GT 6 (False advertising)

[Johnnypenso]

Well the more I watch that video the more the audio doesn't make sense, so I guess in a way you're right. How many different engine tones was that?

Should a viewer have to decipher engine sounds and whether they are correctly implemented within the framework of a videogame and then determine they must be placeholders because they aren't quite right? I would think your average viewer would watch a trailer and assume the cars, tracks, features and sounds would all be part of the game that trailer is from.

 

[HBR-Roadhog]

Citation required.

I don't have the time nor the desire to go digging through the old news posts to locate one of the instances where this was mentioned but it was mentioned on more than one occasion. both leading up to release and after release. I think [but not sure] that it was last mentioned in the round table interview Jordan streamed back near the end of Jan.

Edit: Ok I decided to do a quick search anyway and here is one of the matches.
https://www.gtplanet.net/gran-turismo-6-to-receive-large-day-one-patch/

Kazunori Yamauchi has confirmed to EuroGamer that Gran Turismo 6 is set to receive a “fairly large” patch when it releases on December 6th, with further supporting updates scheduled to last 12 months.

Bolded by me. And that is right from the horses mouth so to speak

This is just one occasion where it was mentioned but there are several more

 

[FormulaKimball]

Should a viewer have to decipher engine sounds and whether they are correctly implemented within the framework of a videogame and then determine they must be placeholders because they aren't quite right? I would think your average viewer would watch a trailer and assume the cars, tracks, features and sounds would all be part of the game that trailer is from.

Amen on that, my point exactly 👍

We've already seen how annoyed some people can get even with those "sound fix" videos where the replacement audio is clearly noted to have come from real onboard and not GT5. Let alone an official video promo which, to be fair, was released a long time before the game came out, but didn't indicate the audio wasn't native to GT6. Calling it a "concept" doesn't excuse editing in elements that aren't in the game - it only excuses showing something incomplete (like maybe if you show a lap of a track that has half of its textures missing).

 

[LVracerGT]

Neatly proving my original counterpoint that GT6 is little different from billion dollar multiplatform franchise like GTAV. Same page FTW.

GT is a Sony backed studio (not 3rd party as Rockstar is) with a gigantic budget and developed specifically for one platform, not multiple. So how does your argument fit again?

 

[Famine]

Rockstar's staffing and budget is an order of magnitude higher - they are also their own publisher (as an wholly owned subsidiary of Take Two) and reap every drop of profit - while PD's budget is set by Sony Computer Entertainment and unrelated to sales, all profits from which go to SCE.

Nevertheless, the original point I was disagreeing with was that GTAV is better for its 12 updates in 7 months than GT6 is for its 6 updates in 4 months* - and that requiring 12 updates is somehow a good thing. GTA required an update after 2 weeks just to activate the online mode (GT6 didn't - it was included from the start) and even then it was broken for several further weeks - deleting player stats, causing much frustration - until further updates came along to fix the update.

You seem to agree with me that both games have had updates to fix issues that shouldn't have been there from the start and updates to fix updates that introduced further issues, so we're clearly on the same page. I guess that's modern games for you.

*Amusingly I often hear "Ugh, another update" from my GT6-playing friends and casual GT6-playing acquaintances. Some of them are more into GTAV and yet I've not heard them complain about double the number of updates. So I guess more updates is a good thing if it's to something you want to play.

 

[Samus]

It is up to person viewing to decide if they want to mislead themselves like I mentioned in my last post, if taken at face value they won't be mislead.

Rubbish. On face value that trailer features GT6 visuals and GT6 sounds. Having 'concept' in the title doesn't change that.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

@Famine I wonder if you hear about as many dilemmas for GTA series as you do for GT like PD might go bust and about two weeks since last update is a sign of game being abandoned . Amazing to think that this might be the most open PD have ever been to its fans regarding communication but it seems to have backfired on them. Maybe best to say not a lot and promise very little like other developers.

Rubbish. On face value that trailer features GT6 visuals and GT6 sounds. Having 'concept' in the title doesn't change that.

So if for example you look at concept cars, you expect production model to be at face value the same one as the concept car or very representative of it?

 

[Tornado]

I certainly wouldn't expect them to dub V8 engine sounds on the real life electric concept car, no.

 

[Samus]

@Famine I wonder if you hear about as many dilemmas for GTA series as you do for GT like PD might go bust and about two weeks since last update is a sign of game being abandoned . Amazing to think that this might be the most open PD have ever been to its fans regarding communication but it seems to have backfired on them. Maybe best to say not a lot and promise very little like other developers.

So if for example you look at concept cars, you expect production model to be at face value the same one as the concept car or very representative of it?

I don't see how that is the same thing at all but anyway we're clearly not going to agree on this so I'll leave it there.

 

[wowbaggerBR]

But it was PROMISED!

PROMISED!!

PROMISEDDD!!!

THEY CAN'T CHANGE THEIR PLANS ONCE THEY PROMISEEE!!!

/faints

Yes, they can. But then they should say something about it.

 

[Imari]

So if for example you look at concept cars, you expect production model to be at face value the same one as the concept car or very representative of it?

What's the point of a concept car if not to be at least in some way similar to the final production model?

 

[LVracerGT]

Nevertheless, the original point I was disagreeing with was that GTAV is better for its 12 updates in 7 months than GT6 is for its 6 updates in 4 months* - and that requiring 12 updates is somehow a good thing. GTA required an update after 2 weeks just to activate the online mode (GT6 didn't - it was included from the start) and even then it was broken for several further weeks - deleting player stats, causing much frustration - until further updates came along to fix the update.

You seem to agree with me that both games have had updates to fix issues that shouldn't have been there from the start and updates to fix updates that introduced further issues, so we're clearly on the same page. I guess that's modern games for you.

*Amusingly I often hear "Ugh, another update" from my GT6-playing friends and casual GT6-playing acquaintances. Some of them are more into GTAV and yet I've not heard them complain about double the number of updates. So I guess more updates is a good thing if it's to something you want to play.

I never said anything about GTA being better because it's had more updates. You're bringing up different points to pivot and claiming I'm agreeing with you.

The point I made was that GTA publicly announced their awareness of the issues and intent to fix it ASAP, as well as providing in game content and credits as an apology. They also followed through on their promises. Neither of which PD has done.

 

[Famine]

I never said anything about GTA being better because it's had more updates.

Correct.

You're bringing up different points to pivot and claiming I'm agreeing with you.

No.

The post I made that you originally responded to was just as I said above - responding to another member saying that GTAV was better for its 12 updates in 7 months than GT6 was for its 6 updates in 4 months. You chose to respond to my comment and your responses are agreeing with my counterpoint to that comment that GTAV is no different - launching without an online mode that would be added through a "future update" that itself turned out to be broken.

The point I made was that GTA publicly announced their awareness of the issues and intent to fix it ASAP, as well as providing in game content and credits as an apology. They also followed through on their promises. Neither of which PD has done.

Great. Rockstar are a third party publisher and do their own PR. PD are an in-house first party development studio and do not.

It's a great drum to keep beating, but not relevant to the post you responded to.

 

[LVracerGT]

Correct.No.

The post I made that you originally responded to was just as I said above - responding to another member saying that GTAV was better for its 12 updates in 7 months than GT6 was for its 6 updates in 4 months. You chose to respond to my comment and your responses are agreeing with my counterpoint to that comment that GTAV is no different - launching without an online mode that would be added through a "future update" that itself turned out to be broken.Great. Rockstar are a third party publisher and do their own PR. PD are an in-house first party development studio and do not.

It's a great drum to keep beating, but not relevant to the post you responded to.

I never agreed with you, you keep claiming I am. I think I would know what I am doing more than you. In fact, I've been saying that GTAV is very different in the way it launched from GT6.

Just because Rockstar does it's own PR doesn't give PD an excuse. PD has it's own website where they could easily provide a statement.

And before you try to tell me the website is run by Sony, you really think PD has no say whatsoever in what's on their website?

 

[Famine]

I never agreed with you, you keep claiming I am. I think I would know what I am doing more than you.

Okay. You might want to rephrase then because what you said agreed with my initial counterpoint.

In fact, I've been saying that GTAV is very different in the way it launched from GT6.

Oh, no doubt. GT6 launched with an online mode that - slightly fussy way to unlock notwithstanding - you could actually use immediately.

Which is what I hinted at in that initial post you responded to. Though, on the topic of the thread, I don't really recall any massive week 2 tantrums about "broken promises" and "false advertising" when it turned out that the $1bn selling game's delayed online mode didn't work. Might have happened though - I wasn't really paying attention since I decided not to buy the game about 2 months before it was released.

Just because Rockstar does it's own PR doesn't give PD an excuse. PD has it's own website where they could easily provide a statement.

And before you try to tell me the website is run by Sony, you really think PD has no say whatsoever in what's on their website?

PD does indeed have their own website at http://www.polyphony.co.jp/

It's not the Gran Turismo website though. That's run by Sony Computer Entertainment, the publishers of that IP. Polyphony's own website barely mentions Gran Turismo (the English version contains a GT franchise sales table and a collaborations page) because PD are literally only contracted to develop it. They simply haven't, to date, got a PR budget from SCE - and if they wasted their dev budget doing PR, I know who'd complain about them wasting time schmoozing the press instead of developing the game.

Rockstar own and publish their own IPs, so their website is intrinsically the same thing as the Grand Theft Auto website (which doesn't exist independently - grandtheftauto.com redirects to rockstargames.com).

It's quite a different situation when you're talking about an wholly owned subsidiary first party developer which has their entire development budget set independently of game sales compared to a third party developer/publisher with profit-driven budgets.

SCE do the publishing and get its regional offices to do the PR, PD do the development. Rockstar do all of it. In house vs. third party.

I'm not wholly sure how many different ways there are to say that in this thread, but what you assign to and demand from PD simply is not in their remit, but in SCE's. Of course, SCE (and PD) read our forums and I've seen suggestions, oft-posited, that PD should get a community manager precisely for this purpose. So maybe you'll get your wish 👍

 

[Tornado]

Supporting that, there's also very rarely any direct correlation between "what PD are currently doing" and "what gets put on the GT website." The GT website is almost never a first source for information, even when Sony themselves are who is releasing it.

 

[ironman44321]

*Snip*

aaaannnnddddd boom goes the dynamite.

 

[mistersafeway]

From what I've seen, PD genuinely do their best, but are understaffed and dealing with fan expectations and Sony's promises. Kaz runs his mouth occasionally, but because he's so excited about the work they're doing. That's obviously not the whole thing, and I understand the frustration some here are displaying (Hell, I feel it too sometimes), but PD are pretty much just a group of people doing what they love. They'll listen to us to a degree, but it's their work, and it'll go the way they want it to as long as they can.

Sorry for how messy this is, my mind's all over the place and I'm trying to watch F1 as I'm typing, but I think it makes enough sense.

 

[Soulfresh_ACV]

From what I've seen, PD genuinely do their best, but are understaffed and dealing with fan expectations and Sony's promises. Kaz runs his mouth occasionally, but because he's so excited about the work they're doing. That's obviously not the whole thing, and I understand the frustration some here are displaying (Hell, I feel it too sometimes), but PD are pretty much just a group of people doing what they love. They'll listen to us to a degree, but it's their work, and it'll go the way they want it to as long as they can.

Sorry for how messy this is, my mind's all over the place and I'm trying to watch F1 as I'm typing, but I think it makes enough sense.

All very good. Last time I checked, they have over 100+ staff in their office. I have no experience in Game Studio setups but say 30 of them are admin related staff, they still have over 70 staff to focus on the game itself? Are they still under staff comparing with their competitors (not specific only to racing game studios)?

I guess at the end of the day the general consensus is that GT as a series have serious issues on:

• priorities in terms of the game development goes
• public communication (regardless if Sony or PD is at fault. Who cares which party is responsible afterall we're discussing about the game/series)

Enjoy F1

 

[mistersafeway]

Yes, they are a small team. For example, From Software aren't considered a large developer and they have ~100 more employees than PD. Despite their high profile and past successes, PD are minnows. I can't find any concrete info on the size of PD's main rivals, Turn 10, but I think I saw twice the internal employees mentioned on this site, and they outsource. PD need to expand or outsource to survive. And their priorities are largely a problem because of team size, they try to do things that would tax much larger companies, which in my opinion makes their successes all the more impressive.

 

[azza200]

i have given up on gt6

 

[TexRex]

*Amusingly I often hear "Ugh, another update" from my GT6-playing friends and casual GT6-playing acquaintances. Some of them are more into GTAV and yet I've not heard them complain about double the number of updates. So I guess more updates is a good thing if it's to something you want to play.

It could also have to do with what the update means for the playability of the game: "Yay! I have more guns to tote around!" or "Oh great, all of my tunes are useless now."
Of course that didn't have much to do with the topic, and perhaps that's why I had to zoom in just to read it, but it was the only thing in here I really felt up to replying to and I actually wanted to reply to it.

 

[GTPVenomZombie]

If you really do think GT6 is false advertisement, why don't you actually do something about it other than cry and complain on here like a 2 year old girl pestering for a damn Barbie doll!

 

[Rafael F]

If you really do think GT6 is false advertisement, why don't you actually do something about it other than cry and complain on here like a 2 year old girl pestering for a damn Barbie doll!

Sorry, but has someone forced you to visit this thread?

 

[GTPVenomZombie]

Sorry, but has someone forced you to visit this thread?

No?

 

[Soulfresh_ACV]

Sorry, but has someone forced you to visit this thread?

 

[Tornado]

If you really do think GT6 is false advertisement, why don't you actually do something about it

Like go in a thread just to complain that people are discussing it!

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

No?

Really because what's odd is you coming into this thread and becoming the classic GT dogmatic fan that can't seem to live a day with a critique such as this unfolding upon the internet-sphere. Oh the humanity how could these people say such things!!! Then you moan about it by complaining yourself, when you could have simply glossed over it and moved on with life instead of now becoming a victim of your own asinine rhetoric.

Many of us don't like certain things on this forum, but we seem to handle our day quite well going around it as if it doesn't exist. Perhaps you should try that on, instead of talking in crazy mumbles about barbies and what not.

 

[Soulfresh_ACV]

Hey, I completely appreciate such teasers on upcoming Senna content @Famine as I said earlier in the thread.

http://www.gran-turismo.com/gb/news/00_4571804.html

It gives fans something to look forward to. I'm surely marking my calendar in anticipation of the DLC as it sounds like there's some sort of "Senna Challenge" game modes!

Yeah yeah yeah, you'll still get those who'll say "release the damn content"

 

[mistersafeway]

http://www.gran-turismo.com/gb/news/00_4571804.html

Content Introduction

The “Ayrton Senna Tribute” is a 4-part special content that retraces the life of Senna through various photographs and videos. Players will have the chance to relive Senna’s career first-hands by driving the same cars and challenging the same events that shaped his legend, such as the #17 DAP Racing Kart he drove to fight in the World Karting Championships and the "Black Beauty" (Senna's Lotus 97T F1 car) on tracks like the Brands Hatch GP circuit and the Italian circuit of Monza, which have been given a complete makeover in order to restore their original layouts from the '80s.