America - The Official Thread

[Touring Mars]

Same vibe:

Reminds me of the old proverb, 'The acorn doesn't fall far from the Stupid Tree'...

 

[McLaren]

Same vibe:

Turning into his pop. Random nonsense.

 

[ryzno]

Same vibe:

You seem to be the only person who's having trouble here.

Anyways...

I don't really have a problem with an infrastructure bill that actually fixes the infrastructure. It's all the other crap that gets hidden in these bills that I don't like.
And they never do what they say they are going to do.
Oh yay, you built a new round about, what about the road that's been crumbling away for 20 years you built for that road? Oh a sidewalk and a shoulder with flowers and a sign are what y'all want? Here you go! "Don't mind the potholes, GA has the best infrastructure in the South!"
My right suspension begs to differ.

It's more than just that though. Let's just look back at the last year.

A trillion dollar stimulus to "help the American people".
Who can live off of $1400 for a year? Why do companies that make billions in profits need a hand?

I can only wait and laugh when universal income gets brought up again.

Reminds me of the old proverb, 'The acorn doesn't fall far from the Stupid Tree'...

Classy.

 

[GranTurNismo]

It's all the other crap that gets hidden in these bills that I don't like.

"Infrastructure" means far more than just roads and bridges. Transportation, communication networks, sewage, water, power, financial systems, healthcare systems, and social services all fit under the definition of infrastructure. Many seem to forget that infrastructure has two, equally important types: hard and soft infrastructure. "Hard", referring to the physical structures and materials of that given society, and "soft" being the human capital that allows an economy to sustain itself.

I thought the Republicans took out most of the "hidden crap" in Biden's original infrastructure bill anyways? Especially all that crap that has the word "green" or "renewable" in it.

And they never do what they say they are going to do.
Oh yay, you built a new round about, what about the road that's been crumbling away for 20 years you built for that road? Oh a sidewalk and a shoulder with flowers and a sign are what y'all want? Here you go! "Don't mind the potholes, GA has the best infrastructure in the South!"
My right suspension begs to differ.

So are you arguing for more money to be spent on the infrastructure bill then?

Why do companies that make billions in profits need a hand?

... yet you support the GOP, the most notorious for this behavior.

I can only wait and laugh when universal income gets brought up again.

Do you mean universal basic income? Because I have no clue what universal income is.

 

[TexRex]

Classy.

Translation: "I'm offended by this but I can't refute it either."

---

Fantastic take on the subject of immigration here. We need substantially more security than mere "hurr durr wall keep brown people out," but we also need to drastically reform immigration policy because the present system that skews entirely too nationalist just isn't working.

How Biden Can Flip the Script on Immigration

It starts with embracing border security.

thebulwark.com

It feels like 2015 all over again.

Back then, Republicans on the make used the plight of the millions of Syrian refugees fleeing their country’s civil war as a way to convince the American public that immigration was out of control.

This was an exaggeration, of course. In fiscal year 2016, fewer than 13,000 Syrian refugees were resettled in the United States.

But as is often the case with migration narratives, the numbers didn’t matter. Driven by fears of the “floods” or “waves” of immigration the American public put an unrepentant nationalist in the White House for the first time in our nation’s history.

Today, former president Donald Trump is leading Republican efforts to weaponize immigration again. But instead of Syrian refugees, he and his party have singled out Central American families fleeing violence and corruption as the new fear.

Texas Gov. Greg Abbott is crowdsourcing funds and law enforcement resources from across the country to supposedly secure the border from these families and in the coming days, several House Republicans will gather in the summer heat for their own Border-Palooza. The headlining act will be a Trump/Abbot town hall hosted by Sean Hannity in Edinburg, Texas.

Will voters buy the panic this time, too?

In 2015, Democrats, and many moderate Republicans, underestimated the power of an anti-immigrant message to convince the American public that immigration was out of control.

And today—at least so far—they are making the same mistake.

The trap Democrats have fallen into is seeing immigration solely as an issue for the two parties’ bases. They believe that only hard-core nationalists on the right care about immigration. And on the left, in both message and policy, they speak to a choir of progressives and liberals.

The Democratic base is primarily concerned with undoing the hundreds of changes to immigration policy orchestrated by Trump and Stephen Miller. And progressives eventually want to see a massive reduction in immigration enforcement. These two desires make many of them reluctant to place any emphasis on the idea of security.

This strategy would be fine if the United States was a progressive utopia.

It is not.

Democrats—and the moderate Republicans who seek a constructive approach to immigration—need to view immigration as an issue that builds consensus. They need to approach it not as a base-turnout wedge, but as an issue that allows those who were turned off by Trump’s immigration approach to find another in-group—one that may still be politically conservative or moderate in nature, but doesn’t scapegoat and demagogue immigrants at every turn.

To do this, Democrats need to talk about security.

Just not in the demeaning and destructive ways that past administrations (both Democratic and Republican) have employed it.

Instead, lawmakers in search of good-faith immigration solutions need to make clear that a secure border—and a secure nation—depend on three things.

• A functioning immigration system.
• A sophisticated security approach that has the technology, personnel and infrastructure necessary to humanely regulate movement at the border.
• Solutions that address the root causes of migration.

To improve the functioning of our immigration system, the Biden administration should first dive into negotiations with Senate Democrats and Republicans to find a bipartisan compromise that stabilizes the lives of Dreamers and farmworkers, and puts in place smart border security solutions. Following House passage of the American Dream and Promise Act and the Farm Workforce Modernization Act, bipartisan efforts in the Senate are well underway. The White House process through which compromises are currently being developed on infrastructure and police reform offer useful templates for moving forward.

Then the administration should secure the border by managing it in a much more effective and efficient way. For example, before rolling back Trump border policies, ensure the staffing and facilities. Surge asylum officers and judges to the region; ensure ports of entry have the necessary facilities; streamline administrative processes.

Look, even Sen. Bernie Sanders’ leaked budget reconciliation draft included $14 billion for “border and infrastructure” and $10 billion for “Land Ports of Entry.” These are security measures. Democrats should own them.

Finally, in terms of solutions south of the border, the administration should continue to collaborate with the governments and civil society organizations of Mexico and Central America to advance solutions to corruption, violence, and poverty.

And most importantly: the White House needs to communicate these solutions to the public in a way that builds consensus.

The immigration debate of 2021 does not have to be the debate of 2015. Immigration doesn’t have to be a divisive tool of fear.

Immigration presents the perfect opportunity to demonstrate how we can be both a nation of laws and a nation of grace.

But that won’t happen unless Biden and Democrats make it happen.

Oh and add "caravans" to the above mentioned "floods" and "waves." The right sure does love to fearmonger to gain an edge in the immigration debate.

 

[Keef]

You seem to be the only person who's having trouble here.

Anyways...

I don't really have a problem with an infrastructure bill that actually fixes the infrastructure. It's all the other crap that gets hidden in these bills that I don't like.
And they never do what they say they are going to do.
Oh yay, you built a new round about, what about the road that's been crumbling away for 20 years you built for that road? Oh a sidewalk and a shoulder with flowers and a sign are what y'all want? Here you go! "Don't mind the potholes, GA has the best infrastructure in the South!"
My right suspension begs to differ.

It's more than just that though. Let's just look back at the last year.

A trillion dollar stimulus to "help the American people".
Who can live off of $1400 for a year? Why do companies that make billions in profits need a hand?

I can only wait and laugh when universal income gets brought up again.

All the other crap, like the anti-trans amendment that Ohio state Republican Jena Powell introduced last week that completely derailed an otherwise unanimous student athlete bill? You mean other crap like that?

 

[McLaren]

A trillion dollar stimulus to "help the American people".
Who can live off of $1400 for a year? Why do companies that make billions in profits need a hand?

I can only wait and laugh when universal income gets brought up again.

Why laugh? The folks who are advocating universal basic income are generally the same folks who agree with your previous point.

 

[ryzno]

Translation: "I'm offended by this but I can't refute it either."

I'm not offended. Just pointing out the ball vs man. You know, civil debating. Respond to my post big guy.

Why laugh? The folks who are advocating universal basic income are generally the same folks who agree with your previous point.

I can't tell.
People want the road fixed but get an intersection and flowers with a sign that cost $1000 for a $250K installation bill that no one wanted. They spend a million plus "studying" an intersection and do nothing.
A perfect example is in Decatur. I285 and Memorial Dr. All they did was put new lights on a "more fule efficient pattern" when I use to be able to simply get on and not sit, now idling waiting 10 minutes to get on the damn highway. Fuel efficient my ass.

You know what I mean @GranTurNismo don't become Tex.

 

[McLaren]

I can't tell.
People want the road fixed but get an intersection and flowers with a sign that cost $1000 for a $250K installation bill that no one wanted. They spend a million plus "studying" an intersection and do nothing.
A perfect example is in Decatur. I285 and Memorial Dr. All they did was put new lights on a "more fule efficient pattern" when I use to be able to simply get on and not sit, now idling waiting 10 minutes to get on the damn highway. Fuel efficient my ass.

You know what I mean @GranTurNismo don't become Tex.

That might be down to what side is advocating what they want done & what side is in charge. If the county is controlled by Dems and advocating proper fixes, but are also the ones committing the acts you brought up, yeah, that's a big issue.

But, that's not really changing what I said. Democrats are more in favor of universal basic income afaik, and Democrats were the ones who wanted to give more money than $1,400. What we got was ultimately a compromise, because one side under McConnell's majority leadership, didn't want to give any a penny more.

 

[TexRex]

I'm not offended. Just pointing out the ball vs man.

There was no ball. There was no court; no field; no net. There was nothing but hot air in that coked-out projectionist diatribe.

The response to the video was apt, your disapproval of the response notwithstanding.

Respond to my post big guy.

Respond to mine, little boy.

You came in last night all het up, full of piss and vinegar, quoting me and going on a disjointed rant that bore no particular relevance to the post you quoted, making broad generalizations that purportedly applied to me but in actuality don't apply to anyone who contributes to this subforum with any kind of frequency.

I quoted you and solicited further explanation regarding remarks within that post and you've since completely dodged. When it was apparent my solicitation had been dodged rather than simply not addressed yet (you performed an action in this thread after my solicitation), I quoted the post again and responded to it with a video clip that had a very similar feel, hoping doing so might stoke a response. You've actually dodged a wide array of similar solicitations from me during our often fruitless exchanges, but let's focus on that one. Or not, as I anticipate will be the case while simultaneously being open to having said prediction proven wrong.

 

[ryzno]

That might be down to what side is advocating what they want done & what side is in charge. If the county is controlled by Dems and advocating proper fixes, but are also the ones committing the acts you brought up, yeah, that's a big issue.

But, that's not really changing what I said. Democrats are more in favor of universal basic income afaik, and Democrats were the ones who wanted to give more money than $1,400. What we got was ultimately a compromise, because one side under McConnell's majority leadership, didn't want to give any a penny more.

Fair enough but $2K really isn't helping anyone who's been out of work since the get go.
I've literally seen someone here who'd rather rely on the government than do something he doesn't like for a while but still wants to complain.

I'll wait for the hit dog to holla.

A person who cares about themselves and or their family will do what they need to do, happy or not for a period of time to get by. Not complain the government isn't helping them.

Man up.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

I can't tell.
People want the road fixed but get an intersection and flowers with a sign that cost $1000 for a $250K installation bill that no one wanted. They spend a million plus "studying" an intersection and do nothing.
A perfect example is in Decatur. I285 and Memorial Dr. All they did was put new lights on a "more fule efficient pattern" when I use to be able to simply get on and not sit, now idling waiting 10 minutes to get on the damn highway. Fuel efficient my ass.

You know what I mean @GranTurNismo don't become Tex.

As far as I know, federal infrastructure funding that gets allocated to local authorities is generally spent the way local authorities choose to spend it. Local authorities are selected, typically by voters. So you problem, in actuality, is with your neighbors...not anything at a federal level. Do you get involved with local politics? Here in CA, it's often more direct than that, as spending allocations are often via direct democracy, as in voters choose directly how much to spend and what to spend it on through ballot measures. I typically vote heavily in favor of bicycle infrastructure even though it's wildly unpopular with some people (anyone who doesn't bike🙃). Sometimes the bike stuff wins, sometimes it doesn't. But that's democracy.

 

[Keef]

Fair enough but $2K really isn't helping anyone who's been out of work since the get go.

Say it again for the people in the front.

 

[McLaren]

Fair enough but $2K really isn't helping anyone who's been out of work since the get go.

That's why a couple politicians went as far as proposing $2K/month. I've seen people from other countries respond to the idea with laughter; how a country can throw so much money into the military spending, but spending a fraction of that to help its citizens was somehow impossible.

I don't know what the rest of your post was responding to. You seem to acknowledge that the govt. didn't do much to help its citizens by offering a combined sum of $2,000, but then argue that one needs to "man up". There are a multitude of variables right now that keep people from "manning up". One of the most vocal is that perhaps businesses should "man up" and offer competitive wages instead of blaming govt. assistance. I don't know how many resume/interview stories I read on a /ask Reddit thread about companies (mainly office jobs) wanting high qualifications, but barely offering $15-17/hour for such positions. The general consensus was that many folks who put their time into getting their Masters and building a decade+ long resume were insulted by such low wages for the large amount of experience they have in their field, wages many had already had at the beginning or early on into their field.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Miami Condo Collapse:

Granholm (Energy secretary) is catching heavy flak from the right regarding comments about climate change on the collapse of the building in Miami. But, honestly...from what I've seen including this pretty illuminating video from inside the basement parking garage I'm leaning towards the idea that this was a sinkhole very likely caused by the water table rising...which is a direct result of climate change. The collapse seemed too abrupt to be strictly a beam or slab failure - though all of that spawling of the concrete was probably a contributing factor. I've read that south Florida is largely porous limestone and so a rising water table causing a large sinkhole is quite plausible. I'm curious to know what kind of foundation this building had. What kind of waterproofing strategy was deployed under the foundation? If the concrete was in such bad shape on the "dry" side of the ground, I'd hate to see the other side.

Out here in the marshy zones, we typically either go with matt slabs (up to 12' thick of solid concrete) or friction piles. One project I worked on had 500x piles each 100ft deep to mitigate the poor soil. If this building was just grade beams or some silly PT slab on grade, and a sinkhole opened under it, this result would be pretty much certain.

Anyone remember the Corvette museum sinkhole?

 

[TexRex]

Granholm (Energy secretary) is catching heavy flak from the right regarding comments about climate change on the collapse of the building in Miami. But, honestly...from what I've seen including this pretty illuminating video from inside the basement parking garage I'm leaning towards the idea that this was a sinkhole very likely caused by the water table rising...which is a direct result of climate change.

I don't know what he said and I'm unfamiliar with the context in which he said it, but his remarks potentially being valid in a roundabout manner doesn't really make them meaningful.

Also, who gives a flying **** what right trash thinks about a Biden cabinet appointment? Those morons blamed green energy policy on cascading catastrophic energy infrastructure failures during a winter storm.

Harrowing stories and imagery coming out of Surfside, though. I think I heard the confirmed fatality count is up to 18.

 

[Blitz24]

Surfside is built up quite a bit and it wouldn't shock me if they have to tear down some buildings.

 

[TexRex]

Okay, seriously, what the **** is going on with this timeline?

 

[TexRex]

 

[merseyxshore]

lol so they're now straight up just saying anti-racism is bad 😂 I can maybe understand people not knowing what "antifa" actually means, but "anti-racism" is plain as day haha

 

[merseyxshore]

I just read through the comments for about ten minutes and didn't come across a single one that wasn't making fun of it haha so maybe there's hope after all

 

[Keef]

Ah yes, "equity" does strike me as such a banworthy buzzword.

I just read through the comments for about ten minutes and didn't come across a single one that wasn't making fun of it haha so maybe there's hope after all

Unfortunately that's not how movements like these work. The people this ad is targeting can just barely comprehend how to use Twitter - or don't participate to avoid the shellacking - so that's not actually how this message will get out. This ad will be picked up by far-right print websites, Fox News, and especially Facebook users and will be passed around virally which, heh, well isn't that an appropriate method. The people who post the message don't even really care what happens to it after they post it, all they care is that it causes chaos. The herd will do the rest. Every single time something like this gets posted all the comments at the source are negative because smart people actually respond to the source, and yet the material still spreads like wildfire. By the end of the day, nobody sharing this message will have a ****ing clue who originally posted it or why, they'll simply be embracing it as fact.

 

[TexRex]

Ah yes, "equity" does strike me as such a banworthy buzzword.

"Identity" is the one that I'm stuck on, particularly given the importance of showing proof of it to vote.

 

[Blitz24]

"Identity" is the one that I'm stuck on, particularly given the importance of showing proof of it to vote.

Or the importance of it to facilitate access to.... well, any application.

 

[Danoff]

Where's anglo-saxon and cultural heritage? Oh wait, wrong buzzwords.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

I just read through the comments for about ten minutes and didn't come across a single one that wasn't making fun of it haha so maybe there's hope after all

Go back out to the main thread on twitter

 

[TexRex]

Go back out to the main thread on twitter

There's plenty of mockery there as well, but there are likely to be far more people approving of it there than beneath a post that itself mocks it.

 

[Joey D]

Granholm (Energy secretary) is catching heavy flak from the right regarding comments about climate change on the collapse of the building in Miami. But, honestly...from what I've seen including this pretty illuminating video from inside the basement parking garage I'm leaning towards the idea that this was a sinkhole very likely caused by the water table rising...which is a direct result of climate change. The collapse seemed too abrupt to be strictly a beam or slab failure - though all of that spawling of the concrete was probably a contributing factor. I've read that south Florida is largely porous limestone and so a rising water table causing a large sinkhole is quite plausible. I'm curious to know what kind of foundation this building had. What kind of waterproofing strategy was deployed under the foundation? If the concrete was in such bad shape on the "dry" side of the ground, I'd hate to see the other side.

It sounds like the building was in shambles for several years. Going back to 2018, an engineering report said the building had major structural damage. In 2020, it was found that the building was subsiding. And then just a few months ago in April, a letter was sent to residents claiming that the building's deterioration was accelerating.

I'm not entirely convinced that it was anything related to a sinkhole, but rather a whole slew of things based on a management team that did the bare minimum and half-assed it. This isn't to say that climate change isn't a factor though. Supposedly, with the higher tides more and more water was seeping into the garage. Salt and concrete don't mix very well and as cracks started to form, the water made its way into the rebar. Really, I think the blame squarely lies on the management of the building for not addressing the maintenance issues sooner.

I know they had a lawyer on CNN the other day talking about a lawsuit in 2015 where a resident sued the condo complex because her walls were crumbling to the point where rebar was showing. Apparently, the condo complex fixed it by patching the wall, but I'm guessing the damage was already done since the rebar was exposed. It happened again in 2017-18 to the same residence as well.

The scary thing is there are probably thousands and thousands of buildings like this in the US.

 

[TexRex]

Aaaaand it's gone.



[Edit] For anyone who missed what right-wing "think tank" Texas Public Policy Foundation tweeted:

A number of media outlets reported on it, but screenshotting stupid social media posts needs to be normalized in lieu of embedding directly because the latter is subject to post takedowns.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

It sounds like the building was in shambles for several years. Going back to 2018, an engineering report said the building had major structural damage. In 2020, it was found that the building was subsiding. And then just a few months ago in April, a letter was sent to residents claiming that the building's deterioration was accelerating.

I'm not entirely convinced that it was anything related to a sinkhole, but rather a whole slew of things based on a management team that did the bare minimum and half-assed it. This isn't to say that climate change isn't a factor though. Supposedly, with the higher tides more and more water was seeping into the garage. Salt and concrete don't mix very well and as cracks started to form, the water made its way into the rebar. Really, I think the blame squarely lies on the management of the building for not addressing the maintenance issues sooner.

I know they had a lawyer on CNN the other day talking about a lawsuit in 2015 where a resident sued the condo complex because her walls were crumbling to the point where rebar was showing. Apparently, the condo complex fixed it by patching the wall, but I'm guessing the damage was already done since the rebar was exposed. It happened again in 2017-18 to the same residence as well.

The scary thing is there are probably thousands and thousands of buildings like this in the US.

Absolutely...and a lot of them are "coming due" in terms of degradation, including plenty far larger and with far larger potential for devastation than this one. We gotta figure out a substitute for rebar.