Formula 1 Gulf Air Bahrain Grand Prix 2021Formula 1

[C-ZETA]

Hindsight will show Red Bull bottled the strategy... They've learned the hard way to stay as close to Lewis as possible, tyre life be damned.

 

[-Fred-]

Vettel got handed 2 penalty points for his contact with Ocon, meaning he's now up to 5. Almost halfway to a race ban.

 

[Keef]

Honda is back! Max will be battling for wins all season, Perez will likely beat Bottas on a few occasions once he gets better in the car, and Alpha Tauri's luck will surely improve. I actually think its possible for Alpha Tauri to beat McLaren this year but I'm pretty confident McLaren will be a solid #4 finisher this year, if not #3 ahead of Alpha Tauri.

 

[andrea]

 

[Jubby]

How did he lie? He said he thought they weren't enforcing the limits in the race, which is indeed what they were told. It was just completely contradictory.

The pre-event notes said for the race “the track limits at the exit of turn four will not be monitored with regard to setting a lap time, as the defining limits are the artificial grass and the gravel trap in that location.”

But in the next paragraph they were reminded of Article 27.3 which states "drivers must make every reasonable effort to use the track at all times and may not leave the track without a justifiable reason".

So which is/was it? Clearly even the FIA weren't sure, and they are the only people at fault here. Racing drivers will always be racing drivers.

A top driver knows the limits. They know the lines. They know what they should do. They choose not to. To feign ignorance of the actual limit is deceptive. That's what Lewis was doing on ghe radio. A simple acknowledgement would be more becoming, like most drivers. He got caught and tried to blubber it away... which isn't a good look. This is the second time in recent history he tried this (Russia practice start). That is why I take exception to it.

I know racing drivers are supposed to find every edge and push every boundary, as they should. If he was trying to test the limits and justify his reason for going outside of the track limits, then okay. He didn't. He tried to dispute the limit. When you have all 4 wheels on/over the artificial turf, you're over the limit. Whether they enforced the racing limit does not mean the limit is not there. That's the purpose of the white lines and red/white kerbs and every professional (and most amateur drivers) know it. A 7 time WDC champion, and arguably the greatest, knows the limits and rules. To feign ignorance is deceptive (I shortened it to lying). To say he was confused, I feel is BS. Max knew it was out of bounds, which is why he had to be told it was "acceptable". Lewis is supposed to be the better driver. Again, let's not confuse monitoring/enforcement with the actual track limits.

Edit: To look at the tweet above shows over 20 instances, which is egregious. Everyone in this board knows that's beyond the track limit. A slip once or twice is a mistake. Nearly 30 times is intentional. You can't justify exceeding the limit like that, as per the article you indicated in the briefing.

 

[McLaren]

That is a disgusting Twitter account. I hope that's not someone you actively follow.

 

[Samus]

Yes, nobody has denied that he did it and the FIA 100% saw it. Pretty sure other drivers were doing it as well. The problem, as already mentioned, is that the FIA couldn't agree with themselves whether it was allowed or not. It was only when Red Bull broadcast it to the world viewers and Max started doing it himself they decided it wasn't allowed. Even though they said before the race it was allowed. But it also wasn't, because it being allowed contradicted the other rule where it wasn't.

So again, 100% on the FIA here. Hamilton did what any racing driver does.

A top driver knows the limits. They know the lines. They know what they should do. They choose not to. To feign ignorance of the actual limit is deceptive. That's what Lewis was doing on ghe radio. A simple acknowledgement would be more becoming, like most drivers. He got caught and tried to blubber it away... which isn't a good look. This is the second time in recent history he tried this (Russia practice start). That is why I take exception to it.

Yes they know the lines. They also know where they can/are allowed to go beyond them to gain an advantage, they got told that at the start of each race. Even though of course they're told they can't gain an advantage. But they do. This weekend they were told:

a lap time achieved during any practice session by leaving the track and cutting behind the red and white kerb on the exit of turn four, will result in that lap time being invalidated by the stewards

Then

(During the race) the track limits at the exit of turn four will not be monitored with regard to setting a lap time, as the defining limits are the artificial grass and the gravel trap in that location

But again, they then immediately contradict themselves somewhat by referencing the article I quoted. They're saying you can set a lap time during the race going beyond the white lines, but you also cannot go beyond the white lines without a justifiable reason.

It IS confusing and inconsistent and it really shouldn't be. It's pretty easy to see why based on the above HAM thought it was OK in the race. The problem is again that the FIA seemingly agreed it was OK up until the moment they decided it wasn't.

Changing rules/directives in the middle of a race, because one team broadcasts about it, is absurd.

 

[evldave333]

Yes, nobody has denied that he did it and the FIA 100% saw it. Pretty sure other drivers were doing it as well. The problem, as already mentioned, is that the FIA couldn't agree with themselves whether it was allowed or not. It was only when Red Bull broadcast it to the world viewers and Max started doing it himself they decided it wasn't allowed. Even though they said before the race it was allowed. But it also wasn't, because it being allowed contradicted the other rule where it wasn't.

So again, 100% on the FIA here. Hamilton did what any racing driver does.



Yes they know the lines. They also know where they can/are allowed to go beyond them to gain an advantage, they got told that at the start of each race. Even though of course they're told they can't gain an advantage. But they do. This weekend they were told:



Then



But again, they then immediately contradict themselves somewhat by referencing the article I quoted. They're saying you can set a lap time during the race going beyond the white lines, but you also cannot go beyond the white lines without a justifiable reason.

It IS confusing and inconsistent and it really shouldn't be. It's pretty easy to see why based on the above HAM thought it was OK in the race. The problem is again that the FIA seemingly agreed it was OK up until the moment they decided it wasn't.

Changing rules/directives in the middle of a race, because one team broadcasts about it, is absurd.

All this hot air and like all races the stewards give a verbal warning as is normal, before they subsequently issue penalties... there is no controversy at all. Its natural to give drivers some leeway in a race, in qualifying there cant be any leeway. Amazing... after such an entertaining spectacle some folks just have to look for a fly in the ointment... all the while there wasnt one lol

 

[Jubby]

It IS confusing and inconsistent and it really shouldn't be. It's pretty easy to see why based on the above HAM thought it was OK in the race. The problem is again that the FIA seemingly agreed it was OK up until the moment they decided it wasn't.

Changing rules/directives in the middle of a race, because one team broadcasts about it, is absurd.

You're right, it shouldn't be. And no, I don't see why Lewis would argue it. Didn't see any other driver argue it. Since Lewis knows the boundary, he knows that taking that line intentionally over 25 times can possibly run afoul of track limits.

You're right, it is absurd to change directives. The directives was absolutely clear. It was not being monitored (it does not say track limits would not be enforced), and it defined the limits (artificial grass). They are two different directives. One defines the boundary, the other defines the monitoring. Neither paragraph legalizes that line. As you stated, the white line boundary is clear.

If the line Lewis crossed was okay, then Max's line was OK. That's what's really confusing. Both cases, all 30 of them, were either legal or not, since every example gained an advantage by both drivers. You can't come back and say that it's different because a pass happened, because even if it's only .2s per lap for each overrun by Lewis, you're talking seconds on his race total. You can easily argue that if Lewis's lead wasn't as large, Max's chase is easier, his pass is easier with fresher tires, and the outcome could be different. Again, it's either illegal (ignore the enforcement) or not.

 

[Liquid]

Come on, nobody should be surprised that Lewis "tyres are gone, man" Hamilton would abuse track limits himself. Him and everyone else. They'll do it until they're told not to, irrespective of whatever the calamitous enforcement of the rules by the stewards is. I actually think it was good that Red Bull spotted it and instructed Verstappen to do the same.

The simple fact is, Hamilton defended well and forced Verstappen too wide. It was a great race and Verstappen was unlucky. On another day, or just one more lap, he'd have gotten the victory. He didn't but it was still a great finish to the race.

I can only hope the two are as close at every other race this season.

 

[Touring Mars]

I personally think that the decision to force Verstappen to let Hamilton back through is criminally bad.

Under any other circumstances, it would be absolutely justified... a clear cut case of passing by going off the track....

...but if track limits are waived/ignored by the stewards at a specific turn for one driver, they simply cannot enforce them against another or change the rules during a race. It's an absolute farce, and Verstappen has been robbed of a race win.

 

[Samus]

You're right, it shouldn't be. And no, I don't see why Lewis would argue it. Didn't see any other driver argue it. Since Lewis knows the boundary, he knows that taking that line intentionally over 25 times can possibly run afoul of track limits.

You're right, it is absurd to change directives. The directives was absolutely clear. It was not being monitored (it does not say track limits would not be enforced), and it defined the limits (artificial grass). They are two different directives. One defines the boundary, the other defines the monitoring. Neither paragraph legalizes that line. As you stated, the white line boundary is clear.

If the line Lewis crossed was okay, then Max's line was OK. That's what's really confusing. Both cases, all 30 of them, were either legal or not, since every example gained an advantage by both drivers. You can't come back and say that it's different because a pass happened, because even if it's only .2s per lap for each overrun by Lewis, you're talking seconds on his race total. You can easily argue that if Lewis's lead wasn't as large, Max's chase is easier, his pass is easier with fresher tires, and the outcome could be different. Again, it's either illegal (ignore the enforcement) or not.

Well that was exactly HAMs point. He'd crossed that line multiple times as he thought he was allowed to, with no issue, then his team are suddenly telling him mid race that if he keeps doing it he'll get the B/W flag treatment. HAM is right to wonder why he hadn't already, if they were following the three strikes rule from the start. They decided they'd start midway through the race.

The inconsistency is indeed the problem, as we've been saying. Article 27.3 of the regulations is clear, you can't leave the track and gain an advantage:

Drivers will be judged to have left the track if no part of the car remains in contact with it and, for the avoidance of doubt, any white lines defining the track edges are considered to be part of the track but the kerbs are not. "Should a car leave the track the driver may rejoin, however, this may only be done when it is safe to do so and without gaining a lasting advantage

So Max's pass was 100% illegal, no doubt about that. He left the track and gained an obvious advantage. But yes, HAM's transgressions were as well, the problem comes with the interpretation of "lasting advantage" which as we've seen in the past the FIA have a very strange definition of.

Mexico 2016 with HAM being allowed to cut T1 to save his tyres will always be absurd to me, for example. Charlie said at the time he got no lasting advantage because the SC came out second later and he lost any ground he gained. Which is true, but completely ignored the huge advantage he gained by not locking up to make the corner in which case he would have probably lost places or at the very least badly flatspotted his tyres.

Which again all spins back around to my original point, the FIA are the ones at fault here with their absurd inconsistency race to race, even corner to corner. How many times have we heard in the past "We're not monitoring track limits at corner X because we don't think drivers gain an advantage" when they very clearly do, or wouldn't consistently do it.

 

[Adam41]

Might be confusing to some people, but the track limits for the weekend post Friday were made clear to the drivers. Read:



Why the FIA changed their mind during the race, no idea. Maybe Red Bull should have kept their mouth shut.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

Much as it would be great if drivers could stick to the track limits, it seems like Red Bull told Max about Hamilton's line through turn 4 a bit late.

 

[evldave333]

The bitterness of these Verstappen fans is understandable, whining about track limits is preferable than facing the fact he threw the win away. Max is really talented but not mentally strong, he is impetuousness cost him today, he could have got the move done if he had been patient.

 

[shoemaker]

One thing we havent had in a long time is actual racing at the front for the lead, its been vey sparse over recent seasons so hopefully today is start of plenty more.

 

[Touring Mars]

The bitterness of these Verstappen fans is understandable, whining about track limits is preferable than facing the fact he threw the win away. Max is really talented but not mentally strong, he is impetuousness cost him today, he could have got the move done if he had been patient.

He had to overtake at some point, it's not 'impetuous' to take a clear chance when it presents itself.

Yes, he could have waited until later in the lap, but Hamilton would still have defended that too, and the outcome may have been no different.

I think it is kind of sad to criticise a driver for being 'impatient' when it is virtually in the DNA of top drivers to not let a clear chance go begging.

And don't forget, Max would have known what state his tyres were in and what grip levels he had, and hence he would know better than anyone how urgently he needed to pass Lewis, and indeed, after giving back the place on the same lap, Max was unable to challenge again for the win, hence it seems fair to me that he tried to pass how and when he did, not least given the farcical rules regarding track limits at turn 4.

 

[evldave333]

He had to overtake at some point, it's not 'impetuous' to take a clear chance when it presents itself.

Yes, he could have waited until later in the lap, but Hamilton would still have defended that too, and the outcome may have been no different.

I think it is kind of sad to criticise a driver for being 'impatient' when it is virtually in the DNA of top drivers to not let a clear chance go begging.

And don't forget, Max would have known what state his tyres were in and what grip levels he had, and hence he would know better than anyone how urgently he needed to pass Lewis, and indeed, after giving back the place on the same lap, Max was unable to challenge again for the win, hence it seems fair to me that he tried to pass how and when he did, not least given the farcical rules regarding track limits at turn 4.

ah such bitterness... objectively it was poor judgement and the victory was assured if he waited for the DRS zone on the home straight into turn 1. Brains not balls was required to seize victory in this instance, inevitably this will improve Max as a driver when he reflects upon what he did. You really embarass yourself saying the rules are to blame... get a grip lol

 

[ShiftingGears]

FIA need to fix the the tracks, the track limits decisionmaking is just embarrassing

 

[Jubby]

The inconsistency is indeed the problem, as we've been saying. Article 27.3 of the regulations is clear, you can't leave the track and gain an advantage:
[Snip]
Which again all spins back around to my original point, the FIA are the ones at fault here with their absurd inconsistency race to race, even corner to corner. How many times have we heard in the past "We're not monitoring track limits at corner X because we don't think drivers gain an advantage" when they very clearly do, or wouldn't consistently do it.

I agree with you 100%. My issue is that it affected the outcome. Unfortunately, the FIA has shown a bias to Mercedes and Lewis when it comes to rule violation in the recent years. They also show a bias to Ferrari, but I won't digress to that point. If the FIA continues to be absurd, they will lose fans and credible races will be marred. This could have been a great unblemished race, but alas we have this.

 

[Touring Mars]

ah such bitterness... objectively it was poor judgement and the victory was assured if he waited for the DRS zone on the home straight into turn 1. Brains not balls was required to seize victory in this instance, inevitably this will improve Max as a driver when he reflects upon what he did. You really embarass yourself saying the rules are to blame... get a grip lol

Bitterness?? Are you assuming that I wanted Max to win? If so, you're wrong.

I think the word you are looking for is 'subjective'... how can it possibly be 'objectively poor judgement' to choose to attempt an overtake at one place and not another? No overtake for the race lead is ever certain, but you seem to imply that it is. Now that is objectively wrong.

Anyway, I'm sharing my views, and you are entitled to share yours, but please... don't insult me for expressing a view on a controversial incident... stick to the debate and stop with the insults.

 

[Jezza819]

At the time I saw Max attempt the pass at turn 4 then run wide, I almost thought Hamilton might have intentionally let Max try it there knowing he would probably have to run wide to do it thus incurring some sort of penalty.

I don't agree with Max saying he could have stretched his lead to Hamilton out over 5 seconds to clear a possible penalty. There wasn't enough laps left for that even if he did have that kind of pace left in his tires.

 

[Samus]

So Masi confirms he/FIA aren't very bright.



Basically "we told them we wouldn't monitor it but then they started doing it every lap so we changed our mind in the middle of the race"

What on earth did they expect?

 

[Dotini]

Inconsistent track limits rules enforcement blighted what could have been a better race. But it was pretty good anyway.
Clear Honda has quite some way to go before a 1-2-3.
Alo looked quite racy for awhile.
Vettel is nearly halfway to a race ban for some reasons(s).
Otherwise, of course here at GTP, Mazepin, Mazepin, Mazepin, Mazpein, Mazepin, Maxispin is the truly important story to stay obsessed with.

 

[Mr Grumpy]

A report on the matter. (not mine)

Hamilton ran wide beyond the extremities of the track boundary at the same corner 29 times throughout the 56-lap race before he was warned by his race engineer Pete Bonnington that he was in danger of receiving a time penalty at mid-distance if he continued to abuse the exit.

The seven-time world champion admitted he was left confused by this instruction and correctly pointed out that before the race it was communicated that track limits would not be policed at Turn 4, unlike in FP2, FP3 and qualifying when such an offence resulted in lap times being deleted.

“Halfway through the race they basically changed their minds and all of a sudden you’re not allowed to go outside that white line,” he said. “Which is fine for me, it’s actually I think faster in the end for me, and helped me look after my tyres, actually. So I’m grateful for the call.”

Hamilton was among a number of drivers who regularly ran wide while exiting Turn 4 during the race and at one stage Red Bull even informed Verstappen to do the same.

Red Bull F1 team principal Christian Horner was left frustrated by what he described as being the “shade of grey” nature of the track limits rules, though he did accept that the decision to penalise Verstappen was technically correct.

Moving to address the confusion after the race, Masi explained that Verstappen’s Turn 4 excursion was ruled to be illegal due to a key distinction in what is deemed as ‘gaining an advantage’.

Masi stressed it was made “very clear” in the pre-event notes and also in the drivers’ briefing on Friday evening that “if an overtake takes place with a car off track and gains a lasting advantage, I will go on the radio and suggest to the team that they immediately relinquish that position.

“With regard to tolerance given with people running outside of the track limits during the race, that was mentioned very clearly in the meeting and the notes that it would not be monitored with regard to setting the lap time, so to speak, but it will always be monitored in according with the Sporting Regulations that a lasting advantage overall must not be gained.”

Responding to both Hamilton and Verstappen’s suggestion that the rules were changed during the race, Masi claimed that “nothing changed at all” regarding the FIA’s stance on track limits.

“We had two people that were looking in that area at every car at every lap and pretty much every car bar one was doing the right thing within what we expected in a general sequence,” Masi added.

“There was the occasional car that had a bit of a moment or went out there but it wasn’t a constant thing.”

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

Just thinking whether Max accepting a hypothetical 5 second penalty and still winning would've been the bigger controversy this weekend. Basically a Palmer/Alonso situation except with much larger stakes.

For all the wordplay the FIA is doing with the track limits deal, still can't beat Vettel's claim that Ocon changed his line when he was the one that moved. Unless he thought at the moment the entire world changed its position.

 

[Samus]

ust thinking whether Max accepting a hypothetical 5 second penalty and still winning would've been the bigger controversy this weekend.

It definitely would have been asking just as many questions. As you say there is precedent of the FIA essentially saying you can illegally pass someone and then just drive down the road to negate the penalty. Didn't used to be a problem in the old days of drive through or stop/go, but with these smaller 5/10 second time adds it is viable.

I guess then they get into the muddy waters of whether there is "intent" to pass clean and just messing it up vs going full video game and short-cutting on purpose to get past.

 

[AshenGraey]

still can't beat Vettel's claim that Ocon changed his line when he was the one that moved. Unless he thought at the moment the entire world changed its position.

Another thing I find funny, not only was he at fault, he managed to spin that Aston Martin just as well as he used to do when he was driving that Ferrari .....I wonder if at some point, Mr Stroll will regret not keeping Perez

 

[ScottPuss20]

Can I have some more? Can I have some more of this action at the front?

 

[MisterWaffles]

After tuning out for most of the last season because it was quite depressing as a Ferrari fan, I have to say that this season is looking set to be one of the best ones yet of the V6 era. The midfield battle is crazy this season and I just want to see where this goes so badly. Not to mention Red Bull actually have a decent shot at winning the title this year it seems, so that would end Mercedes' dominance.