If GT5 is supposed to be a REAL driving simulator.....then why??

  • Thread starter URBsmkr
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I bought NFSC, and have'nt looked back since...

...I'm going to give PD one more chance to blow me away w/ GT5. If not....it's been nice knowing you guys but it's NFS for the duration of the PS3s life for me...

You think Need for Speed Carbon is a better driving simulator than GT4 or GTHD...? :odd: Why, then, have you been subjecting yourself to the relatively steep learning curve, slow-paced racing and repetitive gameplay of the Gran Turismo series, when you could have been even happier lapping up every Need for Speed release EA has been throwing out since Hot Pursuit 2?

Obviously a diverse selection of cars and accurate physics are of absolutely no interest to you. Trouble is, those two things are (or should be) top priority over at Polyphony Digital headquarters -- in other words, they're what GT is supposed to do better than anyone else. In my opinion, GT4 has fallen short on the physics bit, but it's still closer to realism than NFS:C could ever hope to be.

The only way you won't be dissapointed by GT5 is if you rearrange your priorities when it comes to what you expect from a "driving simulator."
 
Uhh....sorry playboy but you can do ALOT more things to vehicles in NFSC than put huge wings on cars and sweet rims fella! Do you even have the game??Oh yeah and I never said NFS was a better simulated driving game, but it is absolutely more fun to play and well more thought out than GT titles. It's almost like the developers at PD are completely LAME or something, my little 2 yr old nephew can come up with better ideas and features for a video game!! I used to be a diehard GT fan too(still am kind of), but I don't enjoy feeling like a sucker after I buy one and its basically the same game with a tad bit better graphics than the previous one. Also PD has been stringing people along for years talking about all the new features the next gt game will have and when the game is released its " Oh we're sorry but we're are going to hold off on those new features until the next GT game( and they could have kept that wack A@# photo mode).I mean damn......is creativity too much to ask for from a video game developer?
 
Uhh....sorry playboy but you can do ALOT more things to vehicles in NFSC than put huge wings on cars and sweet rims fella! Do you even have the game??
Yeah, like putting on nitrous systems that'll extend the top speed to 215 MPH. Or changing suspension settings by an undescriptive slider.
 
Uhh....sorry playboy but you can do ALOT more things to vehicles in NFSC than put huge wings on cars and sweet rims fella!
What does that have to do with anything I said? Perhaps more importantly, what does that have to do with the question of whether or not Gran Turismo is a good driving simulator?

Do you even have the game??
Yes. My best friend added it to our shared PS2 library of games, and I have played the PC version.

Oh yeah and I never said NFS was a better simulated driving game...
It certainly seemed to have been implied, at least the way I read it. My mistake.
 
No disrespect, but the PS2 version and the PC version should'nt even be mentioned in the same thread as the PS3 version! This is next Gen gaming, and PD is really going to have to step their game up, that's all I'm saying!!
 
Oh yeah and I never said NFS was a better simulated driving game, but it is absolutely more fun to play and well more thought out than GT titles.

No and that's a bit strange when you are using it to argue against the GT series in a thread that you titled " If GT5 is supposed to be a REAL driving simulator.....then why??" and started with a post specifically discussing realism...

If GT5 is supposed to be a real driving simulator, then why have they ALWAYS left out the most realistic parts of driving a car, like skid marks,damage, reverse lights(no matter how insignificant, it helps with the realism of the game) damage, car horn, the ability for SOME cars to do donuts etc. etc. And why does the ferraris engine on GTHD sound just like the Infiniti and most of the other cars in the game?

....you need to be specific as to what you define realistic to be, as I have already mentioned, you appear to be after something very different to most of us here.


.....and they could have kept that wack A@# photo mode).I mean damn......is creativity too much to ask for from a video game developer?
And a quick look at the hundreds of threads and thousands of posts regarding the Photomode, competitions, etc will show that you are most certainly in a minority on this one.

Regards

Scaff
 
I don't mind having opinions that everyone does'nt agree with, in fact I enjoy it. But please explain to me what is sweet about photo mode? There are'nt even enough vehicle options to enjoy sharing photos, millions of people will probably be showing photos of identical cars!
 
It's not just the car, it's the location, the angle of the shot, the lighting ect, getting it all right for that perfect shot. Photography is an art, if your not into it you won't enjoy it as much as someone who is. Personally I'm not that into photography, but I do understand why some people love photo-mode.
 
Also another issue I have with the lack of exiting gameplay in GT series, is the fact that it is hard to find anyone else who likes to play the game with you! Most of my friends are into sports, fighting, and shoot em' up games. when I grap GT4 their like man put that bull^%$# away, nobody wants to play that boring @$$ game. Which really makes the fact that they left out online play for GT4(and still took FOREVER to drop the darn game) a tough pill to swallow!That's another reason i really want PD to step up gameplay, so you can paly w/ your friends, and show the game off.
 
Also another issue I have with the lack of exiting gameplay in GT series, is the fact that it is hard to find anyone else who likes to play the game with you!
I don't think you can blame a game for not having the right friends.
Everyone has their special interests, including entertainment, so maybe find some that don't smoke herbs.

From what I've read so far, it seems as if you will turn an argument around the way you want, so take our advice as you will. Face it. GT hasn't supplied everything you want nor everything we want, in the way we all want it. The reasons for that are well known and well documented in just about every GT forum, including this one.

Cheers,

MasterGT
 
I don't mind having opinions that everyone does'nt agree with, in fact I enjoy it. But please explain to me what is sweet about photo mode? There are'nt even enough vehicle options to enjoy sharing photos, millions of people will probably be showing photos of identical cars!
Do you have any interest in photography or have you ever looked at a well composed and structured pictured and admired it? I can guess from your answer that its a no, otherwise you wouldn't ask that question.

As has already been said, even with a finite number of cars and courses, that still leaves a huge level of variation in track position, angle, composition, lighting, etc; all without adding editing such as Photoshop into the mix.

Just because a number of people photograph the same car (even at the same track) does not make the photos the same, as I already mentioned, even a quick look around the photomode sub-forum and in particular the competitions quite clearly shows this.
having just reached the 100th week of running for the standard competitions.



Also another issue I have with the lack of exiting gameplay in GT series, is the fact that it is hard to find anyone else who likes to play the game with you! Most of my friends are into sports, fighting, and shoot em' up games. when I grap GT4 their like man put that bull^%$# away, nobody wants to play that boring @$$ game. Which really makes the fact that they left out online play for GT4(and still took FOREVER to drop the darn game) a tough pill to swallow!That's another reason i really want PD to step up gameplay, so you can paly w/ your friends, and show the game off.
Don't blame GT for your friends interests and likes, you may have noticed that this is a rather active and thriving community of people who, on the whole, do love to play GT. So as a point you are a bit wide of the mark.

Now I fully agree that its a shame that GT4 did not include on-line, but what exactly would that have done to change you friends opinions? I would guess nothing.

You have also still failed to address a question I have asked you a number of times now, and that is exactly what element of a racing game you consider important to make it realistic.

Regards

Scaff
 
Also another issue I have with the lack of exiting gameplay in GT series, is the fact that it is hard to find anyone else who likes to play the game with you! Most of my friends are into sports, fighting, and shoot em' up games. when I grap GT4 their like man put that bull^%$# away, nobody wants to play that boring @$$ game. Which really makes the fact that they left out online play for GT4(and still took FOREVER to drop the darn game) a tough pill to swallow!That's another reason i really want PD to step up gameplay, so you can paly w/ your friends, and show the game off.


My 13 year old nephew has the same problem, he loves GT4 but all his friends thinks its boring (like he did once with GT3 until he started playing it with me) and all his friends want to play NFS Carbon. Why?...... They are 13, 13 year olds usually love tacky things.

I play GT4 and so do almost all my friends and none of them like NFS since the first two, mind you we are all in our 20's.
 
Don't blame GT for your friends interests and likes, you may have noticed that this is a rather active and thriving community of people who, on the whole, do love to play GT.

And drive/fly to other countries to take part in social GT4 gatherings...
 
It's not just the car, it's the location, the angle of the shot, the lighting ect, getting it all right for that perfect shot. Photography is an art, if your not into it you won't enjoy it as much as someone who is. Personally I'm not that into photography, but I do understand why some people love photo-mode.
Do you have any interest in photography or have you ever looked at a well composed and structured pictured and admired it? I can guess from your answer that its a no, otherwise you wouldn't ask that question.

As has already been said, even with a finite number of cars and courses, that still leaves a huge level of variation in track position, angle, composition, lighting, etc; all without adding editing such as Photoshop into the mix.

Just because a number of people photograph the same car (even at the same track) does not make the photos the same, as I already mentioned, even a quick look around the photomode sub-forum and in particular the competitions quite clearly shows this.
having just reached the 100th week of running for the standard competitions.
Excellent points LFS & Scaff. With over 700 cars, multiple color choices, over 50 tracks, countless areas on each track, multiple special areas dedicated to photomode, and of course an immeasurable amount of different areas on each track and different ways of taking each shot, you are looking at billions and billions of possible variations available in photomode.

Personally, I'm not into it it, but obviously many are! There are over 3,000 threads on GTP's Photomode board, nearly 150,000 posts, and about 10 million views of those threads. Yeah, I'd say photomode is quite popular with many people.



Don't blame GT for your friends interests and likes, you may have noticed that this is a rather active and thriving community of people who, on the whole, do love to play GT. So as a point you are a bit wide of the mark.
And drive/fly to other countries to take part in social GT4 gatherings...
And this is just among GTP folks. I am fairly new here, and I have been participating in local GT events outside of those organized by GTP members for several years. As MasterGT & Scaff said, don't blame a game on the fact that you do not have friends that appreciate playing it, or with you.




Judging by the following observations, and that URBsmkr is a new member, I wonder if he has some other agenda, and isn't interested in addressing key issues or actual facts about Gran Turismo:
You have also still failed to address a question I have asked you a number of times now, and that is exactly what element of a racing game you consider important to make it realistic.
From what I've read so far, it seems as if you will turn an argument around the way you want, so take our advice as you will.


Face it. GT hasn't supplied everything you want nor everything we want, in the way we all want it. The reasons for that are well known and well documented in just about every GT forum, including this one.
Exactly, and more to the point even, no matter what kind of game, and no matter how large, and no matter how great, it will NEVER appeal to everyone in the same way, and that there is always going to be people that will find something to criticize it for... some more than others. :)
 
I'm not the hugest fan of Photomode, but I do like to take photos, and there is something 'special' about being able to take glory shots of a favourite car. I got one of the Oreca Viper spitting fire around Sarthe (I think it was) that I thought looked quite good.

I do quite like photography in real life, though, and I can see where the appeal would be. An example: my friend's 400cui Chev powered HQ GTS Monaro -





A few shots I got of his car. He likes them, and everybody he sent the pics to likes them... I'm hoping to catch a nice candy red RX-4 (mint condition) that lives down the street. Here's hoping...

No game is ever going to live completely up to everybody's standards, even if it is 100% life-realistic. Not only does PD have to attract the purists, but the arcaders and casual gamers as well... Yes I believe there are ways the game could be improved, but as it's the final release (and nothing's going to be changed in it), complaining is pointless - with the exception of feedback for future games. I take it for what it is, as I do with any game. To do anything else just ruins it for me, which then negates the point of buying or playing the game.

Enjoy them for what they are. If Enthusia offers better drifting in your opinion, then drift with Enthusia. It will give you more satisfaction than grinding your teeth over GT4. If racing is better in GT4 in your opinion, then race with GT4. It will give you more satisfaction than grinding your teeth with Enthusia.

The other thing that I make a point of being aware of is the fact that 99% of what is posted on these forums is opinion. If somebody has evidence to back up their opinion, then I give it credence. Anything else is noted as opinion, until I see it for myself. If what they say is true, then I'll accept it. If not, well, that's their opinion, and I have mine. Not to sound arrogant, but maybe to suggest a different take on reading and responding to posts, especially by newer members who aren't familiar with the veterans...?
 
What I'm saying is that after 3 years of production, the best idea for a new game mode PD could come up with is photo mode, that's LAME!!! Is this a racing game or a photography class?
 
Once again, based on the vast popularity of the Photo mode, apparently PD was on to something, although if you are implying PD did nothing more to GT5 in those three years other than photo mode, I suggest you do a closer comparison between the features of GT4 and GT5. For over a year I never touched photo mode, but it took me less than a few minutes to quickly see many of the differences between the two games.
 
What I'm saying is that after 3 years of production, the best idea for a new game mode PD could come up with is photo mode, that's LAME!!! Is this a racing game or a photography class?
Do you have any concept of the differences between objectivity and letting personal bias get in your own way?

There are numerous differences between GT4 and the previous version (doh!) and, if PD wasn't so rushed trying to satisfy everyone quickly, you (we) would also have had on-line, something for which you are pining. Your accusations don't match the evidence.

Just because you think photography of cars is lame, doesn't mean that it is. You have been given evidence that proves your thoughts wrong, but as I mentioned earlier, you have chosen to completely ignore it. Have you never looked through a car magazine and drooled over the pictures of the cars? Now picture the same magazine with just words. Now, that's lame!

Cheers,

MasterGT
 
What I'm saying is that after 3 years of production, the best idea for a new game mode PD could come up with is photo mode, that's LAME!!! Is this a racing game or a photography class?

The second best idea they had was B-Spec Mode. Just be thankful they didn't go ahead with that!


Wait, what? You're kidding? Damn.


Anyway, B-Spec Mode stuffs together two of the most popular formats for games in the world - the biggest selling Playstation franchise (a racing game) and the biggest selling PC franchise (a football management game), giving you a game you can do yourself if you want to, or let an inept, talentless AI engine screw it up badly on your behalf, despite any input you might make.
 
Umm..........you take a car and drive it around the track..........exactly HOW innovative do you expect? There is only so much you can do until you start adding "non car related" features into the games to better them.
And of course.......I find it amazing that your "next-gen game" doesn't look as good as GT4 does on it's 6 year old system..............GT4 is a beautiful game.

NFS ain't innovative...........
Blurring has been done before (driven....automobilia Modelista....among others)
customizing cars have been done before (supercar challegenge, among others))
Modified cars have been done before (NFS, SRS, Forza, SegaGT, among others)
Illegal street racing has been done before (hell...the old test drive games...)
Teams have been done before (half a dozen F1 games, among others)

EVERYTHING in need for speed has already been done to death. And you say it's innovative?
 

Anyway, B-Spec Mode stuffs together two of the most popular formats for games in the world - the biggest selling Playstation franchise (a racing game) and the biggest selling PC franchise (a football management game), giving you a game you can do yourself if you want to, or let an inept, talentless AI engine screw it up badly on your behalf, despite any input you might make.

ROFL. That's one of the funniest descriptions of B-Spec I've heard yet. I've just got to +rep you for that 👍

Seriously, URBsmkr, the game is what it is. People criticise it, which is fair, but at the end of the day it is what it is. They're not going to release a GT4 v2 with everybody's gripes worked out. GT4 stands as it is. You'll find that most of the people around here don't waste their time pining over it, but rather look to the next installment and put what positive input they can into it. At least if you do the same you're not going to be flogging a dead horse and driving yourself aggro doing it.

What is it that you are looking for? We acknowledge your opinion - it's your opinion and for what it's worth that's where it stands. But to start pushing opinion as fact or gospel is a quick way to get shot down in a big hurry. Other people don't think the same way as you. We all have different opinions. Just because you don't like photomode or B-Spec or any other part of the game, it doesn't mean the collective gaming populace is going to suddenly agree with you, throw down the game and go protesting outside PD headquarters. Hell, I'd love a refined version 2 for now, with bugs and gripes worked out, but PD aren't going to do it. GT5 is their current puppy.

You may think that photomode sucks, but the sheer weight of evidence speaks against you. People use it - there is evidence. People like it - there is evidence. Yes there are people out there who don't like it - there is evidence of that. However, the evidence of people liking and using it far outweighs the evidence that people don't like it. It doesn't mean you have to like it. But it also doesn't mean I have to not like it.

Again, we acknowledge your opinion, and agree that there are people out there who do not like the same things you do not like. But you are going to end up wearing yourself out if you're set on convincing everybody to agree with you. "Gosh URBsmkr, you're absolutely right! You're my hero!" Not going to happen. At the end of the day you'll just get shot at, and probably end up being told "if you hate it so much, go play something else". One thing I make sure of is that when I am posting my opinion it is known that it is just my opinion. My particular way is to end such a post with the words "Just my thoughts." Then everybody knows exactly what they are. I find it helps, and I don't recall having been 'shot down' yet. My opinions have been picked and disputed, but that's fine. I don't mind being wrong as long as I can learn what's right.

Now understand that I am not having a go at you - I am merely pointing out some obvious things that I believe you would benefit from taking notice of.

"Is this a racing game or photography class?" Since photomode doesn't even contribute to the completion of the game, then your comment has no relevance to the game. If you had to take good photos to advance in the game, then I'd give it credence. However photomode is an easter egg - a nice little bonus that people can use for their own enjoyment. Even B-Spec is an easter egg. You can get through the entire game without having to use it if you didn't want to. So I would say that GT4 is indeed a racing game - a racing game with a couple of easter eggs.

The fact that so many people use the two easter eggs tells me that, right or wrong, maybe PD knew what they were doing. Again, it's not like they're mandatory to complete the game. In other words, you don't have to use them. Pretend they don't exist - it won't make a difference to the gameplay.

All I have to say is: less time arguing = more time driving... why am I here talking this gibberish then? :dunce:

I'm outta here! Nordschleife here I come! :sly:
 

Anyway, B-Spec Mode stuffs together two of the most popular formats for games in the world - the biggest selling Playstation franchise (a racing game) and the biggest selling PC franchise (a football management game), giving you a game you can do yourself if you want to, or let an inept, talentless AI engine screw it up badly on your behalf, despite any input you might make.

I couldn't disagree more. I think it adds a new dimension. It's interesting to place a car you've tuned into the hands of someone else, even if you can control aggression and what not. Often, this leads to close race finishes which are exciting to watch.

It's also a good test of the settings themselves.
 
May I ask the original poster what new things have been added to NFS lately? NEW ideas?
 
Another good thing about Photo Mode is that you can capture an artistic image of something cool you did. If it wasn't a good and popular idea, Turn 10 wouldn't have copied it into Forza 2.

I agree with the above posters. Make your case and then let chips fall. And play whatever game you like. Go on boards that support the enthusia of that particular game and share the love.
 
I couldn't disagree more. I think it adds a new dimension. It's interesting to place a car you've tuned into the hands of someone else, even if you can control aggression and what not. Often, this leads to close race finishes which are exciting to watch.

It's also a good test of the settings themselves.

It was mainly for comedic effect. Let us not forget that I posted up a list of every (arcade) car in the game's B-Spec times around Trial Mountain, which is how I can put together competitive car lists for LANs.
 
Yeah, even PD was the first to have a photo mode, so it has to be good if they stole it.

Cheers,

MasterGT
GT4 was not the first racing game to include some sort of photo mode, let alone the first game.
 
I thought the last half might have been referring to Turn 10 :lol:, no worries.
 
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