American car lovers rejoice! CR sees the light!

[TopHat]

Autoblog

Toyota hit hard by new Consumer Reports predicted reliability ratings

Posted Oct 16th 2007 1:25PM by John Neff
Filed under: Car Buying, Ford, Toyota


So you thought Consumer Reports was biased in favor of imports, did you? Today's release of CR's 2007 Annual Car Reliability Survey suggests otherwise, as the Toyota Camry V6, Tundra V8 4WD and Lexus GS AWD were all bumped from the magazine's vaunted "Recommended" list for receiving below average ratings. This news also has farther reaching effects, as CR will no longer recommend new or redesigned Toyotas based solely on the automaker's past reliability, a practice for which we dinged them back in August.

Meanwhile, Ford did very well in the new survey, with 41 out of 44 of its products scoring average or better in predicted reliability. Plus, the Ford Fusion, Mercury Milan and Ford F-150 V6 2WD were three of the only four domestic models that earned the label of "Most Reliable".

Follow the jump to find out which other brands made quality gains in the eyes of CR subscribers.

[Source: Consumer Reports]

Overall, however, Consumer Reports states on its blog that U.S. automakers still have a way to go, with 20 out of 44 models on the "Least Reliable" list belonging to domestic automakers. The European brands including Audi, BMW, Volvo, Porsche and Mercedes-Benz, are seeing improvements with specific models like the Audi A3, A4 and A6; BMW 3-, 5- and 7-Series, the Volvo S60 and Porsche 911 all earning above average ratings.

Love 'em or hate 'em, disagree with their testing and survey practices or not, but there's no denying that Consumer Reports holds a lot of sway with potential car buyers. Today's new will surely be felt by Toyota at some level, which for so long has enjoyed an unquestioned reign of superior quality that may be coming to an end soon.

Shock! Horror! Joy among joys! Ford is saved! The sheep like masses will flock to the Fusion!

 

[Azuremen]

Shock! Horror! Joy among joys! Ford is saved! The sheep like masses will flock to the Fusion!

I've actually noted the slow improvement in Ford's quality. The ding to Toyota surprises me a bit, but alas, it does happen! Its a good thing too, because it means everyone is realizing that can't sell crap all the time. Though, they were taken of the recommended list, was it below average scores for Toyota, or in general?

What does VW sit still though on those charts Cause I just know Brad is on his way now to post something about "Hay, told you guys so" (I'm just being an ass Brad )

 

[TopHat]

The Passat V6 fell noticably.

 

[KAMKA-Z]

I'm sure it helps that the Fusion/Milan share a lot of Mazda engineering and componentry.

 

[TopHat]

The Fusion and Milan are more reliable and much nicer than the 6.

 

[YSSMAN]

What does VW sit still though on those charts Cause I just know Brad is on his way now to post something about "Hay, told you guys so" (I'm just being an ass Brad )

You read my mind!

"I TOLD YOU SO!"

...Naw, I'm just kidding. Its a surprising change all the way around really, particularly when I recall the Pontiac Solstice being near the bottom of the list when it comes to reliability. Aww well, better luck next-time Toyota!

 

[JCE]

Awsome. Maybe Toyota's sales will be hurt a tiny bit by this. If they took a noticable hit in sales then maybe they'd fix a few things.

 

[niky]

No duh... all of this... have been seeing this and talking about this for years...

Toyotas are not indestructible. Period.

YSSMAN should be happy... oh, wait... He is!

 

[Azuremen]

Awsome. Maybe Toyota's sales will be hurt a tiny bit by this. If they took a noticable hit in sales then maybe they'd fix a few things.

Probably alot. Their image is important to them, so now that a well known (to the general public) publication is complaining about them, they will step back into line, get crap sorted out, and fix things.

Whether we get a fun car is a different matter.

 

[YSSMAN]

Its hard to say how Toyota would be able to spin this though. Consumer Reports has been "on their side" for so long, its like having a family member turn against you. I mean it isn't as though all of their products are reported badly, but given that all of the "falling stars" were indeed newer products and indeed Toyota is replacing all of the aging models here (Corolla, Matrix, Land Cruiser, Sequoia, etc), things could get bad quickly...

...My guess is that the demands on production is leading to the issues. Furthermore, reports continue to come in that workers aren't happy and want to unionize, and Toyota won't let them...

We'll see. I've been very disappointed with all of the new Toyota products, obviously a few marginally decent models here and there. But, this can only be good for GM, a few bad apples or not...

 

[Azuremen]

Its hard to say how Toyota would be able to spin this though. Consumer Reports has been "on their side" for so long, its like having a family member turn against you. I mean it isn't as though all of their products are reported badly, but given that all of the "falling stars" were indeed newer products and indeed Toyota is replacing all of the aging models here (Corolla, Matrix, Land Cruiser, Sequoia, etc), things could get bad quickly...

...My guess is that the demands on production is leading to the issues. Furthermore, reports continue to come in that workers aren't happy and want to unionize, and Toyota won't let them...

We'll see. I've been very disappointed with all of the new Toyota products, obviously a few marginally decent models here and there. But, this can only be good for GM, a few bad apples or not...

We know you've been disappointed. I think the whole world knows Brad.

That aside, I can see them not wanting to let the workers unionize. I have seen unions push for too much and just mess everything up for every one. So, I dunno what would be best, but I can see both sides there.

 

[forza2.0]

Ive said before that toyota and lexus reliability was going downhill. No one believed me though

 

[CodeRedR51]

The Fusion and Milan are more reliable and much nicer than the 6.

The current 6, yes. New one...... not so much.

 

[TopHat]

But we're not getting that one here.

 

[CodeRedR51]

But we're not getting that one here.

Yet.

 

[Jim Prower]

But once we get it, we'll get a new Fusion/Milan. and maybe Mondeo, if they're gonna take things Global...

But, wait, Isnt' this about Toyota and Consumer Reports?

CR's a mag written by non-enthusiasts, and, to their credit, they tend to do things scientifically. but...the passion of driving takes a backseat to cupholder count, and livability and reliablity take the forefront. which is why i dont' give a whole lot of thought to their opinion. But, so called "Smart Consumers" do, and it's a good thing CR's being more subjective for a particular model year, now.

Now, Toyota...start building engines so bulletproof that you can make over 1,000HP on the stock crank, rods, and pistons again. and cars to match. I remember Motor Trend, during the Van Tune days, saying about the Supra that it'd "run through just about anything short of spontaneous combustion of the atmosphere." that's about a top-tier sports car.

 

[YSSMAN]

Despite being knocked from the top spot in Consumer Reports' reliability survey, Toyota executives are pleased with the results. Overall, Toyota still placed first in 6 out of 8 reliability categories and represented 44% of the magazines most recommended vehicles.

However, Toyota's top brass was concerned that three of its vehicles were moved to the "not recommended" category — the Camry V6, Tundra V8 and Lexus GS AWD. “The bad news from our perspective is we never want to see vehicles on the ‘not recommend’ list,” Jim Lentz, executive vice president of Toyota Motor Sales U.S.A. told Automotive News.

Lentz said he was not surprised that the Camry V6 was on the list as it had a transmission flaw that Toyota was aware of.
“We knew in the very beginning we had a transmission issue with that vehicle,” he said. The problem caused the transmission to get stuck in second gear or pass through second gear roughly. However, Lentz doesn't feel the flaw will impact Toyota's reputation for quality. “I don’t think it’s going to have a long-term impact on the overall view of Toyota as a reliable product,” Lentz said.

Lentz had no explanation for the other two vehicles making the "not recommended" list.

So they even knew about the problem and didn't fix it? Sounds like something dear old GM or Ford would do. Oh well, I like their backpedaling. Its fun. Now we just need to get someone at Sony to really screw up on something, Wal*Mart too while we're at it, and I'll get to do my evil laugh for a week straight. When the big kids fall, well, it just makes it that much better...