How Would YOU Reshape GM?

[YSSMAN]

I was just reading today the new Autoextremist rant about how he belives GM should be reshaped in order to stay on top in the automotive world, and it was very interesting. Although I will not post the entire thing (you can find it HERE), as it is considered illegal to do so, so I HIGHLY suggest you read it. It is short and sweet, take the two-to-three minutes to read it.

He also gives a list as to how he would structure the entire lineup for the entire company, segment by segment, model by model. Also a very interesting list (which you can find HERE).

So I ask this question; How would YOU change GM for the better?

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I personally would probably do something very similar to DeLorenzo's strategy, but also a bit different. Most of GM currently can be summed up as either Chevrolet or Cadillac, and thus a two-party system is born. Pontiac, Buick and Saturn would then be folded into Chevrolet, while Cadillac absorbs Saab and Hummer. Yes, that leaves out GMC and Isuzu, two sick dogs that need to be shot. Although GM would continue to function under a two-party system, specific models would be sold as say Pontiacs or Saabs, but through Chevrolet or Cadillac dealers. However, lineups are to be cut substantially, and may also be folded in with Opel/Vauxhall cousins.... So here it goes:

Chevrolet:
-Cars
Entry Level: Chevrolet Aveo, possibly replaced with Opel Corsa
Economy Car: Pontiac G5, possibly replace with Opel Astra
Mid-Size: Saturn Aura (aka Opel Vectra)
Full Size: Chevrolet Impala (RWD)
Full Size Option: Buick Statesman (RWD)

- Crossovers, SUVs, Trucks, etc.
Entry: Chevrolet HHR, possibly replaced with Opel Signum
Minivan: Saturn Relay, possibly replace with Opel Zafira
Crossover: Saturn Outlook
Crossover Option: Buick Enclave, AWD abilities may need to be increased
Large Van: Chevrolet Express
Entry-Level SUV: Holden Adventra (rebadged as Chevrolet)
Large SUV: Chevrolet Tahoe, Chevrolet Suburban
Small-Pickups: Holden Ute/Crewman (rebadged as Chevrolet)
Large-Pickups: Chevrolet Silverado

-Sports Models:
Entry: Pontiac Solstice
High Performance (2+2): Chevrolet Camaro
High Performance GT: Pontiac GTO
High Performance Sedan: Pontiac Grand Prix (possibly changed to Tempest)
Sports Car: Chevrolet Corvette
Ultra High Performance: Chevrolet Corvette Z06, ZL1

Cadillac:
-Cars
Entry: Saab 9-3, all variants
Mid-Size Entry: Saab 9-5, all variants
Mid-Size: Cadillac CTS
Full-Size: Cadillac STS
Ultra-Full-Size: Cadillac ULS (replacing the DTS, eventually with RWD)

-Crossovers, SUV
Entry: Sub-H3 hummer of some kind
Mid-Size: Hummer H3 (new V6 or I6 powerplant)
Crossover/Small SUV: Cadillac SRX, or possible upcomming Saab crossover
Full-Size SUV: Hummer H2, updated to GMT900 specs, uses LS9 V8
Full-Size Luxury SUV: Cadillac Escalade, all variants

-Sports Cars
Mid-Size: Cadillac CTS-V
Ultra Mid-Size: Cadillac CTS-V Plus, with LS7 V8
Full-Size: Cadillac STS-V, possibly use LS7 V8
Ultra-Full-Size: ULS-V with S/C 5.0+L Northstar V8, more than 500HP

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Some would argue that Saturn is as worthless as Isuzu and GMC, but I think they are a pretty important part of GM. To keep them at the bottom of the luxury end of GM, something has to be done to keep costs low, similar to how well Volvo has placed the S40 and S60 in the market today.

I also included Opels in this change, as Saturn has now been merged with Opel/Vauxhall here in the US. Some of their models would fair well here, and utilising their products to the fullest, it would cut costs (theoretically) to build more of the same cars for the world market. The only thing that would need a change for the US market is engine output and gear ratios, but that is an easy fix.
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Those are my ideas, how about yours?

 

[Jay]

Entry-Level SUV: Holden Adventra (rebadged as Chevrolet)

Problem is the Holden Adventra is old, I expect it to be dropped anytime soon and I doubt will be replaced with a new one now that we are getting the Holden S3X (Chevrolet Captiva).

 

[YSSMAN]

...Well, either or then... Both are presumably better than the VUE/Equinox/Torrent we allready have right now...

 

[xcsti]

No mention of minivans ehh? I don't think I have any points to argue minivan wise other then the fact that they should keep some commercial van production (likely through gmc) and also that they should take more characteristics of european vans (like dodge has lately).

With chevy its hard to say where to cut fat and where not to. Is a racing program necessary? I love the c6r's but I don't think they sell anymore base corvettes for them. The corvette is a good enough car on its own for buyers. Lemans sees little coverage in the us and I feel that people who are into it already know the finer points of the c6 or are atracted to other foriegn makers.

That said I don't want them to pull their program but if it would significantly help them (I don't know how much they have to invest into it) then I would accept it.

 

[Jay]

No mention of minivans ehh?

Yeah he mentioned minivans under "- Crossovers, SUVs, Trucks, etc."

 

[YSSMAN]

I would prefer to see the minivans go in a more European direction, as the current models just do not cut it anymore. Let Honda and Toyota duke it out for the top-line minivan positions... I say GM should shoot a bit lower, and hit the middle class moms and dads who still want a fun to drive vehicle with the functionality of a minivan. Something like the Mazda5 would work well enough for two parents and a few kids, and thats what the Zafira could do here in the US.

 

[Sage]

I don’t know much about business, but I agree with the general consensus that GM needs to cut out a lot of the crap if it wants to regain any glory. Better engineers and designers would help too (or if they actually have good engineers and designers, then the managers who only approve the ugly bullstuff need to be fired). Here we go:

Chevrolet
Keep it, since this is the company most people associate with GM. Try to make it the Toyota of American cars – boring, but reliable and substantial in feeling. In fact, make it match most of Toyota’s lineup (subcompact, compact, mid-size sedan, small SUV, mid-size SUV, etc.), aside from obvious weirdos like the FJ Cruiser (Toyota probably made that for fun, not really for much direct profit).

GMC
Kill. Make the Chevy trucks high-quality in the first place, while keeping the prices down.

Saab
Sell it to somebody competent.

Cadillac
Keep as-is, except give them decent interior materials for gawd’s sake.

Hummer
Keep (as much as I hate to say it).

Saturn
Kill.

Pontiac
Make this the sporty non-lux division (Mazda-ish). Have a compact, mid-size sedan, and the Solstice. Nothing more. Well, maybe they could take over the Corvette (blasphemy!).

Isuzu
Kill.

Buick
Kill (Cadillacs work just fine for non-speedy old people too).

Holden/Opel/Vauxhall
I can’t comment, since I’m totally unfamiliar with these brands.


So that leaves Chevrolet, Cadillac, Hummer, and Pontiac. Chevrolet will be like Toyota, Cadillac will be like Lexus with a dallop of sportiness, Hummer will be Hummer, and Pontiac will be like Mazda. Mainstream, old/rich people, rock-climbers, and sports enthusiasts – those are the main bases that need to be covered, and GM doesn’t need any more than those four divisions to do it.

 

[a6m5]

I don’t know much about business, but I agree with the general consensus that GM needs to cut out a lot of the crap if it wants to regain any glory. Better engineers and designers would help too (or if they actually have good engineers and designers, then the managers who only approve the ugly bullstuff need to be fired). Here we go:

Chevrolet
Keep it, since this is the company most people associate with GM. Try to make it the Toyota of American cars – boring, but reliable and substantial in feeling. In fact, make it match most of Toyota’s lineup (subcompact, compact, mid-size sedan, small SUV, mid-size SUV, etc.), aside from obvious weirdos like the FJ Cruiser (Toyota probably made that for fun, not really for much direct profit).

GMC
Kill. Make the Chevy trucks high-quality in the first place, while keeping the prices down.

Saab
Sell it to somebody competent.

Cadillac
Keep as-is, except give them decent interior materials for gawd’s sake.

Hummer
Keep (as much as I hate to say it).

Saturn
Kill.

Pontiac
Make this the sporty non-lux division (Mazda-ish). Have a compact, mid-size sedan, and the Solstice. Nothing more. Well, maybe they could take over the Corvette (blasphemy!).

Isuzu
Kill.

Buick
Kill (Cadillacs work just fine for non-speedy old people too).

Holden/Opel/Vauxhall
I can’t comment, since I’m totally unfamiliar with these brands.


So that leaves Chevrolet, Cadillac, Hummer, and Pontiac. Chevrolet will be like Toyota, Cadillac will be like Lexus with a dallop of sportiness, Hummer will be Hummer, and Pontiac will be like Mazda. Mainstream, old/rich people, rock-climbers, and sports enthusiasts – those are the main bases that need to be covered, and GM doesn’t need any more than those four divisions to do it.

I agree with Sage on most of his ideas here. That Pontiac/Mazda thing is genius. 👍

Few of my ideas: Saturn is expected to rebadge a lot of Opel cars, right? I think they deserve one more chance. I hear that Buick is a huge hit in China. Since Chinese automobile market must be the fastest growing in the world, I'd keep Buick. In the U.S., I'd combine Buick with another not-so-popular GM brand, like Pontiac, Saturn, GMC. Kinda like how Jeep/Eagle, Chrysler/Plymouth used to do it. It should become some sort of limited availability cars, just for hardcore fans. Hummer should offer more than H1 - 3. Wrangler type, serious off-roader would be nice. Also, off-roading pickup(like Tacomas). I don't want any gimick like seen in H2 and H3.

 

[YSSMAN]

GM said in the past that their plans for Pontiac, Buick, and GMC were to combine the three into one brand, but with seperate identities. Pontiac would build the sporty models, Buick would tackle the older folks, and GMC would pick up the truck sales.

Still some models overlap, and really dont serve a purpose as Chevrolet allready has them.

I'd vote for the G5, Solstice, GTO, Grand Prix, Statesman, and Enclave to come out without a problem. GMC just serves such a small purpose to GM these days, there really isnt a need for them to be around. Hopefully GMC is smart and ditches the Envoy when the Acadia comes out, and they do something substantial to seperate the Sierra from the Silverado when the GMT900 models debut. But even now, there isnt much of a difference between the Escalade and the Yukon Denali in GMT900 form, so whats the point?

 

[a6m5]

More I think about it, I think GMC should be kept. But they should stick with just work/fleet trucks. It's kind of annoying with Ford, when they have just one name, but they have truck dealers and car dealers. I kind of wish Ford had their version of GMC.

 

[YSSMAN]

GMC is a great brand, and I would be sad to see them go as they were one of the origional General Motors companies... But when they do so little to differentiate themselves from the Chevrolets which they base themselves uppon, why bother? If you option a Chevy right when compared to a GMC, you are usually looking at a grand or more in savings... Sure, its nice to have a chrome grille and leather seats in your GMC, but you can get that in a Chevy as well.

Its hard to put your finger on I guess, but it just seems so pointless to have the two together. Maybe GM could follow the same ideas as posted above, and make special versions of the Silverado as the GMC Sierra, kinda like the differences between the Holden Statesman and Caprice... Once you reach a certain trim level, the model changes, and so fourth.

...Now that I think of it, maybe if GMC sold ONLY the Denali models, then they could stick around...

 

[Wolfe]

I don’t know much about business, but I agree with the general consensus that GM needs to cut out a lot of the crap if it wants to regain any glory. Better engineers and designers would help too (or if they actually have good engineers and designers, then the managers who only approve the ugly bullstuff need to be fired). Here we go:

GMC
Kill. Make the Chevy trucks high-quality in the first place, while keeping the prices down.

Saab
Sell it to somebody competent.

Cadillac
Keep as-is, except give them decent interior materials for gawd’s sake.

Hummer
Keep (as much as I hate to say it).

Saturn
Kill.

Buick
Kill (Cadillacs work just fine for non-speedy old people too).

So that leaves Chevrolet, Cadillac, Hummer, and Pontiac. Chevrolet will be like Toyota, Cadillac will be like Lexus with a dallop of sportiness, Hummer will be Hummer, and Pontiac will be like Mazda. Mainstream, old/rich people, rock-climbers, and sports enthusiasts – those are the main bases that need to be covered, and GM doesn’t need any more than those four divisions to do it.

I agree completely with all of the above. 👍

Now, for the parts that I disagree with --

Isuzu
Don't kill -- sell it to someone who will actually do something with it. Toyota, perhaps. Isuzu made some great little cars back in the day.

Holden/Opel/Vauxhall
To be explained in the next two --

Chevrolet
I agree with what Sage said -- about making Chevrolet Toyota-ish -- and I think Opel already does a fine job making boring, relatively reliable cars of various sizes, with the occasional pocket-rocket (like the Astra VXR). Basically, do to Chevrolet what GM is currently planning on doing with Saturn.

Pontiac
Follow in the footsteps of the GTO and make Pontiac the Holden of america. From what I know of Holden's cars, they perfectly match the image that GM has been trying to give to Pontiac, and, like Sage said, would provide a good, non-luxury performance brand.

 

[Poverty]

Id get rid of every GM division apart from chevrolet, cadillac, hummer, saab and saturn.

Id make cadillac a Mercedes rival and position saab against BMW and Audi.

Chevrolet I would pretty much get on by itself and make saturn into the rebadged Opel.

I think buick is pointless as its just a old mans luxury car maker. Cadillac makes luxury cars which are more desirable so buicks pointless.

 

[194GVan]

they should keep some commercial van production (likely through gmc) and also that they should take more characteristics of european vans (like dodge has lately).

While those "Dodge" Sprinters are really big, and great for companies that need vans, they are really a rebadged Mercedes Sprinter, and are quite expensive when compared to similarly equipped Fords and Chevrolet fullsize vans. Don't forget the Ram van, which was discontinued in 2005, and replaced by the Sprinter. Its not a redesign, just an import. I think it had something to do with the interior space in the Ram, Ive noticed at least in the 2005 model, it just seems a lot smaller than the Ford and Chevy. Well now they got the biggest one!

I beleive the Fords are even a bit more expensive than the Chevy's right now too, which is why I guess about 90% of the new cargo vans I see on the road today are either Chevy or GMC.

Sorry, not trying to flame you, Im just probably the only van fanatic on the board.

 

[niky]

Agree mostly with Sage and somewhat with Wolfe. Here's my GM of the future:

Chevrolet / Opel / Holden: The Cobalt and Astra lines should be rationalized, as well as the Vectra / Malibu / Impala etcetera... Corvettes and Camaros ought to be in the "exciting" Pontiac division, but badge recognition means that they should stay as Chevys, even in markets with Opel/Vauxhall. In Australia, the Camaro could be sold as a Holden.

Pontiac / Suzuki: Love the Mazda idea. The Solstice, a "cheap" Cobalt/Astra, stripped down with good upgradeability and performance potential, a "sporty" cute ute, and maybe a Solstice based coupe.

And Suzuki would get rebadges of these cars for the overseas market.

To streamline sales and production, Suzuki exits the US market. Pontiac, instead of being mostly rebadged Chevys, can share a "cute" ute with Suzuki, their micro-off-roaders and the real Swift for sale in the US.

Saturn / Buick / Saab: follow in the steps of Oldsmobile. No offense, but neither Buick nor Saab has meant anything much in the last decade or so.

Isuzu: Kill the US dealer network, but keep the connection for the engines.

Hummer / Cadillac: keep as is.

 

[xcsti]

Alright, I completely missed there mention of vans.

While those "Dodge" Sprinters are really big, and great for companies that need vans, they are really a rebadged Mercedes Sprinter, and are quite expensive when compared to similarly equipped Fords and Chevrolet fullsize vans. Don't forget the Ram van, which was discontinued in 2005, and replaced by the Sprinter. Its not a redesign, just an import. I think it had something to do with the interior space in the Ram, Ive noticed at least in the 2005 model, it just seems a lot smaller than the Ford and Chevy. Well now they got the biggest one!

I beleive the Fords are even a bit more expensive than the Chevy's right now too, which is why I guess about 90% of the new cargo vans I see on the road today are either Chevy or GMC.

Sorry, not trying to flame you, Im just probably the only van fanatic on the board.

I had realized the the dodge was a european import but didn't know what it was an import of. I guess it never had crossed my mind that dodge doesn't really exist overseas.

 

[YSSMAN]

I think Dodge is selling cars under its own name in Europe now (I remember reading that somewhere). The Caliber, Charger, Viper, and Ram I think were going to make up that lineup, but I'm not sure.

 

[xcsti]

I know for years they either didn't sell them overseas or (in the case of the viper) sold them as chrystlers.

 

[YSSMAN]

Yeah, I thought that it was pretty funny that they had "Chrysler Vipers" in Europe. It just sounds funny.

 

[zoxxy]

Stop buying and killing every carmanufacturer there are. 👍
They totally destroys and take away all the souls the brands once had *cough* Saab *cough*

 

[STLbarcelona5]

Best thing that would EVER happen regarding a sports car for GM. Rebadge (ONLY) the Vauxhall VX220 Turbo. And just leave the damn engines alone, who would ever want a car with 170hp when the European version gets 197. AND THEN, the most important thing, don't make it a boat, keep it light, it's 79.171941&% of the cars charm.

 

[YSSMAN]

Um, STL, the VX220 is being replaced by the Saturn Sky (actually the Opel GT, which can all be traced back to the Pontiac Solstice). Didnt you get the memmo?

About the 171HP engine: You do realise that the engine is based off an Opel design, and throughly re-tuned for the American market by substantially increasing the torque? Making 166lb-ft of torque is pretty good, and explains why the car keeps up with the lighter MX5 even though it shouldnt.

 

[YSSMAN]

Something interesting about GM and it's brand placings:

n a new interview with Reuters, General Motors VP of North American sales Brent Dewar said the automaker will put an increased emphasis on marketing its eight brands individually. Last year, GM tried to emphasize the connection between its many brands, with a mixed reaction from consumers. However, when it comes to sales, GM will continue to consolidate. GM will continue to combine Pontiac, Buick and GMC dealers. It will also group its Cadillac, Hummer and Saab brands together in many cities. Dewar said GM will also increase ad spending targeting its sport-utility vehicles and trucks.

Doesnt it just make sense to sell Saab, Hummer, and Cadillacs together in the first place? Call me crazy, but this is something they should have been doing years ago. Although, its funny. Fox Motors just built a new Saab showroom, and their new cars might have to go to Harvey Cadillac/Hummer. Tee Hee!

 

[Sniffs]

my version.

1. chop everything but caddy, chevy, GMC, and pontiac.
2. Foreign Concerns: let the country take them back and try to run them (why they bought SAAB in the first place, when they seemed to be doing fine, I'll never know)
3. leave caddy where it's at...chasing MB/AMG
4. Chevy is the bargan basement
5. GMC takes ALL the Utility, except a full size PU
6. Pontiac goes sporty, and stays there

 

[Kent]

If I was given the chance to change GM I would do several things...
Relating to GM's American brands...
First I would take the time to re-evaluate my competition.
This would lead me to Japan and inturn I would adjust my product line as such:

Keep the Cobalt (work on developing and refining the 4-door style since it is being killed by Civics and Corollas).

Re-introduce the Camaro retro-style much like the newest mustang. 👍
Right now there is a serious void in the RWD 18-30k American car market (especially if you want something good looking and semi-light weight).

Those two actions alone would be enough to make me happy with GM.

To get really serious about re-vamping the company I would take an approach similar to what Sage has already mentioned.

However, I would down size the SUV product line and consider re-styling many of the current cars.
As stupid, cheap, cheesy and un-original as it sounds, I would try to re-shape GM with the new world of car market competition in mind.

Ford is not who I would worry about... The Japanese are who I would worry about.
Re-shape the company's products to compete with Japan's companies and everything else would fall into place. 👍

Any way, those are just a few of my thoughts... Wish I had more time to get into this discussion but for now I must run.
Later.

 

[STLbarcelona5]

Um, STL, the VX220 is being replaced by the Saturn Sky (actually the Opel GT, which can all be traced back to the Pontiac Solstice). Didnt you get the memmo?

About the 171HP engine: You do realise that the engine is based off an Opel design, and throughly re-tuned for the American market by substantially increasing the torque? Making 166lb-ft of torque is pretty good, and explains why the car keeps up with the lighter MX5 even though it shouldnt.

Yeah its just that the Sky is 800 POUNDS more than the VXs 2050lbs. So regardless of the extra torque, it still doesn't negate the fact that the driving characteristics are going to be drastically different. On top of the fact that they moved the engine to the front.

Now yes I know that Saturn bought the rights to the front-engine opel speedster, which opel decided they would not produce. But I dunno, I think im just more irritated about them taking a wonderful car, reducing the power, and then adding 800 lbs.

 

[YSSMAN]

Saturn didnt buy anything from Opel, in fact, Opel had nothing to do with the Saturn Sky. The origional concept was developed by Pontiac under the direction of Bob Lutz in 2002. The chassis was developed by taking the baisic design of the Y-Body (Corvette, XLR) and shrinking it down to 60%. Thereafter, Pontiac used bits and pieces off of other GM products, such as the door handles from the Cobalt, HVAC and Radio from the H3, transmission from the Colorado, and some other lights/etc. from other models to keep the car's cost down and increase the possibility of production.

...Saturn's model was an afterthought in 2003, after the Solstice was greenlighted. Saturn openly admitted that their car was styled after the Vauxhall VX Lightning concept from the year before, and GM made little concesssion that the new Kappa cars were going to be the replacements for the Elise-based VX220 and Speedster.

You have to keep in mind that in America, we had a little car called the Fiero back in the '80s that was quite a mess for Pontiac. That alone is a good reason why the Solstice was front engine, rear wheel drive. Beyond that, you also need to keep in mind that many Americans have a fasination with small sports cars, particularly those built in the vein of the traditionalist MGAs and Triumph TR6s.

I wouldnt worry too much about the performance differences. The Solstice is close enough to the Mazda MX5 to take sales away, and overall it is cheaper, so that is a big plus. Although the Saturn version may be a bit sportier, the differences are going to be minimal. Plus, the GXP and Redline versions are on the way with the 2.0L direct-injection turbo engines with 260HP, and I'm sure thats plenty to keep up with the old VX220 Turbos.

 

[RVDNuT374]

My GM reshaping plan:

1. Get rid of the majority of the UAW workers and replace them with robots. (in a perfect world)
2. Break off some of the companies GM bought out and let them be independent once again. (except Daewoo, sell them to Hyundai)
3. Keep Chevy, GMC, Buick, Pontiac, Hummer, Holden, Vauxhall and Cadillac. Kill off the rest of the brands not broken off. GM does not need 200 versions of one car.

 

[STLbarcelona5]

Saturn didnt buy anything from Opel, in fact, Opel had nothing to do with the Saturn Sky. The origional concept was developed by Pontiac under the direction of Bob Lutz in 2002. The chassis was developed by taking the baisic design of the Y-Body (Corvette, XLR) and shrinking it down to 60%. Thereafter, Pontiac used bits and pieces off of other GM products, such as the door handles from the Cobalt, HVAC and Radio from the H3, transmission from the Colorado, and some other lights/etc. from other models to keep the car's cost down and increase the possibility of production.

...Saturn's model was an afterthought in 2003, after the Solstice was greenlighted. Saturn openly admitted that their car was styled after the Vauxhall VX Lightning concept from the year before, and GM made little concesssion that the new Kappa cars were going to be the replacements for the Elise-based VX220 and Speedster.

You have to keep in mind that in America, we had a little car called the Fiero back in the '80s that was quite a mess for Pontiac. That alone is a good reason why the Solstice was front engine, rear wheel drive. Beyond that, you also need to keep in mind that many Americans have a fasination with small sports cars, particularly those built in the vein of the traditionalist MGAs and Triumph TR6s.

I wouldnt worry too much about the performance differences. The Solstice is close enough to the Mazda MX5 to take sales away, and overall it is cheaper, so that is a big plus. Although the Saturn version may be a bit sportier, the differences are going to be minimal. Plus, the GXP and Redline versions are on the way with the 2.0L direct-injection turbo engines with 260HP, and I'm sure thats plenty to keep up with the old VX220 Turbos.

ooook. It's just that I remember watching Top Gear, and Jeremy Clarkson said directly that there was a front-engine Opel Speedster, that Opel never decided to produce, and then they sold the rights to Saturn.

But, whatever. Guess he was wrong.

 

[YSSMAN]

...Well, I'm sure that once Clarkson drives the car, he will probably talk about how great it is, and then after finding out the Opel GT was built in Kentucky after being designed in America, he will probably call it one of the worst cars ever made.