Car Behavior and Tire Temps after Patch 2.0PS4

[Cote Dazur]

It’s in the post I linked?

.
No it is not, for example are all the cars in the GT series irrespective of engine placement have the same optimum pressure for front and back tyres? Most like l’y not, so the one liner answer for whole series has no value.

 

[BrandonW77]

No it is not.

Yes it is?

Formula Cars (IndyCar, FX, FA, FR3.5): 1.7bar front / 1.45bar rear (24psi / 21psi) at road circuits. The Dallara IR-12 oval/speedway tires like up to 45psi on the right side.

Modern GT & LMP: ~1.8bar front and rear. Maybe down to 1.6bar for a very slow track like Long Beach or higher to 1.90-1.95bar at Le Mans to squeeze a little bit more off the rolling resistance.

Touring cars & V8 Supercar: 2.0-2.15bar front and rear

Ford Fusion: 2.4-2.6bar front and rear for road courses. Ovals might go to 3.0bar+ (45-50psi) on the right side

Light sportscars (Radical, BAC, KTM, etc): ~1.6bar (24psi)

Road car tires: All in the 2.1-2.2bar (29-32psi) range hot. Any MotorTrend readers will know how much they stop every few laps and bleed pressure to hold that target during the BDC tests.

Vintage GT: Roughly the same range as modern GT

Vintage Group 6 & Formula: Bit more flexible here. Something in the 1.7bar (25psi) range is usually a good starting point up to 2.0bar (29psi) or down to 1.2bar (17psi) to adjust for balance on something wild like the Lotus 72D

 

[Cote Dazur]

I can assure you it crystal clearly is not. At least 55 people were satisfied with the info in the post that was linked to. I think you'll be too if you read it again.

Even if 200 people liked that answer for whatever reason, it would not changed anything. Most people do not understand why tyre pressure is key and I guess one answer is better than nothing, also why is the thread locked after one brief and incomplete post?

 

[Cote Dazur]

Yes it is?

Formula Cars (IndyCar, FX, FA, FR3.5): 1.7bar front / 1.45bar rear (24psi / 21psi) at road circuits. The Dallara IR-12 oval/speedway tires like up to 45psi on the right side.

Modern GT & LMP: ~1.8bar front and rear. Maybe down to 1.6bar for a very slow track like Long Beach or higher to 1.90-1.95bar at Le Mans to squeeze a little bit more off the rolling resistance.

Touring cars & V8 Supercar: 2.0-2.15bar front and rear

Ford Fusion: 2.4-2.6bar front and rear for road courses. Ovals might go to 3.0bar+ (45-50psi) on the right side

Light sportscars (Radical, BAC, KTM, etc): ~1.6bar (24psi)

Road car tires: All in the 2.1-2.2bar (29-32psi) range hot. Any MotorTrend readers will know how much they stop every few laps and bleed pressure to hold that target during the BDC tests.

Vintage GT: Roughly the same range as modern GT

Vintage Group 6 & Formula: Bit more flexible here. Something in the 1.7bar (25psi) range is usually a good starting point up to 2.0bar (29psi) or down to 1.2bar (17psi) to adjust for balance on something wild like the Lotus 72D

So Brandon, all road cars have an optimum tyre pressure of 2.4 front and 2.6 back irrespective of engine placement and tyre type. Same for BMW 1m and Ferrari Enzo?

 

[Mr Tree]

The tirepresures are hot presures.

The diffrence in the pressure between tracks could also be correct. Tirepresure is pore then just finding the optimal griplevel or optimum rolling resistance (or lack thereof). It is a balance between these factors so if on the straights one can save the time his/hers harder tires lose in the curves it means its presure is more optimal for said track. So yes tracklayout 'changes' optimal tyrepressure.

 

[BrandonW77]

.
for example are all the cars in the GT series irrespective of engine placement have the same optimum pressure for front and back tyres? Most like l’y not, so the one liner answer for whole series has no value.

In this game I would expect that actually is the case, all the GT cars will have the same ideal pressures regardless of engine placement. I believe the devs have even said something to this effect.

also why is the thread locked after one brief and incomplete post?

Not uncommon for mods/staff to make a post that's meant only for information and not discussion so they lock the thread after the first post. Happens on all forums.

So Brandon, all road cars have an optimum tyre pressure of 2.4 front and 2.6 back irrespective of engine placement and tyre type. Same for BMW 1m and Ferrari Enzo?

In this game, sure. In other games probably not but I think this aspect is a bit simplified in PC2.

 

[Mr Tree]

Well I suppose the info you request is aquired through testing.

I'd find it odd if a tiremanufacturer would invest in test that would go any further than tiretemp and pressure that provides the optimal ballance between grip an rollingresistance on a 'generic' track.

So as a raceteam I geuss you would have to use that value as a base and start optimizing tirepressures per track.
So if you want the optimum pressure as you state is so important start testing?

If I made wrong assumption please correct me!

 

[Cote Dazur]

In this game, sure. In other games probably not but I think this aspect is a bit simplified in PC2.

Well I am not so sure it is that simplistic in PCars 2, not saying it is not, like you I don’t know.
I am just not ready to accept that for a game of the magnitude of PCars 2, with the aim at being a full fledge simulator, the only available information on such a crucial aspect, is that one locked thread with a few line of text, containing conflicting information such has different optimum tyre pressure depending of track lenght. The variable for tyre pressure is cold pressure in order to reach the optimum tyre pressure. There is only one optimum tyre pressure per tyre type for a particular car.

@Mr Tree when the developer set the tyre parameter they have to enter a data for tyre pressure to set the best performance of that tyre, that data with the other parameters will give you the optimum performance for that particular tire. The testing is finding the cold temperature that will allow you to reach that optimum pressure for that tyre and car, for a given track, condition and driving style, the starting point cold pressure is the variable. Without knowing where the target is you are shooting in the dark.
Car settings, mostly suspensions and tyre type will then influence tyre temp, but first you need to get at or very near the optimum tyre pressure.

 

[Mr Tree]

Well I am not so sure it is that simplistic in PCars 2, not saying it is not, like you I don’t know.
I am just not ready to accept that for a game of the magnitude of PCars 2, with the aim at being a full fledge simulator, the only available information on such a crucial aspect, is that one locked thread with a few line of text, containing conflicting information such has different optimum tyre pressure depending of track lenght. The variable for tyre pressure is cold pressure in order to reach the optimum tyre pressure. There is only one optimum tyre pressure per tyre type for a particular car.

It was not length of the track but track speed.
And my question to younis why would one tyrepressure be optimal for any track?

I can find reasons for this to be untrue.
And it boils down to optimum for what? Which optimum are you looking for?
Fastest straight speed best cornerd best traction when accelerating?

Again I might be wrong but could you explain me why?

 

[BrandonW77]

Well I am not so sure it is that simplistic in PCars 2, not saying it is not, like you I don’t know.
I am just not ready to accept that for a game of the magnitude of PCars 2, with the aim at being a full fledge simulator, the only available information on such a crucial aspect, is that one locked thread with a few line of text, containing conflicting information such has different optimum tyre pressure depending of track lenght.

Well it looks like that info came from one of the people responsible for making the game so I see no reason to doubt them? And I believe some of the devs discussed it in the early days of the game, saying the ideal pressures are pretty much uniform across cars in the same class. And just because they claim it's the most advanced sim/tire model out there doesn't mean it actually is. In my brief experience with this game, trying to apply logic or methods used in other sims doesn't really work here so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

 

[Cote Dazur]

Well it looks like that info came from one of the people responsible for making the game so I see no reason to doubt them? And I believe some of the devs discussed it in the early days of the game, saying the ideal pressures are pretty much uniform across cars in the same class. And just because they claim it's the most advanced sim/tire model out there doesn't mean it actually is. In my brief experience with this game, trying to apply logic or methods used in other sims doesn't really work here so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Again, not saying I don’t agree, for all I know you might be right. I am also not worried one bit, I am only inquiring, in case it would be available
Most people don’t even understand the question to start with, I know I did not for the longest time either, so I would understand if the developers just kept it simple and gave most of their tire a similar value irrespective of what car uses the said tyre.

 

[Zenzic]

"Most people do not understand why tyre pressure is key"
"Most people don’t even understand the question to start with"

Like "most people" you seem to miss the fact that it's likely you're actually part of "most people", Cote Dazur.

 

[Cote Dazur]

"Most people do not understand why tyre pressure is key"
"Most people don’t even understand the question to start with"

Like "most people" you seem to miss the fact that it's likely you're actually part of "most people", Cote Dazur.

And you might be right on that, who knows!

 

[BrandonW77]

I know I am! #ignoranceisbliss

 

[ozwheels]

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No it is not, for example are all the cars in the GT series irrespective of engine placement have the same optimum pressure for front and back tyres? Most like l’y not, so the one liner answer for whole series has no value.

What you are looking for is entirely dependent on the tires being used and who makes them. In this case that would be SMS. The link I posted has info from the Vehicle Technical Lead at SMS. He probably knows what he’s talking about since he helped make the game.

If you read the post it says 1.80 for GT on average with a low of 1.60 and a high of 1.95. There is your range from the slowest track such as Monaco to the fastest such as Le Mans or Monza. You’ll have to test those pressures and see what works for you.

It’s also not uncommon to have the same optimum pressure for the front and rear on GT cars. If you look through this thread you will find some Pirelli technical documentation that states that.

 

[ozwheels]

@F1Racer68 Sooooo, I’m aware of your testing of the bug with NA cars losing too much power at high altitude tracks. Have you investigated this after this patch? I’ve been testing at Fuji and the NA GT3 cars are absolutely dominating the turbo cars by close to a second. I went to Long Beach and the Audi has the same horsepower as it has at Fuji, 497. Have you heard any thing like this or do you think it’s possible SMS ‘removed’ the altitude horsepower calculation as quick fix remedy?

 

[Daz555]

With most cars I've tried, aiming for about 2.2 bar (32psi) when fully warm seems to be working for me. Maybe that's too high? Either way I'm not any faster at say 1.9 or 1.8.

 

[ozwheels]

@F1Racer68 Sooooo, I’m aware of your testing of the bug with NA cars losing too much power at high altitude tracks. Have you investigated this after this patch? I’ve been testing at Fuji and the NA GT3 cars are absolutely dominating the turbo cars by close to a second. I went to Long Beach and the Audi has the same horsepower as it has at Fuji, 497. Have you heard any thing like this or do you think it’s possible SMS ‘removed’ the altitude horsepower calculation as quick fix remedy?

As an update to this it appears Fuji is bugged and doesn’t reckognize the altitude or something along those lines. It’s giving all the GT3 cars the horsepower they would have at sea level, which benefits the NA cars the most.

 

[Senna94f1]

With regards to the tires, forget everything you learned about them in pCARS1. Tire pressures no longer work the way they did in pCARS1, where lower pressure meant hotter temps. They now work much more realistically. As such, the tire pressure is far more critical than the displayed temperature.

Follow the guidelines I found in the attached documents from Michelin, Pirelli, and Hankook, and you will find success. I have done extensive testing in many conditions in game to verify that this works in game exactly as described in this real world document.

The goal should be to achieve 32 PSI in every track condition. This means your cool (ambient) temp pressures set in tuning setup need to be HIGHER than your warm (ambient) temp pressures. Remember that the pressure being set in the tuning setup is your COLD pressure, whereas the target is 32 PSI (2.2 BAR) at HOT pressure state. Cooler ambient temps means less heat generated, so the starting pressure needs to be higher to begin with (closer to 32PSI).

Using the above guidelines, I have achieved consistent 150F - 175F temps in all conditions. Note that Pirelli states that "Racing tires work best at high temperatures (122° - 176° Fahrenheit)". In my testing, this has been exactly correct, and has been where I have found the most grip.

NOTE: I race on the PC version, and all of my testing so far has been done in GTE class cars. The above has worked PERFECTLY for me every time.

I can't download or see the charts ,it's just left in the loading ,round and round and round lol

 

[BMW1983]

Okay this might be an older thread but it covers pretty much everything I'm gonna discuss ........ recently I've started playing Project Cars II and the first thing I came across was learning to run on cold tires compared the warmer tires.. see I played GTS before PC II and didn't have to bother bringing my tires up to temp before I started to attack the course 100% .. from the get go I went balls to the wall without the worry of spinning out or having to be aware of lifting off the throttle then flooring it too much ... Project Cars II feels realistic and a big change compared to other racing SIMS on the market.

So far I've gone from a **** ton off oversteer whilst turning into corners, mainly due to putting my foot down to the max letting off and then letting off throttle too much/too easy and getting onto the throttle too much/too easy after turning into a corner on "cold" tires .. that was remedied by changing my input setting for my controller, the throttle and steering where both way, way too responsive... doing this has helped massively but there is much more I can do in the way off settings to help me improve my lap times (1-8 pre hot/warm tires mostly)