DiRT Rally 2.0 General Discussion

[MagpieRacer]

It's so disheartening that you are having such a bad time with weather and night conditions in rally. I'll keep you two in my prayers tonight

Great thanks. For someone who was in such pursuit of realism you've sure changed your tune .

Theres too many dark and wet stages. Fact.

 

[cjr3559]

So far the Community events appear to have less rain/dark/wet/heavy surface degradation.

The career mode can be a grind, but using a faster car class results in better surface conditions which helps eliminate some of the slog using H1 class. At least that’s my initial impression of My Team career mode.

 

[PzR Slim]

So far the Community events appear to have less rain/dark/wet/heavy surface degradation.

The career mode can be a grind, but using a faster car class results in better surface conditions which helps eliminate some of the slog using H1 class. At least that’s my initial impression of My Team career mode.

I actually like the H1 class and have zero issues with the surface conditions. I just hate the terrible lighting, even in broad daylight it can be tricky to see at times, and how bad the rain makes the view you get of the stage. Heavy rain looks like six inch nails are constantly falling from the sky.

 

[BrainsBush]

Help! Out of money and need to repair my Volkswagen.

I really like the immersive weather and scenery. It only distracts my eyes from the road too much (good excuse right?)

 

[fernandito]

Theres too many dark and wet stages. Fact.

So was it in the golden era of rally. Get over it, or go play rallycross.

Night stages haven’t really been a part of the WRC since the mid-90s, basically since David Richards got ahold of the sport and switched everything to service parks and cloverleafs in the hope of becoming TV-friendly.
In recent years some rallies have brought a few night stages back here and there, but it’s nothing like it was decades ago.

One of the reasons I quit watching rally twenty years ago. My hatred for FIA has come a loong long way, and still growing deeper today

 

[PzR Slim]

Help! Out of money and need to repair my Volkswagen.

I really like the immersive weather and scenery. It only distracts my eyes from the road too much (good excuse right?)

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Nice pics! However, they perfectly illustrate what I am talking about. How can the general lighting be that dark when all objects are casting such dark shadows?

 

[MagpieRacer]

So was it in the golden era of rally. Get over it, or go play rallycross.

One of the reasons I quit watching rally twenty years ago. My hatred for FIA has come a loong long way, and still growing deeper today

Rally Poland 2017, no night stages, 2 evening arena super specials. Lots of overnight rain but not much in the day (Thursday was basically cancelled.)
Rally Argentins 2019, no night stages, heck only 2 stages are scheduled past 4pm. 2018 dry for 3 days with minor fog day 4.
Rally Australia for the past 3 years, dry, no night or dusk stages. And when they did run a night stage in Oz, the drivers complained due to it being too dangerous.

Golden era of rally is different for everyone, and for me it doesn't have many, if any, night stages. Certainly not half a rallies worth.

 

[fernandito]

Can get shimmering form time to time, but I find the lightning good enough, as well as the darkness pretty realistic in those locations such as Australi and New Zealand.

They haven't had time to optimize the new lightning/shader stuff however, hence the crazy ups and down on the frames per second in some areas.

Rally Poland 2017, no night stages, 2 evening arena super specials. Lots of overnight rain but not much in the day (Thursday was basically cancelled.)
Rally Argentins 2019, no night stages, heck only 2 stages are scheduled past 4pm. 2018 dry for 3 days with minor fog day 4.
Rally Australia for the past 3 years, dry, no night or dusk stages. And when they did run a night stage in Oz, the drivers complained due to it being too dangerous.

Golden era of rally is different for everyone, and for me it doesn't have many, if any, night stages. Certainly not half a rallies worth.

I do agree I said, that FIA turned rally sport into another baby's sport. No night stages; if it rains too much the may even cancel.., etc, but that's not rally at all, and one of the many reasons I quit watching it decades ago.

Once upon a time true men drove some beautiful fantastic cars under the worst weather conditions imaginable. Since 2004-'05..., oh well. Yeah rally they continued name it after. No wonder why so many legendary brands (such as Subaru) retired little after that. They knew well that rally as many have known it had come to an end with nowadays cars and way way softer rules regarding stages and weather.

The golden era of rally is fixed from the seventies to the early two thousand, and that's for everyone. Then among those decades everybody have a favourite of their own. Some may prefer the Stratos and Scort Cosworth era; older fans might prefer the sixties; others GroupB or A; others the last of the true so called rally cars from 1998 to 2003.., etc. but the golden era wraps those four decades.

 

[MagpieRacer]

Can get shimmering form time to time, but I find the lightning good enough, as well as the darkness pretty realistic in those locations such as Australi and New Zealand.

They haven't had time to optimize the new lightning/shader stuff however, hence the crazy ups and down on the frames per second in some areas.

I do agree I said, that FIA turned rally sport into another baby's sport. No night stages; if it rains too much the may even cancel.., etc, but that's not rally at all, and one of the many reasons I quit watching it decades ago.

Once upon a time true men drove some beautiful fantastic cars under the worst weather conditions imaginable. Since 2004-'05..., oh well. Yeah rally they continued name it after. No wonder why so many legendary brands (such as Subaru) retired little after that. They knew well that rally as many have known it had come to an end with nowadays cars and way way softer rules regarding stages and weather.

The golden era of rally is fixed from the seventies to the early two thousand, and that's for everyone. Then among those decades everybody have a favourite of their own. Some may prefer the Stratos and Scort Cosworth era; older fans might prefer the sixties; others GroupB or A; others the last of the true so called rally cars from 1998 to 2003.., etc. but the golden era wraps those four decades.

It's not for everyone. Again don't presume to know what everyone's tastes are.

 

[Ali]

I do agree I said, that FIA turned rally sport into another baby's sport. No night stages; if it rains too much the may even cancel.., etc, but that's not rally at all, and one of the many reasons I quit watching it decades ago.

Once upon a time true men drove some beautiful fantastic cars under the worst weather conditions imaginable. Since 2004-'05..., oh well. Yeah rally they continued name it after. No wonder why so many legendary brands (such as Subaru) retired little after that. They knew well that rally as many have known it had come to an end with nowadays cars and way way softer rules regarding stages and weather.

I mean, I also stopped watching rally around 2004, and find the mid-2000 to 2012~ cars the most boring rally cars ever, but whenever I read someone talk about true men of the past I can't help but laugh

 

[fernandito]

Again don't presume to know what everyone's tastes are.

That's why you and those you talk about can go play rallycross. Quit crying about darkness and too much rain before devs give up to to you and their tears and nerf everything, like happened to Driveclub (physics nerfed and less weather) and other killer games. If you can't get over it, go play another racing game.

I read someone talk about true men of the past I can't help but laugh

hehh

You know there's a lot of truth in that anyway :-D, but ok maybe I went a little over the to or too sentimental xD

 

[MagpieRacer]

That's why you and those you talk about can go play rallycross. Quit crying about darkness and too much rain before devs give up to to you and their tears and nerf everything, like happened to Driveclub (physics nerfed and less weather) and other killer games. If you can't get over it, go play another

The game is too dark fact, HDR is broken, the weather balancing in career mode is wrong. These are facts. Nothing to do with the physics, they're great, feels fantastic.

As it stands, single player career mode isn't fun because of the incorrect balancing of weather conditions versus what you would expect. Night stages aren't a challenge or fun anymore they're a chore. Not how a game should be.

Everything else is great. Thankfully custom championship is excellent and I can recreate a realistic rally weekend.

 

[Rodger Davies]

@MagpieRacer I don't think it's factual to say it's 'broken'. It may just be a decision that they have taken that the majority of players aren't again of - it's possible it was done this way because they believed people wanted the extra challenge over realistic weather patterns.

Currently it's working as intended. There are four times of day cycled through in order each time (day, sunset, dusk, night) and one of the available weather conditions chosen at random for that time of day.

Now, don't get me wrong, I think it sucks like this and is the game's main drawback for me personally (the only major one to me) and I hope they do something about it, but I don't think you can say as a fact that it's broken, just that it's proving unpopular.

To me, some steps need taking:

1) we need more weather options for the available times of day. At the moment, most dusk and sunset stages only have one or two options. For example, in the USA sunset is always wet, whereas dusk is always dry. In every event.

2) Either more times of day to be added to the cycle (early and late morning, noon and early and late afternoon) or a chance of multiple day stages in a row and a percentage chance of each of the evening types (say 80% chance of sunset, 40% chance of dusk and 20% chance of night).

3) A 'pattern' of weather options. So, if the first stage in Spain is daytime and sunny, there should be a 90% chance that the next stage is sunny. A small percentage chance of clouds and a small percent of rain. This would be one epic flowchart to make for each location, but would give the impression of weather that is believable for a 'day'.


Now I accept that this wouldn't be the work of a moment, but IMO it's the direction that needs to be taken.

More importantly, I want to see some blog post or long forum post where Codemasters acknowledge the issue, explain it and say what, if anything, they plan to do about it. Even saying 'we can't do anything about it' would be better than nothing.

 

[Gr4ndy]

The game is too dark fact, HDR is broken, the weather balancing in career mode is wrong. These are facts. Nothing to do with the physics, they're great, feels fantastic.

As it stands, single player career mode isn't fun because of the incorrect balancing of weather conditions versus what you would expect. Night stages aren't a challenge or fun anymore they're a chore. Not how a game should be.

I can completely agree on those points. I literally couldn't see anything in the historic event in Australia in Golf - cockpit view, headlights didn't help a bit.

Also the FFB on my t150 is completely broken, feels like I'm driving on a completely flat surface.

For now this game is a massive disappointment for me.

 

[fernandito]

I don't know about HDR broken making game too dark, I play on monitor. Can't that stuff be deactivated on the very TV anyway?

 

[MagpieRacer]

I don't know about HDR broken making game too dark, I play on monitor. Can't that stuff be deactivated on the very TV anyway?

Yes it can be but obviously it loses a lot of colour depth versus having it on. No other game I've played with HDR suffers from this. I have turned it off for the majority of my playing. Which is a shame as its effectively downgrading the game to be visible.

Doesn't change the balance of conditions though.

 

[fernandito]

One thing I don't like is the massive field of view. Everything looks soo wide (and with very high pitch) that I literally have to set the slider to zero-full left on bumper cam (just lol wtf?), and still ain't optimally narrow for racing in a game like this.

And what the hell is this thing with everything looking that wide on chase camera too. You can't do **** on chase camera with so much fov. Another good lesson Driveclub gave to everyone on how making proper chase view (narrow fov, with very little pitch, and with the car very close to you).

I mean i play these "sims" on bumper cam always, and very close and narrow fov too, but in the past I liked playing the more arcady oriented games on chase camera, like the old Colin McRae games and Evolutions WRC games for the ps2 (and Project Gotham and lastly Driveclub). Now even on arcade racing games the fov on chase cam has got so wide it literally makes your driving suck, and when I see how this game (and first dirt rally too) look like on chase camera It just makes me think what these devs may be truly thinking when they design chase camera like that.

Another thing I can't stand on chase camera is it being that attached to the car when you take corners, instead of see the car rotating, and the corner position adjusting later. WRC games for the ps2 where great when you could see your car rotating and the wheels spinning like that. Another great thing of the past about chase camera lost to modern era.

 

[MagpieRacer]

I quite like the chase cam. Chase and bonnet feel good to play with.

I actually do occasionally find bonnet cam a bit stiff but I think the motion blur effect makes that feel worse when the cars bounce around.

Just finished a 6 round 36 stage championship using the R4 class. Won it at the final round, overturning a 20 point deficit to win.

 

[fernandito]

I quite like the chase cam.

That's what I meant. I used to play rally games on chase cam, when the fov was narrow, your car was close to you and the camera wasn't attached to you when cornering. The last good rally game to support all these my humbles preferences for chase camera was WRC3, and that's been 15-16 damn years since. The other reason I liked chase cams is because I prefer playing with a controller if the handling is good (the "problem" of project cars, and why I use a wheel with it)

The chase camera fov in this and the recent past rally games is just too much. I can't play properly when I choose it, let alone in semi-sims like this. That's why I jump in to bumper camera straight away, regardless I'm on a controller. You can go really fast too.

I actually do occasionally find bonnet cam a bit stiff but

My fastest times in pc2 have been made on bonnet. Lately, I went back to bumper (pc2) and I found it a lot more precise, regardless I haven't been able to score my older times. Bumper still feels better to me. In this game dr2 I find bumper cam like madatory given how tremendously wide and relatively high pitch everything look like.

Bonnet camera on dirt rally 2 is, honestly, terrible.
Just finished a 6 round 36 stage championship using the R4 class. Won it at the final round, overturning a 20 point deficit to win.

This is what I was talking about some posts back about AI. Chances are that you won with that 20 point deficit because the first car that was winning retired, as you have scored many second and some third position during that cahmpionship. am i wrong

I don't like the way AI works on DR1 and 2. It is actually they thing I dislike the most about these two games, regardless I end up winning on masters too eventually.

 

[PJTierney]

 

[GroupB]

Terminal damage on the D+ monthly Was just cruising along in the third event, no problems whatsoever, and clipped a “narrow gate”

 

[fernandito]

Same story here, but terminated by direct nose smash into a tree. Oh well, rally is about that, too

 

[BrainsBush]

We may praise ourselves lucky it is only virtual damage.
My colleague who is an (amateur) rally co-driver with his new Citroen DS3 R5 EVO showed me a pic of his most recent accident he had with new team driver Roald Leemans. Ouch. About 15K damage.

For those interested. He drives Dutch/Belgian Rally previously in BMW 1 and 3 and now Citroen DS3.
source Zuyderzeerally 2019: https://www.rallynieuws.nl/geen-droomdebuut-voor-roald-leemans/

PS The pictures I shared over the past weeks are more bright on my 4K screen then on my laptop screen. In race it is ok but the *.png I share are absolutely not representative for my own in game experience. Not that dark and no HDR enabled.

 

[kikie]

View attachment 807607

The damage model seems to be very realistic. I'm not sure about the physics engine though.

Spoiler: Ooh.

I'm a worthless person, making jokes with other's 15K worth of damage.

+ =

 

[Theiceman1]

 

[MarcoM]

I can completely agree on those points. I literally couldn't see anything in the historic event in Australia in Golf - cockpit view, headlights didn't help a bit.

Also the FFB on my t150 is completely broken, feels like I'm driving on a completely flat surface.

For now this game is a massive disappointment for me.

You might consider getting a tactile system like the buttkicker. I did a week ago and I can feel the road now via the vibrations on my bum.

As for the rain conditions. Over the weekend I drove in heavy rain on Friday and a hail storm on Sunday. DR 2.0's interpretation isn't that far off.

 

[BrainsBush]

You might consider getting a tactile system like the buttkicker. I did a week ago and I can feel the road now via the vibrations on my bum.

That's indeed the same how I also experience it. Because I play DR2.0 with a Buttkicker and NLR motion platform this more or less compensates the 'lack of' steering vibration for the roadfeel etc. As we already know only the wild grids are very present.

@Theiceman1 : Thanks for sharing. Good to know a FFB/rumble update will not come very soon. Still enjoying Dirt Rally 2.0 very much

 

[Scaff]

You might consider getting a tactile system like the buttkicker. I did a week ago and I can feel the road now via the vibrations on my bum.

As for the rain conditions. Over the weekend I drove in heavy rain on Friday and a hail storm on Sunday. DR 2.0's interpretation isn't that far off.

Third vote for a tactile unit, mine is the only thing that (just) keeps me with DR 2.0 at the moment.

 

[kikie]

I definitely want a tactile unit. But I need advice on which system is the best system.

1. A standard amplifier with speakers and a bass
2. Buttkicker
3. Other PC gaming systems like the buttkicker
4. Or what @Scaff has (I still don't get it what you have exactly).

This could make DR 2.0 more interesting. You know that I hate fake and unrealistic FFB and only want FFB coming through the steering wheel that is felt in real life. DR 2.0 has such a bad FFB engine (or whatever you call it) that fake and unrealistic FFb is welcome.

 

[MarcoM]

I can only speak for the one I have on the ps4 and that is a single buttkicker gamer 2.

I have it connected from the ps4 via

to split the hdmi into hdmi and L+R RCA.

Then I use this:

https://shakercentre.co.uk/gaming-simulation/stereo-to-mono-converter.html
To combine the L+R RCA into one mono channel. The Buttkicker amp only has one momo input.

I think it is important to combine the L+R channel via this converter. If you have a home cinema set things are taken care of by the cinema set, so I've read.

When I did not have the stereo mono combiner, I felt only rumble when I went of left or right curbs. With the combiner, I feel always rumble when I hit the curbs with either the left or right side of the car.

I only use one buttkicker. My rigg is very stiff and therefore it does not make much difference where I attach the buttkicker. Just for the best result I attached it to the beam the closest to my bum. But I have had very good results attaching it elsewhere. Stiffness is the thing you want on a racepod.

I get excellent feedback in my ps4 games. Especially Project Cars 2 and DR2.0 have well designed tactile output. You can feel the gravel surface really good and when you brake there's extra rumble also on asphalt. I love that in DR2.0.

Assetto Corsa , also has good effects. F12018 is the least one. Still enought but just not great.