Did SPORT ruin Gran Turismo?

  • Thread starter Groundfish
  • 105 comments
  • 7,318 views

Did making GT SPORT an esport game make the GT franchise better?

  • Yes

    Votes: 69 45.1%

  • No

    Votes: 47 30.7%

  • Maybe

    Votes: 30 19.6%

  • Other (explain)

    Votes: 7 4.6%
  • Total voters
    153
No, I don't think it ruined it at all. It's simply a different entry in the series and one that set out to do what it wanted to do fairly well. In spite of all of the complaints about the penalties system the online racing experience is miles ahead of any other console racing game. I will say though that the AI in single player mode could really have used some more time, they are very, very stupid.
 
For me personally the GT franchise had become extremely stale. Each game was fundamentally the same experience, and for a game with hundreds and hundreds of cars I found the racing against braindead AI pretty shallow.

GTSport has changed the way I play racing games forever, and its become a hobby in its own right for me. No other game has come close to achieving that.

Also @Groundfish do you realise the question you ask in the thread title and the question you actually ask in the poll are complete opposites, so you may get some confused answers.
 
watto79
For me personally the GT franchise had become extremely stale. Each game was fundamentally the same experience, and for a game with hundreds and hundreds of cars I found the racing against braindead AI pretty shallow.

GTSport has changed the way I play racing games forever, and its become a hobby in its own right for me. No other game has come close to achieving that.

Also @Groundfish do you realise the question you ask in the thread title and the question you actually ask in the poll are complete opposites, so you may get some confused answers.
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No. ...I mean yes. Yes, I agree. Probably no, then. ;)
 
I guess there could be a better balance of online and offline stuff. Supposedly, that's what the new game will have.
I liked that in the older games, I could work on grinding out races, so I could make money to buy better cars and buy upgrades for my cars.
I also miss the oil changes and car washes. :D

The worst part about Sport Mode is repetitiveness. I miss having 3 new races every day.
Even if they had started off by having weekly races, they could still be making 3 original combos every week.
I did the math once, and I believe there are something like 17,000 possible car/track combos available in the game.
How many do you think they've done? Maybe 250-300? They're out of touch with their player base.
Imagine the massive popularity of an open garage N300 Big Willow race, or trucks at Brands Hatch.
I believe a lot of people just leave their console turned off for the week when they see 3 stale repeats. Sport Mode is mismanaged. :grumpy:
 
05XR8
PD ruined the marketing for this game. Not SPort. Look at the original intro. There we see classic racing cars in various disciplines.messed The history of those scenes are not even explained to players new to racing. Many players didn't and don't know about GT4 and GT3 racing. It was the lack of educating players that ruined the experience of GT Sport for many players.

I lkiterally booted up the PS4, deleted my saves and restarted a new game. After setting up the screen prompts, the intro begins. Being it's Spec II, the FIA intro is shown. Rally cars spinning, are the first game images we see. Non-real life racers on the world stage. That's cool. Now, onto the game intro.

AMD Safety car. Classic race cars, JDM cars from the 1980s, more rally cars and AMG Safety Car. GT3 cars in full effect. Then, we get to see the various cars included in the game. It's clear PD marketed this as a racing game.
So, what's the first car you get? A road car(I also got a Gr.3 Genesis for my birthday). :lol:

There's no guidance with the game. Noone explaining what players could do. Very weird as PD collaborated with Niisan and Mercedes with GT Academy.

Sport made online racing easy for everyone. Had the etiquette videos made players drive at a few circuits to gauge where they should be placed, that would have made it much better. Those that have grievances with offline AI, it's not boring to race the AI. PD just haven't made the AI competitive. Boring isn't the right word. Frustrating is.

I said time and again how I was late to buy GT Sport. I wanted my offline Gran Turismo. Trying SPort Mode got me into playing online more than ever. However, that is manily due to the lack of polish offline recieved.
Click to expand...
This post is very correct and there are so many other things you could include even related to the basics of sport mode - not explaining tyre choices/penalties, a generally awkward UI, the complete lack of any transparency or communication with the community regarding the game's various problems over the years.

Hopefully, and even as I type I know this won't happen, but hopefully with GT7 PD realise we're in the 2020s and if you want a series which is based on competitive online play you need to make the game appealing and engaging, and that means genuine communication with the playerbase. You can't just put out updates without explaining why. You can't just put out updates that break the game and not respond to them until a week later when the fix comes out.
 
Yet there are often complaints about GTS being "simcade" and "dumbed down". I wonder what those people would think if the game explained the difference between a sports medium and sports soft tyre..

I can't really see how the UI is awkward, its pretty straightforwards.
 
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DriveSpark
Yet there are often complaints about GTS being "simcade" and "dumbed down". I wonder what those people would think if the game explained the difference between a sports medium and sports soft tyre..

I can't really see how the UI is awkward, its pretty straightforwards.
Click to expand...
There's a recent post, about a player
that thinks the car set up wasn't there before this latest patch. Some players just pick a car and drive. Could be similar to the majority of players that don't enter Sport Mode.

This is where discussion, in the GT7 Forum, bring up the issue of licence progression from previous Gran Turismo games.
When starting, if the player is informed about Beginner, Intermediate, Amateur, Professional, Expert. That could help place players where they need to be for more information. Does it have to be a boring part of the game? Can be made fun to prepare players for both offline and online portions of the game.

GTS offers some video clips, driver aids and acceleration, braking and cornering tests, but to the many entry level players that may skip that, the Etiquette videos should show more.

Some games have players due a quick race or test and suggest players start at a certain level. I think it was GT5 or GT6 that had players do a lap around Brands Hatch in the Clio R.S. That's the best way to gauge a player's skill level.

I feel the best way to enter Sport Mode, would be the same thing. After the etiquette videos, add videos showing the drivetrain layouts and quick education about performance of the different layouts and classes.
From there, have players do one or two laps to gauge what level to start them at: E/B- A/S or Beginner to Expert.

Its a big task for a beginner to buy this game, go through the intro, receive their starter gift car, go through the menus, choose Spore Mode, see that they need to watch the Etiquette videos, enter location info, choose a Daily Race, see they don't have the appropriate car for two of the events, go to Nations, see they don't have the appropriate car, go to Manufacturers, pick the GR.3 and GR.4 car, enter the GR.4 Daily with never having driven the car or experienced the circuit and exit with whatever result.
Repeat with the GR.3 Race C, which is longer with faster cars and fuel tyre wear regulations. The novice may not understand, despite the info icons.

PD should educate new players on how Sport Mode works and how players may receive penalties for contact and/or track limits.
 
05XR8
GTS offers some video clips, driver aids and acceleration, braking and cornering tests, but to the many entry level players that may skip that, the Etiquette videos should show more.
Click to expand...

So if the player is going to skip the basics, what makes you think they're going to sit there and watch videos that cover more in depth subjects ?
 
DriveSpark
So if the player is going to skip the basics, what makes you think they're going to sit there and watch videos that cover more in depth subjects ?
Click to expand...
Because they have to watch the Etiquette videos to begin Sport Mode as it is.
 
05XR8
Because they have to watch the Etiquette videos to begin Sport Mode as it is.
Click to expand...

you mean they have to play them.. if they can't be bothered to watch the videosof the basics I doubt they take a blind bit of notice of the etiquette videos.
 
DriveSpark
you mean they have to play them.. if they can't be bothered to watch the videosof the basics I doubt they take a blind bit of notice of the etiquette videos.
Click to expand...
They can't skip the etiquette videos and anything else included with the etiquette videos.

I'm saying, players skip the Driving School, Mission Challenges and everything else in Campaign that would help a beginner.
When a beginner skips that and jumps straight into Sport Mode, they must click on the etiquette videos. Even if they click and go to the toilet, they'd have to physically DO a quick lap to see where they would be placed. As I'm suggesting.
 
05XR8
Its a big task for a beginner to buy this game, go through the intro, receive their starter gift car, go through the menus, choose Spore Mode, see that they need to watch the Etiquette videos, enter location info, choose a Daily Race, see they don't have the appropriate car for two of the events, go to Nations, see they don't have the appropriate car, go to Manufacturers, pick the GR.3 and GR.4 car, enter the GR.4 Daily with never having driven the car or experienced the circuit and exit with whatever result.
Click to expand...

I have to admit, I was a beginner to this game. The UI and menus were definitely NOT intuitive. I however didn’t enter sport mode at all for at least a couple months and when I did it was n100 Tsukuba.
I did work on the driving school etc campaign to get money for cars.
I agree more COULD be done for a beginner in the next title but really I think that overall sport mode lacks variety.
Make some silly combos sometimes omg instead of the serious ones.
The game should understand people like stuff like that. I’d like to see some crazy race with like mini coopers and Tomahawks all together or whatever!
I think though that without the SPORT, I would have given this game up a long time ago even if there was engaging career mode.
But, just as it could use improvement for beginners, and maybe even more important would be improvements for experienced players.
Like making higher ranked players always at fault in collisions, pen system in general, scoring system in sport mode.
I mean it would be great if they would seperate scoring between FIA and dailies.
It would be so simple...You enter FIA events at some DR level say 100, from then on you can only gain OR lose FIA rank in FIA, then just keep dailies seperate points or even unranked for FIA players.
Let dailies be what they are and give players the option to be guaranteed dailies won’t affect FIA and vice versa.
I think more top players would race each other for fun in dailies if they knew their FIA status was protected.
Right now there’s no telling how many acts people use because of this.

The absolute main thing imo for a game like this is the pen system.
Everything else is good enough but if you have a pen system people find unfair, then your games unfair, and less will play...
 
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We had the fun combos before the daily races became weekly races. How long has it been since karts were used in the dailies? N800? GR1 not on Le Mans, GR.B? I don't know what PD is doing, but they're clearly not interested in sport mode anymore... This week 2x GR.4 on overused tracks (Panorama is fine with me, but why always GR.4 sprint race) and GR.3 with mandatory pit stop, again. The lack of variety is killing sport mode as much as the penalty system.
 
Groundfish
I have to admit, I was a beginner to this game. The UI and menus were definitely NOT intuitive. I however didn’t enter sport mode at all for at least a couple months and when I did it was n100 Tsukuba.
I did work on the driving school etc campaign to get money for cars.
I agree more COULD be done for a beginner in the next title but really I think that overall sport mode lacks variety.
Make some silly combos sometimes omg instead of the serious ones.
The game should understand people like stuff like that. I’d like to see some crazy race with like mini coopers and Tomahawks all together or whatever!
I think though that without the SPORT, I would have given this game up a long time ago even if there was engaging career mode.
But, just as it could use improvement for beginners, and maybe even more important would be improvements for experienced players.
Like making higher ranked players always at fault in collisions, pen system in general, scoring system in sport mode.
I mean it would be great if they would seperate scoring between FIA and dailies.
It would be so simple...You enter FIA events at some DR level say 100, from then on you can only gain OR lose FIA rank in FIA, then just keep dailies seperate points or even unranked for FIA players.
Let dailies be what they are and give players the option to be guaranteed dailies won’t affect FIA and vice versa.
I think more top players would race each other for fun in dailies if they knew their FIA status was protected.
Right now there’s no telling how many acts people use because of this.

The absolute main thing imo for a game like this is the pen system.
Everything else is good enough but if you have a pen system people find unfair, then your games unfair, and less will play...
Click to expand...
If PD weren't thinking about Sport Mode, maybe more of the same as the other titles. GT League seems that way. Maybe the GR.3 & GR.4 events as Seasonals.

I don't know what Kaz thinks. It appears he wants to at least keep the car encyclopaedia going. However, less and less people going to racing circuits and low tv race viewers, even lower with the pandemic and electric cars, just throwing cars at players, doesn't automatically breed car enthusiasts.

Maybe many players don't want to have to compete. Could be fear of not just personal failure, but being ranked. Grouped. I don't know for what real reasons majority of GTS buyers don't touch Sport Mode.
 
I haven't got much to add to what's been said already but I think the Main Menu Stream is one of the most underappreciated things about GT Sport. It's just such a nice thing to have running next to your computer and glance at every now and then while surfing or working. In this regard GT Sport is a huge improvement over the previous games. The presentation and background music just do it for me and I really, really hope that this gets eventually carried over to GT7.

 
Last edited:
Baka_Marimo
I haven't got much to add to what's been said already but I think the Main Menu Stream is one of the most underappreciated things about GT Sport. It's just such a nice thing to have running next to your computer and glance at every now and then while surfing
Click to expand...

You cannot SURF the net. It is BROWSED.
Surfing is the sport of kings.
Beyond that I couldn’t agree with you more.
It can be kind of fascinating too the AI behavior when it shows them also. It’s a great point about the screensaver trivia and even the tunes too. I like them. I thought I was the only one.
 
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Well it ruined it by not being a proper game. The offline elements are worse than any other I have played, but then we have online which is a nice thing. I would rather have a really good single player game and hopefully GT 7 will do both.
 
Despite playing GT4, 5 & 6 - I wasn't bothered about GT Sport. I downloaded the demo, looked into it but didn't connect with it. Bought GT Sport on day 1, and got hooked. Love Sport mode, custom races, livery editor, and photo mode. I kind of miss the Gran Turismo of old, but racing against AI is horrible. I look forward to GT7, but I suspect that I'll be using online modes far more than offline.

I am surprised with how few players (according to Kudos prime) play online.
 
05XR8
They can't skip the etiquette videos and anything else included with the etiquette videos.

I'm saying, players skip the Driving School, Mission Challenges and everything else in Campaign that would help a beginner.
When a beginner skips that and jumps straight into Sport Mode, they must click on the etiquette videos. Even if they click and go to the toilet, they'd have to physically DO a quick lap to see where they would be placed. As I'm suggesting.
Click to expand...

so they play the video, watch tiktok on their phone instead, do a lap and are slow etc and they're in to online ?
If they don't want to learn, they won't, doesn't matter how many steps you put in the way.
 
Yard_Sale
Gran Turismo “sport” has brought way more people into the franchise than it’s lost. It’s not even close.

Had one of Super GT’s videos not randomly come across my YouTube recommendations 2 years ago, I wouldn’t have even known there was a new Gran Turismo out.
Click to expand...

It sold more than the awkwardly released GT6 (falling between gens without a ps4 version) but is still shy of the 12 million GT5 sold. Plus GT Sport went down in price much sooner and had the pandemic boost. On top of that 83% of players haven't done a single sport mode race, a stat that's probably even worse considering a lot of those that do play sport mode end up making alternate accounts.

I actually bought the game twice, switched to the digital version when it was dirt cheap, and am reponsible for 2 accounts as well (my kid played a bit on his account, sport mode with me, but is otherwise not interested in the game)
 
GT Sport brought me back into the series after playing Forza almost exclusively from about 2014 to 2018. This game did things that Forza simply wasn't doing at the time, and the online racing structure really hooked me in (as the game set out to do). Polyphony revitalized the series for me and has laid the groundwork for GT7 in a big way. I've never had so much anticipation for a game in my life, and GT Sport really left me craving for more with GT7. I really look at this game as a prologue for GT7 and the beginning of a new golden era for the series. This game was a success and it absolutely helped the Gran Turismo series and brand, despite the change in the core philosophy of the game.
 
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DriveSpark
so they play the video, watch tiktok on their phone instead, do a lap and are slow etc and they're in to online ?
If they don't want to learn, they won't, doesn't matter how many steps you put in the way.
Click to expand...
The ones that do want to learn do.
 
To me the idea of GT Sport was better than what it actually ended up being. Not saying I didn't enjoy it for a while, but I feel like the online racing just got exhausting.

Between the penalty system, monthly updates, and daily races, I felt like I was always hopeful of something exciting coming, only to end in disappointment. It'll probably be the last Gran Turismo game I own.
 
Sven Jurgens
It sold more than the awkwardly released GT6 (falling between gens without a ps4 version) but is still shy of the 12 million GT5 sold. Plus GT Sport went down in price much sooner and had the pandemic boost. On top of that 83% of players haven't done a single sport mode race, a stat that's probably even worse considering a lot of those that do play sport mode end up making alternate accounts.

I actually bought the game twice, switched to the digital version when it was dirt cheap, and am reponsible for 2 accounts as well (my kid played a bit on his account, sport mode with me, but is otherwise not interested in the game)
Click to expand...


That's a wild statistic. Online racing is the general direction I'm pretty sure they want to go with the series. I think they're working out how to get the best of both worlds. I used to always roll my eyes when people would complain about the AI. To me..... it was like, "what do you expect them to do? It would be beyond difficult to program the AI to be able to 'think' and be aggressive". Then I watched game play of the AI from other sims (mainly race room), and now I get it. GT has a long ways to go in that regard.

When GT7 eventually comes out, I think you're going to see how much Fire Power PS5 has. I have faith that PD is going to do a decent job of satisfying all the different spectrums of the sim market within reason. In a preemptive hindsight, I think the whole covid situation and lack of PS5 availability will prove to be the best thing that happened to GT7. It will have given them plenty of time to finish up a game that is content-rich, with no clunky roll out. I truly do believe we're going to see the best elements from all of the previous GT titles, along with the good elements from other titles as well
 
I haven’t played any other Gran Turismo titles, but I can speak to my experience with Sport. I first downloaded the Beta version and then got the full title at launch back in October 2017.

The graphics are great and the physics aren’t offensively wrong to me. I love racing against real people and I’m still playing the game going on 4 years now. It is still a challenge with great competition. I have not played any other video game for that amount of time or gotten this much enjoyment from one either.

I got my money’s worth from original purchase, bought a full rig, and got my money’s worth out of that, too. I have my complaints, but the haters go too far. This is an excellent game.
 

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