Forza Horizon 4: General Discussion

[WanganDream]

Winter...
View attachment 802959

Land Rover again! Further price increases!
... Seriously, do they fool?

 

[Classicman]

I have no clue what so ever about the second DLC.
I am just praying for a decent map expansion. That is why I adored TDU 1&2 so much.

 

[Milouse]

Land Rover again! Further price increases!
... Seriously, do they fool?

Maybe they just know that a good share of active players are playing for a few weeks at most (very likely), then ignore the older players.

 

[Nacho Libre]

There is a new drag strip over Derwent (at least for me is new.)

 

[DK]

^That gets unlocked every Winter.

 

[Nacho Libre]

^That gets unlocked every Winter.

I probably didn't had enough drag strip level (7 currently), that's why it just unlocked for me.

 

[ImaRobot]

It's interesting, really. Apparently, it's no longer allowed to speak ill of Forza Horizon anywhere but in Turn 10's forums or YouTube comment sections, where the angry teens congregate.

It's also a shame that people need to twist words to criticize something, as I never stated that a future entry in the franchise would flop "because" of Hoonigan's cars.

The funny thing is, not one person is trying to stop your opinion. More so replying to it. I also really don't think anyone was intentionally trying to twist your words either. I always find it odd when people pretend that their opinion is getting silenced, because that literally isn't happening. You put a lot of specific words into that post that lead to everyone thinking such things. Starting with the damning of Hoonigan and wasted resources by the devs because something you liked wasn't in the game. Then you moved on to people needing to get fired, ending with "maybe when the Next Forza Flops."

Everything lines up to be taken a certain way, to be honest. You can't really blame the responses at that point.

With Game Pass, Microsoft has eliminated the very concept of "flop". Let's take Crackdown 3 for example. It's a good, underrated game. It's nowhere nearly as bad as some people are making it out to be. But, at $60 a key and no "über-realistic" graphics nor "compelling" story, it would never reach as many players as it did if Game Pass did not exist. Therefore, a Forza Horizon 5 can never "flop" in the traditional sense.

I don't really disagree, what with many devs now focusing on player numbers rather than sales as of late, but I'm just not fully on board with that. Sure, a game can reach a lot of people because of the gamepass, but if a game still doesn't sell well, I still think it can very much flop. Problem being here is that this Forza is apparently on it's way to do better than the last, in terms of sales, even with the game pass.

I'm speaking more along the lines of the concept simply reaching its peak and starting to nosedive. People tend to get bored of things if they don't change often enough. Playground is approaching the limit of what they can do with the game, and fast. None of the things they added to 4 are truly groundbreaking. Not the stories, not the seasons, not the Route Creator, not the individual skill system. The map is better, the car roster is generally better, and that's it.

I do agree, to an extent. I've definitely grown bored with the series, but I think I also have with racing games in general. It's hard to reinvent the wheel with games like this. Especially concerning that last sentence, that's generally all you can hope for in this genre that's trying to mimic real life.

The introduction of new road cars and stock cars being slowed down in favor of these customs like Hoonigan, DeBerti and (possibly) Guntherwerks is either a good or a bad thing depending on what you like, but I'm convinced that, given the choice, most would pick a Huracán Performante over a Hoonigan RS200, even more so considering you can build an RS200 yourself in the game. The Hoonigan version is just a cosmetic variant with an OP physics file. The Performante on the other hand at least looks better than a regular Huracán with the Forza aero kit.

Any source on cars being slowed down in order to make others appear faster?

Forza Horizon remains unparalleled in driving pleasure due to borrowing the ForzaTech engine from Forza Motorsport but in the volatile gaming market it doesn't take much for a franchise to fall from grace like Need for Speed for example did. PUBG was all the rage in 2017, then Fortnite was molded into a battle royale game with more stable performance, better optimization and no exclusivity on consoles, so it became the standard in battle royale play while PUBG lags behind Apex Legends in third place these days.

The thing is, I'm betting it's the Forza franchise that had a hand in making NFS seem so mediocre in the first place. To me, their the Fortnite that came in with the better game. However, they've also shown that they hold the reins quite hard at this point, as most any similar game that has been churned out has been severely lacking in comparison. I don't expect another change any time soon, even if that's for better or worse.

The prize crate rumors, real or fake, forced Turn 10 into defensive mode with FM7, a stance they haven't left yet.

Completely fake, you mean. There was nothing real about the rumors of misinformed people. However, you're right. There are very much still misinformed people around the loot crates in FM7, even some on this site thinking they actually cost money.

The reason why Forza Horizon's competitors are weak right now is due to stubbornness from their owners with regards to design choices rather than inability to make something that could match or even surpass it.

It's not just the stubbornness, It's a combination of both things you've said, I feel. Much like NFS seem to have the inability to make a decent driving model for their game - I feel that's both design choice, as well as a lack of skill, because issues are still spanning two games, strictly talking about it's driving model.

After all, T10's continued blunders with FM7 and earlier allowed the rebirth of Gran Turismo as a household simcade name and, even as a fan of Forza, I have to admit Forza Motorsport is playing catch up right now, which would be unthinkable as late as 4 years ago.

There was no rebirth of the name. The name never left most peoples mouth. And just 4 years ago was around Forza 5, which was completely mediocre in terms of content and depth, while it did offer improvements. So I don't really get the sentiment.

 

[Marqus]

Winter...
View attachment 802959

Forzashop:
[OFFROAD] 1972 Land Rover SERIES III FORZA EDITION
[EXTREME TRACK TOYS] 2018 KTM X-BOW GT4

Prizes:
- [CLASSIC MUSCLE] 1973 Pontiac FIREBIRD TRANS AM SD-455
- [SPORTS UTILITY HEROES] 2012 Cadillac ESCALADE ESV (new car)
(Street Race with 100-900 SUH)

Car required for Weekly challenges:
[CLASSIC MUSCLE]1969 Chevrolet CAMARO SUPER SPORT COUPE

 

[Moglet]

I want the next DLC to be either Goodwood or go karts and small off-road buggies. I'd love to have a karting type venue in the game with new smaller vehicles for both tarmac and off-road and there are hundreds of them scattered across the UK so they fit with the location. I'm not sure there would be much gameplay value with that though, I probably need to think much bigger judging by the previous DLC locations that were added.

On an unrelated note, be careful with any tunes that force your car into the ground

 

[RazorSharkz]

Finally found a Mercedes E63 in the Auction House. Only 4 wheelspin exclusives left.

 

[Nielsen]

I missed the KTM GT4 first time around, but I'm not sure about spending 700 FP on a fully-fledged race car in FH4. I'd be less worried about spending my points if it wasn't because there's some old bug keeping me from getting double FP. Double points stopped working for me shortly after launch, but the lake property still says the perk is active. So annoying!

Finally found a Mercedes E63 in the Auction House. Only 4 wheelspin exclusives left.

I'm glad cars locked behind chance have been offered as seasonal prices lately. Still have 10 or so to check off.

 

[RandomCarGuy17]

After all, T10's continued blunders with FM7 and earlier allowed the rebirth of Gran Turismo as a household simcade name and, even as a fan of Forza, I have to admit Forza Motorsport is playing catch up right now, which would be unthinkable as late as 4 years ago.

Honestly, I don't get how you're feeling this at all. I've seen what GTS has to offer, there really isn't much of anything that FM7 needs to catch up with GTS on. There's online mode and now the audio in GTS is in some cases better, but that's it. FM7 still beats GTS in every other category I can think of such as the track selection, car selection, offline career, offline arcade mode, and customization. If anything, I would say GTS is still playing catch-up to FM.

It's interesting, really. Apparently, it's no longer allowed to speak ill of Forza Horizon anywhere but in Turn 10's forums or YouTube comment sections, where the angry teens congregate

Once again, how the frick are you coming to this conclusion? He didn't tell you to shut up or anything. You stated an opinion and got a response. Responding to criticism =/= shutting down criticism.

 

[GTvsForza]

Is the Trans Am new?

 

[Joey D]

Is the Trans Am new?

I think it's a wheelspin car.

 

[Stang616]

Is the Trans Am new?

I think it's a wheelspin car.

Joey is correct, it's not new, just rare in wheelspins. I've seen it once.

 

[RazorSharkz]

The community championships are really fun. It's cool to se what other player come up with using the map.

 

[Populuxe]

I just purchased the last of the 10,000,000 Cr cars.


I have a list of all the cars in the Autoshow that I don't already own, including prices. I list them from cheapest to most expensive, then work on buying them all going from bottom to top. I've done this with every Horizon game since the very first. When the game is new, there's plenty to do to keep me occupied while building up the money to buy the most expensive cars. Then as the game become familiar and it settles into a routine, new cars start to come faster as each new one on the list is less and less expensive. New things to do are replaced by new cars to drive, which keeps it fresher longer. At least it does for me. Here are the remaining cars on my list and how much I'll need to buy them all.

1985 HDT VK Commodore Group A 28,000
2014 Terradyne 450,000
2017 Ford #14 Rahal Letterman Lanigan Racing GRC Fiesta 500,000
1965 Hoonigan Ford “Hoonicorn” Mustang 500,000
2010 Lamborghini Murcielago LP 670-4 SV 500,000
2013 MINI X-Raid All4 Racing Countryman 500,000
1993 Toyota #1 T100 Baja Truck 500,000
2016 Spania GTA GTA Spano 800,000
2010 Ferrari 599XX 1,000,000
1953 Ferrari 500 Mondial 1,000,000
1967 Lamborghini Miura P400 1,000,000
1960 Porsche 718 RS 60 1,000,000
1987 Ferrari F40 1,200,000
2012 Hennessey Vemon GT 1,200,000
1954 Mercedes-Benz 300 SL Coupe 1,200,000
2012 Pagani Huayra 1,300,000
2013 McLaren P1 1,350,000
2016 Aston Martin Vulcan 1,500,000
2013 Ferrari LaFerrari 1,500,000
2011 Koenigsegg Agera 1,500,00
2016 Pagani Huayra BC 1,500,000
1992 Bugatti EB110 SS 1,700,000
2016 Koenigsegg Regera 1,900,000
1993 McLaren F1 2,000,000
1998 Mercedes-Benz AMG CLK GTR 2,000,000
2009 Pagani Zonda Cinque Roadster 2,100,000
1965 Shelby Cobra 427 S/C 2,100,000
2011 Bugatti Veyron SS 2,200,000
2016 Lamboghini Centernario LP 770-4 2,300,000
2018 Bugatti Chiron 2,400,000
1961 Maserati Tipo 61 Birdcage 2,400,000
1965 Alfa Romeo Giulia TZ2 2,500,000
1998 Porsche 911 GT1 Strassenversion 2,500,000
2014 Ferrari FXX K 2,700,000
2015 Koenigsegg One:1 2,850,000
1989 Ferrari F40 Competizione 3,000,000
1984 Ferrari 288 GTO 3,100,000
2013 Lamborghini Veneno 4,500,000
1948 Ferrari 166MM Barchetta 6,500,000
1957 Ferrari 250 California 8,000,000
1955 Mercedes-Benz 300 SLR 8,000,000
84,778,000

 

[Outspacer]

1985 HDT VK Commodore Group A 28,000

LOL, what is it about that car? It's the only cheap one I haven't had on a wheelspin yet as well!

I've had 82 duplicate cars from wheelspins since the last one that helped (Zonda Cinque)

Still 12 of the 10 million cars and a similar selection to your list (maybe slightly fewer) that I haven't got yet, and only 75 million or so in the kitty.

 

[Nielsen]

The second round of the latest community championship turned out rather stupid for me. I entered with a stock VW Dingo, meaning that none of the cars in the field carried enough power to make the longest jump. So there was a bunch of confused Drivatars that couldn't find their way back onto the racing line once having fallen down between the ramps. The shortcomings of community-created routes in a nutshell... However, some of the routes demonstrated over the weeks have been rather nice.

 

[Thomas2012]

Completed The Trial with a clean team, thankful for that. Used the AMC for a challenge went on to win every race so clearly the car was no joke. Happy to help anybody struggling to find a good team! Tune for the AMC bond edition shared

 

[ShakesMcQueen]

Hoonigan's cars are fun to drive but they drain resources away from modelling cars I actually want, so I dislike them. Worst deal Forza has ever done IMO (same as DeBerti).

They have a partnership with Ford of all people yet don't have the new GT500 in time for the latest game. That's such a wasted opportunity, I think there's some higher up at either of these studios that needs the boot quickly, perhaps when the next Forza Horizon flops.

I'd go for Ralph Fulton.

Most of the Hoonigan cars are just custom liveries, body kits, and tunes - and a bunch of them even share the same body kits, like the various Fiestas and Focuses. But moreover - some people like them...? Complaining that they are "draining resources" because a handful of cars in a game with over 500 of them aren't to your personal tastes, seems a little unreasonable.

And I can't imagine why Ralph Fulton would get the boot any time soon, nor why the next Forza Horizon game would "flop", when the series is a critical darling and a financial success. The fact that they now have a second dev team working on what rumour has it is a new, open-world Fable reboot, should tell you how much confidence Microsoft have in them right now.

 

[ShakesMcQueen]

It's interesting, really. Apparently, it's no longer allowed to speak ill of Forza Horizon anywhere but in Turn 10's forums or YouTube comment sections, where the angry teens congregate.

No one challenged your right to "speak ill" of the game - they pushed back on the reasonableness of your specific criticism, and your left-field expectation that the next game will "flop", despite literally every sign to the contrary..

 

[GTvsForza]

Well, I did something stupid and unnecessary but did it for the heck of it. I did a 24 in-game hour long race to see how much I can get from it. One whole day in Horizon is about 1 1/2 hours. 702k Cr. and 140k Influence. Might have gotten more if I unlocked the perks on my Lola, but still saving for the Regalia D...

 

[Techlet]

Interesting. The Hot Hatch championship near Edinburgh showed it was already completed when I haven't touched the game for a week.

Looks like PG's running out of content on the main map too.

 

[WanganDream]

Well, have any players experienced that auto saving is not finished?
I am in this state right now. The circle keeps rotating even after waiting for five minutes

 

[HyperSpeeder]

@ImaRobot I'm not gonna quote the whole thing because I'm busy, but your points are fair and I apologize to Northstar.

When referring to "speed" I meant how frequently cars are introduced into the game. For example, Lamborghini already has a revised Huracán out (the Evo) and we don't even have the Performante yet (I suspect something but that's food for another topic). Meanwhile we get tons of new Hoonigan cars based on existing content. They're fun to drive, but they're not what got most people into Forza, including myself.

The feeling I get from FH4's Car Pass is that the devs have run out of cars to add to the game, so the "easy" ones like the FM4 remasters were added to fill in the slots. I paid for the Car Pass (I own the game, in fact) and if I'm paying extra I want special stuff. FM7 had a similar problem with trucks and SUVs likely added due to contractual obligations.

FH4 has long surpassed FH3 in sales over the same timeframe and I find it a superior game to its predecessor in pretty much every way. But it feels as if Playground is catering to the casuals who sub to Game Pass and play the game once a week just fooling around and doing silly stuff. Every community needs a core of dedicated people to keep the game running and a mass of casuals to keep the money coming, but Playground is not doing much to appeal to the former, sadly.

With regards to Gran Turismo, the current installment doesn't appeal to me, but on the surface it's supposed to have "fair racing with penalties" and for over a year now it's had this edge over Forza. It hurts to see GT garner praise while the better known aspect of FM's multiplayer is the poor behavior of the players. In YouTube era it's a disaster to have several videos with plenty of views exposing how much of a mess the unregulated game is. FM's multiplayer is a blast with the right people but it's difficult for T10 to get the message across when the public lobbies get the most visibility.

 

[Moglet]

Meanwhile we get tons of new Hoonigan cars based on existing content. They're fun to drive, but they're not what got most people into Forza, including myself.

What relation does "getting people into Forza" have to do with Hoonigan cars? They're a welcome addition from me, while it was tiring to get so many in such a short space of time I've found them so much fun to drive that I really like them.

It feels as if Playground is catering to the casuals who sub to Game Pass and play the game once a week just fooling around and doing silly stuff. Every community needs a core of dedicated people to keep the game running and a mass of casuals to keep the money coming, but Playground is not doing much to appeal to the former, sadly.

This is a very bizarre way of looking at people who play the game. Why are you splitting players into casual vs. dedicated all of a sudden? Why do you assume that "casuals" keep the money coming in? All sorts of people play FH4 (and I imagine continue to spend money on it too), I believe that PG are targeting a wide variety of players with their updates, bug fixes and events.

 

[ShakesMcQueen]

This is a very bizarre way of looking at people who play the game. Why are you splitting players into casual vs. dedicated all of a sudden? Why do you assume that "casuals" keep the money coming in? All sorts of people play FH4 (and I imagine continue to spend money on it too), I believe that PG are targeting a wide variety of players with their updates, bug fixes and events.

Casting a wider net to appeal to people all over the "hardcore-casual" spectrum, is the entire purpose of the Horizon series, in fact. Even then, the Car Pass only had one week of Hoonigan cars, as far as I can remember. Others have come via the free weekly stuff, and the base game has a bunch.

 

[Populuxe]

I have no idea where I fall on the 'hardcore-casual" scale. I'm not much of a gamer, but I have played some form of GT/FM/FH almost daily for the past 21 years. Horizon is my favorite of the three franchises. I welcome everyone who wants to play, whether they are hardcore gamers who are scrambling for every achievement and gamer point, or the casual player who just wants to play that car game with the crazy jumps. They all contribute to the success of the game, meaning PG and MS will make more, and I can continue to play this game until my old arthritic hands can no longer hold a controller.

 

[HyperSpeeder]

Casting a wider net to appeal to people all over the "hardcore-casual" spectrum, is the entire purpose of the Horizon series, in fact. Even then, the Car Pass only had one week of Hoonigan cars, as far as I can remember. Others have come via the free weekly stuff, and the base game has a bunch.

I've noticed something of a shift after there was some backlash against Car Pass content, but it could have been because the new Hoonigan cars from the bonus events weren't "new", as opposed to the Hoonitruck and, to a lesser extent, the Escort.

They know they dropped the ball with the Car Pass big time (as much as Turn 10, in fact), which is why most of the remasters and returning cars were moved to the seasonals and the Car Pass ended on a relatively high note with new releases such as the 992 Carrera S and the TVR Griffith as well as iconic cars like the 1968 Mustang and the Caddy Eldorado.

When it comes to the players, by "hardcore" I don't mean people who have more skill or anything, but people who are more dedicated to the game, that is, they play more, create content, etc. They access features that the casual player would overlook. On top of that, they have more attention to detail than the usual player. The game didn't launch in a favorable way for hardcore players. The Team Adventure mode wasn't to people's tastes, the contests are inferior to what we had in the last two Forzas, the wheel paint update broke old designs and no fix was issued which made some people leave, Route Creator is cumbersome to use and featured routes sometimes ship with unfair gameplay.

The "casual" fanbase on the other hand are people on the Xbox (or PC, that's a thing now) who don't think of Forza as their primary franchise and play the game "casually", for lack of a better definition. Game Pass has allowed these players to swarm the game and as players of the game they're a legitimate part of the community. Most of the game's flaws are not readily apparent to these people, since they don't spend enough time in the game to find them. These are the same people who thought in the past the old Need for Speed Underground and Most Wanted games were amazing, when in fact I found them an unbalanced mess despite being fun.

No one is better than the other, but when it comes to fixing the game's flaws I'd probably listen to the hardcore fanbase first. When it comes to introducing new features on top of the old ones, the casual players would have more weight.

My biggest complaint towards Forza these days is inconsistency. Which happens because the game has grown too large. I could speak of other areas of the game, but let's focus on cars.

There are cars like the 1968 Mustang which came with a Bullitt bodykit and an RB26DETT engine swap, or the Hillman Imp with its bodykit and rally parts, or even the 1974 Honda Civic with its widebody kit and B16 and K20 engine swaps. Then there are cars like the Agera RS which under the body looks the same as the One:1 when it shouldn't, or the Corvette ZR1 which shipped with the wrong wheels and gauge (it was fixed, thankfully), or even the TVR Tuscan which has bad normals near the wheel lugs (in pause menu you can see it). I was a vocal critic of GT5's "premium cars" feature back in the day and I find it sad that Forza is going down a similar route, albeit for different reasons.

Hoonigan cars, due to being replicas of one-off cars, have an attention to detail that requires additional resources, which are in turn being drained from other cars because the dev team has limited time to do everything at once (and here I cut Playground some slack). I agree they're a lot of fun (especially stock, as Ken Block intended them!), but there are things I like in the game being sacrificed in favor of giving these cars more detail, which disappoints me.

Maybe it's just my OCD at play here but I drive lots of different cars in Forza ranging from trucks, pickup trucks and SUVs to muscle cars, supercars, JDM tuners, classics, etc. and I like most equally, even from brands I hate. The sheer number of these cars keeps the game fresh for a long time. In FM7 for example I first drove the Eagle-Weslake F1 car last week and enjoyed learning it. So this inconsistency annoys me a fair bit.