If GT5 does incorporate a livery editor...

[BlacqueJacques]

Track Maker! Not editor!

I am at the point that all complainers of GT5 should just wait for GT6 then

 

[terminator363]

WOW what a stupid thread

 

[BlacqueJacques]

WOW what a stupid thread

Agreed:tup:

 

[CoolColJ]

I'd rather have a track maker we have GT5 over a full blown livery editor any day!
One will enhance long term value and gameplay more than the other. One will just modify superficial appearance...

Even fiddling with the decals in Mod Nations, various other drift games, and Trackmania games was too much effort and a snore fest to be worth it. I mostly just pick a colour and plunk down some stickers and words and that's all I need. GT5 may well have that, which isn't a full livery system, but is sufficient IMO

 

[regnar]

I would assume PD biggest challenge at this time, in implementing a Livery Editor, wasn't the editor itself, but the challenge of setting up a proper infrastructure to manage (police) the images from improperness &/or copyright issues arising from outside images being brought into the game, assuming the ability to access USB still remains. I think they might in part been have struggling with the openness of a system for Photomode & a closed system for a livery's Editor.

Forza's approach is a closed system, more manageable, but very limiting for the user that has to create almost every common manufactures decals from scratch. Over the last year I have created about 40 race livery's, but find it sometimes discouraging to make some cars that have very common decals, knowing I have to spend two to three hours per decal to do it right. Sorry personal rant.

 

[VXR]

I do dislike the fact that a reason for not including an editor is because someone finds it personally a chore or won't add longevity to the game. It's just utter selfishness.

 

[XEPEGTP]

You can't sacrifice progress for commodities.

And I understand those saying "Well I dont want to see your manga porn and Spongebob" and so on, NASCAR has M&Ms all over Kyle Buschs car, so it's ok for those silly things to be there?

It's like when you walk out the door, and you see people whos style you might think is appalling but you wouldn't run tell them, "hey I don't know you but I hate your guts"

Little do you know it's some 8yr old GT Protege who can even make his own Spongebob Livs and smoke you with his booster seat DFGT.

And I would rather race him over someone with an accurately modeled ultra high-res authentic race livery, who spent all his time drawing instead of polishing up his dive bombing, exit points and line guarding.

 

[supersquirrel]

its not like itll look pretty with damage...

 

[VXR]

In a game with 800 last-gen compromises, looking pretty clearly isn't Sony's plans for GT5.

I'm sure Kaz would have rather had the 200 premiums only, but the marketing department want numbers for the box.

 

[supersquirrel]

id truly rather have all those cars that ONLY 200 premium.

 

[eSZee]

I do dislike the fact that a reason for not including an editor is because someone finds it personally a chore or won't add longevity to the game. It's just utter selfishness.

It's ridiculous.

 

[lalaurentide]

Better, Track "MAKER" GT5 or Excitebike?

EXCITEBIKE! Nothing on the track, not even a finish line, then race endlessly while triping opponents over and over.

 

[infamousDee]

In a game with 800 last-gen compromises, looking pretty clearly isn't Sony's plans for GT5.

I'm sure Kaz would have rather had the 200 premiums only, but the marketing department want numbers for the box.

My thoughts exactly. It's a terrible shame, because if Sony had come clean and openly presented the fact that content would be limited in Gran Turismo's first seventh generation iteration to the public, as they did with Gran Turismo 3, none of this nonsense would have begun in the first place.

 

[Coxis]

EXCITEBIKE! Nothing on the track, not even a finish line, then race endlessly while triping opponents over and over.

Oh gosh. Man, how much fun did I have playing that game when I was little kid... I loved it. I hated level 5, it was so difficult. It was always fun ramming dudes off the road with your back tire.

 

[VXR]

My thoughts exactly. It's a terrible shame, because if Sony had come clean and openly presented the fact that content would be limited in Gran Turismo's first seventh generation iteration to the public, as they did with Gran Turismo 3, none of this nonsense would have begun in the first place.

Yep, a simple "200+ high definition cars with graphics unrivaled in this generation" and job done.

 

[Vincent Viceroy]

My thoughts exactly. It's a terrible shame, because if Sony had come clean and openly presented the fact that content would be limited in Gran Turismo's first seventh generation iteration to the public, as they did with Gran Turismo 3, none of this nonsense would have begun in the first place.

I couldn't agree more.

End of.

 

[C_Raccoon23]

id truly rather have all those cars that ONLY 200 premium.

Same here.

 

[kartracer2442]

Well since NASCAR 09 gave the opportunity to make schemes for your cars on your computer i got a chance to make some nice liveries myself.

Those are two of my custom cars for NASCAR 09. I made both from scratch alothough i got the logos and the templates from other sites.

 

[Carbonite]

After Reading this thread, i am honestly sick of all the hate with incorporating a livery editor. I mean if you don't like it, Fine! but that should not passed on to those that do like it. Each to their own, true enough but come on guys.

Okay, i will agree that some custom liveries look like absolute crap. No argument from me there, but i mean, the authour likes it and designed so that they find it appealing. they aren't there to please you or Billy bob in his car or anyone else but it is instead there to please there eyes. If you don't like it then tough, either don't focus on there livery, or quit the race. Simple as that.

Which brings me onto my second topic. Are you really going to focus on other racers cars when your driving? or are you going to focus on the track and your racing line, being competitive? 💡 If you choose option 1, then maybe racing online isn't for you. If you choose option 2, then there you go, so who gives a rats ass what Joe blows car looks like while your decelerating from 200 kph to 60 kph to take a turn.

Lastly, there are many talented people out there who not only take pride in creating custom liveries, but also do it to represent either there fantasy racing team, or just to present their artistic talent. For them, it can make any attractive cars, more attractive.

All in all, i do hope the KZ does incorporate a full custom livery editor (not like Forza where you only got like 1000 points i think to customize the car visually> correct me if i am wrong) And that this will allow artists like me and other members on this board to unleash their creative power. And if those members that hate liveries enter a race with cars that do have them, then like i said... put up or get out

 

[Spagetti69]

You get far more than 1000 layers mate but I get your drift.
All the haters will probably have to give GT6 a miss though.

The irony is that if forza has it and gt doesn't, then it's a useless addition. Just like the skidmarks.
They were seen as a waste of time. Now there even talking about a skidmarks competition lol.

 

[CoolColJ]

In a game with 800 last-gen compromises, looking pretty clearly isn't Sony's plans for GT5.

I'm sure Kaz would have rather had the 200 premiums only, but the marketing department want numbers for the box.

Nope, I want the other 800 cars too!
Most of the 800 weren't that satisfying to drive in past GTs, due to the low physics fidelity. GT5 fixes this big time.

And that's all that matters in GT5 at the end of the day, the driving.
A livery editor and other fluff won't make up for poor physics and feel.

I don't know why people get hung up on all the livery fluff and number of cars and wether they have cockpits or not.
Physics and the number of tracks have far greater impact on the experience.
Tracks get boring real fast, the more the merrier

People will only be driving 50 cars at the most on a regular basis, after that you want tons of tracks.
Number of tracks should be the selling point - along with a track editor if anything.

 

[SZRT Ice]

After Reading this thread, i am honestly sick of all the hate with incorporating a livery editor. I mean if you don't like it, Fine! but that should not passed on to those that do like it. Each to their own, true enough but come on guys.

Okay, i will agree that some custom liveries look like absolute crap. No argument from me there, but i mean, the authour likes it and designed so that they find it appealing. they aren't there to please you or Billy bob in his car or anyone else but it is instead there to please there eyes. If you don't like it then tough, either don't focus on there livery, or quit the race. Simple as that.

Which brings me onto my second topic. Are you really going to focus on other racers cars when your driving? or are you going to focus on the track and your racing line, being competitive? 💡 If you choose option 1, then maybe racing online isn't for you. If you choose option 2, then there you go, so who gives a rats ass what Joe blows car looks like while your decelerating from 200 kph to 60 kph to take a turn.

Lastly, there are many talented people out there who not only take pride in creating custom liveries, but also do it to represent either there fantasy racing team, or just to present their artistic talent. For them, it can make any attractive cars, more attractive.

All in all, i do hope the KZ does incorporate a full custom livery editor (not like Forza where you only got like 1000 points i think to customize the car visually> correct me if i am wrong) And that this will allow artists like me and other members on this board to unleash their creative power. And if those members that hate liveries enter a race with cars that do have them, then like i said... put up or get out

Well said.

Also, if you see someone else's car looking crappy, wouldn't that make you feel better about your own car and style? Vinyls are a plus no matter how you see it. Getting angry at someone else's ugly car is pointless. You should be happy about it! It makes your good looking car look that much better by comparison!

 

[Slurm]

While I can see your point about freedom of expression, I think you fail to understand that for many, being surrounded by skulls and zebra stripes and lightning that just wouldn't exist in professional racing, threatens to destroy the realism, immersion and atmosphere of the game. For those people it's an unwanted reminder that yes, this is a videogame, and yes, it's largely the domain of kids. I, myself welcome it. I'm optimistic that the better designs will set trends and we'll get a majority of good looking machines, with a lot more diversity.

You may get very defensive about your designs, but the cars of professional racing series' just don't get painted like that. Part of it is personal, but also I guess a lot of it is down to how good the editor is, so it's important they get it right.

 

[analog]

And that's all that matters in GT5 at the end of the day, the driving.
A livery editor and other fluff won't make up for poor physics and feel.

I don't know why people get hung up on all the livery fluff and number of cars and wether they have cockpits or not.
Physics and the number of tracks have far greater impact on the experience.
Tracks get boring real fast, the more the merrier

People will only be driving 50 cars at the most on a regular basis, after that you want tons of tracks.
Number of tracks should be the selling point - along with a track editor if anything.

What has an impact on the experience is highly personal ( to me cockpit view isn't irrelevant for example ) and just assuming what is important to you should therefore matter to everyone else is simply denying the fact GT can be perceived and experienced in multiple ways.
The driving part ( and therefore the physics ) are essential, nobody's denying that as it frankly is a no brainer.

If the basics are covered ( cars, tracks and a good physics engine ), how does that rule out any possible gameplay addition in the form of a livery editor?
If you're not going to use it ( no interest, no creative skill or opposed to it due to a perceived impurity of the whole concept ) then you can fully focus on the driving aspect of the game only, that's your choice.

For some the choice will be to enjoy creating liveries ( maybe some will find this aspect even more appealing than the driving part, not me but I'm fine with people perceiving the game differently ).
Just because you think it's not essential and just "fluff" doesn't rule out others perceiving it as the main selling point.
What GT should be or should not be about isn't even relevant as the player who buys the game can decide themselves, basically any content put on a disk by PD and branded as GT is GT.
Any new element or addition which extends gameplay and keeps people interested should be welcomed in my opinion as you can leave it to PD to decide whether it will be appropriate in the context of GT.

Strictly speaking anything in a game can be regarded as irrelevant or non-essential, even the physics as a game aims to provide enjoyment or an experience and the combination of all aspects are what matter and the best games ( or products in general ) are more than the sum of their parts.
A car in a videogame doesn't get me from A to B and I only drive them in a videogame because they provide fun and every aspect ( physics and visuals which include cockpit view ) to me is equally important because one faulty or missing element will affect the experience as a whole.
I will not give one element a higher priority or at least won't tell people what I think should be the highest priority as they're all relevant and irrelevant at the same time or can be perceived to be more or less depending on personal preference.

Is a livery editor relevant? Ofcourse not, nothing is relevant in a game as previous iterations also didn't include it. Does it add to the overall enjoyment of the game? To a lot it will, including me and even when previous iterations didn't include it that doesn't mean the development of GT should stagnate and more features and elements added are logical as times move on, why else make new GT-games when the previous ones will do fine?

 

[Mr Frappy]

After Reading this thread, i am honestly sick of all the hate with incorporating a livery editor. I mean if you don't like it, Fine! but that should not passed on to those that do like it. Each to their own, true enough but come on guys.

So, it's OK for people who like it to pass that onto those who don't, but god forbid those who don't like it and pass that onto those who do? Sorry, but forums are not all supposed to be a one-way happy agreement.

Yes, there is always the point of not using it if you don't like it, and that's fine if you don't care what other people think. However, for the vast majority of people a livery editor is a bit of fun that is secondary to the cars themselves and the actual racing. CoolColJ pretty much said it in the last part of his post quoted above.

So, unlike some I'm not going to so diplomatic about it and come across as desperately trying not to rock to boat one way or the other. For me, if they did include a livery editor near the scale of Forza, it would have been a waste of time - time they could have invested in a more comprehensive track editor for example, time spent on adding things that extend the life of the game for everyone, not just those artistic few.

 

[eSZee]

So, it's OK for people who like it to pass that onto those who don't, but god forbid those who don't like it and pass that onto those who do?

The point is that if you don't like it you have a choice to not use it, like you said. You don't need to straight up say I'm not gonna use it so I hope it isn't in the game. However if you do like it and it's not in the game, you have no choice.
It all comes down to being selfish and not having an open mind. I don't on using online mode but I don't go around bashing it.

 

[analog]

So, it's OK for people who like it to pass that onto those who don't, but god forbid those who don't like it and pass that onto those who do? Sorry, but forums are not all supposed to be a one-way happy agreement.

Yes, there is always the point of not using it if you don't like it, and that's fine if you don't care what other people think. However, for the vast majority of people a livery editor is a bit of fun that is secondary to the cars themselves and the actual racing. CoolColJ pretty much said it in the last part of his post quoted above.

So, unlike some I'm not going to so diplomatic about it and come across as desperately trying not to rock to boat one way or the other. For me, if they did include a livery editor near the scale of Forza, it would have been a waste of time - time they could have invested in a more comprehensive track editor for example, time spent on adding things that extend the life of the game for everyone, not just those artistic few.

I won't say that you're not entitled to not wanting a livery editor for whatever reason although I doubt it will be only used by an artistic few, if it were, the majority who oppose it due to the fear of having to deal with all sorts of hideous creations would be reassured to a large extend I guess.
And even if the vast majority doesn't really care for it or treated it like a non-essential bit of fun, why not cater to those who do wish to be creative as they're currently not being catered for as opposed to all aspects you seem to care for as there are plenty of tracks ( sure there can never be enough, I'll agree with you on that but still ) already and a good physics engine seems to be in place to experience them in the way you see fit.

I don't think that time being spend on creating it will affect the time spend on creating more tracks as I think they're already working on it as one of the many possible secret projects ( an assumption ofcourse ) they're constantly working on.
These are just things they probably develop alongside and decide whether to implement them into a game, sure they could stop all those projects and completely focus on adding more and more tracks ( if it even involves the same people working on it that is ) but if the vast majority is already catered for and a new feature could attract new buyers ( "the artistic few" ) or offer existing ones a new way of experiencing the game and thereby selling more copies of the game ( some would perhaps otherwise prefer Forza simply for the inclusion of a livery editor ).
It makes sense to therefore include more elements and features to the game to attract a wider and possibly more diverse audience, the existing ones who are only interested in more tracks will always demand more tracks, can't satisfy those demands alone as they always want more ( which is logical, you can't have too much tracks or cars ).

 

[kartracer2442]

Again I am refering to NASCAR 09 with its method with custom cars. When you enter a race with a custom car, the only people that can see the livery are your friends and everyone else just sees a blank car. In NASCAR 09 it was ugly because half the cars in a race were blank grey cars, but I'm sure that if GT5 is anything similar, it would say make the car a random factory color or something along those lines. This may solve the problem of random people making horrible designs. Let me know what you think!

 

[regnar]

Another option that falls between a Livery Editor and none at all, is something simple, almost like NFS Shift where you have a option to pick frome 4 race livery's.
This might still find its way into the game since it's not a editor. You might be able to select this option from the race modification that Kaz mentioned at Gamescom.

 

[DestinyDanny]

Well since NASCAR 09 gave the opportunity to make schemes for your cars on your computer i got a chance to make some nice liveries myself.

Those are two of my custom cars for NASCAR 09. I made both from scratch alothough i got the logos and the templates from other sites.

Love the Monster livery!, looks fantastic, it would also be great to see some Nascars with european/japanese car stickers like that Subaru, thats awesome!