Europe - The Official Thread
- Thread starter Touring Mars
- 2,133 comments
- 119,483 views
- 31,701
- Buckwheat City
- Dennisch
There wouldn't be a debate if Greece just accepted everything that was thrown at them years ago.
Even Spain!!!! has now a strong enough economy to warn Greece.
Spain. That country that currently has an unemployment rate of 23%.
Have a look at the various unemployment numbers, PDF file
Even Spain!!!! has now a strong enough economy to warn Greece.
Spain. That country that currently has an unemployment rate of 23%.
Have a look at the various unemployment numbers, PDF file
Tired Tyres
Premium
- 12,592
- West Yorkshire
- Tired_Tyres
- Tired Tyres
A country can't go Bankrupt. It goes into arrears instead.
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/greek-bailout-fund
500,000,000 Europeans giving up not very much each could bail them out.
Last edited:
- 29,919
- Bratvegas
- GTP_Liquid
- 31,701
- Buckwheat City
- Dennisch
We already paid something like 400 per person to keep Greece going.
Enough is enough. They wanted to play it like this, this is what happens.
Tired Tyres
Premium
- 12,592
- West Yorkshire
- Tired_Tyres
- Tired Tyres
- 31,701
- Buckwheat City
- Dennisch
What do you think that they have been trying for the last couple of years?
Do you think that when you go to the bank you can lend money on your terms instead of the bank's terms?
Tired Tyres
Premium
- 12,592
- West Yorkshire
- Tired_Tyres
- Tired Tyres
. The hell they have. You don't fix problems with loans. That creates more debt. You're loaning money from Peter to pay off Paul. Aid is the only solution.
zzz_pt
Premium
- 8,188
- Porto living in Hamburg
- zzz_pt
He's not saying what you said he's saying.
The referendum is not Yes or No to money but Yes or No to the bailout conditions.
And so, asking for 2 more years with other conditions is not inconsistent. That's how I see it at least.
How to explain in one gif, why the loans never helped the Greek people.
Last edited:
- 29,919
- Bratvegas
- GTP_Liquid
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33345219
Tsipras ready to cut a deal. Basically what was agreed before talks collapsed including:
A big part of Greece's own collection problems is that too many people, by their own admission, avoid taxes. That's a major hurdle which needs to be sorted. Never mind that no-one buys tickets for the state-owned Metro and thusly revenues must be at a pittance.
Tsipras ready to cut a deal. Basically what was agreed before talks collapsed including:
- VAT (sales tax): A new system to come in from 1 July, with three rates, aimed at boosting annual revenue by 1% of total output (GDP)
- Most goods to be taxed at top rate of 23%, including restaurants and catering and processed foods
- Reduced rate of 13% for basic food, electricity, hotels and water
- Super-reduced rate of 6% for medicines, books and theatre
- End exemptions and eliminate VAT discounts for Greek islands
- Create strong disincentives to early retirement
- Move retirement age up to 67 by 2022
- End Ekas "solidarity" top-up grant that some 200,000 poorer pensioners get - immediate Ekas cut for wealthiest 20% of recipients, and cut completely by 2020
- Pensioners' healthcare contributions to rise to 6%, from 4%
A big part of Greece's own collection problems is that too many people, by their own admission, avoid taxes. That's a major hurdle which needs to be sorted. Never mind that no-one buys tickets for the state-owned Metro and thusly revenues must be at a pittance.
- 31,701
- Buckwheat City
- Dennisch
Good luck finding that sucker.
Dotini
(Banned)
- 15,742
- Seattle
- CR80_Shifty
Source, and whole article
https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/06/25/europeans-expect-grexit-happen-and-few-want-stop-i/
- 29,353
- Glasgow
- GTP_Mars
I know, but you can't go to the bank saying "I refuse to accept the terms of your loans, but please can I have some more money anyway?" - it's a microcosm of the entire situation... Greece can't have it both ways - they either accept the terms of their creditors and take the loans, or they don't. There was some room for maneouver (not any more though), but the fact remains that Greece stills need alot of money and have already pushed the limits of what their creditors are prepared to accept. This isn't solely about what Greece needs - her creditors have as much if not considerably more say when it comes to determining how much more money Greece can borrow, hence demanding more cash while rejecting the terms is not going to fly.He's not saying what you said he's saying.
Dotini
(Banned)
- 15,742
- Seattle
- CR80_Shifty
The EU cannot, it thinks, afford to permanently bail out Greece. But it knows for sure it can't afford to let Greece go to the BRICS. So the Greeks pull your chain until the last grain of sand goes through the hourglass.
Face it, you've got a beautiful if slightly overweight harlot on your southern border, and she needs to be kept and supported.
Face it, you've got a beautiful if slightly overweight harlot on your southern border, and she needs to be kept and supported.
Last edited:
.
- 297
- Aldebaran
- rudolphcarter
He's not saying what you said he's saying.
And so, asking for 2 more years with other conditions is not inconsistent. That's how I see it at least.
How to explain in one gif, why the loans never helped the Greek people.
This gif is the fastest way to explain the situation.Nice.
- 31,701
- Buckwheat City
- Dennisch
Harsh language from Germany and the Netherlands.
If the Greeks vote no on the coming referendum there will be no more talks, and more importantly, no new support plan.
Tsipras and Varoufakis think that even with a no they can talk with the EU.
Edit.
The tourists are also done with the uncertainty, and are cancelling their trips.
If the Greeks vote no on the coming referendum there will be no more talks, and more importantly, no new support plan.
Tsipras and Varoufakis think that even with a no they can talk with the EU.
Edit.
The tourists are also done with the uncertainty, and are cancelling their trips.
Last edited:
Tired Tyres
Premium
- 12,592
- West Yorkshire
- Tired_Tyres
- Tired Tyres
It is pointless blaming anyone in Greece for the situation they are in. You can't go back in time and try again differently.
At last. The IMF starts making sense.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33373390
At last. The IMF starts making sense.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33373390
Dotini
(Banned)
- 15,742
- Seattle
- CR80_Shifty
- 6,041
- Puget Sound
- Crash852
And since the EU let Greece join the Euro in the first place, they should be able to just as easily kick Greece out now.
He's not saying what you said he's saying.
And so, asking for 2 more years with other conditions is not inconsistent. That's how I see it at least.
Interesting thing is, the terms that the referendum is on apparently don't exist anymore since those terms were built on the previous bailout package that expired at the end of June.
The EU can certainly bring the same terms back, but that is not a guarantee.
Euro since 1 January 2001
What a success.
Looks more like Greek government continually spending more than they bring in, and just simply borrowing money to continue the spending.
- 29,919
- Bratvegas
- GTP_Liquid
From that graph things started spiking after 2004 which sounds about right; Greece spent so much money on hosting the 2004 Olympics. And a majority of the infrastructure they invested in was and still is state owned. They never made the money back from it and they're obviously feeling it to this day still.
Dotini
(Banned)
- 15,742
- Seattle
- CR80_Shifty
They could, but it would be insane and self-destructive to kick Greece out of Europe only for it to become part of a Russian and Chinese economic and ultimately military cooperation.
Do you really want Russian and Chinese military bases in the Mediterranean?
Greece has the EU over a barrel, and the EU knows it. Your tourists will return, since it's safer then Tunisia - at the moment.
- 20,681
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
