Gran Turismo 7 Update Coming July 28

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There's people here who see the NSX, NSX Gr.4 and NSX Gr.3 as duplicates tho :lol:
Are you talking about this post? I think he was more so complaining about the addition of fictional cars than them being duplicates.
BUT, and now I'll definitely back you up here, when you consider things like:

Mustang Gr.B
Mustang Gr.4
Mustang (road car)
Mustang Gr.3

And other cars in similar situations... Now yes, we are talking about clear duplicates. Or the 2014-2015 Clio RS, or the 2019 and 2020 Supra... And yes, the BRZ/86 is another type of duplicate.

The biggest offenders to me are the Gr. cars that aren't real life cars but cars that were tuned by PD... These cars could've been in the game in the same way we made RM models on cars back in GT5-GT6, yet they bothered to make them stand out as actual cars for sale in the Brand Central and consider them as a "car count". Makes no sense to me.
 
To be fair, wasn't the reason for Spa not appearing in GTS for a while that they were trying to charge more for the license than they were doing to other games? For Lotus in particular they quite literally had a finished car in GT Sport that they never added, so it wouldn't make sense if they really just hadn't bothered trying to get it settled.

People in the know have said many times that Ferrari is notoriously difficult to work with in games. Like… they don’t even want people to be able to apply custom liveries kind of difficult. Do the other titles have as many Ferrari models as Gran Turismo does?

Just trying to work it out in my mind why PD would pursue this? Unless PD felt it was more worth it to license Ferrari’s more historical cars instead of the 488. Maybe PD allots a certain $$ figure to each manufacture and need to trim fat somewhere.
 
Are you talking about this post? I think he was more so complaining about the addition of fictional cars than them being duplicates.

Was talking about both. Those Mustangs I listed, and you have other models like it, are all based on the original Mustang Road Car. They simply had modified GT Auto and Tuning Shop parts added to them and are counted as actual cars of the game. And as I said in the same post, we could've had the RM option like in past GTs to create those cars in the first place.

Generational differences, like the GT-R R32, GT-R R33 and among others, are quite obviously not duplicates.

Still, compared to past GTs, GT7 has by far the least duplicates. So we can't really complain much about duplicates, but it does have by far the biggest number of fictional cars.
 
If we had more events to grind, the IG economy wouldn’t be nearly as big of a deal.
But we don't. It was designed that way, and appears to be being maintained that way.

We can all see from the custom race creator that making events is just not that hard. The low event count is an explicit decision by Polyphony. As is the very low number that pay out at a high rate. As is making sure that custom races don't pay out at a competitive rate.

Polyphony could have made the economy not "as big of a deal", but they didn't and they aren't.

For whatever reason, Polyphony apparently thinks that the game is better if it has a low amount of events and has a very defined and repetitive path to efficiently gaining credits. It seems hard to believe that any seasoned developer would think that's the most fun for the players*, so there must be another reason they've done it like this.

I wonder what it could be?

*It should be noted that this is pretty much the opposite of how endgame is usually designed in pretty much any game. The standard structure seems to be to have the game be pretty straightforward or even linear through the levelling/story phase, and then at endgame the options for the player explode to cater for as many different playstyles as possible. Developers have learnt that this is what works if you want a game to have a long tail.
 
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Was talking about both. Those Mustangs I listed, and you have other models like it, are all based on the original Mustang Road Car. They simply had modified GT Auto and Tuning Shop parts added to them and are counted as actual cars of the game. And as I said in the same post, we could've had the RM option like in past GTs to create those cars in the first place.
So you were calling Gr.3 cars duplicates. Wait, then how is that guy's post a strawman if someone is actually complaining about it?

Alright aside from that. I hear you and I'm going to say that you're wrong, the Ford Mustang Gr.3 Race Car was literally made based on GT3 cars in real life. It's meant to be a "what if" car for a Mustang GT3, not parts that you can simply get from a body shop or the Ford Performance parts website and place on a normal S550 Mustang GT.

Your logic here is the same as someone saying you could just take a BMW M6 to a body shop and turn it into a GT3 race car, it doesn't work like that.

and here's the thing about the RM option, they still would've been counted as separate cars if that was a thing. That's what happened in GT5.
 
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and here's the thing about the RM option, they still would've been counted as separate cars if that was a thing. That's what happened in GT5.
Although, it was dumb when they did it in GT5 because the original implementation in GT1/2 didn't count them as separate cars. It was just an upgrade that you could do.

It wasn't a surprise in GT5 because of the extreme lengths that game went to in order to artificially inflate the car count, but that doesn't mean it wasn't stupid or that they should keep doing it.
 
PD have added a few new Group 3 cars so they're probably saying "isn't this what you guys wanted?". Well not exactly but thanks anyway.
 
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PD have added a few new Group 3 cars so they're probably saying "isn't this what you guys wanted?". Well not exactly but thanks anyway.
For sure. “Where’s the (enter any manufacturer without a Gr.3 & Gr.4 car).“

Those in the know, didn’t ask for a Gr.4 650S. Would have been better to use the GT4 570S. Also, introducing that road car.
Wish Kaz would tell us the reasons for a whole lot of stuff.
 
Although, it was dumb when they did it in GT5 because the original implementation in GT1/2 didn't count them as separate cars. It was just an upgrade that you could do.

It wasn't a surprise in GT5 because of the extreme lengths that game went to in order to artificially inflate the car count, but that doesn't mean it wasn't stupid or that they should keep doing it.
For sure, they probably shouldn't kept doing it, but they we know that they would anyway.

----
Though I feel mixed on whether or not they should not count as a separate car. I mean, the RMs in GT2 for the most part just a racing themed skin applied to the road car with some aero and an extra weight reduction. The RMs in GT5 always felt to me more than that, they felt for a word more like hypothetical race cars made from the manufacturer rather than something you could throw together in a body shop.
 
Those in the know, didn’t ask for a Gr.4 650S. Would have been better to use the GT4 570S. Also, introducing that road car.
Wish Kaz would tell us the reasons for a whole lot of stuff.
I am sure they would liked to do all the GT4/3 cars but whatever reason they decided to skip 570S

probably to save time as the 650 looks almost like 570 if you squint eyes :P

more i don't get why we don't have P1 when we got the P1 GTR , they could do even the laziest efford to just remove the rear wing and call it a day (yea i know there are more differences than that)
 
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I am sure they would liked to do all the GT4/3 cars but whatever reason they decided to skip 570S

probably to save time as the 650 looks almost like 570 if you squint eyes :P

more i don't get why we don't have P1 when we got the P1 GTR , they could do even the laziest efford to just remove the rear wing and call it a day (yea i know there are more differences than that)
Similar to the seven Gr.3/GR.B road cars. Leaving out all the other GR.3/GR.B models.
 
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I don’t think the price of licensing is an issue. One, Sony can afford it. Two, they’ve licensed 1200 cars before (or 111 manufacturers) in GT6. I think it’s just what they want to add to the game.

This is where there’s a disconnect to some degree. For sure we aren’t owed anything but I also think Kaz wants what he wants in the game. Which is fine, it’s his game. But it is a little disappointing to not get certain cars which many fans have wanted for a while.
 
For someone who has clearly got an issue vis-a-vis "You don't speak for other people" and "lack objective insight"; your accusation "... all you crave is attention" seems to be both of those.
Your good friend "yard sale" has been polluting the thread with none factual rambling assertions about MTX and this needs to be called out. MTX's are contentious and he is feeding on this hence I question his intentions.
 
Though I feel mixed on whether or not they should not count as a separate car. I mean, the RMs in GT2 for the most part just a racing themed skin applied to the road car with some aero and an extra weight reduction. The RMs in GT5 always felt to me more than that, they felt for a word more like hypothetical race cars made from the manufacturer rather than something you could throw together in a body shop.
There's an easy way to deal with that. Is it actually mechanically related to the original car?

If we can do widebodies and such, even major modifications seem fine as long as it's based on the same chassis. For example, most GT4 cars. Those would be a single car with a set upgrade list for the spec races.

If the car is a spaceframe or something that only externally resembles the car it's named after, that seems fair to be a separate car. For example, GT500 cars. They're named after models the manufacturer wants to promote and they sort of look similar, but that's about it.

At this point there's enough detail in the models to probably be able to tell which is which even without Polyphony being explicit about it. But if they wanted to be explicit about why some cars are separate and others are upgrades then that would be cool too, it'd be that communication thing they're so good at.
 
I wonder what it could be?
At least you're admitting you don't know. 👍

I don’t think the price of licensing is an issue. One, Sony can afford it. Two, they’ve licensed 1200 cars before (or 111 manufacturers) in GT6. I think it’s just what they want to add to the game.
A license agreement is the formalization of negotiations around usage of IP, between a party that has money, and a party that has the IP. It is not an off the shelf thing with a fixed price or terms. For all we know the lion's share of the standard models that were re-used in 6 were covered by earlier license agreements... for all we know perhaps PD is now paying double for all it's licenses to ensure multi-game licensing...

... the point is we don't know, and not even by a small amount. It's not like we have most of the info and are just trying to piece together specifics... we have literally no information to go on. Even the Pikes Peak license we only think we know something based on what another developer said.

People making **** up to fill gaps in their understanding is how we ended up with religion.
 
At least you're admitting you don't know. 👍


A license agreement is the formalization of negotiations around usage of IP, between a party that has money, and a party that has the IP. It is not an off the shelf thing with a fixed price or terms. For all we know the lion's share of the standard models that were re-used in 6 were covered by earlier license agreements... for all we know perhaps PD is now paying double for all it's licenses to ensure multi-game licensing...

... the point is we don't know, and not even by a small amount. It's not like we have most of the info and are just trying to piece together specifics... we have literally no information to go on. Even the Pikes Peak license we only think we know something based on what another developer said.

People making **** up to fill gaps in their understanding is how we ended up with religion.
Hey, I’m not saying I know for sure. Just my thoughts on why certain cars aren’t in.

And indeed, licenses fluctuate in terms and price. We’ll likely never know but it is odd that certain cars are omitted, unless PD has themselves tied up in some sort of “you can have x amount of y manufacturer’s cars in the game” and as a result, a Ferrari that features in almost every other prominent racing game isn’t in. Whether that could exist as terms for a license, I don’t know. I’m just guessing.

But like you said, we don’t know what the situation is.
 
So you were calling Gr.3 cars duplicates. Wait, then how is that guy's post a strawman if someone is actually complaining about it?

Alright aside from that. I hear you and I'm going to say that you're wrong, the Ford Mustang Gr.3 Race Car was literally made based on GT3 cars in real life. It's meant to be a "what if" car for a Mustang GT3, not parts that you can simply get from a body shop or the Ford Performance parts website and place on a normal S550 Mustang GT.

Your logic here is the same as someone saying you could just take a BMW M6 to a body shop and turn it into a GT3 race car, it doesn't work like that.

and here's the thing about the RM option, they still would've been counted as separate cars if that was a thing. That's what happened in GT5.
The strawman was directed at him saying "players" wanting modern cars and not wanting old cars or whatever, and then using something as the 488 and 720 GT3 as examples of duplicates when they quite clearly are not. He really didn't address anything here... Just empty words really.

As for the Gr.3 cars. They don't exist IRL. PD just added bodykits to the road car and called them Gr.3/Gr.4 when they could've easily had the RM option in GT Auto for those cars. This is a game, it isn't supposed to be ultra-realistic about where you can buy the car parts.
However, using normal cars, adding parts to them and creating basically fictional Gr. cars and then add them to the car count? That's laziness...
Go to the Mitsubishi car dealership in brand central... And you have like 5 iterations of the Evolution Final, of which 4 don't exist... And a VGT.

And just because it counted in GT5, doesn't mean it wasn't a stupid way of inflating the car count anyway. GT5 and GT6 were the worst of the series in terms of inflating the car count. Far worse than GT7 by the way which is actually not bad in terms of duplicates, just too many fictional cars.
PD even goes the extra mile to create Gr. cars out of frickin fictional already non-existing VGTs ffs. I want to race the cars that I've seen in videos, in TVs, that the manufacturers actually created for a purpose in racing, cars with actual history. Not something made up to appease the 0.1% that do the races on e-sports and to just inflate the car count.

Out of all the Rally Gr.B cars in the game, only 2 of them are real life cars... The Audi Quattro and the 205 Evo II... That's just... sad. When they had a crapton of cool and amazing Rally cars in the past games.
 
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At least you're admitting you don't know. 👍
Nobody will ever really know unless Polyphony decides to tell us what they were thinking when they designed it. That seems unlikely when they can barely be bothered to talk about the future of their own game.

That said, there is such a thing as a rhetorical question. It's used when the answer is just plain unnecessary. It doesn't ultimately matter why they chose to design the events and economy the way they did as there's no answer that is going to be convincing that this was the best for the players.
 
I don't know if someone already said this in the forums but I've opened a ticket today and received a Ford GT LM Spec 2 engine to swap. Anyone know what car will be able to use it?

Link Below

 
I don't know if someone already said this in the forums but I've opened a ticket today and received a Ford GT LM Spec 2 engine to swap. Anyone know what car will be able to use it?

Link Below


 
There's an easy way to deal with that. Is it actually mechanically related to the original car?

If we can do widebodies and such, even major modifications seem fine as long as it's based on the same chassis. For example, most GT4 cars. Those would be a single car with a set upgrade list for the spec races.
I feel like I would still be driven crazy on the idea of the real GT4 cars being treated as seperate cars and the fictional ones not. Another problem is that I have a feeling is PD implemented this, it would become a menu navigation nightmare. You would have to buy a road car, then I bet they would make you put so many buttons to make the car.
At this point there's enough detail in the models to probably be able to tell which is which even without Polyphony being explicit about it. But if they wanted to be explicit about why some cars are separate and others are upgrades then that would be cool too, it'd be that communication thing they're so good at.
God, I hate their communication department. The wierd thing is that I see Kaz willinging to constantly talk about his GT eSports competitions on Twitter, but he won't take time out of his day to talk about how GT7 is going? sigh

The strawman was directed at him saying "players" wanting modern cars and not wanting old cars or whatever, and then using something as the 488 and 720 GT3 as examples of duplicates when they quite clearly are not.
Hmm, hold onto that thought.
As for the Gr.3 cars. They don't exist IRL.
Cool, I said "based on cars in real life", not exists in real life.

-----
Alright, before I get into this argument, I'll admit to being wrong and making a mistake on the first part. I thought GT3 cars in real life were built on a completely different chassis and body makeup to their road car counterparts, that's wrong.

An Audi R8 GT3 for instance still has the same skeleton as a normal R8, just with some alterations.

PD just added bodykits to the road car and called them Gr.3/Gr.4 when they could've easily had the RM option in GT Auto for those cars. This is a game, it isn't supposed to be ultra-realistic about where you can buy the car parts.
However, using normal cars, adding parts to them and creating basically fictional Gr. cars and then add them to the car count? That's laziness...
Go to the Mitsubishi car dealership in brand central... And you have like 5 iterations of the Evolution Final, of which 4 don't exist
With that said above, I have an issue with your argument. GT3 & 4 cars in real life literally are in some cases modified versions of existing cars. That article I just linked mentions this about a R8 GT3:
Both cars start life on the same production line, with their base chassis being built in a new manufacturing facility at the Böllinger Höfe industrial park in Heilbronn. The GT3 chassis is fitted with aluminium cast joints and a steel roll cage, but is otherwise identical to the road car.

That is basically what if inferred that PD had done to the Gr.3 cars in GT Sport & 7. They're designed with the same way as a real-life car. My problem is your argument sounds like it comes down to the cars not counting as separate cars just because they're fictional and thus doesn't sound fair.

And just because it counted in GT5, doesn't mean it wasn't a stupid way of inflating the car count anyway. GT5 and GT6 were the worst of the series in terms of inflating the car count.
I think you misunderstood my point, I wasn't saying that as a defense for the Gr.3 cars. I was saying that realistically, Polyphony Digital would do that though. Not saying it's smart to do that, but it's realistically what they would do, knowing this company.
 
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With that said above, I have an issue with your argument. GT3 & 4 cars in real life literally are in some cases modified versions of existing cars. That article I just linked mentions this about a R8 GT3:
I don't have a problem with GT cars... I have a problem with Gr. cars that don't exist being in the game counting as an individual car on top of that, rather than those that exist. And those Gr. cars could've just been RMs in GT Auto instead of being part of Brand Central dealership.

The real life GT cars were fully developed by the manufacturers themselves, and not made up by "imaginary" componentes and parts that are mostly the Gr. type cars in this game. Having them in the game is different, simply no comparison to those other Gr. cars.

Thr Gr. B category is the most ridiculous of them all. With only 2 real life cars and all the other 15 or so being fictional upgraded cars from the road going model, some of them making crap for sense like the GT-R, Mustang and NSX Gr. B, cars clearly not designed for off-roading. Where's the Polo WRC? The C4 WRC? The Delta S4? The Stratos Rally Car? The 037? The Renault 5 Maxi Turbo? The actual Audi Quattro? Collin McRae's 90s Impreza Rally Car? The Celica Rally Cars?

Why duplicate a frickin VGT car into a Gr. car?

Too many wasted opportunities. They have a ridiculous budget, over 300 staff members and Sony's backing as one of their top exclusives... Make use of it.
 
I don't have a problem with GT cars... I have a problem with Gr. cars that don't exist being in the game counting as an individual car on top of that, rather than those that exist. And those Gr. cars could've just been RMs in GT Auto instead of being part of Brand Central dealership.

The real life GT cars were fully developed by the manufacturers themselves, and not made up by "imaginary" componentes and parts that are mostly the Gr. type cars in this game. Having them in the game is different, simply no comparison to those other Gr. cars.
I heard your point the first time, but it once again basically sounds like this:
My problem is your argument sounds like it comes down to the cars not counting as separate cars just because they're fictional and thus doesn't sound fair.
It doesn't matter if they're fictional, they were fictionally made to a certain standard. Polyphony made the cars up, but the cars were made based on the logic of real cars. You can't just write them off as the same car as their road counterparts just because they're fictional.

and in this video, it's flat out said Gr.3 cars were made to be like Gr.3 cars.


I've already heard your argument over and over again about the fictional cars being a waste of space. Stop repeating it.
That's not what I'm arguing about here, I'm questioning your mentality of simplying saying that Gr.3 cars can be classified as the same exact thing as a normal road car.
 
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I don't have a problem with GT cars... I have a problem with Gr. cars that don't exist being in the game counting as an individual car on top of that, rather than those that exist. And those Gr. cars could've just been RMs in GT Auto instead of being part of Brand Central dealership.

The real life GT cars were fully developed by the manufacturers themselves, and not made up by "imaginary" componentes and parts that are mostly the Gr. type cars in this game. Having them in the game is different, simply no comparison to those other Gr. cars.

Lol-wut.

So, for example, you think the M4 Gr.4 should be an RM in GT Auto, but an M4 GT4 would be okay as a separate car.... despite them functionally being basically the same thing?

**** me.

Given how much bitching goes on about selling cars being part of the games advertising, there's a lot of people that seemed to have missed the Vision GT and the Concept car on the cover of the game.
 
I've already heard your argument over and over again about the fictional cars being a waste of space. Stop repeating it.
And I'm telling you exactly how that is my problem and you keep on misdirect it... And yes, I can write them off precisely because they are fictional. Do not bring up the past GTs, I don't agree with those either, but even they weren't to the point of being 1/4 of the whole game.

We are on an agree to disagree argument here... No point in going any further atfer I made my stance clear now.

Modeling cars these days into a game, especially at the excelent level of detail Gran Turismo 7 does it, requires a lot of time. And IMO that time should be given to real life cars, not fictional ones. Even if they take little time or less time, they still take time and resources regardless. Some VGTs being in the game as part of the program is one thing, but to have fictional cars occupy 1/4th of the whole car roster? ... ... No... just no. I wouldn't mind as much if they were 1/10th (and even that is a bit too much), but it's quite ridiculous as it is.

Who the hell aside from a very large minority gets excited about driving a Gr.1 VGT car over an existing 80s/90s Group C or an actual LMP1 car? Same to any other category, Gr.3, Gr.4, Gr.B...

Surprisingly, there are no fictional Gr.2 cars... But somehow even that tiny little group gets butchered by having 2008-2016 GT500 cars with late 90s LM GT1 cars. :lol: This is a different discussion alltogether though.
 
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And I'm telling you exactly how that is my problem and you keep on misdirect it
Because your argument also keeps treating 2 different kinds of the cars as the same, you're comparing a Mustang GT to a Gr.3 car like how someone compares a Skyline GT-R 1999 to a Skyline GT-R 1999 in Midnight Purple II. That's the way you presented yourself.
Do not bring up the past GTs, I don't agree with those either
First of all, that video was meant to cement the point that you keep ignoring, not whatever argument you think I said in your head. You're thinking in your own thick skull that the fictional Gr.3 cars should not be treated the same as the GT3 cars despite the developers otherwise explaining that they were made with the same logic. They don't exist in real life, but they were made with real-life principles in mind.
Modeling cars these days into a game, especially at the excelent level of detail Gran Turismo 7 does it, requires a lot of time. And IMO that time should be given to real life cars, not fictional ones. Even if they take little time or less time, they still take time and resources regardless.
Cool, I don't care about this argument right now. I understand wanting resources and time to be put towards other cars, I've heard this argument to other people already. I can sympathize with it to an extent, but I'm not questioning this. I'm questioning how you can somehow think a race car can be essentially be treated as a duplicate even if the car is different. I already told you that GT3 cars in real life essentially also are road cars with a wider body, altered chassis, and a roll cage.

I told you that the cars are fictional but use some real-world logic. These Gr.3 cars aren't like the Vision GT cars that use made-up technology to be powered.
but even they weren't to the point of being 1/4 of the whole game
Who the hell aside from a very large minority gets excited about driving a Gr.1 VGT car over an existing 80s/90s Group C or an actual LMP1 car? Same to any other category, Gr.3, Gr.4, Gr.B...
Um, WHAT?! All of the fictional Gr.1,2, & 3 cars were literally first introduced in GT Sport! The only fictional race cars introduced to GT7 are a handful, just a couple of Suzuki cars and Genesis cars.

and even if you account for Vision GT cars, once again; pretty much only a handful of Vision GTs were introduced to this game. Most of all of them were already in GT Sport.

Once again, you present a flawed argument. You think they didn't make 1/4 of GT Sport, but magically adding a few more suddenly does that for GT7.
We are on an agree to disagree argument here... No point in going any further atfer I made my stance clear now.
Yup, your stance is clear, inconsistent, and uses poor logic. Got it! 👍
 
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People forget nowadays that it takes longer to build a fictional car than a real one, simply because it would mean either:

  • Creating something from scratch (this is mostly apparent with VGT's)
  • Conceptualizing a "what if" racing version based on an existing vehicle which probably doesn't/is yet to exist in the real world
  • Reimagining the car entirely
...and that's why you're more likely to see more real cars in updates than fictional racing versions of certain cars and to an extent, VGT's.
 
Because your argument also keeps treating 2 different kinds of the cars as the same, you're comparing a Mustang GT to a Gr.3 car like how someone compares a Skyline GT-R 1999 to a Skyline GT-R 1999 in Midnight Purple II. That's the way you presented yourself.

I can understand how you are interpretating this, but this isn't what I mean.

First of all, that video was meant to cement the point that you keep ignoring, not whatever argument you think I said in your head. You're thinking in your own thick skull that the fictional Gr.3 cars should not be treated the same as the GT3 cars despite the developers otherwise explaining that they were made with the same logic. They don't exist in real life, but they were made with real-life principles in mind.

Don't care if they were made with the same logic... They don't exist, period. The time they wasted on thinking about the parts and the tunes to make those cars could've been used on actual real life cars. Would it be less cars? Yes, probably, but they would at least be cars we can relate to, that we saw racing in real life.

These cars were made purely for the purpose of the manufacturer series, basically, for the .1% of players that participate in them and represent those brands. But even some brands have been shafted of their true purpose GT cars that exist in real life for a fictional model (eg. McLaren 570S GT4, yet in the game we have a fictional 650S Gr.4 instead). So, I do understand why PD made these cars as "stand-alone" cars that make up the car count. But I certainly don't agree with the way they do this at all. Might as well just pick every single road car in the game, apply some changes and now call it a stand alone car to double the car count... really... this is just lazy.

Um, WHAT?! All of the fictional Gr.1,2, & 3 cars were literally first introduced in GT Sport! The only fictional race cars introduced to GT7 are a handful, just a couple of Suzuki cars and Genesis cars.

and even if you account for Vision GT cars, once again; pretty much only a handful of Vision GTs were introduced to this game. Most of all of them were already in GT Sport.

Once again, you present a flawed argument. You think they didn't make 1/4 of GT Sport, but magically adding a few more suddenly does that for GT7.

??? You misunderstood me here. I wasn't talking about GT Sport, I was talking about the scenario of you eventually bringing up the old main title GTs, which also had fictional cars but not anywhere near to the % that GT7/Sport have.

GT Sport is basically GT7 prologue and not a main title... so... meh. When I talk about past GTs, I never take into account Sport (in the same way I don't take into account GT Concept or Tokyo Geneva or GT4 and GT5 Prologues etc).

Yup, your stance is clear, inconsistent, and uses poor logic. Got it! 👍

My stance if anything, is actually consistent... You are essentially arguing semantics with me of why I consider those cars duplicates. In the true sense of the word, they aren't, but they are in the way that they just picked up the base model and updated it with some parts and considered it a stand-alone car, when instead we could've just had the base road model that they scanned and actually upgrade it as we see fit in GT Auto. If they came up with all those parts for those specifc cars, they could've just as well implement them in GT Auto, really not that hard as the features are in the game already.
Instead, they picked up a base model (take the Mustang and Mitsubishi Final) and multiplied it by 2 or even 3 with some parts to categorize it as different cars lol. Not TRUE duplicates, but the essence is basically the same, to not have the hassle of actually using real life models, or... just for the Gran Turismo events where only a tiny minority participate in.
 
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