Forza Motorsport 7: Demo Discussion

[Pillo-san]

You never made it clear the issue is just for wheel users though did you. You said forza has the worse physics on the market. Seeing as the physics are the same regardless of input I'm telling you that you're wrong as they are probably the best out there for pad users (might change when PC2 comes out)

Now, answer my question. Just what is wrong with Forzas physics engine? (tires, suspension, aero etc)

I did, everything was about how bad the cars are when using a wheel.
Physics wise it is nothing special at all, and I actually ejoy it with a pad, the physic in forza is more setup for a oversteering experiance where you can effortlessly control your skids/slides and drifting. Really fun but it does not give you the same feeling like you get from other titles. Sure they too have issues but they are way ahead, especially when you are using a wheel. A car game with bad wheel handling is kind of funny in a sad way. But yeah when paired with a controller it is really enjoyable, to bad I dont drive cars in irl with a pad nor any Racesims on the PC. If Forza cant get it fixed then it is nothing more than say GTA5 but without the town cruising or shooting

 

[Tyl3n0L]

You are missing my point. We turn off all assist because it is more "SIM" to us but in reality modern TCS on modern supercar really makes you faster. IT is not hte case in games like Forza. It really slow you down when it's enabled.

Oh ok. Well, maybe Forza isn't for you then? I mean as I said I don't really care if it's Sim or not. I'm playing with TCS off and find it enjoyable. If you can't play with TCS off and TCS On is too slow for you I don't know what to tell you...

 

[GT Kelv]

Not a bad demo, but that Porsche really disappointed me. It understeers quite a bit and seems to have a lot of “lift-off” oversteer. That car needs a good tune, tires, brakes, and a diff. Other than that it was what I expected. But that Porsche was crap.

 

[zr1chris]

Which is unrealistic because all moderns cars comes with some TCS.

Which we turn off when doing any kind of racing.

 

[Symtex]

Oh ok. Well, maybe Forza isn't for you then? I mean as I said I don't really care if it's Sim or not. I'm playing with TCS off and find it enjoyable. If you can't play with TCS off and TCS On is too slow for you I don't know what to tell you...

Who said I can't play with TCS off ? Dude. I never said anything about that. Stop making **** up as you go. I have nothing against Forza. I've played every single iteration of the game since the fist version on original xbox. It doesn't make it more sim. It's fun. I will enjoy it but let's not kid ourselves. Project Cars or Assetto Corsa does a much better job at the sim aspect than Forza.

 

[Tyl3n0L]

Who said I can't play with TCS off ? Dude. I never said anything about that. Stop making **** up as you go. I have nothing against Forza. I've played every single iteration of the game since the fist version on original xbox. It doesn't make it more sim. It's fun. I will enjoy it but let's not kid ourselves. Project Cars or Assetto Corsa does a much better job at the sim aspect than Forza.

Take a chill pill my friend. I don't care if you can or can't play with TCS. All i'm saying is there's an option to turn it off if you want to lol. Again, as I said multiple times, sim or not who cares, as long as you're having fun

 

[RPM Bibblefish]

I did, everything was about how bad the cars are when using a wheel.
Physics wise it is nothing special at all, and I actually ejoy it with a pad, the physic in forza is more setup for a oversteering experiance where you can effortlessly control your skids/slides and drifting. Really fun but it does not give you the same feeling like you get from other titles. Sure they too have issues but they are way ahead, especially when you are using a wheel. A car game with bad wheel handling is kind of funny in a sad way. But yeah when paired with a controller it is really enjoyable, to bad I dont drive cars in irl with a pad nor any Racesims on the PC. If Forza cant get it fixed then it is nothing more than say GTA5 but without the town cruising or shooting

No, you did not. Your original post may have referenced how bad forza was with a wheel briefly but you then went on to say 'Once again forza seems to be the worst game out there when it comes to ffp/physics and PC2 seems to be a big step forward to your dismay if you go by the youtubers at least'

Forza has many issues and I, like you, play multiple driving games but from what I've experienced of the demo the physics model is not one of the major concerns

 

[RPM Bibblefish]

If it's anything like previous games, the option to enable it will be free to everyone, just like Traction Control, ABS etc. are. You can then turn it on/off at will.

I think the higher Divisions of Leagues used to have assist restrictions however (and Simulation Damage) and I'd expect Friction Assist to be disabled there. The general Hoppers will be the same Wild Wild West they always were however.



Might be worth a few more people tweeting to him about it.

Multiplayer Hoppers can be changed almost at will when it comes to settings, and I think all Hoppers (with the exception of ones aimed at beginners) should have this assist forced off. Gran Turismo 6 had such a filter for Skid Recovery Force.

If it's anything like previous games, the option to enable it will be free to everyone, just like Traction Control, ABS etc. are. You can then turn it on/off at will.

I think the higher Divisions of Leagues used to have assist restrictions however (and Simulation Damage) and I'd expect Friction Assist to be disabled there. The general Hoppers will be the same Wild Wild West they always were however.



Might be worth a few more people tweeting to him about it.

Multiplayer Hoppers can be changed almost at will when it comes to settings, and I think all Hoppers (with the exception of ones aimed at beginners) should have this assist forced off. Gran Turismo 6 had such a filter for Skid Recovery Force.

Good idea, this will ruin multiplayer if allowed. The races will be more like something from need for speed

 

[ClydeYellow]

So leave it on in the menu then!

Naaaaah, I'll take my chances in Forza, thanks.

I'd say a huge factor in the choice of many players to keep all assists off even when it's completely unrealistic is that Forza has a very aggressive one-size-fits-all solution for traction control. In real life, supercars and racecars will be fitted with fine-tuned, highly optimized systems that will usually make the car faster around a track - here, TC will easily destroy your laptimes. Games like Assetto Corsa and pCars ship with a "factory assists" option - but they also have a much smaller car roster and aren't aiming for the level of accessibility of Forza, anyways (plus, Assetto Corsa's TC sucks, so there's that).

 

[Tyl3n0L]

Naaaaah, I'll take my chances in Forza, thanks.

I'd say a huge factor in the choice of many players to keep all assists off even when it's completely unrealistic is that Forza has a very aggressive one-size-fits-all solution for traction control. In real life, supercars and racecars will be fitted with fine-tuned, highly optimized systems that will usually make the car faster around a track - here, TC will easily destroy your laptimes. Games like Assetto Corsa and pCars ship with a "factory assists" option - but they also have a much smaller car roster and aren't aiming for the level of accessibility of Forza, anyways (plus, Assetto Corsa's TC sucks, so there's that).

Completely agree with you on that point. Also people need to keep in mind that Forza has always been a Console game aimed at gamepad users. In the instance of Assetto Corsa & Project Cars I firmly believe their main development focus was PC & Steering Wheel but yet people keep placing all racing games in the same basket and compare them like it's the same thing. Apple vs Orange.

The simple fact that Forza is now available on PC makes me happy. I couldn't care less if it isn't as sim as iRacing, which I also have.

 

[Mr Latte]

More than pleased with the demo (using controller) via PC

Being an Audio & Tactile oriented guy...
Clearly a lot of the audio effects have been improved and some brillant work done with the audio to match those brilliant graphics so much focus has been on.


Have You Heard?

The game works fantastically with "Win 10 / Dolby Atmos Spatial Audio" on headphones having superb 3D positional audio for many effects. Crazy good hearing the helicopter circle around or how the windscreen wiper is clearly positioned upfront when in cockpit view.

Being able to now control the impact/crash sound is a major bonus for those with tactile transducers. Now you REALLY can feel the curbs, impacts, and rubs with other cars. Also having the ability to turn down the menu music. 👍

However..... T10 👎

AI Cars volume is FAR TO LOW (even at max) Hope this gets fixed.
Confetti Cannons are much to loud and strong (give serious kick with Buttkicker much more than some more important effects etc) Yet these and some other sounds we cannot lower their volumes



Colour Me Happy!!!

One last thing that is very impressive from this title that I waited a long time to try but few will be able to enjoy. I have a Phillips 3 Sided Ambilight TV. Also have 2 additional Phillips Hue LED strips and an overhead Phillips Hue color bulb. With this we can control what lights are activated with different regions of the on-screen action.

The beautiful "Skys" really come to life with the Ambilight as your whole room while viewed from your peripheral vision encompasses you with directional lighting based on the screen activity. Be it the yellow sunset glow, pinky blue hue ior clouds with sunlight patches, the flashing lightning or lights/signs in the tunnel streaking over the interior of the room. These all make for a rather impressive visual and entertaining experience.

 

[GT Kelv]

Who said I can't play with TCS off ? Dude. I never said anything about that. Stop making **** up as you go. I have nothing against Forza. I've played every single iteration of the game since the fist version on original xbox. It doesn't make it more sim. It's fun. I will enjoy it but let's not kid ourselves. Project Cars or Assetto Corsa does a much better job at the sim aspect than Forza.

I still have every Forza game and all 3 Horizons. In my opinion PC and AC do a much better job in the sim department. Forza is good now don’t ger me wrong. But in my eyes it’s more of a arcade like racer with in-depth tuning options. But that’s just my opinion though.

In previous Forza games the Porsche 911 handled well, with or without a lot of power with limited tuning. But OMG that GT2RS in the demo is utter crap. I literally finished playing the demo 10 minutes ago for the second time to get another opinion. It is so unbalanced it’s not even fun to drive. It feels similar to one of the cars from the NFS: Shift series in the “drift mode” when trying to drive it at a higher limit. But, it’s not my final verdict because we haven’t been able to tune it yet so I’m hoping the car will be night and day when we can do so.

I was so disappointed that I didn’t bother to use my wheel with the game. I heard it feels a lot better than previous games so i still look forward to trying it out with it. Any recommendations for wheel rotation?

 

[Populuxe]

I'm not going to tell you the 911 GT2 RS does/does not behave just like a 911 GT2 RS should behave for the simple reason that I've never driven a 911 GT2 RS. The only Porsche I've driven at length is my late brother's 1960 356, and I'm going to go out on a limb and say they are not comparable.

The 911 race was frustrating. I had to run it twice before I won the race. I chalk that up to not knowing this course at all rather than any fault in the car. Like a lot of people, I thought the truck race was a lot of fun, and it's good to have Mugello back. The GT-R is a demon in the wet, but of course it would be, wouldn't it?

I run all my races in far chase cam, even the truck race, and I had no problems with the camera shake. It actually added a touch of immersion that I welcomed.

I'm surprisingly excited by all the racing suits. I never gave a single **** about them in Gran Turismo since it was always the same suit, just in different colors. But they are actually different suits in FM7, and they are clearly having fun creating different suits. Astronaut? Motorcycle cop? Greaser? Fleek? FLEEK!? Collecting these looks like it will be fun.

I'm still on the fence a bit about the actual racing. After the freedom of Horizon, Motorsports feels a little constraining. But the legendary race cars (Porsche 804? Really? Yes please) will keep me entertained for the next year while waiting for Horizon 4.

 

[GBO Possum]

Just like FM5 and 6, there is no option to hold previous and best lap times on the screen for longer than a few seconds at end of lap.

I really want to be able to compare my current performance with previous laps. This is one of the key reasons I gave up on 5 and 6.

Thanks for the helpful demo, I won't be buying.

PS I wonder if they'll still limit saved replays to 10 in total in the actual game

 

[HuskyGT]

There is a single aspect I can criticize so I don't sound like a complete fanboy. That is that "floaty" feel. It's been there since I first turned into the Forza franchise two years ago with Forza 3 and 4. It feels like driving a soap bar, if that makes any sense. Even Gran Turismo managed to get rid of that lack of weight feel that driving/racing games suffer from, back in GT6 (or was it GT5; I don't remember).

Other than that, I can't really complain about the physics. It's drivable, it's fun, it does not feel like a chore.

 

[JeanTheGamer]

Friction assist is ridiculous, why on earth was this added to a game that already has more than enough assists.

10 seconds a lap faster with it turned on, no joke. It says it invalidates lap times (rightly so) but I hope this assist isn't allowed in multiplayer

I've only tested it with the GTR in the wet but man, wtf were T10 thinking.

It's disallowed online, I'm pretty sure. Just like the penalty system which is enforced online according to many articles I've seen.

Yes, that's the first thing I did.
The Nissan does feel normal, it's the porsche which ruined my impression on the handling of the road cars in the game.
The handling of the GT3 RS is so wrong...I can't understand how Porshe guys could leave Turn 10 to do such a bad represention of their car in the game, I won't buy such a car ever, I won't even drive such a car in real life with such aweful handling.

The Porsche handled like it was on an oil slick when I tried it, at least for me.

 

[Pallie]

The Porsche was a pig, plain and simple. This board is about the only place I've come across with people defending it, or calling out people for being "bad drivers" for pointing it out. Face it fella's, it's not good. It's a bad look for your game when a damn semi/lorry whatever the hell you call it handles better.

 

[queleuleu]

Just like FM5 and 6, there is no option to hold previous and best lap times on the screen for longer than a few seconds at end of lap.

I really want to be able to compare my current performance with previous laps. This is one of the key reasons I gave up on 5 and 6.

Thanks for the helpful demo, I won't be buying.

PS I wonder if they'll still limit saved replays to 10 in total in the actual game

Thank you! It's just so basic. Oh and a mode called "Time Trial" would be nice.

 

[GTDavy]

Honestly this may be less of a hardcore SIM as Assetto Corsa or Project CARS (2), but in the end of the day do you enjoy playing it?

Thats is more important for me at least. AC has the best FBB, feel of the car on the road probably, but for for me its nowhere near as fun as a game. It is missing crucial setting (deadzones for instance, on my g920 I cannot set the brake deadzone or any deadzone etc..) and other options. I play AC only sometimes when I want to drive some hotlaps or a new DLC comes out etc, but other then this.. soon FM7 , PC2, F1 2017 and maybe sometimes FH3 will keep me quite busy for a while I reckon!

 

[-Fred-]

Honestly this may be less of a hardcore SIM as Assetto Corsa or Project CARS (2), but in the end of the day do you enjoy playing it?

It's basically Gran Turismo for XBox and PC... GT has never been a sim, yet we've all enjoyed playing it.

 

[Tyger]

Don't want to add fuel to the physics/Porsche discussion fire (it clearly doesn't need that) but doesn't a car ideally need to be moving to start pulling donuts? Not sure you can just full-lock the steering from a standstill, the car needs to be rolling and a little scandinavian flick helps, but I may well be wrong, I'm just going on when I have seen F1 drivers and the like doing it.

 

[GTDavy]

It's basically Gran Turismo for XBox and PC... GT has never been a sim, yet we've all enjoyed playing it.

Agreed! I have played every GT game since the first, and massively enjoyed it! I have also really been enjoying FM 6 and FH 3 so I am sure I will also enjoy FM 7.

 

[RPM Bibblefish]

The Porsche was a pig, plain and simple. This board is about the only place I've come across with people defending it, or calling out people for being "bad drivers" for pointing it out. Face it fella's, it's not good. It's a bad look for your game when a damn semi/lorry whatever the hell you call it handles better.

The Porsche handles like a RR car driven at the limit should do. However, it looks like there is a problem for wheel users. Nothing wrong with the car on a pad and your comment about the racing truck handling better is a bit daft

Also, anyone thinking the handling is wrong. Go and try the 2012 GT2 RS in FM6 and you'll find it very similar. Are we saying all the porches in that game are broken as well now?

 

[longshot1314]

I gave the demo a shot this morning with the g920, only with the porsche. It feels marginally better than 6 did with the wheel. That being said there literally is no ffb feel for weight transfer and road contact. This was starkly apparent since I came into the demo having just been playing dirt 4 with the wheel, same style of settings; no assists, sim steering, h-gate shifter. The only time I could really feel the track in the ffb was when the car broke into slides or spins. Or if contact was made with other cars. It also feels like the tank slapping issue is still there, as well as the delay in grip. What I mean is, is that when initiated a slide it is often impossible to recover from it, regardless of how much the angle is and what the speed is. I think this also is in part due to having no ffb for weight transfer, because unlike in dirt you can't really feel those weight shifts, thus its difficult to manipulate it the same way. Will see how this compares to project cars when that comes out at the end of the week, though I may be conceding to FM7 being entirely a pad game. I think I will spend a lot of time test driving FM7 with no cars on the track, since being thrown straight into a race didn't leave a lot of room to learn the handling.

 

[Ialyrn]

@longshot1314

Wheel damping 0%
Centre spring 0%
Vibration 50%

Set the FFB to what you like, 85% is a good starting point; and then go from there.

I was using my G920 on the demo this morning, these settings proved most helpful in getting the feel of the weight of the car there. There are still issues with the self aligning, but it is better than FM6. A dev has been talking to us on the Forza Forums about it, and it seems some of the FFB is not working properly in the demo; and he is looking into issues people are having. Been quite nice to have a dialog with a dev over this stuff for once.

 

[AudiMan2011]

Had a quick go in the Porsche and GT-R GT500.

• Handling on the controller feels much and such the same as Forza 6 which is fine with me.
• Graphics and lighting are stunning, especially the dynamic elements at Nurb.
• Rain weather graphics are much improved over Forza 6 and the added dynamism is a welcome touch.
• I'm really happy that the GT-R GT500 now sounds the way it's meant to be.

So far it's looking like the familiar feeling from Forza 6 is still there, but with tweaks here and there to keep it feeling fresh.

 

[Ak1504]

Good racing with ai not possible. No braking no reaction nothing except full throttle. Thats driving around blind obstacles for the player not racing.

 

[HuskyGT]

I finally gave it a try with my G920. Goodness, the default settings are HORRIBLE! I copied my settings from FH3 and the game is perfectly enjoyable. I feel it's actually smoother. Yes, there is very little feel fromt he car compared to AC, but it is perfectly playable.

About the Porsche. With a wheel it is indeed very hard to get used to, but after a couple of laps, I managed to control it just fine. I even won the race. No assists, SIM steering (whatever that means in Forza) and even ABS off. This car will be perfectly fine with a better set of tires. Hopefully not racing, but the one before (if it is not using them already).

So yeah. On a G920 at least, the game is just fine.

 

[Ialyrn]

Good racing with ai not possible. No breaking no reaction nothing except full throttle. Thats driving around blind obstacles for the player not racing.

Yes, the AI in the demo is awful; most likely just place holders for the demo. The full game will be the same as FM5, FH2, FM6 and FH3 in that it will use drivatars farmed from player collected data.

 

[longshot1314]

@longshot1314

Wheel damping 0%
Centre spring 0%
Vibration 50%

Set the FFB to what you like, 85% is a good starting point; and then go from there.

I was using my G920 on the demo this morning, these settings proved most helpful in getting the feel of the weight of the car there. There are still issues with the self aligning, but it is better than FM6. A dev has been talking to us on the Forza Forums about it, and it seems some of the FFB is not working properly in the demo; and he is looking into issues people are having. Been quite nice to have a dialog with a dev over this stuff for once.

Thanks I'll definitely give that a shot when I get the chance. That's good news that it may just be an issue with the demo.