FITT challenge. Viper Strike Closed Congratulations to Lap; Lionheart2113 & Drivers choice Xande1959

  • Thread starter Otaliema
  • 425 comments
  • 27,736 views
That's strange, on my car, hitting over 160mph, the front barely lifted.
I just rebuilt your car, yes your are hitting 260 km/h at the braking point but at the bump, your only at 250 km/h which is below the lift off speed. when I bumped your power upto 750 hp, and got it to hit 255 at the bump your car was lifting as much as everyone else.
I've added the tune to my keep list just need to adjust the LSD so i'm not spinning it when I smash the gas coming out of a turn
*Adjustment if your interested->RH tires, Accel setting 20, no other changes, still have outsiide wheel spin for rotation but it's not instant spin on reduced grip situations**
 
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Black always looks awesome clean:cool:......Lincoln LS however, engineering nightmare and stupidity wrapped in tight package:lol:
Yes that car was a mis-match at best, causing it to have a multi personality disorder.
I just rebuilt your car, yes your are hitting 260 km/h at the braking point but at the bump, your only at 250 km/h which is below the lift off speed. when I bumped your power upto 750 hp, and got it to hit 255 at the bump your car was lifting as much as everyone else.
:lol:Here we are not talking about oversteer, understeer, but exactly how fast your car needs to be going before "lift off"!:lol:

Edit:
Your car has a lower top end by about 15-20 km/h than everyone else in this challenge. Your car is redlineing at the bump while everyone else is still acceleration and going faster.
So mine isn't lifting because of my wicked awesome tuning skills...it's because I tuned it and it's the slowest?! Why do I not find that hard to believe?:dopey:
 
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:lol:Here we are not talking about oversteer, understeer, but exactly how fast your car needs to be going before "lift off"!:lol:

Edit:

So mine isn't lifting because of my wicked awesome tuning skills...it's because I tuned it and it's the slowest?! Why do I not find that hard to believe?:dopey:
I know right? if this wasn't a racing forum people could be forgivin for thinking that we were talking about airplanes.

Yes it's the "slowest" car, but with wicked acceleration your ranking in the top 5 atm. proly going to be top 3 this run. I missed the mark this challenge so I just hoping for a top 10 finish.
 
Sheet update, DC blanking out has been corrected, there were cell link up errors, and formula population errors that have been addressed and repaired.
 
I just rebuilt your car, yes your are hitting 260 km/h at the braking point but at the bump, your only at 250 km/h which is below the lift off speed. when I bumped your power upto 750 hp, and got it to hit 255 at the bump your car was lifting as much as everyone else.
I've added the tune to my keep list just need to adjust the LSD so i'm not spinning it when I smash the gas coming out of a turn
*Adjustment if your interested->RH tires, Accel setting 20, no other changes, still have outsiide wheel spin for rotation but it's not instant spin on reduced grip situations**

I see :D I haven't tried with more power :) You are not supposed to the smash the gas when driving a powerful car with torque that melt the tires :lol: I tend to use higher lock LSD as it allows better traction with controlled throttle, I often feather/modulate the throttle at around 70% on mid corner. It's like second nature for me :D I used to drive powerful FR turbo car with high lock/preload LSD, it was a beast in the rain, it even managed to wiggle the rear end on 3rd gear with part throttle after I fitted wider tire :lol:
 
I see :D I haven't tried with more power :) You are not supposed to the smash the gas when driving a powerful car with torque that melt the tires :lol: I tend to use higher lock LSD as it allows better traction with controlled throttle, I often feather/modulate the throttle at around 70% on mid corner. It's like second nature for me :D I used to drive powerful FR turbo car with high lock/preload LSD, it was a beast in the rain, it even managed to wiggle the rear end on 3rd gear with part throttle after I fitted wider tire :lol:
I know :cool: but when PD programed the DS3 for button movement, it ended up being only about 3/4 of the full range that gets used. So moving it 1/2 way is 80% of the gas so it's hard not to smash the gas. I really need to get some trigger mods for my controller so I have a much longer range of movement.
 
I know :cool: but when PD programed the DS3 for button movement, it ended up being only about 3/4 of the full range that gets used. So moving it 1/2 way is 80% of the gas so it's hard not to smash the gas. I really need to get some trigger mods for my controller so I have a much longer range of movement.
Try using the sticks instead, then you have a full range of motion rather than just on/off
 
Try using the sticks instead, then you have a full range of motion rather than just on/off
I use L2 and R2 for throttle break so I can left foot break and use my thumb for shifting square/x.
Circle for NOS and Triangle for Hand break.
R3(stick) has the same range of control as L2/R2 in terms of movement of throttle/break when the car is actually moving. at a standing start it's full range but soon as the race starts 25% of the button range gose poof and I don't get it.
 
It's time to get USB adapter and DS2, trust me, it's good investment and will make driving in GT6 much better experience ( on controller )
As long as you don't use the L2/R2 for throttle/brake. The DS3 has the better range of movement for those triggers than DS2.
 
the DS2 still has multi postion digital triggers, and pressure sensitive digital buttons, the DS3 has analog triggers, and regular digital buttons, Same with the DS4, think a DS4 would work on a PS3? the new controllers should have better movement range. in theory anyways.

They called them analog buttons on the DS2 but they are not. no potentiometer's installed like in the DS3 and DS4.
 
As long as you don't use the L2/R2 for throttle/brake. The DS3 has the better range of movement for those triggers than DS2.

the DS2 still has multi postion digital triggers, and pressure sensitive digital buttons, the DS3 has analog triggers, and regular digital buttons, Same with the DS4, think a DS4 would work on a PS3? the new controllers should have better movement range. in theory anyways.

They called them analog buttons on the DS2 but they are not. no potentiometer's installed like in the DS3 and DS4.

The good thing about DS2 is the face buttons are pressure sensitive with much better range. Imagine pressing full throttle on DS3 using the X to 100%, now on DS2 the pressure used on the DS3 will only register about 25% to 30%, you will need to press harder and deeper to get 100% ( about 3 times ). The rear trigger on DS2 also pressure sensitive on certain PS3 games :D

I have opened DS3 and DS2, they are quite similar ( for the face buttons ) and the rear trigger also not much different. The build quality is much better on the DS2 though ( internally ) - I have original DS2 from my Slim PS2 :P

If in doubt, download my replays posted on my garage ( GPRM 86GT GT4 and Riley Tech Camaro GT4 ), without ABS with high BB, and high lock LSD, there you can see how much throttle and brake control is possible even with old worn out DS2 stick :cheers:
 
The good thing about DS2 is the face buttons are pressure sensitive with much better range. Imagine pressing full throttle on DS3 using the X to 100%, now on DS2 the pressure used on the DS3 will only register about 25% to 30%, you will need to press harder and deeper to get 100% ( about 3 times ). The rear trigger on DS2 also pressure sensitive on certain PS3 games :D

I have opened DS3 and DS2, they are quite similar ( for the face buttons ) and the rear trigger also not much different. The build quality is much better on the DS2 though ( internally ) - I have original DS2 from my Slim PS2 :P

If in doubt, download my replays posted on my garage ( GPRM 86GT GT4 and Riley Tech Camaro GT4 ), without ABS with high BB, and high lock LSD, there you can see how much throttle and brake control is possible even with old worn out DS2 stick :cheers:
Anything to help an "X" throttle, I'm all for it!:cheers:
 
The good thing about DS2 is the face buttons are pressure sensitive with much better range. Imagine pressing full throttle on DS3 using the X to 100%, now on DS2 the pressure used on the DS3 will only register about 25% to 30%, you will need to press harder and deeper to get 100% ( about 3 times ). The rear trigger on DS2 also pressure sensitive on certain PS3 games :D

I have opened DS3 and DS2, they are quite similar ( for the face buttons ) and the rear trigger also not much different. The build quality is much better on the DS2 though ( internally ) - I have original DS2 from my Slim PS2 :P

If in doubt, download my replays posted on my garage ( GPRM 86GT GT4 and Riley Tech Camaro GT4 ), without ABS with high BB, and high lock LSD, there you can see how much throttle and brake control is possible even with old worn out DS2 stick :cheers:
someting to consider I have a couple old DS2's in the basement and some cable extensions.
Too bad X-box controllers wont work on the PS3 the have fantastic trigger controls.
 
Anything to help an "X" throttle, I'm all for it!:cheers:
Doing some research the DS3 have the pressure sensitive face buttons just like the DS2 does, if they don't work that way than PD didn't program the comparability into GT6.
Anyways I've got two cars left to test than I will post results in the morning after I drive them.
 
OK, here goes.

All cars tested for 10 laps, using DS3 (d-pad), all aids off except ABS1 and driving line, with Auto transmission.

Not sure what happened with my lap times in this one, maybe the car and track not suited to my style, and it ranks up their with the Miata at Matterhorn for thumb achedness and frustration. It seems I only really settled with 2 tunes out of the 15, so well done to those.

Listed as requested by the host.

@Otaliema
Time - 1:25:284
DC - 7
Struggled with the understeer, then struggled to get on the power. Having said that though, after completeing the testing, time was up there.

@Bowtie-muscle
Time - 1:25:811
DC - 8.5
Very stable car. Touch of oversteer on corner exit if mashing the go button. Deserved a better time.

@Ridox2JZGTE
Time - 1:26:783
DC - 7.5
Nice tight tune. Slightly underpowered but able to use what it had well. A little understeer and not too keen on the bumps but good effort.

@brian wolf
Time - 1:25:279
DC - 8.5
Quite similar in feel to Bowties submission. Good turn in with a hint of oversteer which is easy to catch.

@Lionheart2113
Time - 1:24:467
DC - 10
No surprises really that this one was quickest for me seeing as we have almost identical driving setups. Was a bit peeved that I couldn't match his time with it. Good solid tune. Easy turn in, good through the corner and easy to get on the power on exit. As mentioned by other testers, was bouncing off the limiter at the end of the back straight. Bravo sir.

@shaunm80
Time - 1:28:378
DC - 7
Was fairly comfortable until I tired to push it. Good turn in and throttle control needed on exit. Fairly unforgiving if you hit the bumps wrong. Accidentaly ran this with a flat floor to begin with and ran mid 1:25's.

@DolHaus
Time - 1:25:595
DC - 8
Good all round tune. A little oversteer if on the power too early but easy enough to catch. Felt like it should have been quicker.

@Gino Caberlin
Time - 1:25:645
DC - 8
Comfortable tune. Easy to get round the track without too much trouble. Good effort.

@krenkme
Time - 1:27:338
DC - 7
Once you get used to the feel of it compared to the flat floor cars it provides a decent drive. Watch out for the rear getting away from you though, as once it does you're finished. Ended quite a few laps sideways somehow.

@787bcgr
Time - 1:26:110
DC - 6
Really struggled to keep hold of the rear, and it didn't cope overly well with the bumps.

@MrGrado
Time - 1:27:183
DC - 7
Struggled to keep the rear in check, and locked up under braking, but other than that a solid tune.

@xande1959
Time - 1:25:378
DC - 8.5
Good solid tune this one. Rear can get away from you if you're too eager. Good effort.

@oppositelock
Time - 1:24:767
DC - 9
The only other tune that seemed to hook up right. Good turn in, stable under braking and can get on the power with confidence. Good effort.

@Motor City Hami
Time - 1:25:354
DC - 8
Good car this. Solid under braking. Good on corner entry with a hint of understeer. A little moor throttle control required than I can privide. I'll keep the keys if that's ok.

@DaBomm4
Time - 1:27:716
DC - 7
Felt quite loose with understeer and oversteer present. Steady on the throttle and it'll be good.
 
OK, here goes.

All cars tested for 10 laps, using DS3 (d-pad), all aids off except ABS1 and driving line, with Auto transmission.

Not sure what happened with my lap times in this one, maybe the car and track not suited to my style, and it ranks up their with the Miata at Matterhorn for thumb achedness and frustration. It seems I only really settled with 2 tunes out of the 15, so well done to those.

Listed as requested by the host.

@Otaliema
Time - 1:25:284
DC - 7
Struggled with the understeer, then struggled to get on the power. Having said that though, after completeing the testing, time was up there.

@Bowtie-muscle
Time - 1:25:811
DC - 8.5
Very stable car. Touch of oversteer on corner exit if mashing the go button. Deserved a better time.

@Ridox2JZGTE
Time - 1:26:783
DC - 7.5
Nice tight tune. Slightly underpowered but able to use what it had well. A little understeer and not too keen on the bumps but good effort.

@brian wolf
Time - 1:25:279
DC - 8.5
Quite similar in feel to Bowties submission. Good turn in with a hint of oversteer which is easy to catch.

@Lionheart2113
Time - 1:24:467
DC - 10
No surprises really that this one was quickest for me seeing as we have almost identical driving setups. Was a bit peeved that I couldn't match his time with it. Good solid tune. Easy turn in, good through the corner and easy to get on the power on exit. As mentioned by other testers, was bouncing off the limiter at the end of the back straight. Bravo sir.

@shaunm80
Time - 1:28:378
DC - 7
Was fairly comfortable until I tired to push it. Good turn in and throttle control needed on exit. Fairly unforgiving if you hit the bumps wrong. Accidentaly ran this with a flat floor to begin with and ran mid 1:25's.

@DolHaus
Time - 1:25:595
DC - 8
Good all round tune. A little oversteer if on the power too early but easy enough to catch. Felt like it should have been quicker.

@Gino Caberlin
Time - 1:25:645
DC - 8
Comfortable tune. Easy to get round the track without too much trouble. Good effort.

@krenkme
Time - 1:27:338
DC - 7
Once you get used to the feel of it compared to the flat floor cars it provides a decent drive. Watch out for the rear getting away from you though, as once it does you're finished. Ended quite a few laps sideways somehow.

@787bcgr
Time - 1:26:110
DC - 6
Really struggled to keep hold of the rear, and it didn't cope overly well with the bumps.

@MrGrado
Time - 1:27:183
DC - 7
Struggled to keep the rear in check, and locked up under braking, but other than that a solid tune.

@xande1959
Time - 1:25:378
DC - 8.5
Good solid tune this one. Rear can get away from you if you're too eager. Good effort.

@oppositelock
Time - 1:24:767
DC - 9
The only other tune that seemed to hook up right. Good turn in, stable under braking and can get on the power with confidence. Good effort.

@Motor City Hami
Time - 1:25:354
DC - 8
Good car this. Solid under braking. Good on corner entry with a hint of understeer. A little moor throttle control required than I can privide. I'll keep the keys if that's ok.

@DaBomm4
Time - 1:27:716
DC - 7
Felt quite loose with understeer and oversteer present. Steady on the throttle and it'll be good.
Thanks biffa, my tune was not expected to be fast, thought stability and comfort would help me with DC and seems that's where it's going. Great review as usual:tup:
 
Thanks for the review @biffa3 !👍 :bowdown: I'm glad you got the same out of the car as I did. I'm surprised you weren't all over my times as well. We are constantly battling!:lol: I did take forever and a day when tuning this, so that's gotta be the only reason I can see.:cheers: Take care of those thumbs!:dopey:
 
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OK, here goes.

All cars tested for 10 laps, using DS3 (d-pad), all aids off except ABS1 and driving line, with Auto transmission.

Not sure what happened with my lap times in this one, maybe the car and track not suited to my style, and it ranks up their with the Miata at Matterhorn for thumb achedness and frustration. It seems I only really settled with 2 tunes out of the 15, so well done to those.

Listed as requested by the host.

@Otaliema
Time - 1:25:284
DC - 7
Struggled with the understeer, then struggled to get on the power. Having said that though, after completeing the testing, time was up there.

@Bowtie-muscle
Time - 1:25:811
DC - 8.5
Very stable car. Touch of oversteer on corner exit if mashing the go button. Deserved a better time.

@Ridox2JZGTE
Time - 1:26:783
DC - 7.5
Nice tight tune. Slightly underpowered but able to use what it had well. A little understeer and not too keen on the bumps but good effort.

@brian wolf
Time - 1:25:279
DC - 8.5
Quite similar in feel to Bowties submission. Good turn in with a hint of oversteer which is easy to catch.

@Lionheart2113
Time - 1:24:467
DC - 10
No surprises really that this one was quickest for me seeing as we have almost identical driving setups. Was a bit peeved that I couldn't match his time with it. Good solid tune. Easy turn in, good through the corner and easy to get on the power on exit. As mentioned by other testers, was bouncing off the limiter at the end of the back straight. Bravo sir.

@shaunm80
Time - 1:28:378
DC - 7
Was fairly comfortable until I tired to push it. Good turn in and throttle control needed on exit. Fairly unforgiving if you hit the bumps wrong. Accidentaly ran this with a flat floor to begin with and ran mid 1:25's.

@DolHaus
Time - 1:25:595
DC - 8
Good all round tune. A little oversteer if on the power too early but easy enough to catch. Felt like it should have been quicker.

@Gino Caberlin
Time - 1:25:645
DC - 8
Comfortable tune. Easy to get round the track without too much trouble. Good effort.

@krenkme
Time - 1:27:338
DC - 7
Once you get used to the feel of it compared to the flat floor cars it provides a decent drive. Watch out for the rear getting away from you though, as once it does you're finished. Ended quite a few laps sideways somehow.

@787bcgr
Time - 1:26:110
DC - 6
Really struggled to keep hold of the rear, and it didn't cope overly well with the bumps.

@MrGrado
Time - 1:27:183
DC - 7
Struggled to keep the rear in check, and locked up under braking, but other than that a solid tune.

@xande1959
Time - 1:25:378
DC - 8.5
Good solid tune this one. Rear can get away from you if you're too eager. Good effort.

@oppositelock
Time - 1:24:767
DC - 9
The only other tune that seemed to hook up right. Good turn in, stable under braking and can get on the power with confidence. Good effort.

@Motor City Hami
Time - 1:25:354
DC - 8
Good car this. Solid under braking. Good on corner entry with a hint of understeer. A little moor throttle control required than I can privide. I'll keep the keys if that's ok.

@DaBomm4
Time - 1:27:716
DC - 7
Felt quite loose with understeer and oversteer present. Steady on the throttle and it'll be good.
@biffa3 Thanks!
 
OK, here goes.

All cars tested for 10 laps, using DS3 (d-pad), all aids off except ABS1 and driving line, with Auto transmission.

Not sure what happened with my lap times in this one, maybe the car and track not suited to my style, and it ranks up their with the Miata at Matterhorn for thumb achedness and frustration. It seems I only really settled with 2 tunes out of the 15, so well done to those.

Listed as requested by the host.

@Otaliema
Time - 1:25:284
DC - 7
Struggled with the understeer, then struggled to get on the power. Having said that though, after completeing the testing, time was up there.

@Bowtie-muscle
Time - 1:25:811
DC - 8.5
Very stable car. Touch of oversteer on corner exit if mashing the go button. Deserved a better time.

@Ridox2JZGTE
Time - 1:26:783
DC - 7.5
Nice tight tune. Slightly underpowered but able to use what it had well. A little understeer and not too keen on the bumps but good effort.

@brian wolf
Time - 1:25:279
DC - 8.5
Quite similar in feel to Bowties submission. Good turn in with a hint of oversteer which is easy to catch.

@Lionheart2113
Time - 1:24:467
DC - 10
No surprises really that this one was quickest for me seeing as we have almost identical driving setups. Was a bit peeved that I couldn't match his time with it. Good solid tune. Easy turn in, good through the corner and easy to get on the power on exit. As mentioned by other testers, was bouncing off the limiter at the end of the back straight. Bravo sir.

@shaunm80
Time - 1:28:378
DC - 7
Was fairly comfortable until I tired to push it. Good turn in and throttle control needed on exit. Fairly unforgiving if you hit the bumps wrong. Accidentaly ran this with a flat floor to begin with and ran mid 1:25's.

@DolHaus
Time - 1:25:595
DC - 8
Good all round tune. A little oversteer if on the power too early but easy enough to catch. Felt like it should have been quicker.

@Gino Caberlin
Time - 1:25:645
DC - 8
Comfortable tune. Easy to get round the track without too much trouble. Good effort.

@krenkme
Time - 1:27:338
DC - 7
Once you get used to the feel of it compared to the flat floor cars it provides a decent drive. Watch out for the rear getting away from you though, as once it does you're finished. Ended quite a few laps sideways somehow.

@787bcgr
Time - 1:26:110
DC - 6
Really struggled to keep hold of the rear, and it didn't cope overly well with the bumps.

@MrGrado
Time - 1:27:183
DC - 7
Struggled to keep the rear in check, and locked up under braking, but other than that a solid tune.

@xande1959
Time - 1:25:378
DC - 8.5
Good solid tune this one. Rear can get away from you if you're too eager. Good effort.

@oppositelock
Time - 1:24:767
DC - 9
The only other tune that seemed to hook up right. Good turn in, stable under braking and can get on the power with confidence. Good effort.

@Motor City Hami
Time - 1:25:354
DC - 8
Good car this. Solid under braking. Good on corner entry with a hint of understeer. A little moor throttle control required than I can privide. I'll keep the keys if that's ok.

@DaBomm4
Time - 1:27:716
DC - 7
Felt quite loose with understeer and oversteer present. Steady on the throttle and it'll be good.
Thank you for the review :cheers:
 
OK, here goes.

All cars tested for 10 laps, using DS3 (d-pad), all aids off except ABS1 and driving line, with Auto transmission.

Not sure what happened with my lap times in this one, maybe the car and track not suited to my style, and it ranks up their with the Miata at Matterhorn for thumb achedness and frustration. It seems I only really settled with 2 tunes out of the 15, so well done to those.

Listed as requested by the host.

@Otaliema
Time - 1:25:284
DC - 7
Struggled with the understeer, then struggled to get on the power. Having said that though, after completeing the testing, time was up there.

@Bowtie-muscle
Time - 1:25:811
DC - 8.5
Very stable car. Touch of oversteer on corner exit if mashing the go button. Deserved a better time.

@Ridox2JZGTE
Time - 1:26:783
DC - 7.5
Nice tight tune. Slightly underpowered but able to use what it had well. A little understeer and not too keen on the bumps but good effort.

@brian wolf
Time - 1:25:279
DC - 8.5
Quite similar in feel to Bowties submission. Good turn in with a hint of oversteer which is easy to catch.

@Lionheart2113
Time - 1:24:467
DC - 10
No surprises really that this one was quickest for me seeing as we have almost identical driving setups. Was a bit peeved that I couldn't match his time with it. Good solid tune. Easy turn in, good through the corner and easy to get on the power on exit. As mentioned by other testers, was bouncing off the limiter at the end of the back straight. Bravo sir.

@shaunm80
Time - 1:28:378
DC - 7
Was fairly comfortable until I tired to push it. Good turn in and throttle control needed on exit. Fairly unforgiving if you hit the bumps wrong. Accidentaly ran this with a flat floor to begin with and ran mid 1:25's.

@DolHaus
Time - 1:25:595
DC - 8
Good all round tune. A little oversteer if on the power too early but easy enough to catch. Felt like it should have been quicker.

@Gino Caberlin
Time - 1:25:645
DC - 8
Comfortable tune. Easy to get round the track without too much trouble. Good effort.

@krenkme
Time - 1:27:338
DC - 7
Once you get used to the feel of it compared to the flat floor cars it provides a decent drive. Watch out for the rear getting away from you though, as once it does you're finished. Ended quite a few laps sideways somehow.

@787bcgr
Time - 1:26:110
DC - 6
Really struggled to keep hold of the rear, and it didn't cope overly well with the bumps.

@MrGrado
Time - 1:27:183
DC - 7
Struggled to keep the rear in check, and locked up under braking, but other than that a solid tune.

@xande1959
Time - 1:25:378
DC - 8.5
Good solid tune this one. Rear can get away from you if you're too eager. Good effort.

@oppositelock
Time - 1:24:767
DC - 9
The only other tune that seemed to hook up right. Good turn in, stable under braking and can get on the power with confidence. Good effort.

@Motor City Hami
Time - 1:25:354
DC - 8
Good car this. Solid under braking. Good on corner entry with a hint of understeer. A little moor throttle control required than I can privide. I'll keep the keys if that's ok.

@DaBomm4
Time - 1:27:716
DC - 7
Felt quite loose with understeer and oversteer present. Steady on the throttle and it'll be good.
Thank you sir. Impressive time with such a twitchy car that I made. I do think tune will be getting an overhaul after the challenge is completed. Fantastic feedback as well thank you
 
Thanks for the review @biffa3 !👍 :bowdown: I'm glad you got the same out of the car as I did. I'm surprised you weren't all over my times as well. We are constantly battling!:lol: I did take forever and a day when tuning this, so that's gotta be the only reason I can see.:cheers: Take car of those thumbs!:dopey:

Not sure of the reason to be honest. I thought maybe it was because you had run many more laps than me whilst tuning. I had to be strict with myself to limit laps run in yours and oppositelocks' car as they were very enjoyable to drive.
 
@Lionheart2113 and @oppositelock have announced their arrivals. Nice performance so far, gentlemen. And @Lionheart2113 is a X and Square user? Super impressive for someone who is all thumbs. 👍
^^^And the ref takes a point away for a cheap shot!👍 Long way to go still, but it's a lot of fun and my goodness the times are all over each other! And @Bowtie-muscle ...remember my luck at 3rd place finishes? As it sits right now 1st for time, but tied with Hami for 5th DC points, that's an average of...3rd!:eek: Spooky :lol:
 
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