Australians: Are you sick of hearing about the "Bali 9"

[LeMansAid]

As well as smuggling drugs yes. I'm only mentioning the murders more frequently because people seem to forget about that...

Anything else that people should be charged with murder for selling? Alcohol perhaps?

 

[Com Fox]

Anything else that people should be charged with murder for selling? Alcohol perhaps?

Any murder is bad but murder for illegal drugs, whether right or wrong deserves a penalty no matter how harsh it is. You do it in another country... Tough 🤬 you should know how they work in the first place.

Sorry for being agressive with this but I'm jist sick of hearing sympathy for them on the news

 

[jimipitbull]

Any murder is bad but murder for illegal drugs, whether right or wrong deserves a penalty no matter how harsh it is. You do it in another country... Tough 🤬 you should know how they work in the first place.

Sorry for being agressive with this but I'm jist sick of hearing sympathy for them on the news

Heroin aka diamorphine is used by hospitals around the world. Are they all involved in this murder conspiracy?

 

[LeMansAid]

Any murder is bad but murder for illegal drugs, whether right or wrong deserves a penalty no matter how harsh it is. You do it in another country... Tough 🤬 you should know how they work in the first place.

The only party talking murder in reference to them is you. The "other" country has nothing to do with it.

If I'm right - by your logic, a person who sells drugs is guilty of murder because their consumers may die from taking those drugs. Why should it not be the same for alcohol and other things that people might kill themselves with then?

Legality/illegality is a separate issue.

 

[Mike Rotch]

To the OP's question; yes, tired of hearing about them, seeing them on every news broadcast and every MSM website.

Bottom line is they smuggled drugs into a country that has the death penalty for smuggling drugs. That they "saw" the error of their ways and repented and made pretty art is great, but ultimately irrelevant. If they hadn't gotten caught, would they have followed the same angelic path? Unlikely, they would have just smuggled more heroin.

Could the Indonesian PM have showed mercy for political reasons? Maybe. Should he have? Probably. But he didn't.

If the lives of two convicted drug smugglers could stop being put on a pedestal, that would be sweet. They aren't heroes. They are convicted criminals.

 

[Com Fox]

This the point where I realised I might've messed up a few sentences .

The ringleaders have also commited murder as well as smuggling drugs...

though what @Mike Rotch said pretty much sums up what I say in a neat way .

 

[LeMansAid]

If the lives of two convicted drug smugglers could stopped being put on a pedestal, that would be sweet. They aren't heroes. They are convicted criminals.

Pffft..... "heroes". Who's calling them heroes? When you place yourself at one extreme with silly hyperbole, you encourage the fervency of those at the other extreme.

The ringleaders have also commited murder as well as smuggling drugs...

I didn't know that. Can you point me to an article of some sort that explains it? A quick net search yielded nothing.

 

[Com Fox]

Pffft..... "heroes". Who's calling them heroes? When you place yourself at one extreme with silly hyperbole, you encourage the fervency of those at the other extreme.



I didn't know that. Can you point me to an article of some sort that explains it? A quick net search yielded nothing.

The net searches are too field with all the bull:censored: we hear now , there were some good ones before. All I found was this in 2005 http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2005/12/22/1135032130143.html?from=rss

 

[Mike Rotch]

Pffft..... "heroes". Who's calling them heroes? When you place yourself at one extreme with silly hyperbole, you encourage the fervency of those at the other extreme.

That is my interpretation of articles such as this. You are welcome to disagree with my opinion, or slot my opinion into some nonsense statement as you have. Or agree with it. I don't care

 

[FoRiZon]

Ill never compare a drug smugglers to a mass murder. But really, atleast the law is towards the concrete problem, not purely political.

Now, Australia temporarily pull off their embassy. No sign of economic penalty, but i guess it wouldnt be.

Also, why the Twitter outraged suddenly, or it is just me.

 

[Com Fox]

Ill never compare a drug smugglers to a mass murder.

Now, Australia temporarily pull off their embassy. No sign of economic penalty, but i guess it wouldnt be.

Also, why the Twitter outraged suddenly, or it is just me.

Like I said, my English in this discussion was very poor

 

[LeMansAid]

this.

Heroes!!

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2005/12/22/1135032130143.html?from=rss

Murderer!!

Seek and you will find. Apparently if it's not even there.

 

[Com Fox]

Heroes!!

Murderer!!

Seek and you will find. Apparently if it's not even there.

Like I said, it is now much harder to refind the sources when it is filled is Australian Patriotic bull:censored: this is closest I got.

 

[FoRiZon]

Wow. Last i saw the execution in Singapore, it was by hanging rather than firing. Their response to their action were exactly like Indonesia to this day.

And yet Indonesian got more flak. While the Singapore even been modeled by US to combat drug trafficking.

Talk about double standard. Just because Singapore are economically more viable?

Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_Singapore#Misuse_of_Drugs_Act

 

[jimipitbull]

Wow. Last i saw the execution in Singapore, it was by hanging rather than firing. Their response to their action were exactly like Indonesia to this day.

And yet Indonesian got more flak. While the Singapore even been modeled by US to combat drug trafficking.

Talk about double standard. Just because Singapore are economically more viable?

The difference is after 10 years in jail, these guys were seemingly successfully rehabilitated, and even helping other prisoners to rehabilitate. To kill them after that, does not send a good message regarding rehabilitation in the Indonesian jail system.

 

[Com Fox]

The difference is after 10 years in jail, these guys were seemingly successfully rehabilitated, and even helping other prisoners to rehabilitate. To kill them after that, does not send a good message regarding rehabilitation in the Indonesian jail system.

I always believed that he past should never be forgotten. Just because there were Good deeds done doesn't mean we should forget what they've done.

I don't think anyone deserves to get away scot-free without an opposite equal reaction and that "equal reaction" is not for Australia to decide because it wasn't in our territory.

 

[FoRiZon]

The difference is after 10 years in jail, these guys were seemingly successfully rehabilitated, and even helping other prisoners to rehabilitate. To kill them after that, does not send a good message regarding rehabilitation in the Indonesian jail system.

Perhaps youre right. It most likely because of how permissive the previous president to keep the relations "cool". Its when the current ones enforcing the law they finally put on death row i presume.

(Broken) Moral: If someone convicted, just quickly execute them. Its quite a sight considering it basically a repeat of the same case in Singapore, only much faster in jail.

 

[jimipitbull]

I always believed that he past should never be forgotten. Just because there were Good deeds done doesn't mean we should forget what they've done.

I don't think anyone deserves to get away scot-free without an opposite equal reaction and that "equal reaction" is not for Australia to decide because it wasn't in our territory.

Spending the rest of your life in jail is not getting away scot free.

 

[Com Fox]

Spending the rest of your life in jail is not getting away scot free.

True but according to Indonesia that isn't an "equal reaction". No matter what anyone in Australia thinks, since the broke Indonesian laws.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Talk about double standard. Just because Singapore are economically more viable?

Call me a cynic, but Singapore hasn't executed an Australian.

In the aftermath of the executions, the Chan and Sukumaran families declared that their sons had asked for mercy, but received none - the implication being that they were promised or entitled to it. They weren't. They were entitled to request it, but they were never guaranteed it.

I don't know how the case is being reported in Indonesia, but down here, it has received massive amounts of media attention. And in the past two days, they have crossed over into a near cult of personality. If you weren't familiar with the case, you would think that they were innocent men, unfairly facing execution. Everyone seemed to forget that they were convicted criminals.

For what it's worth, please do not read too much into the idiots who want to boycott Indonesia as a form of protest. Because like I said, it comes down to letting you be a nation. And I think that is far more important than the appeals for clemency for two convicted criminals.

 

[FoRiZon]

Call me a cynic, but Singapore hasn't executed an Australian.

In the aftermath of the executions, the Chan and Sukumaran families declared that their sons had asked for mercy, but received none - the implication being that they were promised or entitled to it. They weren't. They were entitled to request it, but they were never guaranteed it.

I don't know how the case is being reported in Indonesia, but down here, it has received massive amounts of media attention. And in the past two days, they have crossed over into a near cult of personality. If you weren't familiar with the case, you would think that they were innocent men, unfairly facing execution. Everyone seemed to forget that they were convicted criminals.

For what it's worth, please do not read too much into the idiots who want to boycott Indonesia as a form of protest. Because like I said, it comes down to letting you be a nation. And I think that is far more important than the appeals for clemency for two convicted criminals.

Well over here, it breaks up to 2 sides. One is basically "they deserved to be killed because they had spread drugs that kills millions of people" and then pointed out about Australian government weaknesses. The other is "i dont think the killings solves majority of drug problem, but law should be respected regardless". Both however, are very concerning about the post-execution diplomatic sanctions and is now in talk with Indonesian foreign affairs.

I should note that its not just Australia in this case. Theres Mary Jane from Philippines, a Brazillian, France, and some more. I also note that some of the convicted death are being reduced at this time period. Some of our media are also ponited out about why "western" countries like Australia and France are gone straight into treathening economic sanction while the Philippines and such come to discuss with Indonesian government about the execution.

 

[Barra333]

To the OP's question; yes, tired of hearing about them, seeing them on every news broadcast and every MSM website.

Bottom line is they smuggled drugs into a country that has the death penalty for smuggling drugs. That they "saw" the error of their ways and repented and made pretty art is great, but ultimately irrelevant. If they hadn't gotten caught, would they have followed the same angelic path? Unlikely, they would have just smuggled more heroin.

Could the Indonesian PM have showed mercy for political reasons? Maybe. Should he have? Probably. But he didn't.

If the lives of two convicted drug smugglers could stop being put on a pedestal, that would be sweet. They aren't heroes. They are convicted criminals.

Well said. It is impossible to get into countries like Indonesia/Malaysia/Singapore without knowing that the penalty for drug smuggling is death. Whether you agree with it or not, the risks are/were well known. If you don't carry drugs, then the harshness of the law is irrelevant. The stuff that I have read online from our government is appalling. I could maybe understand if the crime they were charged with was not a crime in Australia, but it is.

Pffft..... "heroes". Who's calling them heroes? When you place yourself at one extreme with silly hyperbole, you encourage the fervency of those at the other extreme.



I didn't know that. Can you point me to an article of some sort that explains it? A quick net search yielded nothing.

That is my interpretation of articles such as this. You are welcome to disagree with my opinion, or slot my opinion into some nonsense statement as you have. Or agree with it. I don't care

That article made them out to be martyrs. Trying to bring drugs to the needy addicts and tourists in Bali .

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Both however, are very concerning about the post-execution diplomatic sanctions and is now in talk with Indonesian foreign affairs.

I don't think that there is anything to worry about. Our government loves nothing more than a foreign leader that they can talk tough about, because it distracts from their domestic issues.

 

[Grayfox]

Lets say they did not get caught.

They would have smuggled 8KG of heroine into the country worth about 4million.
People that try it or use it get hooked.
They spend every bit of money they have buying more drugs to suppress their cravings for it.
They loose their job.
They then run out of money so they start stealing from friends and family which is easiest option for them.
Then their friends and family say no.
They then go out break into peoples homes to steal things, injure anyone who gets in their way just to support their habit.
They sometimes drive while under the effects.
They get arrested for theft and or driving while under the effects of an illicit drug.
The tax payer has to pay for their rehab while in jail which includes drugs like methadone to break their habbit.

All of this can easily be well over $500,000.
But hey they should not die even if their actions could cause the deaths of hundreds.

 

[croozer_63]

Anything else that people should be charged with murder for selling? Alcohol perhaps?

Definitely tobacco. How many millions of lives have been totally ruined by that ****. When I was an impressionable adolescent there were actually ads for that crap on prime time TV, telling us, 12yo's, how cool and sophisticated smoking is. The government and the medical profession have known from WW1 the terminal effects of tobacco, and still the maggots allow it to be sold. Nothing short of wholesale manslaughter, if not straight out murder. Very easy profits to be made preying on peoples addictions. Alcohol is really not much better either. Millions of people addicted to another"acceptable" drug. The world and life itself are beautiful things, to be enjoyed. You really don't need mind altering substances to get the most out of life. Your brain works far better being powered by clean water and good fresh air, just how it was intended to function.

 

[Grayfox]

Definitely tobacco. How many millions of lives have been totally ruined by that ****. When I was an impressionable adolescent there were actually ads for that crap on prime time TV, telling us, 12yo's, how cool and sophisticated smoking is. The government and the medical profession have known from WW1 the terminal effects of tobacco, and still the maggots allow it to be sold. Nothing short of wholesale manslaughter, if not straight out murder. Very easy profits to be made preying on peoples addictions. Alcohol is really not much better either. Millions of people addicted to another"acceptable" drug. The world and life itself are beautiful things, to be enjoyed. You really don't need mind altering substances to get the most out of life. Your brain works far better being powered by clean water and good fresh air, just how it was intended to function.

The government gets taxes from it.
If they taxed cannabis it would be legal too.

Plus if a country like Australia were to make Tobacco illegal every single tobacco company would take Australia to the international court.
The tobacco companies tried to prevent plain packaging on boxes

 

[Pseudopod]

Of course they don't deserve death. Only barbarians still practice the death penalty.

That they're getting it for just moving goods that others want to buy makes it even worse.

 

[Com Fox]

Of course they don't deserve death. Only barbarians still practice the death penalty.

That they're getting it for just moving goods that others want to buy makes it even worse.

So even though this would happen and what they recently have done...

Lets say they did not get caught.

They would have smuggled 8KG of heroine into the country worth about 4million.
People that try it or use it get hooked.
They spend every bit of money they have buying more drugs to suppress their cravings for it.
They loose their job.
They then run out of money so they start stealing from friends and family which is easiest option for them.
Then their friends and family say no.
They then go out break into peoples homes to steal things, injure anyone who gets in their way just to support their habit.
They sometimes drive while under the effects.
They get arrested for theft and or driving while under the effects of an illicit drug.
The tax payer has to pay for their rehab while in jail which includes drugs like methadone to break their habbit.

All of this can easily be well over $500,000.
But hey they should not die even if their actions could cause the deaths of hundreds.

They don't deserve punishment in countries that has a huge drug problem with drug dealing that needs to be resolved ASAP (I'm not saying this is the best solution to their problem but it's one of them).



Probably how much I hate about this event is that this makes Australia look like the biggest 🤬 country in the world, makes me feel a bit a shamed to be born here despite me being against Patriotism to begin with.

 

[Pseudopod]

So even though this would happen and what they recently have done...

What did they do other than smuggle drugs? Doesn't matter though. They still don't deserve death.

 

[Com Fox]

What did they do other than smuggle drugs? Doesn't matter though. They still don't deserve death.

Even when, Andrew Chan even threatened one of the Bali 9s members families lives in order to fulfill their goals.

Would I deserve death If I forced you to smuggle drugs or your Family Dies...? I think I would.