FM7 vs. PCars 2 vs. GT:Sport

[limepie]

I feel like the goalposts just shifted. We've gone from "I can't drift or even do a donut" to a video of a guy drifting but saying that there's something odd about it.

As I said, I'm not a drifter so I wouldn't say I could judge what drifting pretty much any car should feel like. Maybe that's one of PC2s weak points, maybe it's just that car. If you watch some of Extra Miles other videos like this:



...he seems much more positive. He seems to know his stuff with regard to drifting, and he even took the time to review a video of the real car drifting beforehand. That would tend to support the idea that the underlying physics are at least capable of simulating correct behaviour, and it's just that the Mustang isn't implemented in-game correctly.

That's not implausible, there are at least two parts to the car simulation: the physics engine and the numbers that are fed into it from the car data. If you get either one of them wrong, the car will feel wrong to drive. If they got the Mustang car data wrong, it will feel wrong. It's also technically possible to have a "wrong" physics engine and car data that is "wrong" in just the correct way to give you a correct result. But less likely, especially over multiple cars.

How many cars have you actually tried to drift in? There are known cars in pretty much every sim that I'm aware of that are of lesser quality or have errors in their simulation. Is this one of those (as @Wolfe suggests), or is this actually a fundamental flaw in the physics simulation of PC2? Did you just get unlucky and pick some of the worse cars in the game for the behaviour that you were looking for?



Maybe that's all it is, some cars are OK, some kind of suck. It wouldn't be the first game to have that. But that's more of a car data problem than a simulation problem. The Chaparral laser powered monstrosity doesn't make GT6 a worse sim just because it breaks any number of laws of physics.

Yeah, i only tried the mustang (you have to return steam games within 2 hours in order to get your money back if you decide not to keep them) I'd assumed it would be the easiest car to drift in the game due to its layout, simplicity and power.

You absolutely bring up a good point that it could just be that car.

And I apologize for 'moving the goalposts' as it were. I believe i stated earlier that small angle stuff is no problem, but that big angle drifts are where the game kind of starts to show its weaknesses. Drift transitions are also a weak point to my memory and result in too many tank slappers. By 'Donut' i was referring to a controlled circular drift, like what you'd do around a roundabout. Drift bros in the drift community get all butthurt when you call something like that 'drifting' so i've trained myself to just call it a donut, but that was probably a little confusing.

Its worth noting that even in the 911 video you posted, you can still see just how unstable the car is as it finishes a drift, i'd recon if he were trying to link corners he'd spin more often than not.

After our conversation, i was worried that maybe i was just a crazy person, so i searched the internet for others who may agree with me. Now, this is clearly anecdotal, so take this with a grain of salt, but here are other people trying to articulate on the problem i have with the game.

From https://www.roadtovr.com/project-cars-2-vr-review-oculus-rift-htc-vive/

Relevant quote:

My benchmark for road car simulation is Assetto Corsa. Project CARS 2’s impressive new tyre model seems to have the potential to match it, but there are too many inconsistencies. The Porsche GT3 RS is superb, the McLaren 720S is a blast, and the mad hybrid hypercars of LaFerrari, 918, and P1 behave similarly to Assetto Corsa’s interpretations, but many of the front-engine, rear-drive road cars lack the inherent balance you’d expect. The Toyota GT86 and BMW 1M are the pick of the bunch, ‘chuckable’ into every corner. But the DB11, widely regarded as a brilliant chassis, is incredibly difficult to drift, particularly at low speeds. The F-Type is similarly awkward. The C63 monster is better, with its realistic ability to eat its rear tyres in a couple of laps, but again, there are problems over the limit. Most of the road cars (with all assists off) exhibit a low speed, high slip angle problem, making tight drift transitions almost impossible.

This steam forum post is clearly made by an a-hole, but this particular a-hole does have the same problem as me
https://steamcommunity.com/app/378860/discussions/1/1480982971173795600/?l=polish

Take a look at the transitions in this Forza 7 video, notice how smooth they are, how the car holds a big drift angle from corner entry to exit before swinging into the next drift:



I can do that (with slightly less precision, i'm not that good) in a variety of games. But within a couple hours of playing P-cars 2 i knew that was never going to be a thing I could do in that game. Now, maybe i was wrong, maybe with enough perseverance i would've been able to get there in P-cars 2, maybe i just needed a not-mustang. But i don't think so. I think the game genuinely struggles to simulate car behavior way over the limit. I understand this may not be a big deal to lots of people, but I am of the opinion that if its a thing many people do IRL with their cars, it should be simulated in the game.