Electric cars .

I don't know anyone who has stuck a Chiron engine into a Viper IRL. I don't know anyone who managed to squeeze 514HP out of an Ambulance. I very highly doubt a bone stock C1 Corvette has 240HP at the crank, nor can I believe that a LaFerrari in running condition really weighs in under 1,300kg (2,866lbs). I have no idea how a driver is supposed to see out of a Peugeot VGT without windows, or how a topless Volkswagen VGT can be eligible for a GT3 equivalent class.

There are a lot of flights of fancy, guesstimations, and creative liberties with the internal combustion cars in the game, and I don't see why EVs can't be allowed the same leeway in fantasy. While there aren't many EVs IRL that have multiple forward gears, the fact is such a feat has already been done before; it's less a flight of fancy than any of the ICE shenanigans I've listed in the previous paragraph.

If the only argument against EVs being able to equip aftermarket gearboxes/transmissions is that it's "unrealistic", then I'm sorry, it's an argument I can't buy at all.
You can buy or refuse to buy whatever you want. I’m not saying PD should or shouldn’t do anything. I’m not saying everything PD does is 100% true to real world either. All I’m saying is that when it comes to EVs not having adjustable gearing in the game it’s because in these cases they chose to keep things realistic. It’s unrealistic to have an adjustable 5 speed transmission in a Tesla. It’s unrealistic to have a Chiron engine in a Viper. That doesn’t mean it’s impossible, it just means in some cases they choose to stick to realism and others they choose to be very fictional or fantasy with their approach.
 
So I was eyeballing an EV motor recently, the stats indicated a max rpm of 15,300 rpm, with an inbuilt reduction gear set with an 11.11:1 ratio. I'd have thought that for applications where constant high speed is probable, you could perhaps alter that ratio to deliver more of the motors rpms to the wheels. I think in the real world this would come at the expense of motor efficiency at low speeds, but since it's for racing and not for street I don't suppose that would matter.

As far as the equivalent of fitting a 5 speed racing transmission goes, imagine a 3 motor setup with two at the back and one at the front... where you putting the 3 gearboxes?
 
It’s unrealistic to have an adjustable 5 speed transmission in a Tesla. It’s unrealistic to have a Chiron engine in a Viper. That doesn’t mean it’s impossible, it just means in some cases they choose to stick to realism and others they choose to be very fictional or fantasy with their approach.
I don't think @Rotgutsnotnos was asking for a fully adjustable transmission in EV's, they were just wanting the option to adjust the final drive so higher top speeds are achievable. It should be quite possible to change this IRL so it's not an unrealistic expectation at all.
 
1. High Speed Efficiency -- The thing is, high speed efficiency literally can't get better. EV motors are already almost 100% efficient at all RPMs, to the point where wind resistance is really the only factor affecting efficiency. The reason they SEEM inefficient at high speeds is because gas engines are extremely inefficient at low speeds, and slightly less inefficient at high speeds, so we're used to seeing better mileage at high speeds than at lower speeds. But EVs are equally efficient (near 100%) at all speeds / RPMs, so even with extremely aerodynamic designs, this guarantees (non-linear) efficiency loss as speed increases due almost entirely to wind resistance. In gas cars, wind resistance is a much smaller piece of the efficiency pie. Because so much of the power released by the gasoline combustion is already being consumed as noise, heat, internal machinery, and the effects of a relatively narrow power band compared to EVs, the added inefficiency of wind resistance is just one of a large number of inefficiencies for a gas car, rather than almost the only factor like an EV.

A transmission does nothing for an EV's high-speed efficiency, since electric motors are (roughly) equally efficient at all RPMs. All it does is allow a higher top speed if the motor happens to be running out of usable RPMs. The added weight, complexity, and drivetrain drag definitely wouldn't have a positive effect on high speed efficiency. Its only use is higher top speed, at the expense of efficiency. Honestly, using a transmission simply doesn't make sense for a motor that has equal torque and nearly identical efficiency across its entire RPM range. Picking an appropriate final drive ratio is the real answer that I think all EV makers are going to come to, even for high-performance models. The Model S gets to 212mph in first gear. No tranny needed*. But back to the point -- in the end, it's the wind that affects EV range at high speeds, not the high RPMs.
That's what I figured was the case. My guess is the Taycan got a second gear because the engineers wanted to make the car have great low end performance and still achieve a high top speed. The engineers must have found their expectations were not possible with a single gear.

You mentioned your Plaid having different drive ratios between the front and rear motors. I don't know all the engineering details of the Plaid, but perhaps the front motor is "turned off" after a certain speed is hit and the rear motors (likely with the longer gearing) take the car to it's final top speed. While its technically not "2 gears" it is effectively changing the final gearing of the whole system to achieve its high top speed. It makes me wonder if the Taycan is hitting its top speed in AWD or not. If the Plaid works like I'm imagining, it is in RWD mode at top speed.

So... Back to the idea of greater efficiency at highway speeds, this is actually a HUGE deal in the US. As mentioned by another person, Norway may look big, but its maybe 2/3rds the length of the US's eastern coastline and 90% of its population is consolidated into an area the size of a single mid-sized US state. Sure, your average person would love more range in the US because it means less charging on a long trip, however trucking goods across this massive country is where EV engineers need to be looking into greater efficiency at highway speeds. Imagine a Semi traveling at 65 mph down the highway (there are many highways that are 70mph in the states), they are going to burn through their entire battery (all 100%) in less than 200 miles if they were to use this Volvo truck: https://www.volvotrucks.com/en-en/trucks/trucks/volvo-fh/volvo-fh-electric.html

That battery is massive (490kW) and will take easily 2-3 hours to fully charge (0-100%). So, you drive for 2-3 hours, then stop and charge for 2-3 hours and rinse and repeat? That sucks. I guess I'll add 3-4 days extra time for my delivery to make it across the country. This isn't as much of a problem in Norway, specifically, but you all still get goods delivered from all over Europe so it would impact you as well if EV adoption is to take place in the trucking industry.

My belief is that EV engineers really need to work on getting greater efficiency at highway speeds. It's the next thing that will really explode the EV adoption. Until then, I'm fully on board to hybrid systems similar to how my old Volt used to work, with some minor tweaks. For regular passenger cars, SUV's and trucks: 35kW battery packs that are used 100% for propulsion until 45mph (likely a 75-100 mile range). After that a fuel efficient 3 or 4 cylinder ICE motor kicks in to provide propulsion. This would give all the benefits EV efficiency and low speed power with the benefits of ICE range and fuel efficiency. Trucks can even benefit from using the battery pack to power tools and other worksite things. This type of system really needs to be put into SUV's and trucks more so than regular passenger cars, but I believe this is the bridge we need until EV engineers can work out the high speed efficiency problems (not to mention towing efficiency problems that EV's have).

Sorry for the long post.

2. Cold Weather Efficiency: Tesla greatly improved cold weather efficiency by switching from a traditional resistance heater to a heat pump system in their newer models, and uses software to strategically keep the battery warm. I think the cold weather issue is overblown anyway ... practically all new cars in Norway are EVs, and I think it gets more than a bit chilly over there. I mean you're not wrong, range is definitely reduced in cold weather. But it's not a dealbreaker IMO or apparently in Norway's opinion either.
Again, this is something that is very different for everyone. My Niro is still super efficient even in the cold. Today I got 4.4 miles/kWh at 30*F outside temps on my 32 mile drive in to work (approximately 8 miles of highway in there). There are a lot of EV's out there that couldn't hit those numbers on a 90*F day doing the same drive. But cold weather efficiency is still a huge bummer, especially when you think about the adoption with larger and larger vehicles, especially those that drive thousands of miles, like semi's. So it is definitely something that needs to be worked on for the big adoption to take place.
 
I don't think @Rotgutsnotnos was asking for a fully adjustable transmission in EV's, they were just wanting the option to adjust the final drive so higher top speeds are achievable. It should be quite possible to change this IRL so it's not an unrealistic expectation at all.
There’s wanting something, then there’s asking why we don’t have it in the game. I assume when someone asks a question they want an answer.
I want a car in the game that can go 5,000mph, but I don’t ask why we don’t have it, because I already know the answer.

Just because something should be possible doesn’t mean it is realistic to expect. Just because something is possible, however unlikely, doesn’t mean we should have it as a potential option in the game. PD can’t include all possibilities for everything in the game just because someone can pull it off as a custom build in the real world. They have to decide what level of realism we get where and when they can give us fantasy and unrealistic stuff like VGT vehicles. Most of those are possible to make in real life, but unrealistic to expect someone will actually produce them.

It is unrealistic to expect to be able to change the final drive in your average production EV, though not impossible. It is unrealistic to find heart shaped headers for your Ford Mustang, but not impossible. They’re not produced and readily available like say a set of cams or a high flow air filter etc. but that doesn’t mean it can’t be done…someone could certainly make them, but it’s unrealistic to expect to find when shopping for headers.
 
Just because something should be possible doesn’t mean it is realistic to expect. Just because something is possible, however unlikely, doesn’t mean we should have it as a potential option in the game. PD can’t include all possibilities for everything in the game just because someone can pull it off as a custom build in the real world. They have to decide what level of realism we get where and when they can give us fantasy and unrealistic stuff like VGT vehicles. Most of those are possible to make in real life, but unrealistic to expect someone will actually produce them.
You can fit a hydraulic handbrake to the Tesla in game, which while i guess it's technically possible to do so IRL, how realistic is it?

More importantly, is that more or less realistic than changing the rear drive ratio? - especially when you can buy this upgrade over the counter in real life.
 
It's not just the Norwegian government's incentives to get people into EVs that has driven the take up, it's as much about their disincentives towards petrol and diesel vehicles, like high taxes* and high fuel prices* (driven by higher tax on those fuels) that made the switch to pure EV's the sensible ecconomic choice. They also have a good charging network.

Although by European standards Norway has a fairly big land mass and the distance from top to bottom is quite far, most of the population lives on the coastal regions of the southern tip, so long car journeys are probably not common in the way that they are in the US. Less efficiency in the cold doesn't matter as much if you can still easily do all your days driving on a single charge.

*compared to the rest of Europe on average.

i think less than 5% of the population wouldn't be able to do all their daily driving on a single charge -- truckers, cabbies, delivery drivers, etc ... but I used to commute an hour and a half each direction (northern virginia to fort meade) and my car easily handled that plus any errands in between. Granted that is with a long-range EV, and I am able to charge at home.

You mentioned your Plaid having different drive ratios between the front and rear motors. I don't know all the engineering details of the Plaid, but perhaps the front motor is "turned off" after a certain speed is hit and the rear motors (likely with the longer gearing) take the car to it's final top speed. While its technically not "2 gears" it is effectively changing the final gearing of the whole system to achieve its high top speed. It makes me wonder if the Taycan is hitting its top speed in AWD or not. If the Plaid works like I'm imagining, it is in RWD mode at top speed.

yeah, as i mentioned, the software does alter the balance between the front and rear, but i'm not sure either ever goes to zero (except in extreme efficiency mode).

So... Back to the idea of greater efficiency at highway speeds, this is actually a HUGE deal in the US. As mentioned by another person, Norway may look big, but its maybe 2/3rds the length of the US's eastern coastline and 90% of its population is consolidated into an area the size of a single mid-sized US state. Sure, your average person would love more range in the US because it means less charging on a long trip, however trucking goods across this massive country is where EV engineers need to be looking into greater efficiency at highway speeds. Imagine a Semi traveling at 65 mph down the highway (there are many highways that are 70mph in the states), they are going to burn through their entire battery (all 100%) in less than 200 miles if they were to use this Volvo truck: https://www.volvotrucks.com/en-en/trucks/trucks/volvo-fh/volvo-fh-electric.html

yeah, long range trucking is one of those use cases where gas is still a better option for sure. But for commuting or even family trips, EVs are actually becoming more convenient than gas.

i mentioned Norway as an example of millions of people living in cold weather and using EVs, but I live in Virginia. I'm familiar with American highways. :) In fact, I take the wife and kids and dog in our Model S to Canada (about 600 miles) every summer, and also take it to Georgia (600 miles the other way) to visit my folks. It's a huge car with ridiculous amounts of cargo space, more than enough for the whole family on a long trip. In terms of range, it's pretty good too. I can make it from DC to Pittsburgh on a single charge very easily, and there are dozens of superchargers along the way anyway (and the screen in the car shows where they all are and how many stalls are in use at each one in real time). Charging takes about 20 minutes. When going to Canada, which is about 10-12 hours depending on traffic, we only stop to charge twice ... actually we could probably push it to one stop if we wanted, but there's no good reason to. Charging doesn't take any longer than it takes to walk the dog and go to the bathroom ourselves, which we have to do anyway. Pretty much every highway in America is dotted with superchargers at this point, and they're usually at Sheetz or Wawa or a strip mall where you have access to a bathroom and food and other amenities. The middle of the country is certainly not as saturated as the coasts, though, and things are definitely rougher if your car can't access the supercharger network. So yeah there are caveats and it won't work for every budget and every situation.

I think the main thing people don't realize is how life-changing it is to be able to charge over night at home. I used to have to get gas like 2 or 3 times a week. But in my EV, I only have to go to charging stations 2 or 3 times per year -- when we go on those family trips. I wake up every morning with a full battery.

I get that a lot of people aren't in a situation where they can charge at their home yet, or can't afford a long-range EV. I'm not saying it's the best solution for everyone. But for our situation it's amazing.
 
I think it's accurate to not allow EV's gear changes. There are many classes of cars where the gears are adjusted for each track IRL, but none are electric as far as I can tell. Electric car usage on tracks is limited to parade laps, some light use in HPDE, and usually one lone class in club racing (if that) where a lone EV car will enter and have no competitors.

Let it play out IRL then simulate it. I think VGTs can have variable gear ratios if OEMs desire them so.
 
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