GTP_WRS Pit Box : Want to chat? - Need help? Post here.

  • Thread starter Sjaak
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So no more pics like this?
TrialMountainCircuit.jpg

Hallelujah!

I've always believed, right from the start that GT5 is really just a huge demo / testing ground for GT6 ;)
 
Still, its not bad for a demo... :sly:

I'm also going to hazard a guess they've made some other 'stealth' changes to the physics... I've just had a quick blast round Monza in the MP4-12C again (arcade as per week 84) and knocked nearly 2 tenths off my WRS lap time after 5 laps.... and fairly easily too.
 
Oh, don't get me wrong, it's the best 'demo' I've ever played :)
I just can't wait for the final, finished product 👍
 
Hooked my wheel back up to test tire wear in my lounge, ran the Jaguar from the endurance race a while ago. First of all at max downforce the car is a little slower in a straight line but i'd wager no more than .5s per lap around la Sarthe.

First few laps I was a little rusty and went faster and faster each lap. Laps 3-5 where best grip as the tires had time to get properly heated without much wear.

Fastest lap was lap 6 (incl outlap) 3'47.4. For comparison my fastest lap pre patch, with a lot of practice was 46.3.

By lap 10 I was up to 3'50.1 and the wear was starting to affect handling.

Lap 15 was 3'52.1 and on lap 16 I ran out of fuel just before the last chicane and limped across the line in 3'55. Rear tires where at about 15% at this point so it would've been possible to do 1 or 2 more without crashing if I had more fuel.

For comparison pre-patch lap 7 would be about where lap 15 was now in wear/times, and 8 was the longest stint I was able to do on full fuel and fresh oil.


Then I dropped DF to the lowest possible setting and was instantly disappointed as it is still much slower round the track, I couldn't break 3'50 this way. The speed gained is not nearly enough to compensate the lost grip, even the 3 Mulsanne splits where slower because of the time lost in the chicanes. This of course is still completely unrealistic as in real life all cars run minimum DF on this track (even good old rFactor models this accurately).
 
yanaran
...(even good old rFactor models this accurately).
Click to expand...
Ahh, rFactor... many a happy hour, day, week, month... :sly: Can't even begin to reckon at the many thousands of laps clocked up in various F1 cars. On the grave of my trusty old G25, the epitaph reads simply "rFactor". :P

Nice test that Jonas, thanks mate. :cheers: Sounds like tyre wear has been sorted nicely anyway... and I'm pretty happy about the changes to suspension too.

The drag vs downforce thing is a puzzler though. I developed a physics package for the 2009 spec F1 cars in rFactor and getting the balance between high/low downforce vs drag was a fairly simple process. I used Motec telemetry to make comparisons and tweaked it on that basis. I realise GT5 uses a simpler data set (well, I assume it does) but PD must have some way of determining the downforce level.. I mean, there is a tyre load sensor available in the HUD, so the calculation is there... All I can say is, PD have a damn strange way of doing things sometimes. But we all still love GT don't we? :P

And when are you coming back for some WRS Jonas lad? :)
 
I haven't played rFactor in a long time because my laptop has been screwed up for over a year. It's tough to play with no sounds when it's such an important part of the experience.
 
Vagabond
And when are you coming back for some WRS Jonas lad? :)
Click to expand...
Wheel is already back infront of the PC, rFactor 2 beta is the only thing I play these days. The only thing I can see myself coming back for would be another la Sarthe endurance race. :)
 
Vagabond
Don't even joke Marc... sheesh!

Just had a play with a few cars to see what effect the update has had on suspension settings.... I can (happily) report that my initial findings are good. It isn't just as simple as the ride height settings being reversed though - the effect of changing ride height, coupled with spring and damper settings, seems to now be much more realistically predictable. So no more nose-to-the-sky idiotic looking replays... finally. :)
Click to expand...

Ah, that sounds lovely, can't wait to check it out.
 
Any Xbox-ites with f1 2012 feel free to friends req me on 'InsatiableFiend' - don't race huge amounts but do love the TTs :)

Welcome the suspension tweaks here, about time! Looking forward to some WRS in the near future :)
 
chart1.jpg


Took the time to do a little analysis of the old vs new. The car was from the used car lot, with fresh oil. The left side is before the latest update and the right side is, conversely, the new update.

The testing was done at the Special test track and only straight line speed tests were done as I don't have access to my wheel here and didn't want to try testing cornering with a DS3.

It is interesting to see the best and worst times move around from one revision to the next. I thought the worst times would definately be all in the with wing set to max on the new revision, but that was not the case. The one mile time and max speed were the worst, but the 1/4 mile, 0-60, and 0-100 were actualy slower in the old revision in the way most of us set our cars up.

Also, having the car set up with the rear higher now actually gives a better 0-60 and 1 mile time than any other configuration. Not to mention that the other times are so close that the difference is negligible (all times are best out of 4 tries, so 3 to 4 thousands is not much of a difference.

Also interesting is the fact that top speed with a wing set at minimum is faster than no wing at all in the new system. Top speed is slowest in the new systme with the wing set at it's most downforce which I expected but I didn't expect the low setting t be faster than no wing at all.

Anyway, I'll leave the skid pad testing to a more competent cornerer than myself to determine if the ride height difference is as pronounced in cornering as the downforce is on straight away speed.
 
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Brilliant work, Ron. Doing some testing myself, but it involved more cars and some replay/lap work, which combined to take ages, so I haven't updated yet (or slept much :dopey:).

I can't figure out how to reliably get lateral grip changes tested, either. Are there any track/tire/car combinations where one can reliably get the space for donuts from the start line (I'm thinking DS3+full lock?). The Route X tests are all DS3+AT with full throttle before screen change, naturally, so they're all repeatable.
 
That's the thing Ren, skid pad tests are next to impossible. The only way to test them is to subjectively "feel" the car reaction in cornering situations.

I suppose one could take a car to the Top Gear Test Track and see/feel when a car breaks traction or looses grip in a hard turn/donut situation.

Or go on line with the front jacked up, and compare to having the rear jacked up and see if the car reacts more realistically.
 
Perhaps Try the Motegi oval?
Try to see what speed can be held around the curves and then see what it takes to lose grip.
 
Hydro
Perhaps Try the Motegi oval?
Try to see what speed can be held around the curves and then see what it takes to lose grip.
Click to expand...

I'll give it a quick try; planning better would have helped :dunce:. Ideally, I'd have car/tire combos that would just be on the limit at 2.07; repeatable off the line is key (I want to be able to line'em up in data logger, ideally), and just flip ride heights and adjust DF independently (possibly on a different car).

I've added doing the first part of part 3 of the AMG Intermediate to my list before updating, anyway - it starts full throttle just after Bergwerk, IIRC (don't want or need a full replay of the whole section, since posting results would be awkward). Don't have a lot of time left for pre-update stuff; I thankfully don't have to do repeatable stuff (like Route X) straight away after updating, but the more subjective things I want to do pretty quickly. There goes any thought of practice for the Monza race :crazy:
 
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Something you don't see everyday when you visit your GT5 garage:

gt5garage.jpg


Going to refresh/find thumbnails for all to see if it corrects itself.
 
ConRollins
Something you don't see everyday when you visit your GT5 garage:

Going to refresh/find thumbnails for all to see if it corrects itself.
Click to expand...

Neat. That Garaiya '08 would be a bit of a sleeper.
 
Has anyone else had trouble getting a handle on tuning since the last update?

I used to be pretty good at knowing what setting to tweak to get the result I wanted, but now don't seem to have a clue.

The ride height used to be a good way to fine tune a setup, but now seems to have little effect. Same with the other adjustments, I find it hard to feel difference in handling when I make adjustments that used to make noticeable changes. It also seems like changes are not as predictable, I'm not even sure if the front is really the front now, or if its still the back.

It's probably just my feeble mind being unable to adjust, but I'm finding it a little frustrating. It doesn't help that the miles bob ran the other day on my FRS didn't get saved, and I can't break the car in while running this weeks event.
 
zrodegreesklvn
Has anyone else had trouble getting a handle on tuning since the last update?
Click to expand...

👍 ...to everything you said. I threw a few suspension configurations at my BRZ last night but it didn't seem to affect my pace at all - the car feels different but hard to say how or what affect it has. LSD settings seem to have disproportionately large effect by comparison. :indiff:
 
In your garage, go to the particular car you need a thumbnail for, hit triangle and choose 'create thumbnail' or 'create thumbnail for all'.
This last one takes a while so be prepared if you choose that.
 
Speedy6543
In your garage, go to the particular car you need a thumbnail for, hit triangle and choose 'create thumbnail' or 'create thumbnail for all'.
This last one takes a while so be prepared if you choose that.
Click to expand...

Thanks Christophe, will try that tonight 👍
 
Vagabond
👍 ...to everything you said. I threw a few suspension configurations at my BRZ last night but it didn't seem to affect my pace at all - the car feels different but hard to say how or what affect it has. LSD settings seem to have disproportionately large effect by comparison. :indiff:
Click to expand...

Thanks for the response Chris. Good to know I'm not the only one scratching my head.
 
zrodegreesklvn
Has anyone else had trouble getting a handle on tuning since the last update?

I used to be pretty good at knowing what setting to tweak to get the result I wanted, but now don't seem to have a clue.

The ride height used to be a good way to fine tune a setup, but now seems to have little effect. Same with the other adjustments, I find it hard to feel difference in handling when I make adjustments that used to make noticeable changes. It also seems like changes are not as predictable, I'm not even sure if the front is really the front now, or if its still the back.

It's probably just my feeble mind being unable to adjust, but I'm finding it a little frustrating. It doesn't help that the miles bob ran the other day on my FRS didn't get saved, and I can't break the car in while running this weeks event.
Click to expand...

Vagabond
👍 ...to everything you said. I threw a few suspension configurations at my BRZ last night but it didn't seem to affect my pace at all - the car feels different but hard to say how or what affect it has. LSD settings seem to have disproportionately large effect by comparison. :indiff:
Click to expand...

zrodegreesklvn
Thanks for the response Chris. Good to know I'm not the only one scratching my head.
Click to expand...

The couple combos that I've put up as tuning events since the update have used cars that have quite a bit of grip for the HP they are putting out. That admittedly makes tuning the car less important in terms of control and therefore, to some extend, speed.

I agree with Chris on the LSD, that made a more dynamic difference in the car when I was tuning the GT300 car than most suspension tweaks.

Camber and Toe seem to still have similar effects as they did before the update.

Spring rates seem to make a bit more difference than ride height. For the most part, ARB and dampers seem to react in about the same way as they did before the update.

I'm not sure that the tuning/physics has changed much at all for Online. I have not tried any of my old tunes for online, but I noticed when dialing in the Arta for online use, the RH changes had similar effects as they did before the update.

I need to go try tuning an FF road car for offline. I think that would be the telling tale, as they required the most extreme tunes before the update.
 

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