BMW or Camry, now with money!

[RDF97]

Before you decide to keep the Camry may I just post this:

Thats brilliant. Where did you find it?

Anyways, If someone wants to trade your car for theirs and the risk is the car your being offered is worse now and will ruin you for your car that won't make you want to kill yourself, keep the Toyota Camry

 

[hawkeye122]

So, I sucked it up and dropped the $900 on the clutch, and now the Camry runs like a champ.
205,000 miles and still ticking like a clock.

Anywho. Here's my new thing: The Camry was "Given" to me (My father still holds the title, but it is supposedly mine) and my father then took the Tracker to be his own, which has constantly had issues.
It randomly decided to not start the other day, and then later decided it did indeed want to fire. I could let my father deal with it himself, but that isnt right. Come September, I will have saved sufficient monies to purchase a new car- not the 1.5K of before, but closer to 7K.
After doing this, I plan to return the Camry to him- Reliable transportation for years to come.

In the meantime, I'm currently evaluating the market around me, and have a few questions...

As members may know, I quite fancy a BMW 3-series. Why? I actually had the chance to drive one which belonged to a friend the other day(2002 325Ci), and everything I surmised was true: Comfortable, "Accessible" power, decent ride, good handling, and a solid 24 MPG whilst driving around town.
One of the more seasoned GTPers had explained to me that E36's were just electronic enough to be a hassle, and not that great anyways. They recommended an E30, or if I could afford it, an E46.
E46's seem to be plentiful, and thats where I'm starting. Already I have a query, however...

I hear rumblings that the Automatic gearboxes are prone to failure if the fluid hasnt been replaced. So obviously a manual is the better choice, but when a clutch kit is $1000 plus labor, in addition to the fact that the previous owner thought he had a race car and may have munched the internals, which is the safer bet?

I would prefer a 2-door over a 4-door, but I am sure that impacts the insurance price a bit. On the other hand, the 2-door has a bit more space in the front, which is useful if you're 6'4", and mostly leg.

In theory, I want to spend LESS THAN 6000 on the car, and plan to put the rest of the money into a nice savings account where it will chill until an issue arises.

Sound good?

 

[Doog]

An E46 is an excellent choice if your budget is about $10k, which seems to be enough to buy a 330i/Ci in good condition with reasonable miles, but for $6k most will have something near your Camry's mileage. An early 323i/Ci is the best bet, being the base and therefore most depreciated E46 you can get. Every BMW owner will tell you that their cars are reliable, but you have to keep up on maintenance. A sparingly maintained Bimmer is a money pit. Find one with the lowest miles possible within your price range, and have it looked over by a mechanic, but that pretty much goes without saying. A quick search reveals that it's possible to find a 323i with reasonable miles (100k or less) for the budget, less so for 323Cis which seem to go for the same price, but with nearer to 150k miles and questionable ads. A 328i/Ci seems to be a bit out of reach, though.

 

[Wolfe]

$6000 should also be plenty to get a nice E30 of any year/model (not the M3 obviously). Of those, the late M42-powered 318i models are the best choice, IMO, with fuel mileage in the 30s and a weight difference of about 500lbs. compared to the 323i/Ci to make up for the missing 30hp. A 325i would be good too. Finding one would be the thing. I don't know what the classifieds look like around where you are, but you could try enthusiasts' forums for some listings. I presume California is a good place to be for that.

If you follow Doog's advice on maintenance/inspection, neither is a bad choice. 👍

 

[hawkeye122]

A 330ci was never in the cards. I figured right away that they're more pricey. I was looking more toward a 325 (01 was the first year?) Ci or i with the sport package. I wouldn't mind a 323 so much, but as they're older they had more miles on them. Obviously 200k is too much, but I see a lot around 120-140, is that too much?

I will look deeper into the sedans though. There appears to be more of them, and they're cheaper too.

Thanks for the suggestions guys! Anybody else with info is more than welcome to tell me I'm out of my mind

I live in Redding, but have given myself a 300 mile radius, which covers up to Eugene, Oregon, and down to the Bay Area/Sacramento. The Bay seems to be filled with them, and they're a bit cheaper on the whole.

 

[Wolfe]

For mileage, it's not entirely greater=bad and fewer=better. Between 100k and 200k miles is a bit of a question mark, because that's when some of the longer-lasting original parts will start to come due for replacement, or items with a life of 70k-80k will come up again. In my view, a car in the higher 100k range with a good maintenance history is better than a car in the lower 100k range.

The manufacturer's service schedule is a good resource for what to expect.

 

[homeforsummer]

I'd not necessarily discount an E36. They were known for handling better than the E30 in the press at the time (stock, at any rate - start modifiying the lighter E30 and the tables reverse) and better than earlier E46s too, which were accused of being a bit floppy and having too-light steering until some revisions in around 00/01.

But E36s are generally well-built and you don't seem to be living in the rust belt so there shouldn't be any problems there either. As far as I'm aware, electronics aren't a major issue on them, certainly not next to the odd suspension or brake issue. And as others have said, provided you get one that looks like it's been well cared-for problems should be minimized anyway.

 

[hawkeye122]

I'd not necessarily discount an E36. They were known for handling better than the E30 in the press at the time (stock, at any rate - start modifiying the lighter E30 and the tables reverse) and better than earlier E46s too, which were accused of being a bit floppy and having too-light steering until some revisions in around 00/01.

But E36s are generally well-built and you don't seem to be living in the rust belt so there shouldn't be any problems there either. As far as I'm aware, electronics aren't a major issue on them, certainly not next to the odd suspension or brake issue. And as others have said, provided you get one that looks like it's been well cared-for problems should be minimized anyway.

The E36's seem to have been given quite a bit more thrashing, and they generally look less "New".

If I found an E30, I'd worry about turning it into a money pit... Aftermarket this, lighter that, Roll Cage... It would end up being a Spec E30, which isnt exactly practical. But if I ran across a 1991 which wasn't totally trashed I'd certainly consider it.

Still looking for a bit of input on transmission choice. The auto is "Prone to failure" but so is a poorly driven manual, which I have no way of actually checking...

I believe the moonroof adds thickness to the roof, making it harder for me to sit upright. So that's a consideration as well.

I'm aware that getting a BMW isn't exactly a "Cheap" prospect, but I think it's one I'd like to undertake. Hence the proposed 2k "Emergency" fund- which ought to cover most things other than a WHOLE engine or a WHOLE gearbox.

So it does sound as if condition is much better than just mileage. I agree with that, but that does make it substantially harder to view vehicles, given the large geographic area I'm searching...

Ah well, thanks guys! Any more info anybody may have is welcome

 

[White & Nerdy]

Once again, have it checked by a mechanic. I'm not sure how thoroughly it would be possible to have the transmission checked, but that could answer your questions.

Just go with a manual. Automatic transmissions are wrong even when they work right.

Forget the moonroof, it'll probably raise the c.g. and it's one more thing to go wrong.

 

[hawkeye122]

Once again, have it checked by a mechanic. I'm not sure how thoroughly it would be possible to have the transmission checked, but that could answer your questions.

Just go with a manual. Automatic transmissions are wrong even when they work right.

Forget the moonroof, it'll probably raise the c.g. and it's one more thing to go wrong.

So the inspection is a go.

While I would much rather have a manual also, the ZF gearbox on those costs something to the tune of $4000 to get replaced. All it takes is one jackass who tried to slam it into second too hard and I'm screwed. Also I'd have to get the clutch replaced... again. I'm rather sick of doing that.

And I really dont WANT the moonroof, but not because it's heavier. It's purely a headroom decision..
While slapping a massive rear wing and a front splitter with dive planes on it, whilst removing the passenger seats and carpets and door cards is TEMPTING, it's not exactly what I'd call practical. For now, it's just supposed to be a bit of transportation which isn't boring as hell.

 

[White & Nerdy]

I would suggest engine modifications, but you live in California and any upgrades you make will probably cause it to fail inspection. So get rid of any conveniently placed sound deadening (which, as an added bonus, will let more lovely BMW I6 sounds in) and any power accessories you don't use or don't need. I would also suggest chucking the AC and rolling down the windows to stay cool, but I'm not sure if rolling the windows down is actually effective in warmer climates.

 

[Clark]

You're not going to get much wrong with a manual gearbox in an E30, and the engines are good to.

The only think unreliable I know about E30 is that although it's a good engine the M42 in the 318is is prone to blowing head gaskets.


E36s are as cheap as they're ever going to be now. It's what I'd go for when you're on a budget.

 

[hawkeye122]

I would suggest engine modifications, but you live in California and any upgrades you make will probably cause it to fail inspection. So get rid of any conveniently placed sound deadening (which, as an added bonus, will let more lovely BMW I6 sounds in) and any power accessories you don't use or don't need. I would also suggest chucking the AC and rolling down the windows to stay cool, but I'm not sure if rolling the windows down is actually effective in warmer climates.

It's 110 degrees on a good day here. I'll go ahead and keep the A/C. Along with all the other stuff.

If I see an E36 that has been well taken-care of, I'd think about it.

Feel free to look on the SF Craigslist, E46's abound in my price range

 

[White & Nerdy]

Then suspension, tires, and brakes. I can't beleive I forgot those last two. If it gets that hot where you live, you can probably roll around on summer tires 24/7/365. Better brakes and better cooling for them will help to beat the heat. Other than that, try and find some aero upgrades that won't make the car too impractical - even a small spoiler will reduce both drag and lift, providing a benefit to both fuel economy and performance.

 

[Harry6784]

try and find some aero upgrades that won't make the car too impractical - even a small spoiler will reduce both drag and lift, providing a benefit to both fuel economy and performance.

Extra downforce doubles as a third row!