Gran Turismo 7 Releasing in "First Half of 2021"

[Auditore]

I won't make any hard judgements over that corvette footage since its way too quick for a deep dive.
PD has been silent for a reason,they aren't ready to show the game again so i do think that footage is a early gt7 build.
The june footage was also an early build and it had bad shadows and pop in.

 

[Vspectra]

They also advertised it for Demon Souls but in the end the game hasn't any ray tracing, i think it will be the same with GT7, i don't think the ps5 can handle 4k 60fps with ray tracing, maybe it it can do it with lower res or half of the frames but 4k/60 with raytracing it is to much to handle even on the latest high end Nvidia GPU's.
Maybe the raytracing will be present only in the menu and such but not in gameplay,but we are talking about PD here so never say never, let's wait and see.

For Demon's Souls I believe mentioning RT was a mistake by whoever wrote the summary for all those games in the PS Blog post. RT for Demon's Souls was only mentioned in that blog post but nowhere else, not even on the official Playstation 5 games site that went up later like with GT7. Plus we've seen GT7 with ray-tracing, Demon's Souls footage never had it and was questionable from the start. Whatever the case, I just hope we get dynamic time of day back.

 

[oneloops]

They can be ready to show the game again but they can want to show new things only in the next exclusive GT7 trailer.

That causes more impact.

I understand this GT7 short clips in PS5 trailers more as a recordatory that GT7 is coming to PS5 than to show the evolution of the game.

For Demon's Souls I believe mentioning RT was a mistake by whoever wrote the summary for all those games in the PS Blog post. RT for Demon's Souls was only mentioned in that blog post but nowhere else, not even on the official Playstation 5 games site that went up later like with GT7. Plus we've seen GT7 with ray-tracing, Demon's Souls footage never had it and was questionable from the start. Whatever the case, I just hope we get dynamic time of day back.

If I'm not wrong Demon's Souls use RT technology for some sources of light and ilumination but not for "clean reflections".

With render engines you can turn on/off some kind of reflections, samples and bounces, for example, make exclusions, etc

 

[Vspectra]

If I'm not wrong Demon's Souls use RT technology for some sources of light and ilumination but not for "clean reflexions".

With render engines you can turn on/off some kind of reflexions for example, make exclusions, etc

Demon's Souls doesn't use any ray-tracing at all as confirmed by the game director.

“We don't actually implement raytracing in Demon's Souls . It's not because we couldn't or because the PlayStation 5 couldn't do it, it's fully capable of doing it, "said Moore.

“It's like any other graphic improvement, there is a cost [to implement raytracing]. If we had implemented ray tracing in the game, that would mean that we would have had to leave something out. There is a limited time in game development.​

 

[Nigrick]

They also advertised it for Demon Souls but in the end the game hasn't any ray tracing, i think it will be the same with GT7, i don't think the ps5 can handle 4k 60fps with ray tracing, maybe it it can do it with lower res or half of the frames but 4k/60 with raytracing it is to much to handle even on the latest high end Nvidia GPU's.
Maybe the raytracing will be present only in the menu and such but not in gameplay,but we are talking about PD here so never say never, let's wait and see.

I had the same thoughts after seeing Spider man MM footage. I believe it is very expensive effect and we might get the very limited version or not get it all, in order to keep 60fps. We will see it in the menus, replays and photomode for sure, but they will run 4k 30fps. I hope that I wrong about this and PD will surprise us, but I feel pessimistic about it.

 

[Petroperu]

They misspelled 2022.


Jerome

2023.

 

[SimTourist]

Knowing Yamauchi I'd say not a chance in hell, especially early 2021, I can at least imagine holiday of 2021, but early in the year is not probable.

 

[Nielsen]

Well that's just great. I managed to score a launch day PS5, picking it up on Thursday, and I've got nothing to play on it...

Did you not see that coming? Your post comes across as if you were misled into it.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Also nice and subtle reflexions depends on how nice and what kind of the objets are in the scene, the camera position and the sun position.

It's easier to get more detailed and more subtles reflections into a forest, like Trial Mountain, than in a desert, like Willow.
It's simply different and maybe not very clear to compare both.

Racing cars haven't the same coated kind of painting than stock-expensive car. Racing cars paint seem like a "plastic" finish more often in real life.

It’s at an extreme enough angle for the environment reflection to be very clear on the door panels. If those are visible then the mirror would be - and I’ve already shown a real example of a race car’s paint at the same angle showing a clear mirror reflection.

 

[oneloops]

It’s at an extreme enough angle for the environment reflection to be very clear on the door panels. If those are visible then the mirror would be - and I’ve already shown a real example of a race car’s paint at the same angle showing a clear mirror reflection.

There is a big difference between the real example and the GT7 capture : the camera heigth, the GT7 capture camera is very low (under 1 m). The mirror will not reflect in the same area than the high position camera (over 1m) of the real example.

 

[oneloops]

I've just made this test with blender and cycles, using raytracing. What is reflected depends of the camera position, even the grass that is near the car will not reflect into the door panel in a low camera position. (only a little in the lowest part)

The black part in the last capture is the sun shadow in this case.

 

[Scaff]

Sorry, I didn't watch the video in full. Anyway, that's crazy seeing how it predates all other PS3 games and yet is the only one having its servers still up and running. I don't know anything about servers and online networks but it probably costs less to only host a few leaderboard laptimes than to maintain a more flashed out multiplayer mode like all the other PS3 entries had. Perhaps the cost for it is so low that PDs accountants simply keep overlooking it when going through their figures. I just can't think of a reasonable explanation.

No problem at all. I think in this case its simply because its such a low load that they forgot to switch it off or repurpose it.

Racing cars haven't the same coated kind of painting than a stock-expensive car.

As a blanket statement that's simply not true at all, as the paint is a 'flat' finish when applied, and it's the lacquers and finishes that change its final finish (including matt finishes)

McLaren uses the exact same painting process that a road car goes through, using the exact same materials, and finish to a much higher standard than anything but the highest-end road cars.

https://www.mclaren.com/racing/partners/AkzoNobel-Sikkens/how-to-paint-a-formula-1-car-1114476/
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferrari-matte-paint-performance-benefit/4338380/

Racing cars paint seem like a "plastic" finish more often in real life.

You seem to be mistaking wraps, which are now heavily used for liveries in some series, with paint, and wraps are not exactly unheard of in the passenger car market either.

 

[oneloops]

As a blanket statement that's simply not true at all, as the paint is a 'flat' finish when applied, and it's the lacquers and finishes that change its final finish (including matt finishes)

McLaren uses the exact same painting process that a road car goes through, using the exact same materials, and finish to a much higher standard than anything but the highest-end road cars.

https://www.mclaren.com/racing/partners/AkzoNobel-Sikkens/how-to-paint-a-formula-1-car-1114476/
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferrari-matte-paint-performance-benefit/4338380/



You seem to be mistaking wraps, which are now heavily used for liveries in some series, with paint, and wraps are not exactly unheard of in the passenger car market either.

I said more often not always. Calm down.

 

[Zlork]

I believe in the first half of 2021 !

So let's keep our fingers crossed

 

[imported_rik19]

Yeah but I could have done that without spending $600...

They will play better on the ps5 going by the videos i have seen, frame rates etc how they should of been,......hope we dont have to wait for the ps6 for ps5 games to run properly...

 

[Scaff]

I said more often not always. Calm down.

I'm perfectly calm thanks.

The first part of your post is simply untrue, when paint is used on race cars the process is the same (and often more involved) that the finish on production cars.

The second part is misleading, as the 'plastic' look comes not from paint, but wraps.

If you don't want to get corrected, then don't make inaccurate factual claims.

 

[oneloops]

I'm perfectly calm thanks.

The first part of your post is simply untrue, when paint is used on race cars the process is the same (and often more involved) that the finish on production cars.

The second part is misleading, as the 'plastic' look comes not from paint, but wraps.

If you don't want to get corrected, then don't make inaccurate factual claims.

If you separate phrases as you did for ignoring more often (that was written in bold) you will always jump on pedant corrections like that.

Paint process often more involved doesn't mean more reflective, Mr "I know everything"

How should I write more often ? in capital letters in addition to bold for you ? Or in every single phrase for your level of understanding ?

 

[Scaff]

If you separate phrases as you did for ignoring more often you will always jump on pedant corrections like that.

How should I write more often ? in capital letters in addition to bold for you ? Or in every single phrase ?

The 'more often' doesn't change the inaccuracies of the two sections I corrected. It's really not hard to understand. Regardless of the frequency of the finish occurring, it's a result of wrapping not paint, nor does that change the utterly inaccurate statement you made in your first sentence about how paint is applied to race cars (it's still a three-part process).

What I suggest you do is cut out the passive-aggressive nonsense, accept the factually sourced corrections and move on. As I said above "If you don't want to get corrected, then don't make inaccurate factual claims".

 

[TheAdmiester]

There is a big difference between the real example and the GT7 capture : the camera heigth, the GT7 capture camera is very low (under 1 m). The mirror will not reflect in the same area than the high position camera (over 1m) of the real example.

As someone who has taken many photos of cars from similar angles, I can assure you that on a car with relatively flat, normal door surfaces like the C7, the mirrors would be visible in some form, especially when the environment is so clearly visible in it.

EDIT: Additionally the car in your example has a much more pronounced crease in the door below the mirror which diverts the reflections when at such a low angle. The C7’s door still has a crease but a much softer one which kind of renders the comparison moot.

 

[oneloops]

The 'more often' doesn't change the inaccuracies of the two sections I corrected. It's really not hard to understand. Regardless of the frequency of the finish occurring, it's a result of wrapping not paint, nor does that change the utterly inaccurate statement you made in your first sentence about how paint is applied to race cars (it's still a three-part process).

What I suggest you do is cut out the passive-aggressive nonsense, accept the factually sourced corrections and move on. As I said above "If you don't want to get corrected, then don't make inaccurate factual claims".

I suggest you to is to cut out the pedant corrections cutting phrases out of context and taking all we post as absolute truth claims in all cases and not more often.

As someone who has taken many photos of cars from similar angles, I can assure you that on a car with relatively flat, normal door surfaces like the C7, the mirrors would be visible in some form, especially when the environment is so clearly visible in it.

Reflections in curved surfaces and different angles are very difficult to predict where they are going to appear. Very often we have unexpected reflexions and unexpected distorsions that can suggest to be fake in real life car photos.

 

[Scaff]

I suggest you to is to cut out the pedant corrections cutting phrases out of context and taking all we post as absolute truth claims in all cases and not more often.

Nope. If someone posts something that is factually inaccurate and I'm able to supply the correct (sourced) information, then that is what I will do.

What you fail to grasp is that I didn't dispute that some race cars can have a 'plastic' look to them. what I did correct, was that this is not due to paint, but the use of wraps (and its also less common now, as the quality of wraps has improved massively), I also corrected the inaccurate claim that race-car paint is applied in a different way to passenger car paint.

Once again, "If you don't want to get corrected, then don't make inaccurate factual claims".

 

[oneloops]

Nope. If someone posts something that is factually inaccurate and I'm able to supply the correct (sourced) information, then that is what I will do.

What you fail to grasp is that I didn't dispute that some race cars can have a 'plastic' look to them. what I did correct, was that this is not due to paint, but the use of wraps (and its also less common now, as the quality of wraps has improved massively), I also corrected the inaccurate claim that race-car paint is applied in a different way to passenger car paint.

Once again, "If you don't want to get corrected, then don't make inaccurate factual claims".

Sometimes looks more like plastic because of different finish, not only due by the use of wraps.
"More plastic like" doesn't mean less reflective nor matte either. "Plastic appereance" can be very reflective but doesn't give the same reflections than metallic finishes.

Once again, if you want to do pedant corrections don't cut the context nor take all claim as absolute truth when is written "more often".

 

[FlameWater]

Thumbs up to this forum, if Sony reads these comments they will realize the consequences of a rushed release.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Reflections in curved surfaces and different angles are very difficult to predict where they are going to appear. Very often we have unexpected reflexions and unexpected distorsions that can suggest to be fake in real life car photos.

Here's the lowest angle I can find of a C7:

Mirror is still clearly visible in the car. It's very hard to find an angle where the mirror isn't visible as a matter of fact - the only evidence I can find is where the car is in an autoshow or showroom environment with lots of harsh lights above it.

Also there's the clear fact that the mirror itself isn't reflecting anything dynamic, whereas we've seen the BAC Mono has a live reflection - surely this is enough of an example.

EDIT: Actually, just to add to this. My car has very curved doors and this is a photo from a fairly similar angle:

Although it's cheating a bit because the car is black, there's no denying that from pretty much any angle a mirror is absolutely going to be visible on the car's door, only except where there's an extreme crease (which the C7 evidently doesn't have).

 

[Scaff]

Sometimes looks more like plastic because of different finish, not only due by the use of wraps.
"More plastic like" doesn't mean less reflective nor matte either. "Plastic appereance" can be very reflective but doesn't give the same reflections than metallic finishes.

You will have no problem at all letting us know what that particular finish is then.

Once again, if you want to do pedant corrections don't cut the context nor take all claim as absolute truth when is written "more often".

Once again, that's not the part I was referring to, so the strawman argument still doesn't fly.

 

[oneloops]

Here's the lowest angle I can find of a C7:

Mirror is still clearly visible in the car. It's very hard to find an angle where the mirror isn't visible as a matter of fact - the only evidence I can find is where the car is in an autoshow or showroom environment with lots of harsh lights above it.

Also there's the clear fact that the mirror itself isn't reflecting anything dynamic, whereas we've seen the BAC Mono has a live reflection - surely this is enough of an example.

EDIT: Actually, just to add to this. My car has very curved doors and this is a photo from a fairly similar angle:
View attachment 970763

Although it's cheating a bit because the car is black, there's no denying that from pretty much any angle a mirror is absolutely going to be visible on the car's door, only except where there's an extreme crease (which the C7 evidently doesn't have).

Yes, I could expect some reflection at that angle in the GT7 capture, I agree with you, but I think it can be missed by the camera position very low that I don't know the exact position.

 

[oneloops]

Edit : (Sorry to the admins for not multiquoting)

You will have no problem at all letting us know what that particular finish is then.


Once again, that's not the part I was referring to, so the strawman argument still doesn't fly.

Common "solid finish" paint like solid white and solid red in common cars vs "metallic finish" paint.

All is referring to the more often on bold written in the beggining, so you can take all the return you want.

 

[Dave A]

Common "solid" paint like solid white and solid red in common cars vs "metallic finish" paint.

All is referring to the more often on bold written in the beggining, so you can take all the return you want.

I don't know if there's a language barrier, but I've seen it time and time again, you really struggle to comprehend points that people disagree with you over.

You've done it with me before and you're doing it right now. Scaff isn't talking about what you put in bold at all, but that's what you keep referring back to, it doesn't change Scaff's comments.

 

[oneloops]

I don't know if there's a language barrier, but I've seen it time and time again, you really struggle to comprehend points that people disagree with you over. You;ve done it with me, you're doing it right now. Scaff isn't talking about what you put in bold at all, but that's what you keep referring back to, it doesn't change Scaff's comments at all.

Nope, I don't like the pedant way that some people use when taking all claims as absolute truth when it's written in bold "more often" or "sometimes", or "in my opinion" as he and other few users try to correct by simple and rigid conclusions, extrapolating a part to the whole, cutting parts, changing claims, etc

 

[Scaff]

Common "solid finish" paint like solid white and solid red in common cars vs "metallic finish" paint.

Having worked in the industry for over twenty years I have come across exactly zero solid paint finishes that looked like plastic, ever. It's even more of an odd claim to make given that metallic and pearlescent paint is simply solid paint that has had aluminium power or flake added to it (ceramic in the case of pearlescent) and in quality, finishes have more than the standard three coat (or primer and two-pack is you want to get technical). Matte is more complex as its often additives to all three layers.

I've come across quite a few wraps (in the early days) that looked very plastic, mainly because that's exactly what they are made of.

All is referring to the more often on bold written in the beggining, so you can take all the return you want.

Well that makes zero sense at all!