Britain - The Official Thread

  • Thread starter Ross
  • 13,347 comments
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How will you vote in the 2024 UK General Election?

  • Conservative Party

    Votes: 2 6.9%
  • Green Party

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Labour Party

    Votes: 14 48.3%
  • Liberal Democrats

    Votes: 2 6.9%
  • Other (Wales/Scotland/Northern Ireland)

    Votes: 1 3.4%
  • Other Independents

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Other Parties

    Votes: 2 6.9%
  • Spoiled Ballot

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Will Not/Cannot Vote

    Votes: 8 27.6%

  • Total voters
    29
  • Poll closed .
As a first-generation immigrant I don't feel like pulling up the drawbridge. People came over here to fill an economic gap using the free movement they enjoyed under the EU. The Poles have largely returned to Poland where the standard of living is now higher. Immigration is everywhere and even British people work overseas.

If the country's going to the dogs, immigration isn't the root cause and if people are too ignorant to understand that it's an economic problem, not a cultural one then yes, we should address the problem of there being a lack of supply rather than blaming our problems on convenient foreign scapegoats. That's what helped to get us into the current Brexit mess which is "the problem" as far as I can see.

Enoch was right... far right.
Which is why there's the need to be careful now, particularly with how much we are importing of the US culture wars - you only have to look at the trans row that is still ongoing to appreciate this. It's easy to dismiss Farage as a dud now that Brexit has gone tits up, just as Americans can similarly ignore Trump, but the danger is a DeSantis like figure rising from the ashes and weaponising the stats to appeal to a population that feels left behind.
 
Which is why there's the need to be careful now, particularly with how much we are importing of the US culture wars - you only have to look at the trans row that is still ongoing to appreciate this. It's easy to dismiss Farage as a dud now that Brexit has gone tits up, just as Americans can similarly ignore Trump, but the danger is a DeSantis like figure rising from the ashes and weaponising the stats to appeal to a population that feels left behind.
Great. So we have to tiptoe around the fee-fees of the people who voted for this situation in the first place? That way we can FAAFO some more as a nation. There's no turning the following trend around unless we're collectively stupider* than I already thought we were - enough to swallow some new demagogue's blatant lies simply because they dovetail with our own prejudices.

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* I'm not using the term pejoratively.**

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** Well, maybe just a little.
 
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Idiocracy aside K seems to have a more rational take on immigration here than the ideologues running the current government. Judging by the video I posted Cruella seems to think the only good alien is a dead alien.
 
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Minister without portfolio Nadhim Zahawi tells nurses striking for a cost of living pay rise that it's sending the wrong message to Putin. Bloody hell, I should think that's the last thing on their minds right now.

 
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Minister without portfolio Nadhim Zahawi tells nurses striking for a cost of living pay rise that it's sending the wrong message to Putin. Bloody hell, I should think that's the last thing on their minds right now.


A. Nursing staff get paid pretty poorly for the job they do considering some have to pay for things like parking and food while on the job. But they work crazy hours sometimes pulling double shifts etc. so I support them wanting better pay in the light of the current Finacial crisis. So anyone in government should not be trying to make them feel bad by dragging the name of a genocidal maniac into the equation.

B. Putin won’t give two hoots about specific sectors strike action. He may be enjoying the chaos of all the strike action, all at once and seeing our government buckling under all this pressure.

These kinds of comments from MPs and Ministers are up there with things like “Don’t like what you earn, get a better job” etc.
 
A. Nursing staff get paid pretty poorly for the job they do considering some have to pay for things like parking and food while on the job. But they work crazy hours sometimes pulling double shifts etc. so I support them wanting better pay in the light of the current Finacial crisis. So anyone in government should not be trying to make them feel bad by dragging the name of a genocidal maniac into the equation.

B. Putin won’t give two hoots about specific sectors strike action. He may be enjoying the chaos of all the strike action, all at once and seeing our government buckling under all this pressure.

These kinds of comments from MPs and Ministers are up there with things like “Don’t like what you earn, get a better job” etc.
You'd think that'd all be pretty obvious to any reasonable person. But this is the guy who claimed nearly £6000 in taxpayer subsidies to keep his horses warm while telling the rest of us to tighten our belts.
****ing Tories!
 
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You'd think that'd all be pretty obvious to any reasonable person. But this is the guy who claimed nearly £6000 in taxpayer subsidies to keep his horses warm while telling the rest of us to tighten our belts.
****ing Tories!
We really need a huge shakeup in the UK, I just think Starmer is not the man to deliver it and quite frankly wee weeing into the same pot.
 
So Pie has something everyone should hear....(well, everyone who still is going to vote Tory at the next election anyway)

 
So Pie has something everyone should hear....(well, everyone who still is going to vote Tory at the next election anyway)
Everything of Pie's on YouTube is something everyone should hear.

More importantly, listening to Tom Walker's real take on politics is worth listening to as well.
 
Suella 'Thick as mince but wants to be Prime Minister' Braverman, has gayly announced that illegal immigration "must stop".

I'm still in favour of @PeterJB's idea of installing Suella Braverman scarecrows along the Dover coast to deter illegal immigrants arriving by boat (would that make her a scare-row?)
 
Suella 'Thick as mince but wants to be Prime Minister' Braverman, has gayly announced that illegal immigration "must stop".

I'm still in favour of @PeterJB's idea of installing Suella Braverman scarecrows along the Dover coast to deter illegal immigrants arriving by boat (would that make her a scare-row?)
Or just use a projector to project her image onto the white cliffs?
 
The floodgate has opened this side of the Twitter Atlantic - Graham Linehan is back on Twitter.
 
Jess... Oh, Jess...



Firstly, being ignorant of something isn't necessarily something of which you should be proud. These people are the people who are becoming famous, whether we like it or not, and if a kid turns round and says "Audrey Hepburn? Who the hell is that?" you'd sneer down your nose so hard at them you could see your own incisors. Well... more.

Above that, it is kind of your job to be engaged with popular culture. "Popular" and "Politician" both derive from the same root after all, and you can't represent the populace properly if you're not at least passingly familiar with popular things. In addition, Tate grew up in Britain, in the Labour-controlled Luton area currently represented by two of your colleagues (Sarah Owen, Rachel Hopkins) and most of his kickboxing career was UK-based.

However he's also been referenced repeatedly as an emerging anti-feminist "star" of social media, spouting misogynistic tripe out of his potato head, with this first coming to light in 2016 while he was on Big Brother (the UK version) - where he was removed from the show after less than a week over a video of him assaulting a woman.

It has significantly escalated since then, to the point where several social media sites banned him. Twitter, of course, recently unbanned him in line with its recent policies of only banning people who are mean about Elon Musk whether on Twitter or elsewhere.

Now, one might think that the SHADOW MINISTER FOR DOMESTIC VIOLENCE AND SAFEGUARDING would have had a chance to become aware of one of the loudest and most popular voices advocating that women should return to the 1950s idyll of being mere chattals for men, shouldn't drive, shouldn't work, can't be trusted, and should always put out, at some point in the last SIX BASTARD YEARS, but apparently you couldn't be bothered.

Oh and letting a woman be in charge of sex trafficking is called Ghislaine Maxwell. Slow clap for that one, Jess.
 
Slightly less chance of this one being removed at source, but Harry's book "Spare" is coming out next week.

If you don't get the reference, it's a phrase used to mean that monarchs need to produce "an heir, and a spare" - one kid to succeed them, and some others in case that one... didn't.

Which is an astonishingly self-pitying title; the implication is that William is the kid they wanted, and he's just there as a backup and therefore not wanted. I wonder what his aunts and uncles think about this concept that they're not wanted since they are, after all, spares for your own father, Harry. Do you see Anne/Andrew/Edward flopping about in misery because they won't be Queen/King (thanks to William and Harry), or their kids who are spares of spares? Princess Margaret didn't exactly wallow in self-pity, and come to think of it what will your daughter, Lilibet Mountbatten-Windsor, feel about being a "spare" for her brother Archie?

It's also pretty ignorant because... he's the great-grandson of a spare. He wouldn't be anywhere in the line of accession if his great-great-uncle Edward VIII hadn't, after years of carrying on with married women, suddenly decided he wanted to marry the most recent one got (an American celebrity, although this one was a socialite) now he was King. Forced to abdicate, it passed to his "spare" brother George VI.


That got me wondering, just how often spares get the job.

So I looked it up and it turns out that Charles is only the fourth ever first child of a monarch who was first child of a monarch - and should William acceded to the throne, he would be the first ever British or English monarch to be the first child of a monarch who was first child of a monarch who was first child of a monarch. There's never been primogeniture for four successive generations in the entire history of unified monarchs of England or Britain going right back to William I.

Going back 300 years we get one of the biggest messes ever (outside of Middle Ages wars), with the accession of George I; he was great-grandson of James I/VI, but there were six monarchs between them mostly down the side of James's eldest children, which at one point had married first cousins William IV/Mary jointly invited to the throne. Neither George's parents, nor grandparents, were ever on the throne.

His son, George II, succeeded him, but then George III was George II's grandson - Prince Frederick, George II's eldest son, died before his father, and III took the throne.

Two of III's kids became King - George IV and William IV - breaking primogeniture again, but none of them had legitimate heirs so it went back up the tree, along to George III's fifth kid Edward and, since he was also dead, down to his daughter Victoria.

She produced George V, and both his kids became King, taking us back to Edward VIII and George VI above.


By my count that's a spare every 100 years over the last 300 (which includes the three longest-reigning monarchs of all): George VI (second son of George V), Victoria (daughter of fourth son/fifth child of George III), William IV (third son of George III).

Before that, George I was a turbospare (great-grandson of James IV, via 12th child [Sophia] of second child [Elizabeth]), William & Mary were hyperspares (son of eldest child of Charles I and daughter of third son [James II] of Charles I), Anne was a spare (second daughter of James II), and James II was a spare (third son of Charles I); and technically Charles II was a spare as he had an older brother who might have been stillborn but I won't count that. Before that we're into all kinds of mayhem with the interregnum, various internal wars, princes in the tower, and so on).

I think that brings us up to seven in 400 years - 1625-2022 - or one every 57 years. We're 86 years (and a couple of weeks) from the last one.
 
From here on there probably won't be many "spares" on the throne, since these days any heir's chances of dying from smallpox or tuberculosis before they're 30 or being offed by either a jealous brother or cousin or a French prince who likes the look of Buckingham Palace are much lower than they were 500 years ago. We haven't had any abnormally early deaths from non-consort royals since Prince George in 1942 and his brother Prince John in 1919, neither of whom were anywhere near taking the throne.

Interesting though that Harry would describe himself in that way, as if he's now somehow jealous of not being the heir, since I imagine most other lesser royals are not envious of being in that position, as they enjoy a lot more freedoms than the heir to throne - such as the freedom to opt out of it all...
 
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It's not unknown for the heir to the throne to opt out like Harry's great-great uncle Edward.

Not being likely to read the book, I guess it's possible that the title is ironic humour (something we Blightians are supposed to possess in abundance) and that he doesn't mind being a redundant backup monarch-in-waiting especially as his bruv seems to have less hair apparent these days, possibly due to the weight of the crown-to-be.
 
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LBC are reporting that 65% of British people would like another vote on Brexit/rejoin the EU.
If only radio polls were as binding as referenda. Interestingly 82% of people who stayed at home for the previous vote now say they'd get off their arses to decide the future of the nation if given the chance.
 
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LBC are reporting that 65% of British people would like another vote on Brexit/rejoin the EU.
There have been plenty of political and economic analysis videos on Youtube about the implications of Northern Ireland rejoining Ireland, an independent Scotland and the headaches that could cause for NATO, how Russia would react to the UK breaking up, etc. I'm sure these discussions have been going on forever but unless Youtube algorithm is feeding me what I want to watch then the topic seems way more realistic than it has been in the past. Arguably all of that is the obvious best decision for Northern Ireland and Scotland as England seems fully intent on disolving the Empire all the way down to resodding their own back yard.

British leadership needs to get their crap together before they piss off the rest of NATO even worse than Turkey can manage.


Ah yes, the downside of the Judiciary in that their job is to interpret law, not morality. It's up to the people and their chosen representatives to interpret morality and put it into law. Unfortunately...



@UKMikey as for tiptoeing, no. Rotten kids go to timeout. Conservative types believe that bad people should be chastised and isolated from society so obviously they need to be given a taste of their own medicine, particularly for their efforts to destroy a functioning society. Let them be loud because the louder they are the easier they are to snuff out and isolate from the real world.
 
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