- 739
- United Kingdom
I will need to give them another go with the assists - I've not tried them at all this week, as I usually can't take 2 corners in a row without spinning 🤣
GT7 Daily Race Discussion
- Thread starter Pigems
- 39,519 comments
- 2,679,693 views
- 3,627
- United Kingdom
I really should try them as well as I haven't driven them in VR
- 809
- UK
- brockybrock
Yeah trial mountain or Bathurst gr3 would be cool, just something I like 🤣
Had a weird one earlier, lost DR and SR in a race where I finished 4th? SR granted I might have had some crunches here and there, but losing DR when finishing 4th?
Also finished 8th in race C earlier and both my letters were blue?
but weird I thought
- 3,627
- United Kingdom
It's just about the lobby scores, if you have the most DR in the lobby it's expected (mathematically that you'll win) there are other things like being beaten by someone (positions 1-3) who have sufficiently less DR than you and those finishing below you.
ELO derived systems all work the same'ish way in that the more levels/ranks/points you are above the opponents the more they stand to gain (and less to lose) and the other way round.
In equal lobbies you get the 50/50 split up and down, in miss matched lobbies position is irrelevant.
I've been in lobbies where the winner who was a top top ranked A+ person was racing with a few As and Bs lost DR for the win.
SR that's your dukes of hazzard driving though 🤣
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- 3,399
- Canada
Tc1, csa on and the other setting on weak. Yeah it's cheating but again, no way these cars are this twitchy in real life. If you run under 1.01.00 it's game on in mixed A and B lobbies, jolly good fun and the perfect track. Most guys are at least trying to race clean.
- 809
- UK
- brockybrock
@newmedia_dev haha lol dukes of hazard indeed, but with that chicane it’s probably an apt description (yeehaa) 🤣
But makes sense, I was slugging it out at BC at the time!
Actually got myself a win with some decent opponents and then back to BB where I’ve struggled this week but manage another win when the leader called out second place before the race 🤣 and that left me there to pick up the win whilst they were taking each other out
But makes sense, I was slugging it out at BC at the time!
Actually got myself a win with some decent opponents and then back to BB where I’ve struggled this week but manage another win when the leader called out second place before the race 🤣 and that left me there to pick up the win whilst they were taking each other out
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- 87,476
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
Unless they've changed how it's calculated from GT Sport, that shouldn't be possible.
Aside from requiring an average 40,001 DR-point difference, GT Sport wouldn't let you lose points for victory. You'd either not gain any or gain one point per opponent - I don't remember which.
- 3,627
- United Kingdom
It's definitely possible, I've had races and was watching one of Rory's streams where the winner did lose DR I think it was Naïf or Laporty
if it is close to ELO which going by the numbers calculating rank that if a player in GT context was that much further ahead in DR points than the rest of the field then it would yield a negative calculation.
It's like Kasparov cherry picking noobs to rank up to a chess grand master that way hence ELO which is basically just a weighting mechanic. That said I only understand it from a 1v1 lense not really sure how it works in a PVP context as there has to be a lot of nuance to it.
Edit: thinking about it, that's why the cap is being increased because the value of racing for DR diminishes quite steeply when the lobby spreads can be as wide as they sometimes are in match making currently. The wider spread will tighten the pools probably more reflective of relative pace as well.
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- 1,790
- United Kingdom
- bone_tone
That's normally OK in the races with 16 players, I think the general rule of thumb is try to finish in the top 8 for a DR up, bottom half will see DR down. That can change if players with higher DRs finish out of position (I think!).
Eg, I had a race C today where I finished 9th, and got a DR up - I suspect that means that people with a stronger DR than mine finished behind me, and the guy in 6th got a DR down - presumably he started with a highish DR, and finished behind people with lower DRs?
- 87,476
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
Yes, the number is the 40,001pt I quoted - so essentially top-A+ vs. a field averaging mid-A.
In GT Sport, it couldn't happen. Any DR exchange giving the lead car a negative value resulted in a 0 or +1 (don't remember which). It was a specific exception built in to prevent a winner losing DR.
- 809
- UK
- brockybrock
Yes I guess it’s relative to your normal kind of level, I’d say I was BA - I’ve won before at BS, when I’ve nailed a good time and racing at a combo I’m good with.
I’ve been at A a few times, never won a race at A, won quite a few whilst repairing my DR/SR etc lower than what I’d say was my level.
That’s why usually my only target is to finish in the top 5, for the stats 😁
Maybe I’m just rambling now 🤣
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- 3,627
- United Kingdom
Not disagreeing just saying I've seen it and experienced it. I edited my post with an additional thought.
I just know how it was done/implemented in a larger sports franchise historically and how it works in chess.
It is feasible and probably likely something that has been experienced in the millions of races.
Ultimately the algorithm is slightly flawed at the edges and that's probably what we are seeing considering the amount we all race.
It's all a black box so who knows what other factors they use, but looking at your numbers it's definitely been refined and going to be changed going forwards
- 1,130
- United Kingdom
My understanding is that you can't actually lose DR in a race if you win it, but you can appear to, because the calculation takes all changes to your DR over the time of the lobby into account.
So if you quit a 19:00 race C, and then join and win a 19:10 race B, the race C DR loss doesn't actually apply until that race ends - not when you quit. So if you lose more DR from quitting race C than you do for winning race B, the calculation for making your DR blue or red at the end of the race B just sees that you've lost DR since you entered the lobby, so makes the text blue and has the down arrow.
So if you quit a 19:00 race C, and then join and win a 19:10 race B, the race C DR loss doesn't actually apply until that race ends - not when you quit. So if you lose more DR from quitting race C than you do for winning race B, the calculation for making your DR blue or red at the end of the race B just sees that you've lost DR since you entered the lobby, so makes the text blue and has the down arrow.
- 3,627
- United Kingdom
- 3,627
- United Kingdom
Yes.
It's massively unlikely because of the matchmaking in the game.
But can happen, if you were a D driver in and All A+ lobby and finished above a high level A+ driver then yes, you could gain DR. It's why we see DR gains losses in some lobbies mean that 10th will gain you DR and 4th etc can lose DR.
It's all about relative strength of the lobby and what they use as the metrics but ultimately the underlying factor is strength starts from how much your beaten other people and how much value/points did/do they have relative to yours.
- 87,476
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
GT Sport wasn't, which is where the numbers came from.
The DR gain in Sport was 80-([Your Start DR-Their Start DR]/500). If the difference in starting DRs was 40,001, you'd notionally lose DR for beating someone. Well, you wouldn't, because decimal places (the outcome is -0.002), but you'd, in theory, show DR down.
But you couldn't. When this happened you'd trigger the exception and it'd be reset to either 0 or 1 (don't remember which).
As they've now obfuscated raw DR data, I have no idea how it works in GT7, but that's how it worked in Sport and I'd be very surprised if the calculation has changed.
What has definitely changed is the DR bar display bug, and I'd be unsurprised if this bled into up/down arrows. Plus there's the whole quit-lag thing noted above.
Absolutely, if the person you beat is very high-ranked, and the people who beat you don't take too many points (by again being a lot higher-ranked).
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- 3,627
- United Kingdom
If I still have the captures I will post some screenshots of it definitely happening. But I think Nankano had perfectly reasonable explanation for what we see vs what was going on.
I agree they probably haven't changed it but if they have only marginally then you would see these edge cases. I think they are raising the cap because honestly this algorithm is a problem, so to better group players in to more finite buckets at the top end. We won't see this change in the normal levels that much.
Also an incentive to get the top guys to race more because they are now bottom of said bucket. It might player numbers depending also help with these A+ to B lobbies where there really isn't a race at the front and everyone behind gets to fight for 3/4th 3 times in a row
Edit: I appreciate I'm conflating two things at this point, related but not a direct response
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- 285
- Ireland
Anyway, to change the subject 🤣🤣🤣🤣. I start a new job tonight, had enough of mechanics after 27 years. New job is 12am until 8am so I will be home in time for this week's new set of daily races. I enjoyed race B this week, some good results on alt accounts but I'm stubbornly stuck in a rut on my main one 🙈 hopefully some morning racing will help with that!!!!
- 3,627
- United Kingdom
The chalice is now yours to post the races each week as I won't have the time on a Monday morning to do it! 😝
Congrats on the new job, just take your time especially with a little one easing in to those hours. You need to make sure you and mum get some time together but also apart to get that space that isn't work or partners.
I've enjoyed this weeks B on all my accounts, didn't do C as it was definitely not looking fun (for me) in VR and I couldn't get to the pace I needed to be competitive so a downward spiral if I'd have done that one.
I'm office mostly this week again so not sure where my pace will be but will wait for your races update
- 285
- Ireland
No pressure so 🤣🤣The chalice is now yours to post the races each week as I won't have the time on a Monday morning to do it! 😝
Congrats on the new job, just take your time especially with a little one easing in to those hours. You need to make sure you and mum get some time together but also apart to get that space that isn't work or partners.
I've enjoyed this weeks B on all my accounts, didn't do C as it was definitely not looking fun (for me) in VR and I couldn't get to the pace I needed to be competitive so a downward spiral if I'd have done that one.
I'm office mostly this week again so not sure where my pace will be but will wait for your races update
Thanks for the advice 👍 luckily my wife is a teacher and she took the year off so we will have time to get into a routine before she goes back in September 👍
The world series races in the rain was brilliant in VR, thoroughly enjoyed it 👍
- 3,627
- United Kingdom
- 5,032
- Connecticut
- Ridley-X4
I sometimes wonder if I'd be more likely to check out Races B and C if they involved more interesting selections of cars. Not just in terms of cars within Gr.4/Gr.3/Gr.2/Gr.1, but even including road cars that could be comparable. Or at least one-makes with various road cars, instead of that sorta thing being reserved for Race A. However, I would not doubt the idea that Races B and C could be mostly featuring Gr.4/Gr.3 in order to collect metadata for PD that could be taken into consideration in future BoP changes.
- 3,627
- United Kingdom
They don't do it often but they did ranked tuned road cars.
They also at launch did single make ranked A races (possibly B as well) as I have liveried Clios and Sciroccos/polos in my garage.
I think realistically it has to be a one make or a class they have tried to balance but arguably they end up being one/two make races anyway. GR3 is a bit better but GR4 is pretty broken.
- 5,032
- Connecticut
- Ridley-X4
Alternatively, it could entail cars that are very similar, like the BRZ/86, or at least cars that are relatively unique in their own rights like the Honda 2&4 Concept or the BAC Mono.
- 118
- Lugano
I finally managed to get in the mid '27 (1:27.478) at RBR. Still not consistent enough to race, even if starting from front row. It was like a week of "circuit's experience", worth for the next time we'll visit Austria.
Next week I'd like to see Sardegna/Gr.3/ RM tyres (normal). Just a wish.
Next week I'd like to see Sardegna/Gr.3/ RM tyres (normal). Just a wish.
- 3,627
- United Kingdom
- 739
- United Kingdom
Well I tried the Karts - first attempt was as expected and I ended up in the pit entry before I'd even started the lap 🤣
Then I tried changing my wheel's sensitivity from 'auto' to 520, as someone else above has recommended. What a difference!!! Instantly far more controllable, unless for touching the grass, but I could catch little slides and the back end stepping out on braking.
I'm too late to try a race, just off a late shift and up at 05:00 again tomorrow. I'd definitely consider the Karts the next time they come up now 👍
Then I tried changing my wheel's sensitivity from 'auto' to 520, as someone else above has recommended. What a difference!!! Instantly far more controllable, unless for touching the grass, but I could catch little slides and the back end stepping out on braking.
I'm too late to try a race, just off a late shift and up at 05:00 again tomorrow. I'd definitely consider the Karts the next time they come up now 👍
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