China

[AerodyManiac]

I'm genuinely curious about something. As a descendent of HK immigrants who are now in Canada, my family keeps a close eye on Hong Kong and Chinese news. News regarding things like the treatment of Uyghurs, the Chinese government cover-up of the coronavirus, CCP crackdown of dissidents, and so on, were all things that my family and I find out through non-mainstream sources including first-hand eyewitness accounts or photographic evidence, long before mainstream media picks up on it, if they even did so. So my question is, does anyone else feel that mainstream media shies away from reporting on the crap that goes on in China? I'm not sure if @AerodyManiac has an opinions on this as well.

I don’t think I’ve actually given it much thought or observation. While I’ve seen some HK news on sites like BBC or Washington Post, I’m not exactly sure what my answer would be to your question, but I think I can kinda resonate with you there. To my (heavily) limited knowledge, I don’t remember seeing much China news on major American media outlets, not if you don’t give a conscious effort into looking for them, at least.

The easiest way in my mind to explain this would be to say “‘Cause their parent companies get their money from China!!”, which I won’t say is completely irrelevant or false, but I think there are a lot more factors at play here that are much more important. These sites are owned by American news reporting agencies, so it’s only natural (and proper) that they focus a majority of their efforts on American news. The usual American also doesn’t care as much about what’s happening on the other side of the globe as issues pertaining to themselves (which is something that’s shared by people in all other parts of the world, including HK), and they’ve already got their hands full with domestic affairs, so naturally they wouldn’t pay as much attention to, say, what Uyghurs are suffering in China. So all of this is normal, I’d say.

Personally I’m fine with it. Americans (or Europeans, or Japanese, etc...) have enough to deal with domestically already, and I wouldn’t expect the news agencies to bombard their audience every time of the day with news about the sufferings of a HK teenager, or a Thai protestor, or an Indian farmer. Yes, the more people know about these, the better, but ultimately it’s still a battle to be fought with our own hands. As long as they report on the really important news at those places, events that could have longlasting consequences, then I don’t think I can ask for more.

Of course, to return to your question, there’s also the issue of the Chinese government expelling pretty much all journalists of non-Chinese ethnicity working for western news corporations a few months ago, which probably doesn’t help...

Taiwan believes it is the true leadership of all of China and treats the PRC as an enemy.

I’m not exactly an expert on affairs across the Taiwan Strait, but if I’m well-informed enough, I believe that such mentality (especially the parts in bold) is something that was only held dearly (and even then by only dictator Chiang and his military government; not sure about normal peasants) a long time ago, and such views have since been given up by a significant part of the population (arguably a vast majority) and by the ruling parties as they progressed into the 21st century. Have a look through major political acts by the Taiwan government lately (such as the renaming of the country’s name in its passport), and you’ll notice that the current direction they’re headed (or at least the currently-ruling Democratic Progressive Party) is to have nothing to do with China. The notion of reclaiming the acres of land northwest of them, they have recognized, is no longer feasible, and will do them no good, which is also why (I think) most of Taiwan’s military is dedicated to self-defense, and the government’s rhetoric is also about its capability to defend itself for long enough to last until the American troops arrive. That is, if they ever decide to get involved.

So far the current leadership of Taiwan is doing a remarkably good job in staying steadfast to its aims of asserting independence, in spite of China’s provocations, and it has managed to feed its people well and not get Covid knocking on its doors, which is all the more remarkable considering that China is where all the $$$ is coming from in southeast Asia nowadays.

 

[HenrySwanson]

 

[Keef]

I turn my back on America (the thread) for one second and China is on top?! Unbelievable.

 

[HenrySwanson]

Cowards! Genocide amendment is struck down by Tories

This would have been a way for UK courts to investigate claims of genocide in China since it would have forced the UK to pull out of trade deals with countries committing genocide.

 

[HenrySwanson]

New BBC report alleging systematic rape, sexual abuse and torture in camps

 

[Danoff]

New BBC report alleging systematic rape, sexual abuse and torture in camps

I think the largest population of admitted asylum seekers we have in the US annually is from China. Second place, when I last looked it up, was not particularly close (see table 7). The Uyghur camps, by basically all accounts, appear to be serious human rights violations. It is North Korea-style abuse occurring within China. It's not clear how much it is Chinese government intentional policy, or just permitted abuse, but certainly it has become well known globally and the Chinese government doesn't appear to be stopping it.

Edit:

While I was in china I toured an institutional facility for abandoned and disabled children, my daughter was cared for in part of the facility, but it was a large campus which helped children of all ages who had many kinds of needs.

It is easy to view the nation through the lens of one particular practice, but i got to see it through a different perspective, I got to see how they try to care as best they can for their less fortunate members.

I think that isolating china will result in more rather than less Uyghur-style treatment of less favored populations. We (the US) don't manage to offer many North Koreans asylum.

 

[Dotini]

Joe Biden may be keeping his pecker in his pants and his shoes dry, but even so is parading his proudest military muscles up and down the Taiwan Strait and now the South China Sea.

Spoiler: bizarre concidence?

As a curious aside, these two carrier battle groups are the very same ones involved in well publicized and bizarre encounters with fleets of UAP while on training exercises in the Pacific, Atlantic and in waters off the Middle East. Perhaps we now have the "others" fighting on our side?

(Reuters) - Two U.S. carrier groups conducted joint exercises in the South China Sea on Tuesday, days after a U.S. warship sailed near Chinese-controlled islands in the disputed waters, as China denounced the United States for damaging peace and stability.

The Theodore Roosevelt Carrier Strike Group and the Nimitz Carrier Strike Group “conducted a multitude of exercises aimed at increasing interoperability between assets as well as command and control capabilities”, the U.S. Navy said, marking the first dual carrier operations in the busy waterway since July 2020.

In Beijing, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Wang Wenbin said the frequent moves by U.S. warships and aircraft into the South China Sea in a “show of force” was not conducive to regional peace and stability.

“China will continue to take necessary measures to firmly safeguard national sovereignty and security and work with countries in the region to firmly safeguard peace and stability in the South China Sea,” he said.

The exercise comes days after China condemned the sailing of the destroyer, the USS John S. McCain, near the Chinese-controlled Paracel Islands in what the United States calls a freedom of navigation operation - the first such mission by the U.S. navy since President Joe Biden took office.

Last month, the U.S. military said Chinese military flights over the South China Sea fit a pattern of destabilising and aggressive behaviour but posed no threat to a U.S. Navy aircraft carrier strike group in the region.

The United States has contested China’s extensive territorial claims in the region, accusing it of militarising the South China Sea and trying to intimidate neighbours such as Malaysia, the Philippines and Vietnam, who have claims that overlap with China’s in the resource-rich area.

“We are committed to ensuring the lawful use of the sea that all nations enjoy under international law,” Rear Admiral Jim Kirk, commander of the Nimitz Carrier Strike Group, said in a statement.

China has been infuriated by repeated U.S. sailings near the islands it occupies and controls in the South China Sea. China says it has irrefutable sovereignty and has accused the United States of deliberately stoking tension.

China has also been angered by U.S. warships sailing through the Taiwan Strait, including one last week, also the first such operation under the Biden administration.

Speaking in Taipei, Taiwan President Tsai Ing-wen said U.S. ships and aircraft carrying out freedom of navigation operations was reassuring.

“This demonstrates the clear U.S. attitude towards challenges to the security status quo in the Indo-Pacific region,” she said.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ct-exercises-in-south-china-sea-idUSKBN2A90I5

 

[mustafur]

Taiwan believes it is the true leadership of all of China and treats the PRC as an enemy.

It's Safe to say that sentiment has changed in the last few years as the Pro independence party has been winning in Elections, and since the HK crackdown the gap has expanded massively as People in Taiwan know if they where to ever merge with the mainland whats happening in HK would probably be the best case sceniaro.

Ever since Taiwan has elected the Pro independence party China has started to push towards war rhetoric as well as they have not shifted their claim to the land, despite the fact the CCP never conquered the land in the Civil War(so their claim is weak anyway).

 

[Outspacer]

I think the largest population of admitted asylum seekers we have in the US annually is from China. Second place, when I last looked it up, was not particularly close (see table 7). The Uyghur camps, by basically all accounts, appear to be serious human rights violations. It is North Korea-style abuse occurring within China. It's not clear how much it is Chinese government intentional policy, or just permitted abuse, but certainly it has become well known globally and the Chinese government doesn't appear to be stopping it.

China's solution: block the information... China bans BBC World News from broadcasting.

 

[HenrySwanson]

I think the largest population of admitted asylum seekers we have in the US annually is from China. Second place, when I last looked it up, was not particularly close (see table 7). The Uyghur camps, by basically all accounts, appear to be serious human rights violations. It is North Korea-style abuse occurring within China. It's not clear how much it is Chinese government intentional policy, or just permitted abuse, but certainly it has become well known globally and the Chinese government doesn't appear to be stopping it.

Edit:

While I was in china I toured an institutional facility for abandoned and disabled children, my daughter was cared for in part of the facility, but it was a large campus which helped children of all ages who had many kinds of needs.

It is easy to view the nation through the lens of one particular practice, but i got to see it through a different perspective, I got to see how they try to care as best they can for their less fortunate members.

I think that isolating china will result in more rather than less Uyghur-style treatment of less favored populations. We (the US) don't manage to offer many North Koreans asylum.

This actually had me thinking for a good while (hence the late reply) and I still can't think of a way forward that is "the right answer". Before your post I would have said I wanted everyone in the West to take the tough line with China and make them realise that it is because of these abuses that we can't continue our current relationship with their government. But then you brought up North Korea. And I thought about Saudi Arabia. Or India. Etc, etc.

So I guess the question becomes, how do we fight this.

Spoiler

And I fear the answer will be, short of warfare, we can't.

 

[Keef]

I don' necessarily think we should. Outside of Hong Kong and Taiwan, China seems to have various cultural problems that aren't very compatible with Western values. A plurality of our asylum seekers may come from there but it was only 7,000 people from a nation with over 1.5 billion. There doesn't seem to be a mad rush to leave. I'm not sure that the Chinese want to be helped or are upset about their government's activities. If they do, they either don't or can't talk about it.

 

[HenrySwanson]

China is retaliating against those speaking about the genocide.

 

[Dotini]

China is retaliating against those speaking about the genocide.

What is the future of the world, democracy or authoritarianism? The battle is on, with China ascendant and the decadent West in decline. The US, trapped with aging, internally fractious leadership, is not doing terribly well. How Europeans deal with Chinese sanctions on prominent individuals will tell the tale. In theory, the best government may be benevolent despotism. In practice, it never lasts. Nothing does.

 

[HenrySwanson]

Xinjiang birth rates have fallen faster than any other territory on earth: report

Xinjiang in far western China had the sharpest known decline in birthrates between 2017 and 2019 of any territory in recent history, according to a new analysis by an Australian think tank.

The report from the Australian Strategy Policy Institute, obtained exclusively ahead of publication by The Associated Press, showed the 48.74% decline was concentrated in areas with many Uyghurs, Kazakhs and other largely Muslim ethnic minorities, based on Chinese government statistics over nearly a decade.

Birthrates in largely minority counties fell 43.7% between 2017 and 2018 alone, with over 160,000 fewer babies born. That compares to a slight increase in births in counties populated mostly by China’s Han majority.

 

[Keef]

Xinjiang birth rates have fallen faster than any other territory on earth: report

Xinjiang in far western China had the sharpest known decline in birthrates between 2017 and 2019 of any territory in recent history, according to a new analysis by an Australian think tank.

The report from the Australian Strategy Policy Institute, obtained exclusively ahead of publication by The Associated Press, showed the 48.74% decline was concentrated in areas with many Uyghurs, Kazakhs and other largely Muslim ethnic minorities, based on Chinese government statistics over nearly a decade.

Birthrates in largely minority counties fell 43.7% between 2017 and 2018 alone, with over 160,000 fewer babies born. That compares to a slight increase in births in counties populated mostly by China’s Han majority.

Sounds like China is doing a successful job of fear mongering in this region, attempting to create a space that these minorities feel is unsafe to raise a child and leading to an automatic decrease in population.

 

[Biggles]

WTF?

Extreme weather kills 21 ultra-marathon runners in China

https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/22/china/china-runners-deal-intl-hnk/index.html

This seems incomprehensible to me. Don't they have weather forecasting in China?

 

[Keef]

WTF?

Extreme weather kills 21 ultra-marathon runners in China

https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/22/china/china-runners-deal-intl-hnk/index.html

This seems incomprehensible to me. Don't they have weather forecasting in China?

Sure they do. But do they care? Would China risk seeming weak by cancelling an event for something as simple as weather?

Alternatively, it is difficult to predict weather caused by terrain uplift if that's what happened here. Especially if it were localized, the phenomenon could turn a typical stormfront into something extreme as altitude climbs. But we do that routinely in the US as well - I recall the time Yellowstone gate rangers told me they were expecting bad weather and to use snow tires up at the pass. I was fine but buddy a light rain at the shack turned into a blizzard up at the pass.

Also the area this happened in China is immediately south of of a very sandy part of the Gobi Desert so I imagine the weather patterns and temperature variations are routinely extreme.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Would China seem weak? I appreciate that China is a fairly totalitarian state...but I'm not sure the government can possibly bear responsibility for this, that seems like a level of in-the-weeds micromanagement of trivial activities that not even Jingping could muster.

The race organizers, on the other hand, might have done a better job of monitoring the weather and maybe better positioned to rescue the participants in conditions like these. However, it's hard to say they were particularly reckless really. There are similar events done every day in the US subject to the same risks. If somebody died during the ride the divide bike race, for instance, I think we would all agree that the responsibility would be on the rider primarily.

 

[Keef]

Would China seem weak? I appreciate that China is a fairly totalitarian state...but I'm not sure the government can possibly bear responsibility for this, that seems like a level of in-the-weeds micromanagement of trivial activities that not even Jingping could muster.

The race organizers, on the other hand, might have done a better job of monitoring the weather and maybe better positioned to rescue the participants in conditions like these. However, it's hard to say they were particularly reckless really. There are similar events done every day in the US subject to the same risks. If somebody died during the ride the divide bike race, for instance, I think we would all agree that the responsibility would be on the rider primarily.

Not sure what you're suggesting here. I can't think of any American event that would be allowed to run through any extreme weather event. Is the Tour de France run through extreme weather, lightning, etc? I was on the tarmac in Lincoln Nebraska ready to jump in the FSAE car when everybody on the field was ordered inside because the lighting from an approaching squall line got too close. An hour later we were all back out there. If shelter wasn't available the event probably would've been cancelled altogether. Nobody who cares just sends people out and tells them good luck you're on your own.

 

[MatskiMonk]

I can't think of any American event that would be allowed to run through any extreme weather event

"Allowed" by who, the Government? the law? the Police? Regulators? Insurers? The organisers? The event director? the property owners?

Is the Tour de France run through extreme weather, lightning, etc?

The TdF isn't run by the French government, just as the Huanghe Shilin Mountain race isn't run by the Chinese government. The blame for this lays with the organisers for disregarding warnings the day before, and for making inadequate provision for competitor safety, especially in light of the weather warning. It's potentially negligent on their behalf, but it's very unlikely to be about the nation saving face, far more likely the people behind the event saving face given there's hundreds of similar style events that go on in China.

 

[Imari]

Not sure what you're suggesting here. I can't think of any American event that would be allowed to run through any extreme weather event. Is the Tour de France run through extreme weather, lightning, etc? I was on the tarmac in Lincoln Nebraska ready to jump in the FSAE car when everybody on the field was ordered inside because the lighting from an approaching squall line got too close. An hour later we were all back out there. If shelter wasn't available the event probably would've been cancelled altogether. Nobody who cares just sends people out and tells them good luck you're on your own.

Is that what happened in China?

The high-altitude Huanghe Shilin Mountain Marathon began on Saturday morning in sunny conditions. But by 1 p.m. local time weather conditions had turned, with freezing rain, hail stones and gale winds lashing runners in Gansu County, according to the state-run Global Times.

So hardly negligent in choosing to start the race then.

As temperatures dropped in the Yellow River Stone Forest, runners started reported suffering from hypothermia, while others went missing.
The marathon organizers called off the race and launched a search party of 1,200 people to scour the complicated terrain. The search operation continued after dark.

By Sunday morning, 151 of the 172 race participants had been confirmed safe, with eight in hospital. Another 21 were found dead, according to the state-run People's Daily.

Sounds like they called it pretty much as soon as it became obvious that the extreme conditions were setting in and brought in 1200 people to search for runners. That's a long way from "good luck you're on your own". I'm not sure what other reasonable steps you'd like them to have taken short of not running the event at all. Which given that it was through remote and difficult to access terrain, would probably have been smarter in retrospect. But that's extreme sports for you, always trying to be one step extremier.

 

[Keef]

So hardly negligent in choosing to start the race then.

Not good enough, especially if they had to search "terrain". What the hell kind of race is this, Dakar for runners? If they knew bad weather was coming, they knew the race would last all day, and they knew the terrain was difficult and the route was scattered, and they knew any potential rescue operations would be massive and difficult, then in my opinion it was absolutely negligent for them to start the race because they already knew it wouldn't end well. This would be like a pilot taking off because the weather is great and then acting like it wasn't their fault when they flew into a cold front. What a ridiculous idea. If you can't finish it, and you can't effectively stop it, then starting it at all would be negligent.

 

[Imari]

If they knew bad weather was coming...

And if they didn't know? Maybe you've never lived anywhere the weather is unpredictable, but they do exist. And you can't just put your life on hold because a freak storm might happen. Well, you can but that's how you end up living as a shut in.

This would be like a pilot taking off because the weather is great and then acting like it wasn't their fault when they flew into a cold front.

I mean, if there was no sign of it when they took off I don't see why that's ridiculous. But that's me, and you apparently think anything less than omniscience is unacceptable if there's any chance of any negative outcome. What's your opinion on Flight 1549? Sullenberger is a moron for flying a plane on a day that birds existed?

Do participants have a similar burden to avoid negligently placing themselves in harms way or the ability to accept risks to themselves of their own volition? Or is it all on the race organisers to ensure that these professional adult athletes are not exposed to any risk whatsoever?

 

[Keef]

I mean, if there was no sign of it when they took off I don't see why that's ridiculous. But that's me, and you apparently think anything less than omniscience is unacceptable if there's any chance of any negative outcome. What's your opinion on Flight 1549? Sullenberger is a moron for flying a plane on a day that birds existed?

My opinion on that event is that everything was very thoroughly planned for - including the possibility of unpredictable catastrophic failure, at which point the plan of action lies with the crew's judgement and experience which is exactly what happened. 1549 is a textbook case of how to properly plan for anything that could possibly happen and make sure everybody walks away safe.

The race in China is an example of not planning anything at all and saying **** it, let's go and see what happens. It's not the 1920s anymore, weather is not a mystery basically anywhere on the planet. And if it is difficult to plan for, that just increases the threshold for all the steps you need to take to make sure nothing will go wrong. Just as the operators of 1549 did everything they possibly could to plan that flight and cover all their bases, the operators of this event should have done the same. During that flight, at no point was the burden of safety put on the people who chose to take that flight, and likewise at no point should the people who chose to enter that race should have been forced to fend for themselves. They should have been able to trust that the organizers had covered all possible bases, but as it turns out they didn't even know where the runners were after the race began.

Everything about this occurrence lines up with things we've seen from China numerous times before - people in authority refusing to accept blame, shortcuts being taken, risks being unaccounted for, human lives being expendable, and of course a massive "recovery" effort after something terrible happens to make up for their culture of not giving a damn.

 

[JKgo]

I was reading up on G7's "pledges" and China's response to it earlier and realized something.

Whenever Chinese government (CCP) puts out a press release, a statement, whatever, it's always "China" this or "China" that, as if CCP represents the will of the Chinese people. Last time I checked, they certainly don't, yet it seems to me they are deliberately using this language to, I dunno, as a way to make it Us Vs. Them situation.

What concerns me somewhat is how the US government and some others (like, say, Russia and North Korea) seem to have adopted this strategy, too, whenever they issue statements as well - or whenever the POTUS says something in an official capacity. "America will not tolerate persecution of Uighurs" "America does not negotiate with terrorists" etc.

My memory is hazy on this one, but I don't quite remember it being this way - wasn't it like "The American government does not negotiate with terrorists" "The American government urges XX to reconsider" etc?

I say this, because the South African government uses this type of language in official statements to this day. "The South African government wishes to extend its helping hand to its neighbours" etc.

I also remember the UK government doing something similar, too.

Or am I just getting old and senile?

 

[HenrySwanson]

I was reading up on G7's "pledges" and China's response to it earlier and realized something.

Whenever Chinese government (CCP) puts out a press release, a statement, whatever, it's always "China" this or "China" that, as if CCP represents the will of the Chinese people. Last time I checked, they certainly don't, yet it seems to me they are deliberately using this language to, I dunno, as a way to make it Us Vs. Them situation.

What concerns me somewhat is how the US government and some others (like, say, Russia and North Korea) seem to have adopted this strategy, too, whenever they issue statements as well - or whenever the POTUS says something in an official capacity. "America will not tolerate persecution of Uighurs" "America does not negotiate with terrorists" etc.

My memory is hazy on this one, but I don't quite remember it being this way - wasn't it like "The American government does not negotiate with terrorists" "The American government urges XX to reconsider" etc?

I say this, because the South African government uses this type of language in official statements to this day. "The South African government wishes to extend its helping hand to its neighbours" etc.

I also remember the UK government doing something similar, too.

Or am I just getting old and senile?

Interesting observation. I'll admit I can't say I've noticed a change but after looking up a few articles we talk about the foreign aid budget as the "UK's foreign aid"

I'll now be keeping an eye out for what politicians refer to such things as

 

[AerodyManiac]

I was reading up on G7's "pledges" and China's response to it earlier and realized something.

Whenever Chinese government (CCP) puts out a press release, a statement, whatever, it's always "China" this or "China" that, as if CCP represents the will of the Chinese people. Last time I checked, they certainly don't, yet it seems to me they are deliberately using this language to, I dunno, as a way to make it Us Vs. Them situation.

What concerns me somewhat is how the US government and some others (like, say, Russia and North Korea) seem to have adopted this strategy, too, whenever they issue statements as well - or whenever the POTUS says something in an official capacity. "America will not tolerate persecution of Uighurs" "America does not negotiate with terrorists" etc.

My memory is hazy on this one, but I don't quite remember it being this way - wasn't it like "The American government does not negotiate with terrorists" "The American government urges XX to reconsider" etc?

I say this, because the South African government uses this type of language in official statements to this day. "The South African government wishes to extend its helping hand to its neighbours" etc.

I also remember the UK government doing something similar, too.

Or am I just getting old and senile?

I'll chime in with my two cents here.

Such types of language use seems to be a rather common type of metonymy. The American government could be using it in order to not lose any discursive ground to China (which has been obfuscating its opinions with that of the Chinese people in a much more blatant way for as long as I could remember; I still remember just some time ago how the Chinese Foreign Ministry claimed that the Chinese people will readily rush to the party's protection, only to receive backlash from the netizens ), but the argument can also be made that the POTUS is doing that only to create soundbites that can be more easily propagated, or that he's doing it to add just that bit more charisma to his speeches. Yes, it's bad to do this (from the viewpoint of clarity and integrity), and it could even be a little bit evil (dependent on the motive of the speaker), but I think it's a really minor offence, since any trained eye (or ear, in this case) would be able to tell that it's simply not the case, and what the POTUS said is not meant to be taken on a very literal level. It'd concern me a lot more if the American government started claiming things that are downright not true.

 

[MIE1992]

I've read a few good articles on how China may not be as tough - militarily, economically, academically, etc. - as they want to give off. Even though the PRoC uses "socialism with Chinese characteristics," they still seem to be fans of following the USSR's and NK's ideas where putting on a pretty facade is more important than admitting any sort of fault. Almost makes me wonder what would've happened if Chiang Kai-Shek won in '49 instead, or if we never put sanctions on Imperial Japan for their invasion of Manchuria.

 

[Keef]

I've read a few good articles on how China may not be as tough - militarily, economically, academically, etc. - as they want to give off. Even though the PRoC uses "socialism with Chinese characteristics," they still seem to be fans of following the USSR's and NK's ideas where putting on a pretty facade is more important than admitting any sort of fault. Almost makes me wonder what would've happened if Chiang Kai-Shek won in '49 instead, or if we never put sanctions on Imperial Japan for their invasion of Manchuria.

My NASIC buddies won't talk about it because they can't talk about it, but the consensus is that underestimating China's abilities would be a terrible mistake. Actually one of the main threats we face when it comes to China is that their government, especially in international terms, is effectively lawless, and their Party culture is steadfast. In a physical war, they would do anything to be successful and that's a serious problem. Another serious problem is the economic implications of the whole thing - the entire Western world would suffer severe goods shortages because of China's global manufacturing dominance. This was not nearly as big a problem for WW2, especially for the US which was quite isolated and self-sufficient long before globalism became the norm. China has a lot to lose as well but unlike the rest of us nobody is really sure if China cares how much they have to lose. It kinda seems like they don't. They're borderline a rogue state with unprecedented labor and manufacturing capacity and countries like Russia, Belarus, and Iran would love for us to get distracted by a conflict. Globalist economics basically guarantees it would turn into a world war, something which economically the Western world is unprepared to deal with and Europe is even militarily unprepared for.

 

[ToyGTone]

I've read a few good articles on how China may not be as tough - militarily, economically, academically, etc. - as they want to give off. Even though the PRoC uses "socialism with Chinese characteristics," they still seem to be fans of following the USSR's and NK's ideas where putting on a pretty facade is more important than admitting any sort of fault. Almost makes me wonder what would've happened if Chiang Kai-Shek won in '49 instead, or if we never put sanctions on Imperial Japan for their invasion of Manchuria.

My NASIC buddies won't talk about it because they can't talk about it, but the consensus is that underestimating China's abilities would be a terrible mistake. Actually one of the main threats we face when it comes to China is that their government, especially in international terms, is effectively lawless, and their Party culture is steadfast. In a physical war, they would do anything to be successful and that's a serious problem. Another serious problem is the economic implications of the whole thing - the entire Western world would suffer severe goods shortages because of China's global manufacturing dominance. This was not nearly as big a problem for WW2, especially for the US which was quite isolated and self-sufficient long before globalism became the norm. China has a lot to lose as well but unlike the rest of us nobody is really sure if China cares how much they have to lose. It kinda seems like they don't. They're borderline a rogue state with unprecedented labor and manufacturing capacity and countries like Russia, Belarus, and Iran would love for us to get distracted by a conflict. Globalist economics basically guarantees it would turn into a world war, something which economically the Western world is unprepared to deal with and Europe is even militarily unprepared for.

I'm sorry but if the biggest threat to the Western World is some fat Filipino looking dad and some old Eastern European Pimp then we, modern day humans, are the biggest disgraceful joke to all of mankinds history. I'm sorry but i rather be long dead than watching bunch of incompetent fools completely wipes out humanity with their mass weapons of destruction.