America - The Official Thread

[Danoff]

I thought those figures only counted the 80M who are paid an hourly wage? In that case the 2017 figures show that 1.8M are on-or-below the federal minimum. It's harder to get data for people who take a salary for a contracted weekly number of hours but it's likely that some of those fall below the minimum hourly rate. That definitely happens in the UK, I know that's not related but the effects are surely the same in many countries.

It happens in the US with (at least) workers that receive tips. In those cases though, the employees are being paid more than the minimum (which is $0). Presumably the tips are good and employees are shopping for venues that offer the best tips.

I got the number from the pewsearch website:
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/01/04/5-facts-about-the-minimum-wage/

You were correct with the at or below. But you are dicounting a huge procentage that have trouble making a living wage at near the minimum wage (less then 10,10 dollars). And I am confident to say have difficulty to chose where they work on the basis of highest wage offered.

Edit: added data

You still have a relatively large number of employers from which to choose. Low wage jobs tend to be fairly fungible. It's the kind of scenario (like I described before) where many people are qualified and employers can pick from the ones who will take the least pay. In those types of jobs, qualifications are inherently minimal, which means that there is a lot of employee movement. It can actually be harder to shop among prospective employers when you get specialized. How many employers need a PhD in spacecraft navigation vs. employers who need someone that knows how to work a cash register. Employees at the low end are very mobile, and shop employers all the time. The problem is that the employers have less incentive to pay them because there are so many people and they're willing to work for fairly little.

To really get wages to jump up you need a small pool of people who are highly specialized in an area that everyone needs. Artificial intelligence is probably such an area today.

 

[Tornado]

Except that is not what i asked. Not sure why you would quote my post with a answer that is propoganda?

Let's be honest here: You didn't really "ask" anything to begin with.

 

[PocketZeven]

No. That scenario describes people that hit minimum wage. That's less than 1% of employed people in the US. Everyone making above minimum wage is necessarily in between those two or is in the 2nd scenario.

I really think you have an optimitic view on how the lower end of the job market. The 1% is probably referring to the federal minimum income. I understand a lot of states have set their own minimum income that isnt reflected in that 1% number. Also I really dont believe anyone in the "near" minimum wage region does have much choice in jobs except in that same wageregion.

edit: correction

 

[Northstar]

Also I really dont believe anyone in the "near" minimum wage region doesnt have much choice in jobs except in that same wageregion.

There's a bit of a double negative here, so please forgive me if I'm reading it wrong.

If they actually look and are willing to put in an effort, there's lots of options, there's even companies whose sole purpose is placing people in those jobs (usually in a temporary placement that can lead to a permanent one). Companies that operate in electrical, plumbing and HVAC are also so desperate for people some will even pay for college!

Also...

 

[Novalee]

Let's be honest here: You didn't really "ask" anything to begin with.

Actualy i did .i asked what will ottos parents think of drumph which is trumps real last name ,saying kim jung un is not responsable for ottos death.

Lets be honest, reading comprehension is king

 

[Tornado]

Actualy i did

No you didn't. You wrote a rhetorical question as a pretext to post another driveby article about Trump being an idiot that you found somewhere. I shouldn't have to explain this to you, but you weren't going to get an answer to that question from anyone in this forum.
Dotini's response that Trump wasn't going to start a shooting war because that kid was killed by the North Korean government, immediately after a peace summit that he was presumably trying to still salvage something from publicly (because even Trump isn't that dumb), is just as valid at answering it as whatever circle jerking you expected when posting it.

Lets be honest, reading comprehension is king

Don't presume the people on this forum are as stupid as they are in whatever comment section or social media page I suspect you usually post this crap in. If you don't even know when you are posting a rhetorical question, you certainly don't get to dictate that people aren't responding to your posts correctly.



Ignoring them, sure.

 

[Liquid]

Lets be honest, reading comprehension is king

In which case you'd know that the family name was Drumpf, not Drumph, and that it isn't his "real" name; his paternal antecedents changed it or it became naturally corrputed or anglicised it decades before he was even born.

By all means criticise Trump but at least get the facts straight. Otherwise you're no better than he is and a sucker for stooping to his level.

 

[PocketZeven]

There's a bit of a double negative here, so please forgive me if I'm reading it wrong.

If they actually look and are willing to put in an effort, there's lots of options, there's even companies whose sole purpose is placing people in those jobs (usually in a temporary placement that can lead to a permanent one). Companies that operate in electrical, plumbing and HVAC are also so desperate for people some will even pay for college!

Also...

I corrected my post.

Electrical, plumbing are actually quite skilled jobs. In my country they get paid quite well and not near minimum wage (17-23 usd an hour)

I am more talking about jobs that dont require much skill and and do not provide a full time job. I dont know if the that 1% only takes account the monthly wage or either the hourly wage.

 

[Northstar]

Electrical, plumbing are actually quite skilled jobs. In my country they get paid quite well and not near minimum wage (17-23 usd an hour)

It's the same here, but there's entry level spots for people just getting into the trade doing the simpler tasks involved in the job (which is how I started). Than as you get more experience and education your skills and wage increase.

I am more talking about jobs that dont require much skill and and do not provide a full time job. I dont know if the that 1% only takes account the monthly wage or either the hourly wage.

Again, there's plenty of options for people with little to no experience to make quite a bit more than minimum wage (which is why it seems like there are so few options for minimum wage). Why on earth would you decide to stay at minimum wage level in that scenario?

 

[Novalee]

No you didn't. You wrote a rhetorical question as a pretext to post another driveby article about Trump being an idiot that you found somewhere. I shouldn't have to explain this to you, but you weren't going to get an answer to that question from anyone in this forum.
Dotini's response that Trump wasn't going to start a shooting war because that kid was killed by the North Korean government, immediately after a peace summit that he was presumably trying to still salvage something from publicly (because even Trump isn't that dumb), is just as valid at answering it as whatever circle jerking you expected when posting it.

Wrong .

It was a question and if you dont like the question ,then it is on. You. Facts are ottos parents were disgusted with trumpelorangeskins responce . We now know the answer to my question . And when i have more questions i will ask them .

Looks like maxine waters is getting the goods on drumphs money deals with german bank .

I wonder what .melania thinks of this ? And i also wonder what she thinks of drumph cheating on her .

https://www.msnbc.com/all-in/watch/...-cooperating-with-her-committee-1450881091506

Also of interest is that drumpf gramps was also a coward like the little orange man with small hands .


Donald Trump's grandfather was kicked out of his native Germany for failing to do his mandatory military service there, a historian has claimed

 

[PocketZeven]

It's the same here, but there's entry level spots for people just getting into the trade doing the simpler tasks involved in the job (which is how I started). Than as you get more experience and education your skills and wage increase.



Again, there's plenty of options for people with little to no experience to make quite a bit more than minimum wage (which is why it seems like there are so few options for minimum wage). Why on earth would you decide to stay at minimum wage level in that scenario?

Even in entry level a job in utilities pays above Minmum wage here. At least in my country most have a degree of some kind (or at least some experience) to qualify for entry postition.
In a lot of cases its because of no college education, no experience, no skill etc. Perhaps I have a more pessimistic view, but from experience lots of people work at lower level jobs and/or multiple jobs for minimum wage out of neccesity rather by "choice".

https://www.businessinsider.nl/more...ake-ends-meet-2017-8/?international=true&r=US

 

[Famine]

Lets be honest, reading comprehension is king

If you're going to play the "people aren't reading my posts properly" card, you need posts that people are happy to read...

Actually I did. I asked what will Otto's parents think of Drumph - which is Trump's real last name - saying Kim Jong-un is not responsible for Otto's death.

Let's be honest, reading comprehension is king.

And, let's be honest, the Acceptable Use Policy is king.

"Drumpf" (with an F, not an H) is one of several ways - and not among the more common, with no actual records in the family's German ancestral region - of spelling the family surname at least 30 years before he was born, and possibly much further back than that. Donald Trump's "real" last name is "Trump".

 

[Tornado]

Wrong .

It was a question and if you dont like the question ,then it is on. You.

Yes, it was a question. It still wasn't actually asked with the expectation of an answer, unless you legitimately thought that kid's parents were going to join this forum and give you one. That's the part that made it rhetorical and your response to Dotini not answering it silly. Again, read what you're actually writing (since I assume you can at least) before lecturing people on the true meaning being lost.


Though, notably, you were the one who threw the fit for not liking the response you were given...

 

[PocketZeven]

Wrong .

It was a question and if you dont like the question ,then it is on. You. Facts are ottos parents were disgusted with trumpelorangeskins responce . We now know the answer to my question . And when i have more questions i will ask them .

Looks like maxine waters is getting the goods on drumphs money deals with german bank .

I wonder what .melania thinks of this ? And i also wonder what she thinks of drumph cheating on her .

https://www.msnbc.com/all-in/watch/...-cooperating-with-her-committee-1450881091506

Also of interest is that drumpf gramps was also a coward like the little orange man with small hands .


Donald Trump's grandfather was kicked out of his native Germany for failing to do his mandatory military service there, a historian has claimed

I will never understand how many people in the US are still turning a blind eye to his obvious immorality. But in other news I found Matt Gaetz pretty appalling surrounding the Cohen hearing. Now I know this guy is also immoral. In a gun hearing for stricter background checks, he apparantly called for the building of the wall as a solution to gun violence in the USA. Essentially blaming immigrants for gun violence. There were family of victims of mass-shootings in that room that were outraged.

Trumps name or ancestry arent relevant to his narcacistic stupidity, that is all his own.

 

[Dotini]

I will never understand how many people in the US are still turning a blind eye to his obvious immorality.

We tried electing a president on the basis of morality a time or two. The most recent was Jimmy Carter.

 

[Northstar]

At least in my country

But we're not talking about your country. Here you have to be doing something very wrong to be able bodied and making minimum wage once your out of highschool.

In a lot of cases its because of no college education, no experience, no skill etc.

Again, there are quite a few companies willing to take you in and provide all 3 of those things! Typically they'll even have you working part time when your not in class!

Perhaps I have a more pessimistic view, but from experience lots of people work at lower level jobs and/or multiple jobs for minimum wage out of neccesity rather by "choice".

From what I've noticed people that feel stuck on the bottom run fit into 3 categories.

1) They have a rather lengthy criminal record.

2) They have a mental/physical disability.

3) They have absolutely no ambition.

There's all kinds of options out there to not make minimum wage, hell, even fast food joints start well above minimum wage here.

If we were in a recession I could see where you're coming from, but we're not and I see giant "we're hiring!" signs pretty much every day.

 

[PocketZeven]

But we're not talking about your country. Here you have to be doing something very wrong to be able bodied and making minimum wage once your out of highschool.



Again, there are quite a few companies willing to take you in and provide all 3 of those things! Typically they'll even have you working part time when your not in class!



From what I've noticed people that feel stuck on the bottom run fit into 3 categories.

1) They have a rather lengthy criminal record.

2) They have a mental/physical disability.

3) They have absolutely no ambition.

There's all kinds of options out there to not make minimum wage, hell, even fast food joints start well above minimum wage here.

If we were in a recession I could see where you're coming from, but we're not and I see giant "we're hiring!" signs pretty much every day.

Perhaps I have a pessimistic look on the job market in the USA. I realise the situation might be very different here then in the USA.

 

[sturk0167]

I will never understand how many people in the US are still turning a blind eye to his obvious immorality.

Trump voters do not really care about that. He is the same guy, as president that he was when he was a candidate. As of now, he's been doing exactly the job they hired him to do (and in some cases, still trying to).

 

[PocketZeven]

Trump voters do not really care about that. He is the same guy, as president that he was when he was a candidate. As of now, he's been doing exactly the job they hired him to do (and in some cases, still trying to).

Thats the thing he strated his whole campaign with lies. His prominant promises he has not (yet) delivered:

- Ban muslims
- Build Mexican paid wall
- Golf less then Obama
- Work more then any other president
- Bring in the "best" people
- Bring back jobs in coal
- Bring back jobs in manufacturing
- Release tax returns after edit
- Repeal and replace Obamacare (with something better, that covers pre-existing conditions)
- ditching NATO
- proscecute after hilary
- labeling China as a currency manipulatitor
- invest in infrastructure
- sue his accusers of sexual misconduct
- eliminate carried intrest loophole
- battle opioid crisis
- battle inflated prcing with big pharma

I do admit he did deliver on:

- Tax cuts (albeit the more wealthy profited more then middleclass)
- Pulling out Paris climate deal
- Take no salary
- ask countries to pay more for joint defense

 

[UKMikey]

- Golf less then Obama

Lolz.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/byron-york-donald-trumps-most-casually-broken-promise

 

[Biggles]

Trump voters do not really care about that. He is the same guy, as president that he was when he was a candidate. As of now, he's been doing exactly the job they hired him to do (and in some cases, still trying to).

True.

Thats the thing he strated his whole campaign with lies. His prominant promises he has not (yet) delivered:

- Ban muslims
- Build Mexican paid wall
- Golf less then Obama
- Work more then any other president
- Bring in the "best" people
- Bring back jobs in coal
- Bring back jobs in manufacturing
- Release tax returns after edit
- Repeal and replace Obamacare (with something better, that covers pre-existing conditions)
- ditching NATO
- proscecute after hilary
- labeling China as a currency manipulatitor
- invest in infrastructure
- sue his accusers of sexual misconduct
- eliminate carried intrest loophole
- battle opioid crisis
- battle inflated prcing with big pharma

I don't know to what degree you can fault Trump for failing to carry out his most impractical, unrealistic & unconstitutional promises.

We tried electing a president on the basis of morality a time or two. The most recent was Jimmy Carter.

Carter was elected, partly, as a reaction to the lying, duplicitous character of Nixon. He was running against another moral & decent man in Gerald Ford, but Ford was tainted by his pardoning of Nixon.

It's going to be fascinating to see how Americans decide to vote in 2020 when the swampy nature of Trump has received a proper public airing.

 

[Dotini]

He was running against another moral & decent man in Gerald Ford, but Ford was tainted by his pardoning of Nixon.

“He’s [Gerald Ford] a nice guy but he played too much football with his helmet off.”

“Jerry Ford is so dumb that he can’t fart and chew gum at the same time.”

- Lyndon B. Johnson

LBJ was one of the crudest presidents in U.S. history. When asked at a press conference why the United States was still in Vietnam, he pulled out his penis and answered, “This is why!” Another time, he let a reporter know he didn’t like his recent article by, as the New York Times puts it, “defecating on the ground in front of him.”
https://www.history.com/news/historical-presidential-insults

 

[McLaren]

Thats the thing he strated his whole campaign with lies. His prominant promises he has not (yet) delivered:

- Ban muslims

This has been addressed several times; there was no Muslim ban. What there was, was a desire to stop people coming from hot spots of terrorist activity. The 6 most Muslim-populated countries were not in that ban.

 

[PocketZeven]

This has been addressed several times; there was no Muslim ban. What there was, was a desire to stop people coming from hot spots of terrorist activity. The 6 most Muslim-populated countries were not in that ban.

You are correct. I was adressing he promised a muslim ban to his following during his campaign. He flip flopped (or straightup lied), because that was inconstitutional.
Quote:

"[I am] calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what the hell is going on."



Donald Trump's campaign website had a statement (now removed), which called for a "total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States"

 

[TenEightyOne]

This has been addressed several times; there was no Muslim ban. What there was, was a desire to stop people coming from hot spots of terrorist activity. The 6 most Muslim-populated countries were not in that ban.

Ultimately there was no Muslim ban, as you say. Nonetheless it was a specific promise from Trump early on in the campaign.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Cross-posted from the much abused "funny" pictures thread so it didn't look like in-line complaining

The joke doesn't work with the NATO flag though. It's saying that the EU think they're equal with the US hen the US are actually pushing them along.

But I mean, $643.3billion, think how many Universal Healthcare's and people on Mars you could get if you cut that in half

The figures are a bit dicey (almost double the actual UK figure, for example), and are presented in a way that suggests that a country's own defence spending is "NATO spending". It isn't. There's no such thing as a Trumpist "NATO bill" (in that sense at least), it's just that the USA spends higher proportion of GDP on de-fence.

 

[PocketZeven]

Cross-posted from the much abused "funny" pictures thread so it didn't look like in-line complaining



The figures are a bit dicey (almost double the actual UK figure, for example), and are presented in a way that suggests that a country's own defence spending is "NATO spending". It isn't. There's no such thing as a Trumpist "NATO bill" (in that sense at least), it's just that the USA spends higher proportion of GDP on de-fence.

The usa historically like to spend a big portion of their budget on military. Allthough Europe is lagging that pie doesnt paint the correct picture:

When you put it in perspective of the GDP the US doesnt even top the list:

Reducing spenditure by 1% or 1/3 does give the us an extra 200 billion to spend on healthcare, infrastructure or education.

 

[TenEightyOne]

The usa historically like to spend a big portion of their budget on military. Allthough Europe is lagging that pie doesnt paint the correct picture:When you put it in perspective of the GDP the US doesnt even top the list:.

I'm fairly sure that neither Russia nor Saudi Arabia are members of NATO.

The original premise quoted was that a country's own defence budget is spent on NATO, it isn't. NATO advises that an average of 2% GDP is spent on defence, that's all. The total NATO administration budget (contributed to proportionally by all members) is about 0.1% of the total military spending of the member countries. Europe doesn't "lag behind" as much is it shares resources between adjacent neighbours and goes for longer without large capital spends.

 

[mustafur]

The usa historically like to spend a big portion of their budget on military. Allthough Europe is lagging that pie doesnt paint the correct picture:

When you put it in perspective of the GDP the US doesnt even top the list:

Reducing spenditure by 1% or 1/3 does give the us an extra 200 billion to spend on healthcare, infrastructure or education.

They certainly top the list when it comes to NATO Countries though.

 

[Danoff]

Good stuff in this: