GT6 Tyre Bug on MR/FR Cars

[Stotty]

I conducted my own research and did what OP suggested caused issues.

I found no such isses and the impact was insignificant.

People don't know how to drive MR cars. And sorry, but when someone comes in complaining about the Audi's handling and calls these cars "MH"... it's clear who the imbecile is.

Dismissed.

Sometimes I feel like this I'm doing this...

KPR states in his 1st post that English isn't his natural language. This isn't unusual for a forum with a Global membership and should be taken in to account when reading posts of this nature. Sometimes you might need to read a post a few times to understand what the poster means.

Perhaps it would help if I translate the original post for you as you clearly still don't understand what KPR meant...

Firstly, it didn't seem to me like you needed to be a brain surgeon to deduce that when KPR said 'MH' and 'FH' he was referring to mid and front engined cars respectively.

Nor did it seem difficult to understand that he then says the following...

The Audi handles poorly on the 1st stint, but it's handling massively improves after changing tyres (to the same type) in a pit stop. Lap times improve by 2s as a result.

For the Front engined cars, the opposite is true and the car becomes slower after a pit stop.

Does this not seem unusual to you in any way?

At no time does he 'complain about the cars handling'... he simply states the Audi is 'incredibly difficult' to drive.

Always best to read the post a few times to make sure you've understood the point before making random and unrelated comments... as you say, it's clear who the imbecile is

 

[MatskiMonk]

Today I learned that being called an imbecile by someone else is okay, but when you dish the same reply back... it's a bad attitude.

How ironic.

No, it seems that today you learned nothing, and you responded by trying to call some-one out on using their own native tongue. The response of someone with a good attitude would have been to actually read the thread and explain why you disagree (preferably with some numbers from your own testing), or at least acknowledge that their might be a legitimate issue.. but instead you've chosen to make arrogant, sarcastic and self important posts... I see that as having a bad attitude.

Good luck driving your "MH" cars... perhaps you should spend a little more time licensing and learning how to properly handle them. Realistic simulation isn't for you.

Thanks, but so far I'm not experiencing too many problems with mittelmotor heckentrieb cars. Good job on being patronizing though...

 

[KPR_starbuck]

Thanks guys! I just wrote it, and realized later thats in englisch its called MR and FR.

 

[Fong74]

Today I learned that being called an imbecile by someone else is okay, but when you dish the same reply back... it's a bad attitude.

How ironic.

Good luck driving your "MH" cars... perhaps you should spend a little more time licensing and learning how to properly handle them. Realistic simulation isn't for you.

Obviously you are lacking such a big part of many things by not realizing any difference between the tyre sets, that discussing that topic with you seems pointless. Like others said, NFS e.g. might suite you more...

Do you speak other languages btw? If german is also part of your tremendous skill-portfolio, feel invited to come to our german forum and enlight us all by "expressing" yourself there. I bet we will get a good laugh then, too

@Star_Buck
Go and edit your initial posts so narrow-minded ppl like the above cant get off on you having used the german abbreviation for FR cars

BTT:
The issue still exists with v1.02. Tested it yesterday with the R8 at Brands. I was not quite sure with the Rocket first, but have to admit that the sound of the x2014 made me grin over many laps, which then kinda ruined my sense for a smaller, no-aero car in the minutes after I drove the RedBull I also think that steering and/or physics have changed somehow with v1.02 too. I had to turn the wheel more to achieve the same reaction from the car than before the update. All to be checked in more detail the days to come, but it all points to the right direction. GT6 is fun to drive as it challenges you more than GT5. Gr8 Job from PD so far I think. Now the bugs need to be removed gradually, but after that.....Jesus, that game will give us many many gr8 moments on those virtual tracks over the next months

 

[Zuel]

There is no bug or glitch with the tires, the tires and shock algorithm are correct. There has been outside proof plus and number of different sources as well, not including the one of two true engineering shops that are on GTP that have clearly proved that the algorithm is correct. If you ran every MR car within GT6 you'll get the same results.

 

[GregOr1971]

Good post OP. For a starter I love GT6 physics , but there are some glitches like "stopies" in Fiats,Alfa's ˛& Lancers (we all can see) so saying nothings is wrong and keep a head in the sand is plain wrong. I've noticed tire size bug and yes, I've noticed that tire grip bug ,when you change tires online in some cars. After I saw yesterday that 1.02 is live , I thought they fixed any of those glitches , but i guess they're not . At least they fixed Daihatsu Supercar

+ have they removed that "loger" option which shows you what's going on with tire physics ? I cannot find it anymore as in GT5. Fishy.

 

[Stotty]

There is no bug or glitch with the tires, the tires and shock algorithm are correct. There has been outside proof plus and number of different sources as well, not including the one of two true engineering shops that are on GTP that have clearly proved that the algorithm is correct. If you ran every MR car within GT6 you'll get the same results.

The OP reports the same car handling differently on the same grade of tyre before and after a pit stop.

What algorithm are you talking about? And what on earth does it have to do with the discussion?

My post wasn't exactly directed towards the OP.. Imbecile. As you said, please read, digest and engage your brain before reading.

Your posts simply says... "Differential is all i have to say. The cars are just fine."

1. What relevance does that have to the subject being discussed in the thread?
2. If it's not directed at the OP why did you bother posting it?

 

[Fong74]

There is no bug or glitch with the tires, the tires and shock algorithm are correct. There has been outside proof plus and number of different sources as well, not including the one of two true engineering shops that are on GTP that have clearly proved that the algorithm is correct. If you ran every MR car within GT6 you'll get the same results.

We did not run all MR cars for sure. But the named switch in handling after changing tyres in the pits (Im talking online lobby only) is there for all other cars, too. Especially FRs which we drove to a much larger extent. For FRs it means that they are really slower on tyre set #2. The correlation to MR cars is the fact that the, lets call it reduced grip-level with set #2, improves their handling. As stated before, the assumption is, that (some, all, I cant say....but with the R8 its significantly noticeable) MRs have a too high grip level at their front axis. The back can not cope with that resulting in a light back-end with which you tend to spin out even at lower speeds. The fact that curbs are a nogo too, supports that theory. Maybe some weight ratio between the two axis is the issue. Just thinking out loud...

Maybe I am getting this wrong, but honestly, I really doubt anyone is able to have a look into any algorithm inside the GT6 source code except PD core members to really assess the issue. So its always a matter of trying, feeling and then expressing yourself. Last point is always difficult in written text and even more if it isnt your native language.

Thanks for the info though. Makes me wonder what is going on even more tbh

 

[Scaff]

The next member in this thread to attack another member rather than addressing the point they are making will be given a temp ban that will see them through to the new year.

Quite frankly the level of intolerance and assumption going on in here is simply not acceptable, and falls well below the minimum standard we accept from members. I strongly suggest that a goo number of you re-read the Terms of Service (bottom of every page) before you next post.

No further warning will be given.

 

[Zuel]

I took the MR cars I have for a run I noticed it was weight transfer along with the suspension. I set up the suspension to handle the weight transfer from rear to front besides adding ballast which helped a great deal with the rear coming out under heavy braking and weight transfer under race speed. Hopefully further updates will fix the weight transfer to combat this trouble.

 

[KrisVlad]

Sometimes I feel like this I'm doing this...

Always best to read the post a few times to make sure you've understood the point before making random and unrelated comments... as you say, it's clear who the imbecile is

This is so ironic. I can't stop laughing.

The Audi handles poorly on the 1st stint, but it's handling massively improves after changing tyres (to the same type) in a pit stop. Lap times improve by 2s as a result. For the Front engined cars, the opposite is true and the car becomes slower after a pit stop. Does this not seem unusual to you in any way?

No. It doesn't. The small variation in lap times is just that... a small variation. Have you ever had the EXACT SAME LAP TIME when racing? No. You haven't.

Maybe he cut a corner a little too sharply on a turn? Maybe he hit the brakes a little harder or a little longer on another turn? Maybe he took a turn way too wide? Could that fluctuation in time be due to... idk... all of the above? Oh jee... yes. Yes, it could.

I see critical thinking isn't your strongest suit. You are an imbecile as well, just like OP. I left a simple comment and you took a turn on asshole street and decided it would be wise to show your ass. It wasn't.

Your mind is like a vortex of stupid theories. Sometimes two collide, and you say something. Stop doing that. I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't shove my head that far up my ass.

No go lay by your dish.

Bye!

It's not a tire bug. You morons just don't know how to drive.

 

[Scaff]

And we have our first winner.

@KrisVlad - See you in two weeks

 

[HBR-Roadhog]

It seems like the 1.02 update changed the weight balance a little. I noticed a few cars handle differently and then I went in the settings to look at my Lotus which I had added a little weight to to get a 50:50 ratio after the update was showing 51:49 I had to remove 25kg to get it back at 50:50 so maybe there was a issue where to much weight was on the rear wheels of these mid engine cars causing them to be a little harder to drive than they should.

Haven't did enough driving with tire wear yet to form an opinion. I have saw different wear rates but in most cases the temp and weather were changing so apples to oranges there.

 

[dr_slump]

T
No. It doesn't. The small variation in lap times is just that... a small variation. Have you ever had the EXACT SAME LAP TIME when racing? No. You haven't.

Maybe he cut a corner a little too sharply on a turn? Maybe he hit the brakes a little harder or a little longer on another turn? Maybe he took a turn way too wide? Could that fluctuation in time be due to... idk... all of the above? Oh jee... yes. Yes, it could.

You seriously call 2 seconds "a small variation"? Are you kidding me?

Good drivers hardly ever have such massive differences in their times.

It's not a tire bug. You morons just don't know how to drive.

 

[Streeto]

Ah, the drama... no wonder so many people are losing interest in this forum.

 

[dr_slump]

Funny how people overlook that this thread is absolutely not about the MR cars behaviours.

It's actually about the tyres...

 

[Lawndart]

It seems like the 1.02 update changed the weight balance a little. I noticed a few cars handle differently and then I went in the settings to look at my Lotus which I had added a little weight to to get a 50:50 ratio after the update was showing 51:49 I had to remove 25kg to get it back at 50:50 so maybe there was a issue where to much weight was on the rear wheels of these mid engine cars causing them to be a little harder to drive than they should.

Haven't did enough driving with tire wear yet to form an opinion. I have saw different wear rates but in most cases the temp and weather were changing so apples to oranges there.

I've noticed this too with the update. This should be retested and the topic updated.

Mid engine cars put more lateral force on the car, distributed more evenly to front and rear tires. This is a being it to grip, but ah inference when you exceed to traction circle.

It appears they increased the margin between edge of grip and exceeding it... But I only noticed this on the Aventador as I'm determined to make this pig perform.

 

[dylansan]

Funny how people overlook that this thread is absolutely not about the MR cars behaviours.

It's actually about the tyres...

I find this issue with the tires really interesting and it's a shame people are using it to argue with each other, rather than doing actual tests to get to the bottom of it.

Everyone else who intends to argue on this point should do the test described in the first post and several other times in this thread, to see for themselves if there is actually a difference.

I haven't been able to play yet so I'm relying on you guys to figure this out.

 

[hasslemoff]

@KPR_starbuck

Did you only try the racing tyres ?

The sports and comfort tyres it didnt seem to affect, but the racing tyres I have heard other people reporting the same issue with lap times dropping.

This was in version 1.01

There seems to be a glitch regarding tyre wear and grip in GT6. I'm running online at the moment in a friends room in a Megane Base Model Race Car on RH, best lap of 1:22.5, if I pit the tyres have less grip and wear faster. My lap times are about 2 seconds per lap slower after a normal pitstop. If I exit to pit, then grip and lap times go back to normal.

I had noticed this before in S class race at Silverstone but decided to look into it more today.

I have not tested it myself in Version 1.02 but going to tonight to see if the problem is still there. As you say it will have a big effect on championships and long races which require pit stops.

 

[hasslemoff]

Ive done some more testing and I used the GT-R GT500 Base Model with full aero but everything else stock.


Ran 12 lap races online (only me) pitted on lap 6, tried RH and RM on Normal tyre wear and RM tyres on Very Fast tyre wear.

Tracks: Brands Hatch GP

Normal tyre wear

RH Tyres

Before Pit: 1'24.004
After pit: 1'25.238

Running consistant Low 24's before the pit and high to medium 25's after the pit.

RM Tyres

Before pit: 1'22.834
After pit: 1'23.932

Again running consistant high 22's low 23's before the pit and high 23's and low 24's after.

Very Fast Tyre wear

RM Tyres

Running consistant low 23's before the pit and high 24's after

The test with very fast tyre wear showed that even the tyre wear is different, I had more tyre wear after the pit stop.

So yes there seems to be a glitch with times and tyre wear with racing tyres after you pit.

The best way to determin this is if people have time to run a race online with a racing compound tyre, by yourself or with others and see if you see or feel any difference.
Would be helpfull if you do any testing to state if you are using a wheel or DS3 please.

My testing was done with DFGT

 

[KPR_starbuck]

@KPR_starbuck

Did you only try the racing tyres ?

The sports and comfort tyres it didnt seem to affect, but the racing tyres I have heard other people reporting the same issue with lap times dropping.

This was in version 1.01



I have not tested it myself in Version 1.02 but going to tonight to see if the problem is still there. As you say it will have a big effect on championships and long races which require pit stops.

Yes, i tried it on Race Cars only with Racing tyres.

But it´s still the same problem with Sport´s tyres. After the update on V1.02 it´s the same effect.


EDIT:

that´s the problem. We were a German Community with a lot of users which were playing GT. In GT5 we had a gt500 Championship, with round about 60 drivers in our best saison. Now in GT6 you can´t plan any championship with different drivetrain concept´s like GT3, GT300, GT500 or ALMS with LMP cars.

That´s it´s why we still post here on GTPlanet our Problem, to discuss with the members about the problem, in the hope that we can achieve PD together, to tell them about the Problem.

 

[MaDHaX]

@KPR_starbuck - Just out of curiosity did you make a note of the track temperature?

I've got a feeling it could affect the grip level's but not sure, maybe someone can confirm.

 

[hasslemoff]

@KPR_starbuck - Just out of curiosity did you make a note of the track temperature?

I've got a feeling it could affect the grip level's but not sure, maybe someone can confirm.

I ran the test at the same Track temperature and time, with the time progression at 1.

 

[MaDHaX]

I should have some time tomorrow to test this out, I'll let you guys know what I find out.

 

[KPR_starbuck]

@KPR_starbuck - Just out of curiosity did you make a note of the track temperature?

I've got a feeling it could affect the grip level's but not sure, maybe someone can confirm.

The Time, weather and temperature could affect the grip level, of couse. But at the test, the was the same.

yesterday we tested the Rocket car, time progression at 10. At 8 PM the grip level was so low, that i can´t catch my time that i drove at 1 pm. But we are talking round about of 0,3 seconds.

 

[Akwaaba]

I find that I am using CS for the front, and SH on the rear to provide a better balance in grip. Something I never felt was worth doing in GT5.

 

[MaDHaX]

Hey KPR_starbuck I can also confirm that your testing is right, after a long race with friends in the GT3 cars we all experienced the FR cars was slower after pitsop. Very strange indeed. The R8 however was much better on second set of tyres.

*EDIT*

I would also like to add that the reason why some people are not feeling these weird changes after pits could be due to the fact they are using a control pad. Last night the guys on wheel noticed but a couple on pad didn't. Not sure what to make of that yet but for sure there seems to be a bug here.

 

[Fong74]

Hey KPR_starbuck I can also confirm that your testing is right, after a long race with friends in the GT3 cars we all experienced the FR cars was slower after pitsop. Very strange indeed. The R8 however was much better on second set of tyres.

*EDIT*

I would also like to add that the reason why some people are not feeling these weird changes after pits could be due to the fact they are using a control pad. Last night the guys on wheel noticed but a couple on pad didn't. Not sure what to make of that yet but for sure there seems to be a bug here.

Now that could explain lots....

We are all driving with wheels, lots of drivers with Fanatec CSWs. Pads are not allowed for league races. Reason is, with a pad you have always some "electronic driving aids" active. I don't talk about the ones you can activate in the game. I am talking about those aids that make driving a car by a pad that only uses few milimeters of input range possible... In GT5 you could go off the track and easily steer the car back. You all know what happened when you tried the same with a wheel.

Yesterday I had a talk with some very experienced german drivers and asked them to perform the mentioned test-run (GT3 Audi R8, Default Setup, Nürburgring GP/F, tyre change after 1 lap). We watched them driving, discussing while they were going. The first thing they said with tyre set #2 was like: I don't have the resonse from the car like on tyre set #1; it's like "Active Steering" (don't know if its called like that in the english version of the game) would be enabled now

Something is different. Thats for sure. To me it seems nothing complex. Its like some internal value is set either to default or is really changed by any reason with one of the Tyre sets. Im not saying #1 is correct, #2 etc aren't. There are just two types of handlings which become apparent when you change the tyres in the pits.

How can we provide that feedback to PD? Thats nothing obvious taht you can test in some seconds. You need to drive a little (and with a wheel maybe). So its not easy to make it clear to someone not aware of it as we all realized in this thread, too.

 

[hensar]

Hi guys, I don't understand why no one is interested in this point.

For my opinion it is an complete physics change during pitstop.

It denies all the new features, like mandatory (correct) pistop/tyre change during races.
And I don't wonna think about races with full damage !!!!!!

 

[Fong74]

I fear that most of the ppl drive only distances that make a tyre change unnecessary.....and that is quite a lot more than in GT5. Depending on the compound you can go 30-60 minutes on the first set with GT6. Fuel is rather the limitative aspect now.

I still hope things will change with the community features showing up in January.