AT and MT options.

[xXSilencerXx]

I was thinking about the transmission options and realized that all the cars can go manual even if it isn't offered on the car in real life. I think in GT5 they should make it so when you buy the car if it has the option, that you have to decide if you want it a stick shift or an automatic, then if you want to change it the you have to buy a new car.

 

[amp88]

What if you start off using manual gears but then have an industrial accident and lose your "shifting" fingers?

Sorry, but I hope this idea doesn't get included, it's a bit silly IMO

 

[buickgnx88]

I agree with xXSilencerXx. I mean, some of the cars in the game, in real life, only come with one type of transmission or a variety (full manual, full auto, clutchless manual, auto with manual-shift, etc.) and since this is a simulator, they should go by real life. They could have you choose after you've chosen the color of the car. This would especially be good for in the used cars, because it would be more like classified ads and would be real cool.

 

[Heel_toe]

The automatics should also sound like automatics, I noticed when I drove the Jaguar S type R (i think) that it sounded like an auto even though i had it set to manual gears. So I tried setting other cars to auto and they didnt sound like slushboxes at all. They still had the abrupt power cut-out during shifts that was indicative of a clutch, instead of the slow dropping of revs that usually happens when a torque converter starts slipping. Just a minor detail, but like buickgnx88 said, it's a simulator, they should go by real life.

 

[Jedi2016]

I think the best way to do it would be to simply match the car up with it's real-life counterpart, and that's that.

If you buy a car that's auto-only in real life, then it's auto-only in the game. Ditto for manual-only cars. The only ones you'd have a choice on would be cars that offer that choice in real life, and you'd ONLY have that choice when you BOUGHT the car. After that, it's "locked" into whatever transmission you bought with it, unless you pay the big bucks to have a new transmission installed (which people do a lot in the game anyway). At which point you'd have the chance to change the transmission type, but it would still be "locked" once you made your selection.

I also agree that the cars should sound like autos when they're autos. As Heel_Toe said, some cars always sound like automatics, and the rest of them always sound like manuals, regardless of how you have it set. I think ALL automatic cars should sound like autos, and if a car has both options available, then they should have BOTH sets of sounds.. so if you pick auto, it'll sound like auto, if you pick manual, it'll sound like manual. Basically, the car should always sound like it's real-life counterpart for WHATEVER transmission you've selected.

I'd also like to see automatic cars BEHAVE like automatic cars. Because right now, all they are is manual cars that automatically shift for you at the redline. Well, I drive an automatic in real life, and I've yet to see that thing hit the redline. I think the autos in the game should programmed the same way.. that it will only go all the way to redline if you've got the pedal nailed to the floor. But if you've only got it at 1/4 depression (like when you're driving to the grocery store with your kid in the back seat), then we should see the thing end up in fifth gear at 30mph, the way a REAL automatic behaves. And then when you floor it, it takes it a second to get going, as it downshifts once, twice, then takes off. The way a real automatic does.

Granted, I much prefer manual transmissions, but for the off-times when I drive an automatic, I'd like it to act AND sound like a real automatic.

 

[Dave A]

I think the best way to do it is leave it upto the player what they want to do, I love manual gears when using a wheel, I hate them with a passion when using the pad. If I was forced to race with cars in manual using the pad I'd probably just not load the game up in the first place and I'm pretty sure I speak for a lot of other people here some who maybe just use automatic exclusively. I remember Rage racer forcing you to use manual on certain cars, you know what, I never drove any of thoes cars after the first time exept the LeMans one on the oval.

Also about it being locked in say Auto after you bought the car, say after a while you start to try manual and you end up preferring it, you then have to scrap your car and buy another to drive it in manual. The reversoe of this is I drive every car in manual when using a wheel, if I'm forced to drive it in Auto with my wheel I'd be dissapointed.

 

[Heel_toe]

Good point, but how many credits do you have at the end of the game? like 15 million or something, right? I don't think it would be TOO much trouble to go to the tuner villiage or OEM and get a new transmission for like 7 grand...

 

[Patrik]

then if you want to change it the you have to buy a new car.

hehe, or change the gearbox, cause thats very possible in real life as well

 

[Patrik]

Haven't anyone noticed that when you choose automatic in the previous games it doesn't sound like an automatic gearbox... think they better fix that...

 

[Dave A]

I still dissagree, it's a ball ache just to get the car you want to drive to the transmission you want. I'd muh rather keep it as it is and concentrate on improving the physics and other aspects of the game. This would not offer any extra enjoyment at all.

 

[Patrik]

I still dissagree, it's a ball ache just to get the car you want to drive to the transmission you want. I'd muh rather keep it as it is and concentrate on improving the physics and other aspects of the game. This would not offer any extra enjoyment at all.

no but if PD want it perfect like me and for sure many other peoples this is a pretty cool detail I think...

 

[Dave A]

But not for a game, theres a line between real and a game that has to be drawn. If an idea is more likely to frustrate than provide fun, why include it. I'm all for more real physics, because I love them, I get enjoyment out of taking corners perfectly with no TCS or braking help in GTR. I enjoy seeing the car infront take the next corner too fast and brake too hard and spin into the wall and lose his front splitter after 3 laps of harrasing him, I enjoy being able to tinker with all the extra details even though I don't know what half of them do. Restricitng certain cars to one type of transmission would not add anything at all to that enjoyment. it would simply make me not be arsed with certain cars and I think thats the same for most people.

 

[Jedi2016]

Restricitng certain cars to one type of transmission would not add anything at all to that enjoyment. it would simply make me not be arsed with certain cars and I think thats the same for most people.

I think you're missing my point. You're going to buy a new transmission anyway.. you can change it there if you want, from auto to manual or vice versa.

All I'm saying is that the game should not offer cars with a certain type of transmission from the dealership when that car does not even have that transmission type in real life.

For example, if you go to a dealership in real life and buy a Honda Odyssey or some other "daily driver" type of car, most of them are available ONLY with an automatic transmission. You cannot buy them with a manual transmission, period.. they don't even MAKE it. So why should you be allowed to do so in the game? If you want manual, you'll have to replace the entire transmission.. just like in real life. Which you're probably going to do ANYWAY, so what difference does it make?

I just don't think it's very realistic to say "Oh, I think I'll make this car an automatic today", then twenty minutes later, you change your mind and drive it as a manual. That's not realistic... I don't have the option of changing the transmission in my Tempo to suit my whim, I shouldn't be able to do it in the most realistic driving simulator, either.

 

[Dave A]

No I'm not in anyway missing your point, I'm saying it will add nothing to the fun rather it will add to the tedium. Fun is not having to buy a new gearbox for every car everytime you want to change the transmission or everytime someone else has a go who races with a different transmission, that to me is not going to be fun in any way, but frustrating in many.

It's not veryrealistic to still be alive after a 200Mph crash, but your not complaining about that are you, it's not very realistic to drive a car via the power of a pad, but you live with that. It's not very realistic to not feel any g-force, you draw the line somewhere. And finally, GT4 isn't the most realistic driving simulator.

 

[Patrik]

No I'm not in anyway missing your point, I'm saying it will add nothing to the fun rather it will add to the tedium. Fun is not having to buy a new gearbox for every car everytime you want to change the transmission or everytime someone else has a go who races with a different transmission, that to me is not going to be fun in any way, but frustrating in many.

It's not veryrealistic to still be alive after a 200Mph crash, but your not complaining about that are you, it's not very realistic to drive a car via the power of a pad, but you live with that. It's not very realistic to not feel any g-force, you draw the line somewhere.

OMG now you're exaggerating!!! the thing is that this is not hard at all to do! and its more realistic. seems to you like when they make one detail more realistic they have to do the whole game REAL!!!

 

[Dave A]

No I'm just making a point that a line is drawn somewhere, I'm not the only person that plays my copy of GT4, my gf does and she always uses auto, if I have every car set for manual then I'd need to buy an auto box for every car too or vice versa, you do that for 700 cars and tell me if your having a good time. Why do you want a feature that will not add to the games fun, realistic or not it won't make the game more fun. If you think I'm against making the game more real think again, I've had people tell me I want it too real. But I still think this is a crap idea an my reasons are valid ones, fine if you still like it, I have no problem with that, I'm simply saying what I think and my reasons why. But I expect you to have no problem with me not liking it too.

 

[Patrik]

No I'm just making a point that a line is drawn somewhere, I'm not the only person that plays my copy of GT4, my gf does and she always uses auto, if I have every car set for manual then I'd need to buy an auto box for every car too or vice versa, you do that for 700 cars and tell me if your having a good time. Why do you want a feature that will not add to the games fun, realistic or not it won't make the game more fun. If you think I'm against making the game more real think again, I've had people tell me I want it too real. But I still think this is a crap idea an my reasons are valid ones, fine if you still like it, I have no problem with that, I'm simply saying what I think and my reasons why. But I expect you to have no problem with me not liking it too.

i cant talk to you anymore... you'll never understand anyway...

 

[Dave A]

Understand what, that by making you have to buy a new car or gearbox to change from Auto to Manual or vice versa is a good idea. No I won't, I think it's crap. As I said, you buy a new gearbox for 700 cars in GT4 and tell me if it's fun.

 

[Patrik]

Understand what, that by making you have to buy a new car or gearbox to change from Auto to Manual or vice versa is a good idea. No I won't, I think it's crap. As I said, you buy a new gearbox for 700 cars in GT4 and tell me if it's fun.

no, ok. its not fun... well, maybe you'r right... all the cars should be able to choose between AT and MT. but dont you agree with me that they should fix the sound of it so the shifting when you have AT is soft and smoth...

 

[Dave A]

Yeah I'll agree with that. A posible solution to this would be in the options have an all cars default to auto, or an all cars default to manual option or an as they should be option. That way you can have the best of both worlds. The thing is I like the idea of having to look through the used cars and not pick one because of the transmission ect, but I also know that at times that will frustrate the hell out of me. If I can just defaultthe cars to Auto for Charlotte for a time then switch them back to as they should be, I'd have far less of a problem.

 

[niky]

Hmmm... what about "manu-matics"? While I agree that an option at the dealership is nice, I think that they should also put the transmission type on the info sheet.

That said, it is possible to shift "traditional" automatics using the 1-2-D-OD option. For most four-speed ATs, you can shift manually from 1-2 by using the shift lever, 2-D in the same way, and D-OD using the overdrive button. What PD should do is allow you to shift 1-2-D-and O/D. In D, the car will automatically downshift as you slow down and upshift as you speed up. In OD, it will still automatically downshift and upshift, but slower. If you choose to "row" through the gears, it'll be slightly faster than in D. Then you could have lower-speed lock-up torque converters and AT coolers. Much fun!

The Honda Fit CVT in-game actually acts like a CVT. And that's a car that OUGHT to allow you to shift seven-speed style, as it has a 7-speed simulation mode... but it would be nice to get it in manual... and in the sports trim.

And the "traditional" ATs act just like traditional ATs, poor power-conversion, delivery, and slow shifting, at least, that's what it feels like. Would be nice if torque-braking were more accurately simulated, but since they let you torque brake manuals in the game, too, there's not much difference.

 

[German Muscle]

this thread needs less bickering and more list making.

I think that cars should be limited to what they are in real life like Jedi said, If a car in real life is Auto then you can only buy it with Auto and vice versa for anything else. You shouldnt be able to change the transmission in the game untill you buy a Full racing Transmission.

Also Auto transmissions would be more realistic if they would make them shift like autos. I can get most cars to shift like an auto in real life and its just right. GTs autos go to redline no matter what, real autos shift based on throttle and some other things. If they fixed how the auto shifted then this would be fixed. Enthusia got it almost dead on. And yes this does matter to me because its a really simple thing to fix and does add to the realism factor.

I should be on the Polyphony development team, i know i could figure out alot of things that needs to be fixed in the GT series that would please pretty much everyone and i would bring a ton of awesome ideas to the table that they arent even thinking about.

 

[crimson_menace]

I agree with you, Buick, but also there is the option in 'real life' to swap out the cars original tranny for the other. It'd be cool if PD actuall put in a 'Custom' shop where you could actually do that, and similar things to your car, as well as the bodykits, paint, etc., yadda-yadda-yadda.

 

[niky]

I used to make my traditional AT shift like an MT by using the stick and juggling with the OD button to get the 3-4 shift right, so it's not totally unrealistic to get the car to redline.

But yeah, if the computer does the shifting, it should cap early... which, come to think of it... IT DOES.

 

[darkwind]

Ehhh, I have mixed feelings on this. OK not really. Fix sounds: yes. Locked transmission until you buy a racing tranny and then lock it again: no.

As a GTer who recently discovered the joy of manual through trying to squeeze as much time out of a 0-400m test, I've gained a lot of experience in the "I can make my car go faster with a manual as long as it's in a straight line."

However, before you flame me for that idiotic phrase. Once I got used to manual on 0-400M tests, I took it to the tracks. Did one lap on auto, decent time, not the godly times of many of the racers here on GTP, but decent. Put the car on manual, my times bombed, a full 5 seconds slower in some parts.

I guess what I'm getting at is that some people actually LIKE being able to "switch transmissions on a whim." It certainly does save time and credits.

 

[Patrik]

this thread needs less bickering and more list making.

I think that cars should be limited to what they are in real life like Jedi said, If a car in real life is Auto then you can only buy it with Auto and vice versa for anything else. You shouldnt be able to change the transmission in the game untill you buy a Full racing Transmission.

Also Auto transmissions would be more realistic if they would make them shift like autos. I can get most cars to shift like an auto in real life and its just right. GTs autos go to redline no matter what, real autos shift based on throttle and some other things. If they fixed how the auto shifted then this would be fixed. Enthusia got it almost dead on. And yes this does matter to me because its a really simple thing to fix and does add to the realism factor.

I should be on the Polyphony development team, i know i could figure out alot of things that needs to be fixed in the GT series that would please pretty much everyone and i would bring a ton of awesome ideas to the table that they arent even thinking about.

we should join eachother and email Polyphony! i totaly agree with you! and i think i know pretty much other stuff that would be great in GT series...

 

[Dave A]

If you e-mail PD they will either ignor you or send an e-mail back saying thanks but we arn't even going to look twice at your e-mail. It's a Sony company policy to not accept any ideas from consumer sources like e-mails from you or me that arn't being taken in a controlled environment. It avoids potential legal problems later on.

 

[Patrik]

If you e-mail PD they will either ignor you or send an e-mail back saying thanks but we arn't even going to look twice at your e-mail. It's a Sony company policy to not accept any ideas from consumer sources like e-mails from you or me that arn't being taken in a controlled environment. It avoids potential legal problems later on.

ok

 

[Arwin]

Eck. What a lame discussion. You should simply make a distinction between realistic transmission types and in-game driving aids.

I'm all for offering realistic transmission options in the game, as they are already doing here and there - some cars that are only available as Automatic and which cannot be set to MT have realistic automatic transmission simulation. I think they're on the right track with this.

At the same time, the option to use AT for cars in your garage that have a manual transmission should be available as a driving aid, like you can run with or without TCS and ASM on all cars.

 

[slayer48]

I agree with Jedi's post on the previous page, especially the bit about the so-called "automatics" in the current GT games simply acting like manuals that are shifted without you pressing the button. When starting from a stop, there is clearly a period when the clutch is depressed before launch, shifting always waits for redline, and there is never any evidence of slippage, ever. This has bugged me since GT1. However I must agree with others in this thread who have said that a car should always be the option of switching, if only as a driving aid. So, perhaps it could work in such a way that if the car is equipped (predetermined at purchase) with a stick shift, some kind of "shift aid" can be enabled, acting like the "automatic" mode in previous GT installments (still the manual tranny, but no need to remember to shift). However, if the car is equipped with an automatic, it should act exactly like its real life counterpart, complete with throttle-sensitive upshifts, slippage (and lockup), brake torquing and idle drive. A "manu-matic" mode has been suggested as well, and is a great idea as an option for automatics, as a counterpart to the manual's aforementioned "shift aid." So there would be four possible shifting modes: Manual, shift-aided manual, automatic, and manu-matic. So no matter which tranny a car has, you can still choose whether to shift yourself or not. But the car would still behave like it has whatever type of tranny it has, being both more realistic and more accommodating to people with different preferences.