Do you feel GTP is becoming over moderated?

[PAPPACLART]

PAPPACLART I've just merged your two posts together, it's often a difficult call to make but if less that a day has gone past I would personally always edit rather than double post in a thread.


In regard to your point then yes it is a valid one to make, but as with most things more that one look needs to be taken on this.

Now I have personally taken long term members to task in the past over 'you noob' type comments when people have been new and made simply forum etiquette errors. Once again just because you don't always see it being done does not mean it doesn't happen.

However new members more than anyone need the occasional gentle push regarding the AUP and in my opinion this is better done sooner rather than later. After all how confusing would it be to get away with something for a few days/week only to then get told to stop?

I'm also confident that I speak for all the staff when I say that PMing a new member with politely worded advice is a bit like playing Russian Roulette. A good amount of the time you get a PM back thanking your for the help and they start to follow the AUP immediately. The rest of the time we tend to get two other situation.

The first is simply a PM full of attitude/grief/indignation/abuse about how they can do what they please and we are all kill-joy Nazi's who ruin the web.

The second is trickier in that they PM you to say they will change and then blatantly fail to do so, repeatedly breaking the AUP and ignoring all attempts to help them.

New members are always going to be a tricky issue, but its not as if the standard we expect here at GT Planet is not clearly covered in the AUP and also clear to see in every single post made.

Having access to the mod forums gives a great insight into just how much work goes into making the choices we do and also just how much thought goes into every single ban. Honestly some ex-members really did get given so many chances that it does almost border on the insane. They sometimes then re-register and fire off thread, after thread of abuse about how unfairly they have been treated.

I can honestly say that I am not aware of a single infraction or ban that I have ever thought was unwarranrted or un-fair.


Regards

Scaff

Thanks for the post merge, I know that is a thing that annoys mods. It's easy done, I respond to somebody, I post, then another person posts which I also want to respond to. I did try to delete my post and merge myself but I failed. (Ironically I was just checking the failure thread!! lol)

Anyway, maybe I am being missunderstood slightly. I am sure all that have been banned deserved it 100% and I was never refering to those banned members in my previous posts. I know that most of the good work you guys do, never gets seen and you never get credit for what is not seen. Unfortunately what we see is often what you are judged by, and maybe what we on occassion see, is not always the best example of what you guys do. (not that it is always bad, on the Contrary)

Maybe I am coming over more critical than I actually intend (this is a problem with text)

Mods/Admins can never win, as we the ''PEOPLE'' (lol) will only see what we want to see, especially if we are looking for something particular to be critical with.

I will say it agian, keep up the good work.

 

[buickgnx88]

Easiest way respond to 2 people is either multi-quote, or if you've already posted and want to respond to a different person, hit quote, copy their quote, and paste it in your previous post along with your response to them.

 

[Azuremen]

The issue with new members is you don't know if they are someone who has been banned trying to come back, a troll, someone that just wants a few posts and then to advertise, or if they just won't get the idea of the AUP and just like causing trouble.

Compared to long term members, where if we start a debate, it is clear we aren't just trying to troll or cause problems. Plus, we've gone through backing up our points in the past, so we have a bit more trust towards us.

 

[PAPPACLART]

Easiest way respond to 2 people is either multi-quote, or if you've already posted and want to respond to a different person, hit quote, copy their quote, and paste it in your previous post along with your response to them.

Yeah I fail!!! lol

This is another thing mods often get very annoyed about and I understand why! Just that people are people, although we have instructions within forums, as well as sticky thread's etc giving all we need to know to guide us to adhere to forum etiquette, but the majority of us never read to the frustration of the mods. The point of Sticky threads and forum rules is in place so that the Mods don't have to repeat themselves over and over again but find that they have too! It is a constant battle that they will never win. (so why get worked up) On very rare occasions mods get annoyed and post up firm and almost sarcastic explanations on how to post/edit/quote etc. Rather than just posting a ''how to'' link. This just fuels the fire. (This happens rarely)


Also, I am a memeber of a few forums all of which use Vbulletin, but it seems that they all carry subtle differences, differences that we have to learn, where as an example, multi quoting is done differently etc

The issue with new members is you don't know if they are someone who has been banned trying to come back, a troll, someone that just wants a few posts and then to advertise, or if they just won't get the idea of the AUP and just like causing trouble.

Compared to long term members, where if we start a debate, it is clear we aren't just trying to troll or cause problems. Plus, we've gone through backing up our points in the past, so we have a bit more trust towards us.

All of the above true and all of which makes the job of being a Mod very difficult... leaning to the opinion that Mods need to be given slack too, as they can't be expected to keep everybody happy. Thats impossible.

 

[nk4e]

The issue with new members is you don't know if they are someone who has been banned trying to come back, a troll, someone that just wants a few posts and then to advertise, or if they just won't get the idea of the AUP and just like causing trouble.

Compared to long term members, where if we start a debate, it is clear we aren't just trying to troll or cause problems. Plus, we've gone through backing up our points in the past, so we have a bit more trust towards us.

Posting and you... I love posting this..

 

[Klostrophobic]

I think a good measure of moderation is the ratio of moderators (BOO!) to regular posters (YAY!) on a particular page. With this post we now have a 9:47 ratio on this page, which is far above the accepted 1:99 ratio I suggest.

 

[Pupik]

Yeah I fail!!! lol

Don't worry, it took me 6 months to figure out how to "multi-quote", without resorting to Notepad or using another browser tab.

 

[Lucas]

Posting and you... I love posting this..

I lol'd... Hard.

 

[DaddyVDUB]

I think a good measure of moderation is the ratio of moderators (BOO!) to regular posters (YAY!) on a particular page. With this post we now have a 9:47 ratio on this page, which is far above the accepted 1:99 ratio I suggest.

I have long ago voted,but seems recently there may be a bit of over moderating. Lately seems that a pretty fair amount of posts in threads are from moderators. And also seems that the mods sometimes are just nit picking on every little thing. Dont get me wrong ,there are a great many things they need to jump in on. Also a fair amount of squashing ideals that they dont seem to share. I love this site BUT dont really like the way things seem to be going lately. At least one thread I know of right off is nothing more than an attempt from the "super" mods to point out how inferior the general public of gtplanet seems to be. Is this a site for people, or the mods to show off there wisdom.

 

[Famine]

Most of the moderators were members before they were mods... Just because we've been given a blue badge doesn't mean we stop having any interest in what the site is about, to instead care only for order, grammar and no poopy-speak.

Plus with a post-count like mine, if a thread has 125 posts, I'm likely to have posted in it already...


The only "ideals" the moderators act upon are Jordan's. If you have an issue with the "ideals", then it's the site owner you need to speak to. That's not to say that our implementation is always right - if you have any moderation issue which troubles you, also speak to Jordan.

 

[DaddyVDUB]

So in other words no one may question you?

 

[Famine]

That's not to say that our implementation is always right - if you have any moderation issue which troubles you, also speak to Jordan.

So in other words no one may question you?

How did you extract that from what I said?

 

[nk4e]

He will answer your question though if you have any problems for their "action" take it to Jordan.

 

[RealCountryDark]

Hey, case-in-point here. I was considering paying for a year of membership but I was wondering if I would then be considered a customer or just a member throwing into the pot? I don't expect moderation to change because of payment just want to know if I'm a customer? And about the moderation I don't really care I'll do whatever it takes to get you off my back. If I did something wrong please let me know.

 

[FoolKiller]

Hey, case-in-point here. I was considering paying for a year of membership but I was wondering if I would then be considered a customer or just a member throwing into the pot? I don't expect moderation to change because of payment just want to know if I'm a customer? And about the moderation I don't really care I'll do whatever it takes to get you off my back. If I did something wrong please let me know.

Explain what you think the difference should be between a member and customer and we can answer that better.

 

[RealCountryDark]

I'm not concerned with what it should be but what it is. Am I then a customer? Just a simple question.

 

[FoolKiller]

I'm not concerned with what it should be but what it is. Am I then a customer? Just a simple question.

No refunds, still follow all rules, and if you are banned, even temprarily you lose premium status without a refund.

Basically, the only difference is you have no ads, along with a few minor perks.

No customer service rep or anything like that. Your ability to communicate and use the site only changes in that you can load pages slightly faster due to the lack of ads.

Does that sound like a customer? I would say no.

 

[RealCountryDark]

The answer is NO. Thank You.

 

[Pupik]

This is from the "sticky" at the top of the Premium Forum:

But, just remember that the same rules apply to everyone here and we have to keep this community civil, so please do not waste your GTPremium subscription!

There you have it...

 

[RealCountryDark]

That is not what I asked but thanks.

 

[FoolKiller]

The answer is NO. Thank You.

I'm not trying to be coy. If someone official said yes and then you paid for premium, and then decided you didn't like something, you could try reporting the site to the Better Business Bureau or something equally zany. Then Jordan gets questions asked of him because someone was not happy with the site he runs as a hobby after they gave what is basically a donation, which he rewards with a few minor perks.

I know it sounds like it would require a real jerk for that to happen, but to be honest I do not know you. For all I know you could just be my wife in disguise to secretly watch me (honey?) or you could be the type of jerk who would do something like that.

There you have it...

I was about to follow up with this:

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/payments.php

And then follow it up with:
https://www.gtplanet.net/aup/

“GTPremium” subscription service fees are non-refundable, even if a user’s account is banned from accessing the forum due to violation of any the above rules or any guidelines in the Terms of Service.

 

[Touring Mars]

For all I know you could just be my wife in disguise to secretly watch me (honey?)

 

[FoolKiller]

Seems funny to you, but this is the same woman who checks Facebook on her cell phone while watching TV or eating dinner because she doesn't want to walk away to the computer.

I would not be surprised if she lurked here seeing everything I say, which is why I leave all my derogatory and sexist comments in the Premium Forum.

 

[Pupik]

↑ Would you like me to edit that for you?

 

[Casio]

I would not be surprised if she lurked here seeing everything I say, which is why I leave all my derogatory and sexist comments in the Premium Forum.

I bet we'll have a new Premo today.

 

[FoolKiller]

↑ Would you like me to edit that for you?

Which part? The part where I act suspicious or the part where I incriminate myself?

I bet we'll have a new Premo today.

That would be funny.

Seriously though, I am 99% sure she has never looked at GTP aside from when she is reading it over my shoulder. I spend so much time in the Opinions Forum that she would get bored. I've already been told to shut up about politics at home.

 

[Duke]

I'm not concerned with what it should be but what it is. Am I then a customer? Just a simple question.

No, you're a member. As others have said, you get no ads, you get the ability to change your user name if you really need to, and you get access to a members-only board. It's more of a way to reward those who contribute to the site costs than it is some sort of sales transaction.

 

[DaddyVDUB]

How did you extract that from what I said?

Because that is what you said, that I should talk to Jordan instead of you. Any way I let it go.

 

[Duke]

He was saying that any member has an easy appeal process if they suffer a disagreement with the moderating staff. Any member can contact one of the administrators (Der Alta or me), or they have the option of going directly to the site owner, Jordan.

His point was that there is no set protocol or rigid chain of bureaucracy you must try to navigate - any member can go straight to the top when desired. He was not try to say "talk to the hand" at all.

I've read through the entire thread you indicated, and I fail to see how it is dedicated to the moderators feeling superior to the "commoners". It certainly wasn't started by a staff member. I see it as many GT veterans - both staff and regular users alike - showing some impatience with the type of person who is going to be bitter and dissatisfied no matter what PD does, and who is going to make a long wait even longer and more irritating by filling it with pointless complaining.