Forza 4 Demo Thread

[Prosthetic]

Noted. As were the previous 5,000 posts littered with 'stupid', 'morons', 'children', etc. as if attempting to lead some revolution from a Forza demo impressions thread buried within the gtplanet forums no less.

Unfortunately, one has to scroll incessantly to find maturely discussed impressions rather than arguments and the CONSTANT wailing and gnashing of teeth over one facet. Oh well.

If you don't like the posts then ignore the posters. Its simple.

Funny how you knew that the post was directed toward you. That must tell you something but that's right I'm just an idiot and your too smart to have a conversation with some idiot like me so I guess the answer to your question is neither.

He never hinted that it was directed towards you. He is simply saying that your post contributes nothing.

This is really is stupid... People are taking this to personally. At this point its comedic.

 

[buttsneeze]

Funny how you knew that the post was directed toward you. That must tell you something but that's right I'm just an idiot and your too smart to have a conversation with some idiot like me so I guess the answer to your question is neither.

Are you going to stop or is this going to keep going?

 

[MikeK]

If you don't like the posts then ignore the posters. Its simple.

Or start another thread about that specific subject and argue there. Simple.

After all, isn't there a greater chance that Dan will notice a thread actually dedicated to the debate? Viva Revolution!!!

 

[zr1chris]

If you don't like the posts then ignore the posters. Its simple.


He never hinted that it was directed towards you. He is simply saying that your post contributes nothing.

This is really is stupid... People are taking this to personally. At this point its comedic.

The point is it's in violation of the AUP. You and your buddy clearly missed it. You guys may want to give it a look through.

This forum was great all day and im now sensing a downward spiral.

 

[buttsneeze]

This forum was great all day and im now sensing a downward spiral.

Feel free to stop posting in it then.

 

[Bogie 19th]

Keep it up, and I will request the mods to close MY thread. Can we move on?

 

[Spagetti69]

Feel free to stop posting in it then.

You seem very aggressive for someone who wasn't bothered with the issue.

Not trying to wind you up just saying.
Were all in the same boat with the you know what? So just relax a bit.

Probably won't get the right attention here anyway, being primarily a PS3 site.

 

[Prosthetic]

The point is it's in violation of the AUP. You and your buddy clearly missed it. You guys may want to give it a look through.

This forum was great all day and im now sensing a downward spiral.

Nothing in that post was against the AUP.

Seriously though... we are now off topic.

My final thought...

Pretty game, good physics, pretty good car list although I wish it had more interesting out of placed cars other then a endless list of perfect sport and super cars. The menu music was nice, cockpits were too dark but I hear you can change that in full game, the car sounds were improved but still sound like a video game. I haven't played with a controller but playing with a Fanatec wheel you can notice the existence of steering assists so that is a major disappointment. With the way the dev team as dealt with this whole thing lost a ton of respect from my camp they need to get their heads out of their ass and learn to respect customers better. This whole ordeal makes me respect companies like Blizzard a whole lot more.

All in all, the package isn't worth the price. I'll think about picking it up when the 360 is cheaper and I can buy an ultimate version where I can actually get all the cars in the game instead of dealing with this preorder ********.

 

[Symtex]

I can't get lower then 1.43 it seems right now with the pad. I think players with the wheel seems to have an advantage. I am still in the top 1% but that Dan guys is just insane. I raced against his ghost and got put to shame real fast.

 

[Tenacious D]

Why the hell consoles can't have a simulation on PC level? Is it just a matter of mainstream appeal? I can't believe there are actual technical issues there.

I hope I'm allowed to have my own opinion around here...

Anyway, I find GT5's physics to be remarkably similar to my PC sims, so much so that I don't mess with them. I don't think this is heresy anymore, since a number of long time PC sim fans have commented very favorably on Prologue, which was a two year old build of GT5 physics, and of course with two years of tweaking, GT5 is better. Others still insist it's the same old simcadiness to them, but the number of those looking favorably on GT5 now from Simland is a definite change in the weather.

Not quite sure what to make of the downer posts about the demo. Forza definitely has its own flavor, and f3 just wasn't that much of a thrill to me to keep me racing through the file handling bog. I would toss the fans a bone and say that the F3 demo wasn't as good as the game. The demo felt very much like F2 with a little understeer. Since the game is going to be released next week anyhow I'll just wait, since tearing around a track with a handful of cars I really don't care for gets old fast.

Mostly I just want Forza so I can paint up and create race cars, so if the physics are as good as the yaysayers say, then it'll be a nice surprise. With the, uhh... plastic MS wheel, but oh well. Someone want to bum me about $300?

 

[Bogie 19th]

I hope I'm allowed to have my own opinion around here...

Anyway, I find GT5's physics to be remarkably similar to my PC sims, so much so that I don't mess with them. I don't think this is heresy anymore, since a number of long time PC sim fans have commented very favorably on Prologue, which was a two year old build of GT5 physics, and of course with two years of tweaking, GT5 is better. Others still insist it's the same old simcadiness to them, but the number of those looking favorably on GT5 now from Simland is a definite change in the weather.

Not quite sure what to make of the downer posts about the demo. Forza definitely has its own flavor, and f3 just wasn't that much of a thrill to me to keep me racing through the file handling bog. I would toss the fans a bone and say that the F3 demo wasn't as good as the game. The demo felt very much like F2 with a little understeer. Since the game is going to be released next week anyhow I'll just wait, since tearing around a track with a handful of cars I really don't care for gets old fast.

Mostly I just want Forza so I can paint up and create race cars, so if the physics are as good as the yaysayers say, then it'll be a nice surprise. With the, uhh... plastic MS wheel, but oh well. Someone want to bum me about $300?

Quick off-topic, but Tenacious D, I know that recently I confused you with InfamousDee, and I might have used your name in vein or said something negative to you or about you. If I did, it was NOT intentional. So if you see something ever going back through posts, I had the wrong person and it wasn't supposed to be you

 

[Chad Esposito]

I hope I'm allowed to have my own opinion around here...

Anyway, I find GT5's physics to be remarkably similar to my PC sims, so much so that I don't mess with them. I don't think this is heresy anymore, since a number of long time PC sim fans have commented very favorably on Prologue, which was a two year old build of GT5 physics, and of course with two years of tweaking, GT5 is better. Others still insist it's the same old simcadiness to them, but the number of those looking favorably on GT5 now from Simland is a definite change in the weather.

Not quite sure what to make of the downer posts about the demo. Forza definitely has its own flavor, and f3 just wasn't that much of a thrill to me to keep me racing through the file handling bog. I would toss the fans a bone and say that the F3 demo wasn't as good as the game. The demo felt very much like F2 with a little understeer. Since the game is going to be released next week anyhow I'll just wait, since tearing around a track with a handful of cars I really don't care for gets old fast.

Mostly I just want Forza so I can paint up and create race cars, so if the physics are as good as the yaysayers say, then it'll be a nice surprise. With the, uhh... plastic MS wheel, but oh well. Someone want to bum me about $300?

You know, I actually enjoyed GT5 (and I'm a sim guy), but it has a huge problem when speaking of physics and it's the brakes (anything else is kind of "ok"). Just surreal, barely touch them, they lock up, they lock up almost no recovery, just spin madly, even with "correct" bias (which is usually an absurd 8:2 setting in many cases), and surprisingly that department goes all the way to FM4 demo, which has much better brakes simulation?!

FM4 demo deserves some credit at least in that physics department, IMO.

 

[Tenacious D]

...recently I confused you with InfamousDee, and I might have used your name in vein or said something negative to you or about you. If I did, it was NOT intentional.

(Bishop's voice) You are forgiven, my child.

Eh, I've been put on a few people's ignore list, so I'm kind of used to being yelled at. Goes with the territory of being a Forza or GT fan, I suppose.

Chad, I'm experimenting with GT5's brake balance myself, turning off ABS, and it's tricky. I won't fault either game as far as technical accuracy with tuning settings go - heck, you can bunch up ALL of a tranny's gears in Forza to one end or the other, which isn't the least bit realistic or sensible, but who cares?

The only thing that matters to me is that this game PLEASE not bite me like Forza 3 did. If not for the file handling, I'd still be playing it in-between stints with GT5. The Livery Editor is simply a dream come true for a model maker and race driver wannabe like myself. I still had troubles with F3's driver views so I didn't feel connected with the car as I do in GT, so I'm hoping that T10 came through on this point as well.

Only a week to go, right chaps? 👍

 

[H20HYBRID_GT]

This is funny I was to say the brakes are the only small letdown in this demo. I really think you can't discuss physics of a videogame the way people on here do, its all personal taste, expectations.

Well I hate to say this but F4 demo is like Id expected GT5 to be... beautiful, great sense of speed, no tearing, very smooth.
It all feels very arcade, but only until you spin or crash. A lot of the arcadish feel I reckon is because of the music tho.

Yes it feels arcady but that doesnt mean it has to be unrealistic. All in all seems like a lot of fun.

Only thing that was weird, why is the Zonda and Ferrari so much easier to drive than the BMW?
Im ok with it as im not a fan of that manufacturer, but still a bit odd.

Steering: simulation
ABS and TC on everything else off, I have to say no idea what you guys mean about steering assist at least using a pad... I really don't.
Im impressed and hope all tracks are as nice as this one.

Thanks again for telling me about the one month gold, glad I didnt have to wait to try this. 👍

 

[NA]

Steering: simulation
ABS and TC on everything else off, I have to say no idea what you guys mean about steering assist at least using a pad... I really don't.
Im impressed and hope all tracks are as nice as this one.
:

Yes, My living situation is such so that it's often a hassle to get out a wheel and set it up in the living room just to play for a short bit. The pad setup suits me just fine though. Deffinitly a step up from FM3 for me. Cars can kick out and get away from you in a way that I find pleasing and fustrating at the same time. I like that it does it, I hate that I did it...hehe.

 

[Crispy]

After a lot of laps, I finally managed a quick lap in the F458 Italia Challenge. 1:25:xx. The top 100 times don't seem like a long stretch, just have to get lucky! I managed a 1:23:xx but because of my last lap it was penalized. Come on Chris! I want you to beat me!

 

[alexleighton]

Well, I just gave the demo a go, I've got mixed feelings. I feel like there's something amiss with the collisions, it seems like cars are crashing without actually touching, which really isn't cool. I'm also getting this feeling of sliding on ice every so often, like suddenly all my grip is gone and I just slide a few feet, I don't know how else to explain it.

The rivals thing is a really cool concept, but I don't know why they've gone and copied the WORST feature of GT5 for it though. Why on earth did they think adding rolling roadblocks who aparently aren't aware of your presence was a good idea, especially when trying to compare two people's skills? And judging by watching a ghost, the AI cars definately aren't in the same places at the same times (since I saw my rival's ghost go right through one) so I know we're going to have situations where we'll have to take a less than ideal line to dodge a stupid Suzuki that our rival didn't have to deal with.

It's pretty though, and for the most part the racing feels good. if only we could get rid of the stupid music (seriously, this isn't Crusin' USA) and remap controls in the demo!

 

[zr1chris]

After a lot of laps, I finally managed a quick lap in the F458 Italia Challenge. 1:25:xx. The top 100 times don't seem like a long stretch, just have to get lucky! I managed a 1:23:xx but because of my last lap it was penalized. Come on Chris! I want you to beat me!

Ill give it a short go before bed in a few minutes. How far in front of me are you?

 

[Crispy]

Ill give it a short go before bed in a few minutes. How far in front of me are you?

Only about 2 or so seconds, at the most.

I noticed that it's almost impossible to set a very fast lap with the Zonda on a controller. With that car you need a little more steering input to take the turns fast, and it's not possible to go to the point it requires on a controller, you have to take it slower to complete the turn.

 

[stevetam]

Same. With the simulation steering I can never get the counter steering right. What sort of times arey ou getting wit h the zonda? I'm at the 1:48:XX CLEAN range, I can do faster but I always get a bad lap if I do (I go slightly out too much...).

I find with the zonda the faster you go the more stable it is, especially on the first section. If you feather the gas, it seems like there isn't enough downforce, so I usually gun that section hoping I don't scrape a wall or go on a rumble strip (which DQ's a clean lap )

 

[II-zOoLoGy-II]

Same. With the simulation steering I can never get the counter steering right. What sort of times arey ou getting wit h the zonda? I'm at the 1:48:XX CLEAN range, I can do faster but I always get a bad lap if I do (I go slightly out too much...).

I find with the zonda the faster you go the more stable it is, especially on the first section. If you feather the gas, it seems like there isn't enough downforce, so I usually gun that section hoping I don't scrape a wall or go on a rumble strip (which DQ's a clean lap )

Go wide and brake early (around the end of the bridge) powering through the first corner in 3rd gear to the inside and you should be set up for the next series of turns (which you can go flat out through) at which point you can go full throttle into 6th all the way down to the wide left.

If I can put up 1:43:5 with a controller than (if you have a wheel) you should be doing AT LEAST an entire second faster than that. I cannot combat the massive amount of understeer that the Cinque has at high speeds with an analog stick.

 

[stevetam]

well, I'm a crappy driver

I just need more time on the hot lap. I tend to restart after every bad lap. I find the understeer is really prominent going into the tunnel. Really ticks me off because It always drives me out too left and causes a bad lap...

 

[II-zOoLoGy-II]

well, I'm a crappy driver

I just need more time on the hot lap. I tend to restart after every bad lap. I find the understeer is really prominent going into the tunnel. Really ticks me off because It always drives me out too left and causes a bad lap...

Well, just try taking most of the corners in 3rd your first time. Then adjust from there. The last two corners before the "hairpin" finish can be taken in 4th and 5th. Everything else is mainly 3rd besides that wide left coming down the hill from the bridge (which I take in 4th).

Just focus on apex, throttle control, and the correct gear. Everything else will fall into place with more lap time.

And for the turn before the tunnel go wide, brake early, sweep inside, and power through in 3rd (same thing as that first turn). I can usually get the Cinque to oversteer here with extra throttle.

Remember: You steer with the throttle; not the wheel

 

[stevetam]

Well, just try taking most of the corners in 3rd your first time. Then adjust from there. The last two corners before the "hairpin" finish can be taken in 4th and 5th. Everything else is mainly 3rd besides that wide left coming down the hill from the bridge (which I take in 4th).

Just focus on apex, throttle control, and the correct gear. Everything else will fall into place with more lap time.

And for the turn before the tunnel go wide, brake early, sweep inside, and power through in 3rd (same thing as that first turn). I can usually get the Cinque to oversteer here with extra throttle.

Remember: You steer with the throttle; not the wheel

I'll try again tomorrow. 👍

I can identify the three areas where I lose MAJOR time on

1. Wide Corners Leading to Tunnel

2. Final Corner Leading to the Uphill Straight

3. Last Corner (I can't find a good line on that, I usually take it down form 5th to 3rd). Going too wide could also lead to the next lap being null.

I can keep up with top times until 1, then the struggles really kick in. I guess it is realyy more throttle control than anything especially when I want to gun the Cinque from the understeer. Now if something could be done about the understeer...

 

[HELLAFLUSH240SX]

I know why I can't compete.
I'm not good at that track
I'm not that good at racing without tons of practice on the pad.
Give me 10+hours and I'll be good.

I suck.

 

[stevetam]

I know why I can't compete.
I'm not good at that track
I'm not that good at racing without tons of practice on the pad.
Give me 10+hours and I'll be good.

I suck.

practice makes perfect?

When I first played the demo, it was pretty much a gongshow. Just drive for fun on a challenge with the line on and get a feel for it. You'll be beating me in no time

 

[zr1chris]

Only about 2 or so seconds, at the most.

I noticed that it's almost impossible to set a very fast lap with the Zonda on a controller. With that car you need a little more steering input to take the turns fast, and it's not possible to go to the point it requires on a controller, you have to take it slower to complete the turn.

Good lap. 👍
Just ran the 458 event I beat the 2 rivals I had between us. Your next. Im just over .5 behind. I'll see what I can do against you in the morning. I really hate these AI Sunday drivers. What can you do when they go 2 wide at the last second going into a corner?

 

[Sele1981]

After playing the demo intensively, I must say the rivals mode is brillant and adds so much to the game! It is really fun and intensive. It is just like an good old need for speed game (most wanted or so) with better arcade physics.

Yeah, arcade physics. Why? You have still so much grip in FM4, I dont think that you can drive with an Zonda R with 250 km/h into an corner, accelerate full throttle out of the corner, even if your wheel is still turned 200° degrees...

I´ve never lost the control of my car and never get the feeling that I will hit the wall if I pass the corner too fast. Yeah there is understeer, just like in FM3. But thats it. It is really fun! And gives you the feeling "I am the king of the roads". Let´s see how the other cars in the full game handle.

It´s also interesting that the M5 is much harder to drive than the Zonda. In GT5, the Zonda is undriveable without TCS.

Sorry dan but all that talk about best physics, worked together with pirelli and so on... I dont feel that much difference to FM3.

But the other stuff in FM is really good. I think I still buy it. But more as a fun game, not as a dry hard sim.

EDIT: Ah, the cockpit view is really good! It is the first game where I can use the cockpit cam to drive. Usually I use the bumper cam in other games. Anyway, I´m still faster with the bumper view... But they made it!

 

[buttsneeze]

After playing the demo intensively, I must say the rivals mode is brillant and adds so much to the game! It is really fun and intensive. It is just like an good old need for speed game (most wanted or so) with better arcade physics.

Yeah, arcade physics. Why? You have still so much grip in FM4, I dont think that you can drive with an Zonda R with 250 km/h into an corner, accelerate full throttle out of the corner, even if your wheel is still turned 200° degrees...

I´ve never lost the control of my car and never get the feeling that I will hit the wall if I pass the corner too fast. Yeah there is understeer, just like in FM3. But thats it. It is really fun! And gives you the feeling "I am the king of the roads". Let´s see how the other cars in the full game handle.

It´s also interesting that the M5 is much harder to drive than the Zonda. In GT5, the Zonda is undriveable without TCS.

Sorry dan but all that talk about best physics, worked together with pirelli and so on... I dont feel that much difference to FM3.

But the other stuff in FM is really good. I think I still buy it. But more as a fun game, not as a dry hard sim.

EDIT: Ah, the cockpit view is really good! It is the first game where I can use the cockpit cam to drive. Usually I use the bumper cam in other games. Anyway, I´m still faster with the bumper view... But they made it!

The Zonda has massive rear tires, a huge rear wing, and is probably tuned for understeer. So I don't think it's unreasonable at all for it to be as grippy or drivable as it is. If anything it's a testament to the realism of their physics that a car with a much inferior power to weight ratio like the M5 is actually more tail-happy simply because of its suspension and aero tuning.

Also, TBH you must not have played much FM3 because it's like a night and day difference. In FM3 the tire physics in transitions were pathetic, it was like half a second or more before the tires grabbed and there was almost no weight transfer. In FM4 the tires really grab nicely and you can get some good transitional and lift-throttle oversteer.

 

[Luminis]

There was also a brilliant post on FM.net (I'll try and quote it once I get home from work) that explained the difference between the Zonda R and the M5 a bit...

In a nutshell:

Why are people suprised that a high performance car that's basically a race car, with tyres and downforce to match that, is easier to drive at speed than a luxurious road car with just heaps of power?

Lesser PI doesn't have to equal easier handling...