different than yours instead of getting all defensive about it and telling them to look to other games. Sounds very fanboyish, IN MY OPINION.
I am a fan of GT- a fanboy I am. What the **** do think I am?
Quiet_Storm
(Banned)
- 495
- xQuietStormx
- xDANOMITEx
- 967
- Delaware
- Watevaman78564
- Watevaman78564
Oh they do?
PD should really explain about it.
I think that they did confirm they laser scan cars, but never about tracks.
I was watching a video of daytona from iRacing and GT5P and they look pretty darn close, iRacing has laser scanned tracks.
PD please confirm if you laser scan tracks or not.
monoha
Premium
- 763
- Aarhus, Denmark
- monoha
I wonder if anyone know how they do it. Not that it matters, but I find it interesting. Other ways I can think of is photogrammetry and GPS-mapping. But my guess would also be laser scans -offhand that seems the optimal way of mapping it. But could also find some pros with the other two methods.
EDIT:
dan_gtp writes a bit about it here: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=2913017&postcount=60
But I don't know where he gets his information from.
EDIT:
dan_gtp writes a bit about it here: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=2913017&postcount=60
But I don't know where he gets his information from.
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- 10,270
- Bonn
- GTAce
Thats what they did with all the landscape tracks in GT3, 4 and 5P (Tokyo, London etc.) and also with tracks like the Nordschleife and Tsukuba.
But im also pretty sure they laser scanned the Nürburgring...
Has no one the bonus DVD from GT4 Prologue?
They showed some of the track stuff in the making of video iirc.
I really hope GT5 game will have SOME laser scans at least.
That guy really makes good points. So far everyone knows GT5P cars are laser scanned, (then some hand touches) and Tracks are GPS and Picture taking. But there might be few tracks that are or will be laser scanned. Would it be way cheaper and faster to laser scan then take 1000000 photos? After Laser scanning they only would need less pics so that they make Skins and all the colors look real.
That guy really makes good points. So far everyone knows GT5P cars are laser scanned, (then some hand touches) and Tracks are GPS and Picture taking. But there might be few tracks that are or will be laser scanned. Would it be way cheaper and faster to laser scan then take 1000000 photos? After Laser scanning they only would need less pics so that they make Skins and all the colors look real.
- 1,067
- No46_TheDoctor or SSRacingUK
I'm sorry Mr Yury Rybakov, but what exactly is your problem? I have seen many, many better renders done than the one your company did, and it's pointless to compare it to a game. Why are GTPlane giving this so much attention? Have they never seen a photorealistic render done before? Did Mr Yury Rybakov say how long that video took to render? and on what size of render farm it was done on? Honestly, is this all they could find to put on the main page of this site? Pathetic.
- 1,252
- Gottcha
Wow, do you have any better GT5 related news to speak of at the moment? If you do, please enlighten us.
The reason this got so much attention was that on Proper Graphics' website, it mentioned that the render was created within GT5 specs or something of that sort. Someone found it, posted it here, and then I personally, emailed the company to see if they worked with PD at all (doubtful in my mind, but it can't hurt to try and get as much information as possible), because I was curious, due to the style of the video of the render as well. It was very GT like, and then the same guy that I emailed, actually signed up here and talked to us about their story.
He might not have given us every bit of information, but if you interested, ask him yourself
Good day.
monoha
Premium
- 763
- Aarhus, Denmark
- monoha
Thanks 👍
👍
I'm not sure which is cheaper and faster - but I have some ideas - I would guess with Laser Scanning the 'hard(or time consuming)' part would be the texturing of the model the scanning makes - and with photogrammetry they have the texture but need to create the model from the images.
To match the precision photogrammetry can output, the laser scan job on the track would take quite some time - but then I don't really know how much time it would take with photogrammetry - and maybe that precision isn't needed. I been studying a bit of both methods but not so much that I call myself and expert
.. yet!Anyway, I'm sure that PD have analysed it and using the optimal method - But I find it interesting as I just started to study Geomatic Engineering
and I'm very interested if anyone have any information about it all and some similar interest 👍
- 7,830
- U S A
- Tetsumura
- Nigel Fox
I haven't read the entire thread, so forgive me if this has been stated. But the reason that Polyphony skimps ever so slightly on the cars on track is to enable the PS3 to handle up to 16 cars at a time, on line, at up to 60 frames per second. The more detail you put into each vehicle, and the more effects you apply, the more work you have to force through the game engine and the Cell BE. Just one element, reflections, can eat up all kinds of processing horsepower. If you have four cars taking a turn in a scene, all with shiny reflective surfaces, the amount of image processing necessary to calculate all those reflections becomes astronomically involved, and the physics calculations would suffer. Not to leave out the fact that the framerate would bog badly, as happens in some racing games still, like Forza 2. Although Forza skimps on certain aspects like environment reflections, which at certain points crawls along like it constantly did in FM1. This is why cars don't reflect off of each other, at least in Prologue. In fact, I've noticed that the Prologue engine skimps in another way, like the GT3 and 4 engine does. Let's see if anyone recognizes what this is.
Frankly, the compromises Kaz and the lads are doing are fine with me. Since GT4, Gran Turismo has been the most immersive racing game I've ever had the pleasure to experience, thanks mostly to the well thought out camera angle choices offered to us. No PC sim has ever come close, and neither does Forza. At some point, I intend to pick up Ferrari Challenge and give it a spin, but my plate is so full already that I've been neglecting Prologue for months. Hopefully the spring will ease up on my free time and I can enjoy some solid racing once again. And when I get a decent install of Windoze on a solid new PC, I might even nab one of the better racing sims and give them a spin. But after the awful experience of GTR, I'm not anxious to jump in to that.
Frankly, the compromises Kaz and the lads are doing are fine with me. Since GT4, Gran Turismo has been the most immersive racing game I've ever had the pleasure to experience, thanks mostly to the well thought out camera angle choices offered to us. No PC sim has ever come close, and neither does Forza. At some point, I intend to pick up Ferrari Challenge and give it a spin, but my plate is so full already that I've been neglecting Prologue for months. Hopefully the spring will ease up on my free time and I can enjoy some solid racing once again. And when I get a decent install of Windoze on a solid new PC, I might even nab one of the better racing sims and give them a spin. But after the awful experience of GTR, I'm not anxious to jump in to that.
- 1,409
- mileret
PD is very smartly faking the reflections, they are precalculated low res bitmap tubes of track and sky, the reflections are already only 30fps and ofthen even less. That and the lack of surroundings detail is the satisfaction for sixteen cars on the track, 200.000 polygons per car and 4000 polygons only in every headlight lamps. But the graphics subsystem is separated from physics engine computed by cell and I think there are huge reserves in cell yet, pro physics are calculated only for player's car and that's the reason for AI being so dull and scripted.
- 1,252
- Gottcha
Even on GT4 the reflections update every 60fps and had geometry on them:
On GT5P easily spotable on london track and the exterior view replay, nothing like a "textured tube".
That's more impressive than I've noticed. Everyone knows the graphics in GT rock, but I guess I never took time to look at the reflections that close...and I think those reflections in that GT4 video are actually quite good, let alone Prologue.
- 973
- Gadbury / GTP_Gadbury
I'm not sure that damage would have to be added to the models, or even modelled. I heard PD modelled panels of the car seperately (to perhaps allow for realsitic deformations).
I think if damage will appear, it will work dynamically (like Burnout Paradise does it) rather than being pre-modelled and applied for each car.
I think if damage will appear, it will work dynamically (like Burnout Paradise does it) rather than being pre-modelled and applied for each car.
Yeah they did mention they had to go back a step, redesign current cars they had and work in separate car pieces. They mention because for the damage factor as well customization. I really hope it would be as something as GTA4 or Burnout, not pre-made bumpers that have damage. As well GT5 should have more internal damage and able to KILL a car.
You can see the front bumper is seperate panel over the entire body.
Another good example for body kits is in GT5Prologue.
The GT TUNNED cars.
They place the cars to show us Body Kits and way to customize the cars.
Cars like Suzuki Cappuccino shows that the custom car has wheels, body kits, ground effects, even mirrors are placed in different location. As well interior changes.
So lets really hope BODY kits will make it in too.
You can see the front bumper is seperate panel over the entire body.
Another good example for body kits is in GT5Prologue.
The GT TUNNED cars.
They place the cars to show us Body Kits and way to customize the cars.
Cars like Suzuki Cappuccino shows that the custom car has wheels, body kits, ground effects, even mirrors are placed in different location. As well interior changes.
So lets really hope BODY kits will make it in too.
- 667
- Ravellron
Yeah they did mention they had to go back a step, redesign current cars they had and work in separate car pieces. They mention because for the damage factor as well customization. I really hope it would be as something as GTA4 or Burnout, not pre-made bumpers that have damage. As well GT5 should have more internal damage and able to KILL a car.
You can see the front bumper is seperate panel over the entire body.
Another good example for body kits is in GT5Prologue.
The GT TUNNED cars.
They place the cars to show us Body Kits and way to customize the cars.
Cars like Suzuki Cappuccino shows that the custom car has wheels, body kits, ground effects, even mirrors are placed in different location. As well interior changes.
So lets really hope BODY kits will make it in too.
yes, it's the same im thinking too...
also side skirt are separate, it sounds like side skirt modding...
and KY said that the new modeling is the "key" to do maybe everythings like we thought......
- 10,270
- Bonn
- GTAce
Even on GT4 the reflections update every 60fps and had geometry on them.
On GT5P easily spotable on london track and the exterior view replay, nothing like a "textured tube".
GT4 doesnt even run with 60fps....
The reflection is a map overlay, so the "textured tube" is the right discription just very simple. You can spot that on some tracks were you see reflections on your car that arent right, i cant remember which tracks that have though.
In GT3 you can spot that on the test course, just follow the yellow line in the 3rd person view and look at your rear bumper, you will see reflections from a line that isnt on the asphalt and vice versa.
EDIT:
GTA4 uses the Euphoria Engine which enables something very cool.
Every material has the ability to deform like it would in real life (Star Wars: The Force Unleashed also uses the Euphoria Engine).
But i doubt it is possible to implement such a tech in GT5, it would be too much.
If they can achieve that plus a proper physics proramming from the materials itself, we will have crashes like in real life.
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