Europe - The Official Thread

TenEightyOne
Interesting, a bold move not being followed by the lenders yet it seems (they say they're rock bottom already). If the market's on its arse then anything to promote investment is good, you're already making no growth.
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Promoting investment with artificially low interest rates is exactly the wrong thing to do. What creates growth is letting the market clear (recession) so that investors can have real information about what best to do with their money. You can't make a gourmet meal on a plate with a turd on it. Market's gotta clear.
 
Thanks to the oil price going down (yeey for us) the Russian Ruble is also going down like madness. Today it has seen the biggest drop since 1998. Russian Minister of finance is warning for a recession if there are no actions taken. The Ruble also is suffering due to the sanctions imposed after the situation in Ukraine.
 
Dennisch
Thanks to the oil price going down (yeey for us) the Russian Ruble is also going down like madness. Today it has seen the biggest drop since 1998. Russian Minister of finance is warning for a recession if there are no actions taken. The Ruble also is suffering due to the sanctions imposed after the situation in Ukraine.
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Yes to all of this.

The price of oil is falling sharply due, not least of all, to high supplies from fracking and low demand from economic recession. Too much lower and it will put marginal petroleum producers, and alternate fuel competitors, right out of business.

But right now The Great Game is afoot, and it is worthwhile to sacrifice a few economic interests in order to pressure Putin-poot and his doomed regime. We'll squeeze him until something breaks. Them, us, or you.:rolleyes:
 
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I said it before. Russia can't survive without the EU and vice versa. Just wait until we have a long cold winter. Gas prices will skyrocket and the EU will be begging Russia for gas.
 
Dennisch
I said it before. Russia can't survive without the EU and vice versa. Just wait until we have a long cold winter. Gas prices will skyrocket and the EU will be begging Russia for gas.
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Hold on just a minute now. Don't go making peace with Russia! Our plan is break up Russia and give parts of it to you. Isn't our benevolence wonderful!
 
Dotini
Hold on just a minute now. Don't go making peace with Russia! Our plan is break up Russia and give parts of it to you. Isn't our benevolence wonderful!
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Are we going for a second edition of Lebensraum?
 
Dotini
Hold on just a minute now. Don't go making peace with Russia! Our plan is break up Russia and give parts of it to you. Isn't our benevolence wonderful!
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Dennisch
Are we going for a second edition of Lebensraum?
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A united Europe carving up Russia while Britain is left floundering on its own outside of the Super Fun Happy Club? Wow, Hitler's dream really is coming true!
 
There may be contagion in Europe as the rouble tanks. Europe, particularly France as I understand it, is holding a lot of Russian credit. If Russia defaults, Europe is left holding the empty bag.
 
Which would be stupid because European sanctions are part of the reason for the worsening of the Ruble.

There have already been several amnesties for Russian nationals holding credit abroad to bring their money 'back home'. Such a command would leave Mayfair and Belgravia in ruin.
 
My understanding is that Saudi Arabia have alot to do with this i.e. they are forcing the price of oil down. It's one thing when a financial crisis is the result of poor policies and unavoidable circumstances - it's quite another if it is seen (or believed) to be the direct result of deliberate action by a hostile nation...
 
As long as the long term effects aren't all that bad I'd say let them keep on lowering that oil price. Gas is getting cheap, for Dutch standards that is, and that puts a smile on my face everytime I am at the pump.
 
I think it was @axletramp who mentioned being at a pump recently which was 100p a litre; an unprecedented price pretty much anywhere in Britain since maybe... 2007? That 100p is still around 70% tax.
 
OP should be updated.

Yes, Saudi Saudi Saudi... they're mad at the Russians, they're mad at ISIS, they're mad at Iran, and all three are hurt by Saudi Arabia flooding the world with cheap oil.

Of course, they might be relying on recouping some of the losses they're seeing themselves when they've finished whatever game they're playing and Russia, Iran and the US fracking opeations are shuttered... but what will they do when they find they've dropped the world into yet another recession, and global demand fails to recover?

Low prices now may seem like a good thing, but that's simply paying all your problems forward.
 
niky
OP should be updated.

Yes, Saudi Saudi Saudi... they're mad at the Russians, they're mad at ISIS, they're mad at Iran, and all three are hurt by Saudi Arabia flooding the world with cheap oil.

Of course, they might be relying on recouping some of the losses they're seeing themselves when they've finished whatever game they're playing and Russia, Iran and the US fracking opeations are shuttered... but what will they do when they find they've dropped the world into yet another recession, and global demand fails to recover?

Low prices now may seem like a good thing, but that's simply paying all your problems forward.
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The Saudis can profitably produce their fields at $10/barrel. If they can force the price down to under ~$40 for an extended time, they may force many other players out and gain market control.
 
Dotini
The Saudis can profitably produce their fields at $10/barrel. If they can force the price down to under ~$40 for an extended time, they may force many other players out and gain market control.
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$10 is too low. Others speculate about $30, in order to have something set aside to keep the fields humming along.

But even then, forcing the price down hurts Saudi's citizens, too. While the operational break-even, whatever it is, is arguably in that range, it makes for a much poorer Saudi Arabia. The wells might break even, but the government and the programs the oil money supports will suffer.
 
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niky
But even then, forcing the price down hurts Saudi's citizens, too. While the operational break-even, whatever it is, is arguably in that range, it makes for a much poorer Saudi Arabia.
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In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.
 
Dennisch
Apple and Steam have blocked access for Russia due to the freefall the Ruble is making, saying that users from other countries now can not abuse the low prices in Russia.

Neogaf users discovered it
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My AppStore still works, Steam does, too (at least did yesterday, I'll check again today when I get home).
However, I've heard that Steam is going to switch to dollar prices for Russia soon. Luckily I got something I wanted from here, even with discount. Like GRID Autosport for 299 rub. With this currency price, I literally stole it :D

Rouble is really going down like a dive bomber. Feels kinda scary. Import goods cost more and more. If I want to get a PS4, I better get it ASAP, because it'll be more expensive later.

By the way:
image.jpg

^Reptiloids! It's their fault!

Yesterday, it went a bit up and made a graph like this:
image.jpg
 
Steam is not blocked in Russia, I just bought Euro Truck Simulator 2 Gold Bundle with 85% discount (for 74 rub - a little more than 1 euro today).
 
Germany is kinda expecting that Greece will leave the Euro zone now that there most likely will be a far left government elected pretty soon. And the leader of that political movement already said that the current set of sanctions are far too harsh for Greece and that they will need to be changed.

As a reaction to all this our dearest Angela Merkel said about a Greek exit (Grexit :indiff:): We actually don't really care if Greece leaves. The other piigs are well underway of getting healthy and the Eurozone as a whole can live without Greece.

I'll bet the Greeks didn't expect that to backfire so fast. :lol:
 
Greece - and Italy for that matter - should never have been admitted into the Euro the first place. They didn't fulfill the financial criteria to do so and the other Euro states knew that and let them in anyway - so it's just as much Germany's fault as it is anyone else's.
 
If there was ever a right (or preferably "least wrong") time to dump the Greeks out of the Eurozone, it would have been 3/4 years ago...but I'd hazard a guess that would have raised questions about the rest of the PIIGS.
 

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