GTP Beginners Competition - Round 1
- Thread starter Delphic Reason
- 153 comments
- 11,620 views
- 2,823
- GTP_Brent
sure, give us a quick sample - make sure you have the display on so we can see your throttle and brake inputs, and kind of guess at your steering.
- 531
Perhaps a list of what modifications your car has and its settings too? Ie, what tires you are using and your suspension settings..?
- 1,515
- BenSpecialized
Swift
Sheesh, some people are so nosey!
Well im doing ok actually thanks Swift. I just got to capture it all to the laptop and make a vid of it. I think there are a couple of sections i can do better but when i made the vid i can self criticise and make amends where needed!
Spec
👍
- 531
Ive had my video done for alittle while now. I just have to finish editing it on movie maker...
Off Topic:
I recently borrowed all the Initial D dvd's from a buddy, and have been nose deep in those for the last few days..
I do admit though, I have been more excited about drifting around on gt4 because of it.
Off Topic:
I recently borrowed all the Initial D dvd's from a buddy, and have been nose deep in those for the last few days..
I do admit though, I have been more excited about drifting around on gt4 because of it.
- 113
- Australia
i 've finised the replays about 3 days ago,i think they quite well..but for me the harder is to make that video!!yesterday i bought capture card but i didn't capture them yet becouse i can't connect ps2 to pc..damn cables..:madSwift
- 531
My entry is in.
- 2,823
- GTP_Brent
good stuff. Lets get a few more - the 7th is quickly approaching.
- 1,539
- Cooly
I'm extremely sorry. Im going have to pull out.
Due to Technical Difficulty's. I had planned to use my friends Video Camera. But he has had a family emergency, and has had to leave town. An issue entirely out of my control.
Many apoligies, i am rather frustrated myself.
If any judges have any quarrals, or wish to approach the issue further. Feel free to PM me.
Due to Technical Difficulty's. I had planned to use my friends Video Camera. But he has had a family emergency, and has had to leave town. An issue entirely out of my control.
Many apoligies, i am rather frustrated myself.
If any judges have any quarrals, or wish to approach the issue further. Feel free to PM me.
HELP 
I couldn't finish the Last 2 tracks
I tried so many time
but I've done recording the first 4
help .... Those turns are so hard
P.S. I just got lucky for the first 4 tracks
was like 1 out of 10 try to do a Drift (for what I think was a drift
)
anyway .. I Did lear alot ... at least where to start .. what speed .. what angle for drifting ...
Thanks guys
Hope I'll have some luck for the last 2 tracks .....
I couldn't finish the Last 2 tracks
I tried so many time
but I've done recording the first 4
help .... Those turns are so hard
P.S. I just got lucky for the first 4 tracks
was like 1 out of 10 try to do a Drift (for what I think was a drift
)anyway .. I Did lear alot ... at least where to start .. what speed .. what angle for drifting ...
Thanks guys
Hope I'll have some luck for the last 2 tracks .....
- 9,589
- GTP_DelphicR
- Esoterik1
GangsTaGT
Sure... Send away...
I use Vegas and Adobe Premier...
- 2,823
- GTP_Brent
I used virtual dub and vegas in the demo clips. I'm working on learning after effects, but havent really made anything with it yet.
- 1,515
- BenSpecialized
ok my entry is safely uploaded to BL's webspace, thanks bud! I made a small error before the last vid where my PWR screenshot appears again. I have no idea why this happened but it doesnt spoil it...........much
- 9,589
- GTP_DelphicR
- Esoterik1
Sure... We can do that...
- 113
- Australia
last but not least..video uploaded..
- 9,589
- GTP_DelphicR
- Esoterik1
Good job everyone... No more entries will be accepted...
Links have been sent to judges...
Swift, Bl... Check your PM's...
Links have been sent to judges...
Swift, Bl... Check your PM's...
- 2,823
- GTP_Brent
Ok, my midterm exams are done and I've started looking at the clips. I'm quite impressed so far to tell the honest truth. Naturally there's a few rough spots in each of the vids, but it is to be expected - you're here for help.
DR has to resend me a few links. If I get them today I hope to have everthing looked at by no later than noon tomorrow.
DR has to resend me a few links. If I get them today I hope to have everthing looked at by no later than noon tomorrow.
- 2,823
- GTP_Brent
BL's Scores and Comments
I just wanted to begin by explaining how I judge so people aren't hurt by the scores. I start people off with 8's and make small deductions as things progress. This means that for runs that totally meet my expectations, they'll get 8/10's across the board. I only dish out 9's and 10's for performances wildly beyond what I thought was possible. I use this scheme in the GTPDC and I think it works quite well - but it had to be slightly modified here since we're seeing more than 1 track. So, really, in this competition with 3 categories I'm only marking out of 24 - scores over 24 would represent unbelievable runs with wild spin-entry drifts, etc.
Just to refresh everyone, the scoring structure is as follows:
[/size]Line (10 points)
Angle (10 points)
Control (10 points)
Total: (30 points)
Oh, and forgive some of the laziness in my comments. I started off just typing my own shorthand into notepad initially. You might notice that the farther down you read, the longer and more precise my comments become.
Also, forgive me for occasionally focussing in on the negative in the vids, and maybe not mentioning the positive - it's just a natural result of the way I judge [allocating some starting value and then deducting from it for the mistakes I see]. Nothing is meant to be taken personally here, it's all constructive criticism.
Lets begin!
---------------------------------------------
Specialized
Line - 7
Angle - 5.5
Control - 6
Total - 18.5/30
Seattle: that feint entry was great! but the drift would've looked better if the exit were pulled wider. You burned through a few too many tires coming out of the drift [small -control]
DF: I think your entry here seemed lazy (compared to Seattle) but your speed was good and kept it exciting. The drift appeared to be a little bit jerky, possible because you were afraid of dropping the car in the grass on that wide line [small -angle]. I'm not convined that your line is the best way to tackle that corner, but you managed to make it work.
Tsukuba: you started out well with a solid feint and a tight line. And you were going well to stay on that line, but the car began to weave around on it quite a bit. If the angle were kept smoother, this would've been a much more impressive drift. [-control, -angle]
SSR5: Good work here - a clean link with decent angle. I think your line could've been wider at the exit, even if it meant decreasing the angle slightly [or gradually decreasing it instead of abruptly killing it] The car seemed to be headed that way and then suddenly halted when you turned up the countersteering. [small - line]
ARII: You just didn't push the car enough here. The S14 could almost go straight sideways through there and still link into the right hander. The line choice was good, but it should have been accompanied by more angle. [-angle]
AH: Sloppy entry on AH [small -control, small -line] - looks like you tried to start your drift early, and then backed out of it. Despit that, you maintained good angle through the links and used the entire track surface to your advantage.
In all, the angle was quite reasonable for the corners [except perhaps at ARII], line choice was clean, but sometimes entries came late, and exits cold have been wider. Biggest point to work on is smoothing out the angle of the drifts - many drifts look quite jerky, even on the track cam.
---------------------------------------------
Kaidogg
Line - 6
Angle - 6
Control - 7
Total - 19
Seattle: You show a good aggressive feint into and reasonable angle here. I think exit was a bit untidy and a little too tight/premature. If you could've run the car a little farther to the outside of the track this would've been perfect, but you just seemd to run out of steam.
DF: excellent line through middle part of corner at DF, but pulled the exit too tight again. The entry could've been more energetic [style issue, no deductions]. Suitable angle and good throttle control.
Perfect line at Tsukuba and great angle (consistent).... could've relaxed the exit a bit, there was lots of track to work with there.
Line at SSR5 was good, but it didnt attack the second corner as much as i thought you were setting up for [no deduction, just my impression].
ARII - you were doing so good until this clip.... It seems like you struggled at the entry to get the car to rotate, and when it did you countersteered to much (and it consequently ruined your line) Deductions in all three areas.
At AH you have to try and use the track more effectively. take as wide an entrance as you can into the first turn in the esses so you can carry more speed through the section. This will help you link the 2nd and 3rd turns. Deductions on line and angle.
Clearly it's the links that are hurting you. On the first 4 Turns you were great. You do use the throttle well to control your angle, and the results look very smooth in most cases. I think it's your steering work that is letting you down in the links. If you can get that to work for you you'll be in great shape.
oh, and quit chopping off the start and finish of your drifts on certain track cams - it's annoying.
---------------------------------------------
Drift King
Line - 5
Angle - 5.5
Control - 4
Total - 14.5
Untidy feint on Seattle, the drift seem to hang out a little wide when you should've been coming down on the second apex. [-line, and small control deduction]
Drift died a little short at DF, but things were going great until that happened. You were on a good line but were forced to leave it as you lost speed - I think it's a result of a little too much angle and countersteer. [small deductions to angle and control]
Tsukuba, almost perfect until that jerk at the exit [small control deduction]. Line was great - used up as much track as you could.
ARII - angle was high, but you let it affect your line through the right hander [small deductions on line and angle]
AH - the section was not linked from start to finish. By looking at the motion of the car it seems that you countersteered too much and killed the link into the second turn. [-control] You line was good, but could've been a touch tighter on the first apex [no deduction]. It would've let you drift the entire section, if not for that initial mistake.
SSR5 is missing.... deducting 1.5 points per category [roughly 10/6]
It looks to me like your steering is what leads to the majority of your errors [at least, the ones seen here]. It occasionally seems to come in short quick bursts, rather than smoothly. The jerky exits, and the missed link you display are almost definitely the result of this. Your angle was good in most of the clips, but you displayed more than once that the amount you're using is not always compatible with your line - going big means nothing if it's not sustainable through the entire corner(s). Once again, this problem may be reduced to weak steering above all else, or it may simply be a case of pushing a bit too hard.
---------------------------------------------
Dorykiing
Line - 5.5
Angle - 6.5
Control - 7
Total - 19
At ARII you started off well with manageable angle (though, perhaps a tad shallow), but your line at the exit through the right hander is awkward, The section would appear smoother and more natural if you took the car to the outside on the exit of the right, whether it is still drifting at that point or not. [-line, small -angle]
At SSR5 you take a clean, slightly neutral line through the corners, but did make adequate use of the trackspace available. For what you were setting up for [linking into the hairpin 👍] your angle was respectable, and your reasons for coming back across the track as you did are understood. Good section.
AH - I'm ignoring the slight choppiness of the entry because you pushed the initiation of the drift back far enough that it kinda butted heads with the turn 2 exit [obviously you'll strive to link the first 5+ turns together in the future]. This is a pretty clean looking section. Your angle is consistent through the 3 turns - and even if it isn't huge, consistency gets points in my books. After watching it a few times, it looks like it should've been possible to hold the drift through the first right a little longer to take a line through the second and third turns that took less of a bite out of the curbs/sand. But at least you were hitting apexes in this one. [small deductions on line and control]
Seattle - great entry, close to the wall, ....the exit was close to the wall too, but the wrong one [small line deduction] Cutting the angle and speed just slightly might have allowed for a wider exit in this case.
DF - on the track cam both the entry and exit look premature on this drift [small line deduction], other than that I can't fault this one. Good drift.
Tsukuba - I don't think you used the available track as well as you could have here. The entrance comes right from the inside of the track and as a result, pushes your drift wide through the first half of the turn. IMO, your line is completely backwards here (wide in first half, tightening in the second half and at the exit). [small line deduction] The angle was appropriate, and you did demonstrate good throttle control over your drift with an almost constant countersteering angle throughout the turn.
Your drifts are very smooth in appearance, your actions are not over aggressive, nor do they seem too slow to me. A good balance. Even if you aren't pulling out the largest angles among the guys entered here, you appear to be able to drift consistently [and as I mentioned, that earns points from me]. I think you have all the tools required to put together some noteworthy laps in the GTPDC events.
---------------------------------------------
Kalo
Line - 6.5
Angle - 6
Control - 5
Total - 17.5
I like you already, you cropped the black border off your clips and took out one of my fav cars 👍
Seattle - the entry didn't have as much flair as is possible to bring into the drift here, but you managed to pick a sensible line and angle. Good use of the ebrake - although it's looked down upon by many, being able to use it effectively in a pinch as you did is helpful in correcting car behaviour. [no deductions here]
DF: I like it. Again, your entry lacked any real punch, but it was enough to get the car sliding [style not an issue here, no deductions]. I do, however, think that the drifting began a little late in the turn [small line deduction]. The drift would have been more impressive if the car began rotating a little sooner.
Tsukuba: this drift lacked flow.... it seemed very discontinous. The angle was unstable, the entry felt awkward, and the line started out quite wide and progressively tightened (which is the opposite of how i think this corner should be approached). [deductions in all 3 categories]. I question the effectiveness of your braking drifts on this turn - a big feint is really your friend on this one.
SSR5: I noticed on this clip more than any others a lot of stuttered steering [-control]. Try to smooth that out - even if the stuttered stuff is keeping your angle more or less constant, smooth steering looks far more impressive in replays. The line here is neutral, doesn't push the envelope but it gets the job done.
ARII: the entry here may have been a little delayed... but otherwise, this is a very clean drift. Angle isn't huge, but seems appropriate to me. You kept the car reasonably close to the 3 apexes, and swept the car out in a wide drift at the exit. Good stuff. [No deductions]
AH: you line choice here is good. Close to the apexes but with room left to stretch out a good drift (little wide at the entrance though - no biggie) I am going to knock you on the countersteering again - you slow the car's rotation abruptly in the left hander as though you steered into the drift a little too much. You still maintained the drift at a shallower angle, but the link into the final turn would've looked much more impressive (and obvious) had you not cut the angle. [angle and control deduction]
You seem to avoid using the feint technique, or any large alteral weight transfer to start your drifts. Although, you do manage to get the car sliding in the clips shown here by a braking method, tweaked with a small flick, I'm sure you'll find yourself limited if you use this exclusively. You might have been able to avoid the use of the ebrake at Seattle if you had executed a more aggressive dynamic/feint entry there, and I've already mentioned that I think Tsukuba demands a feint if you want to be on a clean line. Experiment a little more with techniques involving more lateral weight transfer - not only are these techniques more exciting to watch, but they're often a more practical way of initiating drift.
---------------------------------------------
Fairlady240ZG
Line - 5.5
Angle - 5.5
Control - 5
Total - 16
AH: A fun sweeping choice of line here, but it didn't prove effective in linking the section together in this case. If you had started the drift sooner and come down on the first apex a little more, the extra speed you could've carried might have finished the link from the left tot he right for you [-line]. I'm also making a small deduction to control points for the wobble at the end of the drift that almost didnt make it into the vid.
DF: I would've liked to see more at the start of this clip... the multiple flicks you show before the feint seem very awkward and unnecessary [-control], but int he end you did find a good line. Your angle is a little shaky here.... but no big deductions. What's with the crossfade of one DF clip over another at the end of the the bumper cam clip?
ARII: your drift does not begin until you contact the first apex [-line, -angle]. Get your drift started sooner here. You did exit the section well.
Tsukuba: No too bad... your line is a little wide at the start - but you commit to it and stay on this wider line to the exit. The angle is reasonable for the corner, but it is a little bit choppy [this + DF = small angle deduction]
SSR5: I liked this drift. Big angle, a clean line, and the way you whipped the car into the second corner was pretty good. I think you might have done better to slowly turn down the angle near the outside wall after the left hander if you weren't going to link to the hairpin [no deductions]
Seattle: You did it again, that awkward wiggle at the corner entry - it just looked like you struggled to get the car to move the way you wanted it to. And why didn't you show us how the drift finished? you cut it too soon [-control]
The line was a touch wide the whole way through - if you could've come down on the second apex a little more and still managed to take the exit to the outside wall it would've been great. [small -line]
Whats with the video editting? You made early cuts at AH and Seattle, didnt show part of the entry on DF and then there was the weird crossfade on bumper cam, and at SSR5 there was a crossfade on the track cam. Don't edit clips in this way for competition type vids, it looks like you're trying to hide something.
---------------------------------------------
GangstaGT
Sorry - none of us seems to have a working link to your video. Could you try resending it?
---------------------------------------------
Ok, with exception to GangstaGT's review, that does it for me. I just wanted to say in closing that I'm glad so many of you decided to take advantage of this event. 7/15 entrants is a little less than 50%... but to be honest, it's still more than I expected to see.
I did want to adress the issue of video editting though. I'm not accusing anyone of cheating, or anything like that, there were usually enough camera views provided to rule that out. Nonetheless, I was frustrated by the fact that in more than one of these vids the clips either began or ended too soon. Please, in the future, do not begin your clips after you've started your drifts or chop it off before the weight transfer in the car has stabilized. Give us 2 or 3 seconds on either side of the drift so we can fully understand the situation and make more useful observations. This competition was held entirely for the entrants benefit, so to try and mask or hide anything from us is only going to cost you points and provide you with less accurate feedback.
Anyways...
Good job guys! 👍
I just wanted to begin by explaining how I judge so people aren't hurt by the scores. I start people off with 8's and make small deductions as things progress. This means that for runs that totally meet my expectations, they'll get 8/10's across the board. I only dish out 9's and 10's for performances wildly beyond what I thought was possible. I use this scheme in the GTPDC and I think it works quite well - but it had to be slightly modified here since we're seeing more than 1 track. So, really, in this competition with 3 categories I'm only marking out of 24 - scores over 24 would represent unbelievable runs with wild spin-entry drifts, etc.
Just to refresh everyone, the scoring structure is as follows:
[/size]Line (10 points)
Angle (10 points)
Control (10 points)
Total: (30 points)
Oh, and forgive some of the laziness in my comments. I started off just typing my own shorthand into notepad initially. You might notice that the farther down you read, the longer and more precise my comments become.
Also, forgive me for occasionally focussing in on the negative in the vids, and maybe not mentioning the positive - it's just a natural result of the way I judge [allocating some starting value and then deducting from it for the mistakes I see]. Nothing is meant to be taken personally here, it's all constructive criticism.
Lets begin!
---------------------------------------------
Specialized
Line - 7
Angle - 5.5
Control - 6
Total - 18.5/30
Seattle: that feint entry was great! but the drift would've looked better if the exit were pulled wider. You burned through a few too many tires coming out of the drift [small -control]
DF: I think your entry here seemed lazy (compared to Seattle) but your speed was good and kept it exciting. The drift appeared to be a little bit jerky, possible because you were afraid of dropping the car in the grass on that wide line [small -angle]. I'm not convined that your line is the best way to tackle that corner, but you managed to make it work.
Tsukuba: you started out well with a solid feint and a tight line. And you were going well to stay on that line, but the car began to weave around on it quite a bit. If the angle were kept smoother, this would've been a much more impressive drift. [-control, -angle]
SSR5: Good work here - a clean link with decent angle. I think your line could've been wider at the exit, even if it meant decreasing the angle slightly [or gradually decreasing it instead of abruptly killing it] The car seemed to be headed that way and then suddenly halted when you turned up the countersteering. [small - line]
ARII: You just didn't push the car enough here. The S14 could almost go straight sideways through there and still link into the right hander. The line choice was good, but it should have been accompanied by more angle. [-angle]
AH: Sloppy entry on AH [small -control, small -line] - looks like you tried to start your drift early, and then backed out of it. Despit that, you maintained good angle through the links and used the entire track surface to your advantage.
In all, the angle was quite reasonable for the corners [except perhaps at ARII], line choice was clean, but sometimes entries came late, and exits cold have been wider. Biggest point to work on is smoothing out the angle of the drifts - many drifts look quite jerky, even on the track cam.
---------------------------------------------
Kaidogg
Line - 6
Angle - 6
Control - 7
Total - 19
Seattle: You show a good aggressive feint into and reasonable angle here. I think exit was a bit untidy and a little too tight/premature. If you could've run the car a little farther to the outside of the track this would've been perfect, but you just seemd to run out of steam.
DF: excellent line through middle part of corner at DF, but pulled the exit too tight again. The entry could've been more energetic [style issue, no deductions]. Suitable angle and good throttle control.
Perfect line at Tsukuba and great angle (consistent).... could've relaxed the exit a bit, there was lots of track to work with there.
Line at SSR5 was good, but it didnt attack the second corner as much as i thought you were setting up for [no deduction, just my impression].
ARII - you were doing so good until this clip.... It seems like you struggled at the entry to get the car to rotate, and when it did you countersteered to much (and it consequently ruined your line) Deductions in all three areas.
At AH you have to try and use the track more effectively. take as wide an entrance as you can into the first turn in the esses so you can carry more speed through the section. This will help you link the 2nd and 3rd turns. Deductions on line and angle.
Clearly it's the links that are hurting you. On the first 4 Turns you were great. You do use the throttle well to control your angle, and the results look very smooth in most cases. I think it's your steering work that is letting you down in the links. If you can get that to work for you you'll be in great shape.
oh, and quit chopping off the start and finish of your drifts on certain track cams - it's annoying.
---------------------------------------------
Drift King
Line - 5
Angle - 5.5
Control - 4
Total - 14.5
Untidy feint on Seattle, the drift seem to hang out a little wide when you should've been coming down on the second apex. [-line, and small control deduction]
Drift died a little short at DF, but things were going great until that happened. You were on a good line but were forced to leave it as you lost speed - I think it's a result of a little too much angle and countersteer. [small deductions to angle and control]
Tsukuba, almost perfect until that jerk at the exit [small control deduction]. Line was great - used up as much track as you could.
ARII - angle was high, but you let it affect your line through the right hander [small deductions on line and angle]
AH - the section was not linked from start to finish. By looking at the motion of the car it seems that you countersteered too much and killed the link into the second turn. [-control] You line was good, but could've been a touch tighter on the first apex [no deduction]. It would've let you drift the entire section, if not for that initial mistake.
SSR5 is missing.... deducting 1.5 points per category [roughly 10/6]
It looks to me like your steering is what leads to the majority of your errors [at least, the ones seen here]. It occasionally seems to come in short quick bursts, rather than smoothly. The jerky exits, and the missed link you display are almost definitely the result of this. Your angle was good in most of the clips, but you displayed more than once that the amount you're using is not always compatible with your line - going big means nothing if it's not sustainable through the entire corner(s). Once again, this problem may be reduced to weak steering above all else, or it may simply be a case of pushing a bit too hard.
---------------------------------------------
Dorykiing
Line - 5.5
Angle - 6.5
Control - 7
Total - 19
At ARII you started off well with manageable angle (though, perhaps a tad shallow), but your line at the exit through the right hander is awkward, The section would appear smoother and more natural if you took the car to the outside on the exit of the right, whether it is still drifting at that point or not. [-line, small -angle]
At SSR5 you take a clean, slightly neutral line through the corners, but did make adequate use of the trackspace available. For what you were setting up for [linking into the hairpin 👍] your angle was respectable, and your reasons for coming back across the track as you did are understood. Good section.
AH - I'm ignoring the slight choppiness of the entry because you pushed the initiation of the drift back far enough that it kinda butted heads with the turn 2 exit [obviously you'll strive to link the first 5+ turns together in the future]. This is a pretty clean looking section. Your angle is consistent through the 3 turns - and even if it isn't huge, consistency gets points in my books. After watching it a few times, it looks like it should've been possible to hold the drift through the first right a little longer to take a line through the second and third turns that took less of a bite out of the curbs/sand. But at least you were hitting apexes in this one. [small deductions on line and control]
Seattle - great entry, close to the wall, ....the exit was close to the wall too, but the wrong one [small line deduction] Cutting the angle and speed just slightly might have allowed for a wider exit in this case.
DF - on the track cam both the entry and exit look premature on this drift [small line deduction], other than that I can't fault this one. Good drift.
Tsukuba - I don't think you used the available track as well as you could have here. The entrance comes right from the inside of the track and as a result, pushes your drift wide through the first half of the turn. IMO, your line is completely backwards here (wide in first half, tightening in the second half and at the exit). [small line deduction] The angle was appropriate, and you did demonstrate good throttle control over your drift with an almost constant countersteering angle throughout the turn.
Your drifts are very smooth in appearance, your actions are not over aggressive, nor do they seem too slow to me. A good balance. Even if you aren't pulling out the largest angles among the guys entered here, you appear to be able to drift consistently [and as I mentioned, that earns points from me]. I think you have all the tools required to put together some noteworthy laps in the GTPDC events.
---------------------------------------------
Kalo
Line - 6.5
Angle - 6
Control - 5
Total - 17.5
I like you already, you cropped the black border off your clips
and took out one of my fav cars 👍Seattle - the entry didn't have as much flair as is possible to bring into the drift here, but you managed to pick a sensible line and angle. Good use of the ebrake - although it's looked down upon by many, being able to use it effectively in a pinch as you did is helpful in correcting car behaviour. [no deductions here]
DF: I like it. Again, your entry lacked any real punch, but it was enough to get the car sliding [style not an issue here, no deductions]. I do, however, think that the drifting began a little late in the turn [small line deduction]. The drift would have been more impressive if the car began rotating a little sooner.
Tsukuba: this drift lacked flow.... it seemed very discontinous. The angle was unstable, the entry felt awkward, and the line started out quite wide and progressively tightened (which is the opposite of how i think this corner should be approached). [deductions in all 3 categories]. I question the effectiveness of your braking drifts on this turn - a big feint is really your friend on this one.
SSR5: I noticed on this clip more than any others a lot of stuttered steering [-control]. Try to smooth that out - even if the stuttered stuff is keeping your angle more or less constant, smooth steering looks far more impressive in replays. The line here is neutral, doesn't push the envelope but it gets the job done.
ARII: the entry here may have been a little delayed... but otherwise, this is a very clean drift. Angle isn't huge, but seems appropriate to me. You kept the car reasonably close to the 3 apexes, and swept the car out in a wide drift at the exit. Good stuff. [No deductions]
AH: you line choice here is good. Close to the apexes but with room left to stretch out a good drift (little wide at the entrance though - no biggie) I am going to knock you on the countersteering again - you slow the car's rotation abruptly in the left hander as though you steered into the drift a little too much. You still maintained the drift at a shallower angle, but the link into the final turn would've looked much more impressive (and obvious) had you not cut the angle. [angle and control deduction]
You seem to avoid using the feint technique, or any large alteral weight transfer to start your drifts. Although, you do manage to get the car sliding in the clips shown here by a braking method, tweaked with a small flick, I'm sure you'll find yourself limited if you use this exclusively. You might have been able to avoid the use of the ebrake at Seattle if you had executed a more aggressive dynamic/feint entry there, and I've already mentioned that I think Tsukuba demands a feint if you want to be on a clean line. Experiment a little more with techniques involving more lateral weight transfer - not only are these techniques more exciting to watch, but they're often a more practical way of initiating drift.
---------------------------------------------
Fairlady240ZG
Line - 5.5
Angle - 5.5
Control - 5
Total - 16
AH: A fun sweeping choice of line here, but it didn't prove effective in linking the section together in this case. If you had started the drift sooner and come down on the first apex a little more, the extra speed you could've carried might have finished the link from the left tot he right for you [-line]. I'm also making a small deduction to control points for the wobble at the end of the drift that almost didnt make it into the vid.
DF: I would've liked to see more at the start of this clip... the multiple flicks you show before the feint seem very awkward and unnecessary [-control], but int he end you did find a good line. Your angle is a little shaky here.... but no big deductions. What's with the crossfade of one DF clip over another at the end of the the bumper cam clip?
ARII: your drift does not begin until you contact the first apex [-line, -angle]. Get your drift started sooner here. You did exit the section well.
Tsukuba: No too bad... your line is a little wide at the start - but you commit to it and stay on this wider line to the exit. The angle is reasonable for the corner, but it is a little bit choppy [this + DF = small angle deduction]
SSR5: I liked this drift. Big angle, a clean line, and the way you whipped the car into the second corner was pretty good. I think you might have done better to slowly turn down the angle near the outside wall after the left hander if you weren't going to link to the hairpin [no deductions]
Seattle: You did it again, that awkward wiggle at the corner entry - it just looked like you struggled to get the car to move the way you wanted it to. And why didn't you show us how the drift finished? you cut it too soon [-control]
The line was a touch wide the whole way through - if you could've come down on the second apex a little more and still managed to take the exit to the outside wall it would've been great. [small -line]
Whats with the video editting? You made early cuts at AH and Seattle, didnt show part of the entry on DF and then there was the weird crossfade on bumper cam, and at SSR5 there was a crossfade on the track cam. Don't edit clips in this way for competition type vids, it looks like you're trying to hide something.
---------------------------------------------
GangstaGT
Sorry - none of us seems to have a working link to your video. Could you try resending it?
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Ok, with exception to GangstaGT's review, that does it for me. I just wanted to say in closing that I'm glad so many of you decided to take advantage of this event. 7/15 entrants is a little less than 50%... but to be honest, it's still more than I expected to see.
I did want to adress the issue of video editting though. I'm not accusing anyone of cheating, or anything like that, there were usually enough camera views provided to rule that out. Nonetheless, I was frustrated by the fact that in more than one of these vids the clips either began or ended too soon. Please, in the future, do not begin your clips after you've started your drifts or chop it off before the weight transfer in the car has stabilized. Give us 2 or 3 seconds on either side of the drift so we can fully understand the situation and make more useful observations. This competition was held entirely for the entrants benefit, so to try and mask or hide anything from us is only going to cost you points and provide you with less accurate feedback.
Anyways...
Good job guys! 👍
- 2,823
- GTP_Brent
Also, I recall someone asking about the demo car settings. Here's what I was using for my S15:
'99 Nissan Silvia Spec R Aero S15
HP: from 230 to 245 [stock]
Mass: 1240kg [stock]
PWR: approx 5.2
Parts:
N1 Tires [front & rear]
Racing Suspension
Full Customize LSD
Spring Rate: 7.4 - 8.2
Ride Height: 112 - 115
Shock Bound: 5 - 6
Shock Rebound: 7 - 8
Camber Angle: 2.4 - 0.0
Toe Angle: 0 - 0
Stabilizers: 4 - 4
Initial Torque: 10
LS Accel: 36
LS Decel: 10
Aids: 0 - 0 - 0
These are just approximate settings, I was changing things up a little from track to track. For example, I had this variation as my B setting:
Spring Rate: 7.0 - 8.0
Ride Height: 112 - 115
Shock Bound: 4 - 6
Shock Rebound: 5 - 7
Camber Angle: 2.4 - 0.0
Toe Angle: -1 - 0
Stabilizers: 4 - 4
Initial Torque: 10
LS Accel: 34
LS Decel: 10
Aids: 0 - 0 - 0
DR and I both agreed that when we do this again, we'll do the demos in cars with a little more power / less weight. We were both feeling severely handicapped this time around by deciding to run only suspension and lsd mods with stock weight and power.
'99 Nissan Silvia Spec R Aero S15
HP: from 230 to 245 [stock]
Mass: 1240kg [stock]
PWR: approx 5.2
Parts:
N1 Tires [front & rear]
Racing Suspension
Full Customize LSD
Spring Rate: 7.4 - 8.2
Ride Height: 112 - 115
Shock Bound: 5 - 6
Shock Rebound: 7 - 8
Camber Angle: 2.4 - 0.0
Toe Angle: 0 - 0
Stabilizers: 4 - 4
Initial Torque: 10
LS Accel: 36
LS Decel: 10
Aids: 0 - 0 - 0
These are just approximate settings, I was changing things up a little from track to track. For example, I had this variation as my B setting:
Spring Rate: 7.0 - 8.0
Ride Height: 112 - 115
Shock Bound: 4 - 6
Shock Rebound: 5 - 7
Camber Angle: 2.4 - 0.0
Toe Angle: -1 - 0
Stabilizers: 4 - 4
Initial Torque: 10
LS Accel: 34
LS Decel: 10
Aids: 0 - 0 - 0
DR and I both agreed that when we do this again, we'll do the demos in cars with a little more power / less weight. We were both feeling severely handicapped this time around by deciding to run only suspension and lsd mods with stock weight and power.
- 531
BL- Thanks for the feedback. As for the driving wiggles, Im not too sure on the entry ones, I dont really remember doing those. I do remember having trouble getting the Z to slide in at the angle I wanted, the car seems prone to long drifts so its possible I was trying to get her alittle wild in the back end. As for the exit wobble on the first section it was part a link into the wide sweeper that got cut off.
Im using microsoft movie maker to capture my clips. This was one of my first try's at using it, besides gtpdc7. All the clips I used were directly from the playstation, I think that the wierd cuts were a combination of the playstation changing views and me not letting the clip last longer. I didnt really think about linking any of the upcoming turns after the section was done.
Also Im still learning how to change lines and move my car around during the drift. I usually drive the track a few times, figure out where I want my drifts to begin, end and pick a line and stick with it.
With these things into consideration Im going to go run these tracks again, work on line and come back next time with a cleaner vid.
Lastly, which program should I use to put my videos togeather. When i use my capture card for video it looks awesome, but wont transfer to movie maker. It then looks like crap once I use the capture device on movie maker, any ideas would help.
Thanks for the feedback and reading the book I just wrote!👍
Im using microsoft movie maker to capture my clips. This was one of my first try's at using it, besides gtpdc7. All the clips I used were directly from the playstation, I think that the wierd cuts were a combination of the playstation changing views and me not letting the clip last longer. I didnt really think about linking any of the upcoming turns after the section was done.
Also Im still learning how to change lines and move my car around during the drift. I usually drive the track a few times, figure out where I want my drifts to begin, end and pick a line and stick with it.
With these things into consideration Im going to go run these tracks again, work on line and come back next time with a cleaner vid.
Lastly, which program should I use to put my videos togeather. When i use my capture card for video it looks awesome, but wont transfer to movie maker. It then looks like crap once I use the capture device on movie maker, any ideas would help.
Thanks for the feedback and reading the book I just wrote!👍
- 2,823
- GTP_Brent
first, i didnt think your video quality was too bad, for the filesize. To render at about 3mb/min and still have it look like that isn't too bad a job. But, if you're looking for suggestions, you could try using your regular capture software, and then piecing together and rendering your vid in Vegas Video [it will render as wmv].
I use VirtualDub for my captures as opposed to the software that came with my card, and then do renders in Vegas 6 [I recently got After Effects though... so I may start using that].
The odd cuts I refer to are not the changing track cam views. I mean, on AH, you fade out your drift clip before weight has stopped moving on the car - I assumed it was to hide the swaying you got as you came out of the vid. I only noticed it on the track cam because I saw the g-meter going crazy at the bottom of the screen as it was fading. At Seattle you do a hard cut out of both of your clips before your car is stabilized - watching the g-meter on the track cam make me think you might have run into some nasty snapback immediately after the cut... who's to say. Things like that make me suspicious.
The weird fades:
At SSR5, on the track cam, watch the timer magically roll from 3:08 to 3:10, totally bypassing 3:09. Same with he bumper cam at DF - the timer rolls 1:00 to 1:02. But in both the DF and SSR5 cases, the other cameras showed the clip in full, so I assumed it was just an editting oversight. I gave you the benefit of the doubt, where I could.
But ya, I think that if in general you can make your entries and exit cleaner the overall appearance of your drifts will increase significantly - meaning, tidy up your steering. You should aim for them to look and feel more like your SSR5 drift - that one was leaps and bounds better than the other ones you included, imo. Infact, I think it was one of the best 2 clips I saw of that section. 👍
I use VirtualDub for my captures as opposed to the software that came with my card, and then do renders in Vegas 6 [I recently got After Effects though... so I may start using that].
The odd cuts I refer to are not the changing track cam views. I mean, on AH, you fade out your drift clip before weight has stopped moving on the car - I assumed it was to hide the swaying you got as you came out of the vid. I only noticed it on the track cam because I saw the g-meter going crazy at the bottom of the screen as it was fading. At Seattle you do a hard cut out of both of your clips before your car is stabilized - watching the g-meter on the track cam make me think you might have run into some nasty snapback immediately after the cut... who's to say. Things like that make me suspicious.
The weird fades:
At SSR5, on the track cam, watch the timer magically roll from 3:08 to 3:10, totally bypassing 3:09. Same with he bumper cam at DF - the timer rolls 1:00 to 1:02. But in both the DF and SSR5 cases, the other cameras showed the clip in full, so I assumed it was just an editting oversight. I gave you the benefit of the doubt, where I could.
But ya, I think that if in general you can make your entries and exit cleaner the overall appearance of your drifts will increase significantly - meaning, tidy up your steering. You should aim for them to look and feel more like your SSR5 drift - that one was leaps and bounds better than the other ones you included, imo. Infact, I think it was one of the best 2 clips I saw of that section. 👍
- 531
Good deal. Thanks BL.
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