Forza 5/6 vs GT6 (See First Post Before Posting)

[Tenacious D]

I have a feeling the new Drivatar will put all other AI to shame.

Dan is being rather coy about how the One is going to open up ways to expand on F5, but that Drivatar thing sounds like the stuff. I was there since Forza 1 days, and the original Drivatar was a blast to teach how to drive. I made a monster DA I named Kujo, and he won me a bunch of races I got tired of fighting the AI to win. And in Forza 1, they were mean, clever little fiends that did stunning things to ruin my races. The potential of having bots that will Borg knowledge on how to race humanly from us and the better racers online is pretty darn fascinating.

You'd think for a guy who has been through four Forzas that I'd have down how to race in it by now, but it just gets more treacherous for me after each game. I guess the three games I'll just have to write off are Enthusia, Forza and... well, anything EA. F5 cooooouuld be the dream racer for me, but I'm just not interested in the $500 MS Leashbox, at least for a good long while till the price drops to more wallet friendly levels. And then, I'm likely to just buy it for Forza like I did the 360, assuming I even care about new Forzas by then.

Of course this is my attitude now, and there's a good chance I'll end up with a mad amount of Christmas money. I'll be keeping tabs on things as the year chugs along, but right now, the Interest meter is just about pegged on Not.

Edit: woops, gotta check out those screenies and see if Kaz's interview got posted.

 

[HAL20XX]

The UI in GT is much better! The garage actually reminds me of GT4 and that's a good thing. Have there been any impressions on the menu? Having done UIs for Fortune 500 companies, the awful menus in GT5 were unbearable.

@Tenacious D: I never experienced much in the way of Forza 1. The 360 was my first Xbox and I picked up a used copy of it. Even though this was a game that was backwards compatible on the 360, it turns out there were two versions of the game and the one I got didn't work 100%. FM2 was released about 2 months after I picked up 1, so my time with it was short-lived.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Destructoid article from E3 :

http://www.destructoid.com/kazunori-yamauchi-on-gran-turismo-6-and-beyond-256119.phtml

We asked Yamauchi what changes Gran Turismo 5 players might notice right off when trying out GT6.

"We've updated the physics engine, we've updated the rendering engine, we've updated the suspension models. That's all good news for GT5 users, but I think if you try the version on the show floor right now you'll realize that going from the top menu screen you can immediately go into a race seamlessly without it stopping for loading times," Yamauchi explained. "That's something we really worked hard for, so that the UI is smooth and quick. That's something that I think GT5 users will really appreciate."

But what beyond that? I told him that it seems like they have something bigger up their sleeves. He laughed and nodded.

"Yes, we have things in the works." [laughs] "I think we might be ready to announce more things at gamescom."

"We mentioned it a little bit at the Silverstone announcement a few weeks ago but we want to affect more industries outside of just the game world, and we're setting up a lot of collaborations with a lot of different game companies right now, as we speak," Yamauchi reminded. "I think those are some of the most interesting things coming up for GT6."

He tells us that this year's gamescom will bring us more information on these and other details, including multiplayer additions to GT6.

What about a PS4 Gran Turismo? Polyphony Digital has already made it clear that they wanted to serve the millions of existing fans out there with PS3 systems with the release of GT6, so we would have to wait a bit longer for a PS4 game. Yamauchi restated this during our chat.

I replied, "I hope we won't have to wait too long."

Yamauchi responded, "After launch we'll continue to update [GT6] and it will grow as a game. Also, a lot more things are coming for it. Once players have kind of played out the features of Gran Turismo 6 and they're satisfied with the game, that's the point when we'll release the next Gran Turismo."

He smiled: "It shouldn't be a very long time."

 

[Imari]

For weater, It was the hardware before apparently. Now it's the physics? I can sorta see that.

But what about day to night? Can't say it's physics for that. And if day-night shift would be pushing the hardware then the XB1 has some problems.

I feel the same way. I can buy that weather couldn't be done right. I can imagine to get the physics happening realistically you need to get track drainage and aquaplaning and various other things so that it's not just a "track is more slippery" modifier.

Day/night, I don't see why they couldn't do that. Lots of games have been doing that and doing it well for years. It's a strange exclusion, especially since giving people the opportunity to play with the lighting in that way tends to lead to some of the most spectacular in-game footage and screenshots. See Project CARS.

 

[KinLM]

Destructoid article from E3 :

http://www.destructoid.com/kazunori-yamauchi-on-gran-turismo-6-and-beyond-256119.phtml

That last line may haunt me..

I feel the same way. I can buy that weather couldn't be done right. I can imagine to get the physics happening realistically you need to get track drainage and aquaplaning and various other things so that it's not just a "track is more slippery" modifier.

Day/night, I don't see why they couldn't do that. Lots of games have been doing that and doing it well for years. It's a strange exclusion, especially since giving people the opportunity to play with the lighting in that way tends to lead to some of the most spectacular in-game footage and screenshots. See Project CARS.

Glad somebody else also sees it this way 👍

 

[HAL20XX]

I kind of understand why they didn't introduce night. They already had their work cutout creating a new lighting system on a new platform. To make that lighting system fully dynamic is probably a massive undertaking. Look at GT5. We know it's not a platform limitation but a physical resource limitation hence only a few select tracks having it.

 

[Earth]

Polyphony Digital really needs to fix their public relations. If Kazunori Yamauchi is not comfortable in public, then he needs to hire somebody to talk to the media, on stage, etc.

I've watched over an hour of Dan Greenawalt interviews at E3. The only thing that has come out of Polyphony Digital is a few behind closed doors quotes. Really unacceptable for the biggest selling Sony exclusive.

Announce the game behind closed doors. Give interviews behind closed doors. Not good

 

[KinLM]

Polyphony Digital really needs to fix their public relations. If Kazunori Yamauchi is not comfortable in public, then he needs to hire somebody to talk to the media, on stage, etc.

I've watched over an hour of Dan Greenawalt interviews at E3. The only thing that has come out of Polyphony Digital is a few behind closed doors quotes. Really unacceptable for the biggest selling Sony exclusive.

Announce the game behind closed doors. Give interviews behind closed doors. Not good

3 things.

1. Kaz isn't uncomfortable on stage. He speaks and has Translator-San translate to English so we can understand.

2. I don't think they were able to give a long speech at E3 because their game is a PS3 game, and the main focus of the day was definitely the PS4. This is why I feel that random PS guy came out and talked a bit about how the PS3 still has life in it and then things moved back on to the PS4.

On the Contrary, FM5 is a launch title for the XB1, therefore I think that it was much more necessary for T10 and Dan to give a personal speech at E3 since their game is one of the main games for the XB1, which was the main thing of the whole event as far as Microsoft goes.

3. GT6 wasn't really announced behind closed doors. It was at a private conference which I'll admit wasn't exactly an open event. But many important and large figures, such as our Jordan, were allowed in. It's not like anybody wasn't informed about it because we got news about it almost immediately thanks to Mr. Greer.

We also got a lengthy interview with Kaz and Translator-San, followed by interviews where they answered many questions.

But how is E3 much different? It's bigger, undoubtedly. But you either have to have a press pass or be in a high position to get to go, so it's not like it's exactly an open event either. And so 99% of us found out about Forza the same way we found about GT6; through streams, videos, and posted interviews.

 

[Northstar]

I think compared to how secretive they have been in the past, PD has been rather open and upfront with GT6.👍

 

[Earth]

3 things.

1. Kaz isn't uncomfortable on stage. He speaks and has Translator-San translate to English so we can understand.

Well he needs to find someone else on the team to handle the press. Evolution Studios has had 3-4 guys talk about Drive Club on stage and to the press.

2. I don't think they were able to give a long speech at E3 because their game is a PS3 game, and the main focus of the day was definitely the PS4. This is why I feel that random PS guy came out and talked a bit about how the PS3 still has life in it and then things moved back on to the PS4.

On the Contrary, FM5 is a launch title for the XB1, therefore I think that it was much more necessary for T10 and Dan to give a personal speech at E3 since their game is one of the main games for the XB1, which was the main thing of the whole event as far as Microsoft goes.

Doesn't explain the lack of new information coming from Polyphony Digital after the initial press conferences. I could have just watched the trailer to know 95% of new details/content for GT6. The press really pushed Dan Greenawalt and he spilled the beans on a variety of important issues.

3. GT6 wasn't really announced behind closed doors. It was at a private conference which I'll admit wasn't exactly an open event. But many important and large figures, such as our Jordan, were allowed in. It's not like anybody wasn't informed about it because we got news about it almost immediately thanks to Mr. Greer.

We also got a lengthy interview with Kaz and Translator-San, followed by interviews where they answered many questions.

But how is E3 much different? It's bigger, undoubtedly. But you either have to have a press pass or be in a high position to get to go, so it's not like it's exactly an open event either. And so 99% of us found out about Forza the same way we found about GT6; through streams, videos, and posted interviews.

Forza 5 was announced on Spike TV along with the Xbox One. Not through a blog like GT6.

Sorry, but I can't help but think Polyphony Digital takes their fanbase and popularity for granted. Kazunori Yamauchi hasn't been on stage at E3 since 2009. It appears all they do is release a little information and hope it goes viral. I see so much more PR effort from Dan Greenawalt and its a shame it hasnt been reflected in sales.

 

[Tenacious D]

Forza 5 was announced on Spike TV along with the Xbox One.

Well duh, Spike TV is practically The Microsoft Channel.

I see so much more PR effort from Dan Greenawalt and its a shame it hasnt been reflected in sales.

One, I don't care how open one dev is over another. Two, for all the talk of Forza being "easy to play, hard to master" which is what they said about the game since Forza 2, it's just not an easy game to grasp. I'm actually surprised it sells as well as it does. I have a couple of Lotus Esprit videos up on my Nigel Fox Storefront showing how much fun I had keeping the beastie on track and nose first.

By the way, I thought I'd give you guys a good laugh. I, uhm... can't seem to stop racing this game. I still can't stand the bots, but I seem to be addicted to this ferocious level of challenge. And I have gradually edged up from Normal bot level to Hard.

 

[20B_4ME]

I want to love Forza more than the Gran Turismo series, I really do, but they keep making it so I have to spend more money to be able to play it. First it was the fact that there were no proper force feedback wheels for Forza 3 and Xbox 360. Then GT5 came out on the PS3 and I already had a Fanatec GT3 RS V2 for some PC racing I did. Then I found out that unless the wheel is Xbox 360 certified, it won't work on the 360 even though the 360 is PC based and has USB ports. Forza 4 came out and I tryed it but ended up selling it soon after because in my opinion, what is the point of a driving game if you can't drive it with a wheel? Then news of GT6 and Forza 5 started leaking, I was worried that this meant I would have to spent $$$ on a new console AND compatible wheel. To my surprise, GT6 is coming out on the PS3 which means I'll be able to not only keep using my beloved console with it's many other games and accessories, but also by the time GT7 comes out, the PS4 will be much cheaper. No word yet on if the PS3's wheels will work on the PS4 or not, but my guess is it won't. Maybe then I'll consider buying a new wheel and maybe the Xbox One with Forza 5? No way! I trust Sony a lot more, I believe they look after us gamers a lot more.

 

[Imari]

By the way, I thought I'd give you guys a good laugh. I, uhm... can't seem to stop racing this game. I still can't stand the bots, but I seem to be addicted to this ferocious level of challenge. And I have gradually edged up from Normal bot level to Hard.

You've got the disease too!

Forza bots are merciless bastards, and I hope they all rot in a watery grave, but the fact that I have to race my nuts off to try and beat them keeps me coming back for more punishment. Before long I'll be hiring dominatrixes and flagellating myself, I can see it now.

 

[HAL20XX]

Sometimes the AI makes me wish this game had a GTA component to it, because I would slam on the brakes, open their door, and beat them over the head with a bat.

I was watching a replay yesterday after an 8 car pile-up where the AI was relentlessly slamming into me. Well, it turns out I might have veered into their lane.

 

[phillgt2002]

Sometimes the AI makes me wish this game had a GTA component to it, because I would slam on the brakes, open their door, and beat them over the head with a bat.

I was watching a replay yesterday after an 8 car pile-up where the AI was relentlessly slamming into me. Well, it turns out I might have veered into their lane.

I laughed at the GTA part.

FM4 AI is terrible. They brake at the most unnecessary part of the track. If you race at their pace then they're pretty good.

 

[BoneSawTX]

I laughed at the GTA part.

FM4 AI is terrible. They brake at the most unnecessary part of the track. If you race at their pace then they're pretty good.

you can replace GT5 for FM4 and it still hold true.

 

[SlyNine]

I'm pretty excided for Forza 5. T10 is partnering with calspan and McLaren and Danny boy says there has been a massive upgrade in the physics " things that are not even in the demo's yet".

Given his claims in Forza 4 were pretty spot on, I can't wait. Forza 5 is the ONLY reason I'm buying a X1.

I approach the "Drivatar" with guarded optimize though; I'm not sure how the AI interpreting how someone else drives is going to make it push faster through high speed banks. I hate how some of the AI cars slam on their brakes early and often. Maybe its just me but the AI seems to break early if you're behind and break late if you're ahead causing you to get slammed in the middle.

 

[GT6mebe]

Polyphony Digital really needs to fix their public relations. If Kazunori Yamauchi is not comfortable in public, then he needs to hire somebody to talk to the media, on stage, etc.

I've watched over an hour of Dan Greenawalt interviews at E3. The only thing that has come out of Polyphony Digital is a few behind closed doors quotes. Really unacceptable for the biggest selling Sony exclusive.

Announce the game behind closed doors. Give interviews behind closed doors. Not good

Dan Greenawalt is the worst PR person ever. The amount of utter bullcrap that comes out of his mouth as PR is astonishing:

The guy was saying Forza 3 had better physics than PC games at the time lmao.

His E3 presentation this year has been voted by most as the most embarrassing moment of E3.

 

[SlyNine]

Dan Greenawalt is the worst PR person ever. The amount of utter bullcrap that comes out of his mouth as PR is astonishing:

The guy was saying Forza 3 had better physics than PC games at the time lmao.

His E3 presentation this year has been voted by most as the most embarrassing moment of E3.

I've never heard that quote, perhaps you could post a source?

Dan is a PR guy, for sure, but honestly if you listen to what he says you can tell he's passionate, and knowledgeable about what he's talking about.

Yes he does use a lot of marketer speak (some times it's a bit annoying), but he also goes far beyond that at times.

http://www.gamespot.com/e3/forza-motorsport-5-e3-2013-stage-demo-6409994/

 

[hennessey86]

Dan Greenawalt is the worst PR person ever. The amount of utter bullcrap that comes out of his mouth as PR is astonishing:

The guy was saying Forza 3 had better physics than PC games at the time lmao.

His E3 presentation this year has been voted by most as the most embarrassing moment of E3.

Am I supposed to take your "opinion" as unbiased with that user name.......

 

[Imari]

I've never heard that quote, perhaps you could post a source?

Dan is a PR guy, for sure, but honestly if you listen to what he says you can tell he's passionate, and knowledgeable about what he's talking about.

Yes he does use a lot of marketer speak (some times it's a bit annoying), but he also goes far beyond that at times.

http://www.gamespot.com/e3/forza-motorsport-5-e3-2013-stage-demo-6409994/

I agree. You can generally tell when he's spouting the company line and when he's discussing something that he's genuinely passionate about. He's got stuff that he has to say for the sake of his company, and it's probably carefully worded in marketing speak. After that he's a guy that gets to make games that he thinks are awesome.

You could hardly accuse him of being disinterested. He always appears to have had about four Red Bulls and is itching to talk to someone. It's kind of cool, he's like a sim racing Energizer Bunny.

The guy was saying Forza 3 had better physics than PC games at the time lmao.

If he did say that, it's probably marketing speak. How do you prove or disprove that? Serious sim racers know that in terms of using the thing it's not the same, but as a sound bite it's totally defensible.

 

[I'm Motarded]

We'll have to see who wins the awards. Are there any photos of the GT6 nominations?

 

[Scaff]

Dan Greenawalt is the worst PR person ever. The amount of utter bullcrap that comes out of his mouth as PR is astonishing:

The guy was saying Forza 3 had better physics than PC games at the time lmao.

His E3 presentation this year has been voted by most as the most embarrassing moment of E3.

Provide sources or keep your flame-bait nonsense out of the treads and the forum.

Given your track record you will not be warned again.

 

[King1982]

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Dan does look and seem genuinely passionate, I'll say that. He definitely loves what he does, just as much as Kazunori probably does. Both are also just as guilty of marketing speak - which is par for the course these days, considering they're both the simultaneous ring-leaders and public faces of their respective companies.

That's one area I've never understood fans of either side sniping at the other's boss: they both are seriously dedicated to their teams 👍

 

[phillgt2002]

Dan does look and seem genuinely passionate, I'll say that. He definitely loves what he does, just as much as Kazunori probably does. Both are also just as guilty of marketing speak - which is par for the course these days, considering they're both the simultaneous ring-leaders and public faces of their respective companies.

That's one area I've never understood fans of either side sniping at the other's boss: they both are seriously dedicated to their teams 👍

Agreed. I remember seeing a post somewhere saying that D. Greenawalt doesn't care about cars. He has a tuned out Audi S4 and a BMW M3.

 

[McLaren]

Dan Greenawalt is the worst PR person ever. The amount of utter bullcrap that comes out of his mouth as PR is astonishing:

The guy was saying Forza 3 had better physics than PC games at the time lmao.

His E3 presentation this year has been voted by most as the most embarrassing moment of E3.

I'll bet what he actually said was along the lines of how fast the physics engine runs in comparison to other games, & in which case, he was right for the most part.

But, given your name, I'm sure you chose to spin that into what you typed above.

 

[Zer0]

I'll bet what he actually said was along the lines of how fast the physics engine runs in comparison to other games, & in which case, he was right for the most part.

But, given your name, I'm sure you chose to spin that into what you typed above.

These were his words:

Forza 3's Game Director, Dan Greenawalt, told x360a at a Forza 3 event in London this week that there's nothing on the market that comes close to simulating what Forza 3 does.

Greenawalt pined, "I play a lot of racing games, including PC racing games and I have not seen anything that is even within years of what we’re delivering here."

"Part of that actually meant visiting McLaren and seeing the simulator that they train on. I’ve seen other race teams as well and some of their simulators. We were kind of able to learn from each of them and incorporate a lot of that. So I think it would be hard for someone to match that," the outspoken Creative Director added.

Greenawalt later noted, "We have the best simulator around. You’re not going to find another one that’s even close, so if you turn off all the assists, you’re driving with a clutch, even on a controller, you’re driving. There’s tire flex, body flex and unsprung weight on the tires. You turn all the assists on, a 6 year old can play it."

http://www.xbox360achievements.org/...on-the-Market-is-Within-Years-of-Forza-3.html

 

[Tenacious D]

Yeah... that's some serious "passion" there, and I remember that. I groaned all through that load of felgercarb coming from him and Che Chou, but when they stuck to the details, I was pretty enthused about the possibilities. Especially to get away from Forza 2's broken Livery Editor. Layer shifting for "the lose."

Forza 4 does show a lot of promise for what T10 can do on a real PC-like box, but... man, Microsoft is really starting to show their vampire fangs on The ONE. I'm just not too sure about this. Of course I say this as my bot is milking a race for much needed credits in F4, and that annoying engine roar is making me want to grab the wheel, and I have several unfinished cars to paint up and race mod, and more than a dozen tokens to buy monster rides with. And here, I haven't even touched GT5 in a week because as solid as the racing is, it just doesn't have that scary adrenaline rush F4 offers...

I dunno, I'll probably have some mad money for Christmas, so I'll not say no for certain, and F5 is looking to be seriously improved...

 

[SlyNine]

These were his words:

Forza 3's Game Director, Dan Greenawalt, told x360a at a Forza 3 event in London this week that there's nothing on the market that comes close to simulating what Forza 3 does.

Greenawalt pined, "I play a lot of racing games, including PC racing games and I have not seen anything that is even within years of what we’re delivering here."

"Part of that actually meant visiting McLaren and seeing the simulator that they train on. I’ve seen other race teams as well and some of their simulators. We were kind of able to learn from each of them and incorporate a lot of that. So I think it would be hard for someone to match that," the outspoken Creative Director added.

Greenawalt later noted, "We have the best simulator around. You’re not going to find another one that’s even close, so if you turn off all the assists, you’re driving with a clutch, even on a controller, you’re driving. There’s tire flex, body flex and unsprung weight on the tires. You turn all the assists on, a 6 year old can play it."

http://www.xbox360achievements.org/...on-the-Market-is-Within-Years-of-Forza-3.html

I wonder if Dan is part of that human species? You know the ones. They tend to get over excided and maybe exaggerate their claims when they are passionate.