is the new physics on par with pc sims?
- Thread starter Brainhulk
- 52 comments
- 3,783 views
- 1,130
- Mexico City
- ppmike921
- MikeB0ssMan
Nope, lol.
TheeFrogmanlego
(Banned)
- 1,546
- Downey
- frogmanlego
On a console there the closest thing but far from .
- 7,830
- U S A
- Tetsumura
- Nigel Fox
I will be the voice of dissent, because I've played almost everything but Richard Burns Rally and iRenting, along with any pre-release rF2 and P CARS demos. And after doing a run with the GTRs and Live For Speed a few months ago along with Forza 4, I've concluded that GT5 and Forza 4 are so close to the realism of anyone's hoighty toighty PC sims, it's not worth arguing over. And I'm willing to bet that no one torture tests their PC sims like I did Live For Speed - awesome experience by the way.
But yeah, GT5 made me quite happy so I'm even more pleased and disinterested in PC sims because of the GT6 demo. *still grouches at hard compound tires*
But yeah, GT5 made me quite happy so I'm even more pleased and disinterested in PC sims because of the GT6 demo. *still grouches at hard compound tires*
- 11,914
- Marin County
In my opinion, close enough. PC sims are no fun. GT and Forza are fun.
[/opinion]
[/opinion]
- 10,958
- Canada
- 1,214
I agree GT6 driving physics are close enough to PC sims.
- 623
- Massachusetts
- MrTimmyA
I always felt that Gran Turismo's physics (bar understeer happy GT4) were good enough.
Once you start to get too real, the game becomes tedious, and no longer fun. But, if they are too arcade-like, then the same applies.
Having a perfect blend of realism, with that hair of "you probably couldn't get away with that in real life, but, it still feels real" works good enough for me.
Others will disagree.
Once you start to get too real, the game becomes tedious, and no longer fun. But, if they are too arcade-like, then the same applies.
Having a perfect blend of realism, with that hair of "you probably couldn't get away with that in real life, but, it still feels real" works good enough for me.
Others will disagree.
- 11,914
- Marin County
I agree with your general position, but not your reasoning. I don't think realism necessarily means tediousness, because if that were the case GT6 would feel more tedious than GT1, which it doesn't really.
The real issue is that most 'hardcore' PC sims devote so much of their development to purely the handling model (and the multiplayer racing aspect) that a lot of the things that general car enthusiasts (general car enthusiast does not necessarily mean racing enthusiast) enjoy can not be implemented in games like iRacing or Rfactor because it's simply too broad of a scope to be handled by the small teams. GT and Forza embrace multiple car cultures, whereas the PC sims only (but fully, I must say) embrace the racing culture.
In this respect, I find the Forza and GT series infinitely more compelling because it's about THE CARS and not the technicalities of racing. It's essentially motorsports and car culture distilled for FM and GT. This is a more broadly appealing subject than iRacing or any of the other PC sims could ever hope to achieve, so the elitists merely scoff and say the physics are better. I honestly couldn't care less that they are, the games themselves are severely limited.
Get back to me when I can put TE37s on a VW Bus on iRacing, I might pay attention.
(I will say that iRacing has been making some pretty phenomenal developments in sound quality putting it ahead of the too-hollywood Forza and too-experimental GT, but it's still not enough to make it fun)
- 7,623
- Exorcet
- OE Exorcet
Realer is better(er).
I don't think people race in real life because its tedious.
Of course it's a personal thing where on the realism scale you like to be, but I don't see pure simulation as really have any drawbacks compared to a dumbed down version. And then there is the obvious benefit of being able to transfer more from one (sim/real life) to the other.
Having a perfect blend of realism, with that hair of "you probably couldn't get away with that in real life, but, it still feels real" works good enough for me.[/QUOTE]
What feels real may change with what you know though. If one group doesn't care too much, but another does, it makes sense to satisfy the latter. The more lax group won't feel a difference while the other group will appreciate the increased realism.
GT is advertised as a sim, and I'm going to hold PD to that.
- 1,124
- TexasTyme214
I can change the clock to play with the GT3? Say no more!
Mini Stiggy
Premium
- 4,202
- Grove City, Ohio
- I__like_oranges
Don't think you can anymore because they took the event off the screen, now there is only the two GTR events to choose from.
- 1,124
- TexasTyme214
I wondered why that happened. That makes a lot of sense. Oh well.
If a PC sim is particularly difficult to drive, it's probably not actually all that realistic. The PC market is flooded with wannabes just like the console market is. Real != Difficult.
With that in mind, I would never settle for the level of simulation that games like GT and Forza offer today. Both titles are still lacking in fundamental areas, but the kicker is that if you patched those up, 90% of players would probably never notice, no matter how "casual" they are. Gran Turismo has its sterling reputation, and Forza has its eminently accessible driving assists...
With that in mind, I would never settle for the level of simulation that games like GT and Forza offer today. Both titles are still lacking in fundamental areas, but the kicker is that if you patched those up, 90% of players would probably never notice, no matter how "casual" they are. Gran Turismo has its sterling reputation, and Forza has its eminently accessible driving assists...
dsgerbc
Premium
- 2,577
- dsgerbc
And that will happen in ... never.
I agree with your general description, but there's nothing wrong with playing both console and PC sims. I like iRacing physics better, but lately I mostly just use it to lap different tracks on my own. For fun racing and other parts of car culture you refer to I come to GT.
- 4,741
- Bogota,Colombia
- GTP_ARP93
I completely agree with what you said.
My problem with iRacing, besides the outrageous costs, is that it's too difficult to be real. Sure, the cars might react very equal to how real cars react, and you can praise the tyre model and the laser-scanned everything for as long as you like but the thing is that you don't get something that you get in real life and makes driving on the limit so much more manageable: feedback. You need to feel the sense of speed, you need to sense the gravity in a turn, you absolutely need the "in the pants" feeling. Without all those advantages real life gives, you're just putting yourself trough an innecesarily demanding challenge, in my opinion.
- 6,318
- West Virginia
- HBR-Roadhog
- HBR Roadhog
I like realism I like the way some of the PC sims feel. Haven't tried IRacing, I did play GTR2 a bit and a few others. The main thing that left me wanting was that they were just about racing. I really like the aspect in Forza and GT of being able to start with some cheap little grocery getter and take it to the track to try and earn some money to upgrade it or buy a better car be it online or offline. I like collecting the cars and I like earning the credits to buy them, I also like upgrading and tuning them and much of that is just not present in the racing sims.
^ I've always faced a similar conflict of interests, which is how I ended up forming a bond with Enthusia Professional Racing and Forza Horizon. Both are more realistic than the usual console game, yet more of a "game" than the usual PC sim. At the same time, they both eschew racetracks in favor of roads -- albeit closed street circuits in EPR's case (plus Tsukuba and the Nordschleife).
I've never turned my wallet inside out to give iRacing a try, but I've read that an update to the tire model rendered road-racing cars undriveable, to the point that top-ranked drivers and even the professionals who play the game all agree that they're garbage. Apparently, the oval racing cars don't suffer the same problem (the developer used to make NASCAR games), but I've never been a fan of oval racing, so I have little incentive to sign up and see for myself.
With the caveat of having never tried iRacing, I believe Live for Speed is the most authentic driving experience you can find on PC. It doesn't just have the physics chops, it also nails the feedback aspect you're talking about. 👍
I've never turned my wallet inside out to give iRacing a try, but I've read that an update to the tire model rendered road-racing cars undriveable, to the point that top-ranked drivers and even the professionals who play the game all agree that they're garbage. Apparently, the oval racing cars don't suffer the same problem (the developer used to make NASCAR games), but I've never been a fan of oval racing, so I have little incentive to sign up and see for myself.
With the caveat of having never tried iRacing, I believe Live for Speed is the most authentic driving experience you can find on PC. It doesn't just have the physics chops, it also nails the feedback aspect you're talking about. 👍
- 4,323
- 185
- Helsinki
- RattijuoppoFIN
Lets get something straight. Realism is not equal to tedious or "hard" handling. Realism is defined by mostly the suspension and tire models and there general appeal. Realism is where the car reacts similarly to reality.
Example racing cars being more brutal and unforgiving and road cars with road tyres being more forgiving. It doesn't mean that realistic handling equals hard or twitchy driving.
I think as far as the GTA demo the suspension behavior and movement is fairly realistic. The car rolls and has more weight movement on the track. Also you have an increased feel of where the weight and therefore grip is and what the car is doing.
Can't say the same about racing cars as there isn't one to drive atm.
The tire model on the other hand isn't even close to the suspension model. Oversteer kills forward momentum in reality as opposed in the demo.Also the tuned Z was on slicks and there were no snap off oversteer present.
Ignore this as the Z is on sports hard tyres. My bad.
All in all the demo is a huge leap forwards and some aspects are indeed very close to the best PC sims though the overall experience is not quite there yet. This dosn't mean that GT6 will be arcaidy.
That is a deeply over exaggerated example. Still must be fun.
Example racing cars being more brutal and unforgiving and road cars with road tyres being more forgiving. It doesn't mean that realistic handling equals hard or twitchy driving.
I think as far as the GTA demo the suspension behavior and movement is fairly realistic. The car rolls and has more weight movement on the track. Also you have an increased feel of where the weight and therefore grip is and what the car is doing.
Can't say the same about racing cars as there isn't one to drive atm.
The tire model on the other hand isn't even close to the suspension model. Oversteer kills forward momentum in reality as opposed in the demo.
All in all the demo is a huge leap forwards and some aspects are indeed very close to the best PC sims though the overall experience is not quite there yet. This dosn't mean that GT6 will be arcaidy.
That is a deeply over exaggerated example. Still must be fun.
Last edited:
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
I thought the tuned z was on sports hard tires ?
- 6,318
- West Virginia
- HBR-Roadhog
- HBR Roadhog
- 185
- Helsinki
- RattijuoppoFIN
EDIT: Your right they are! Interestingly the tire feels so much like a slick tyre.
Perhaps that is what a semi-slick sports tyre should feel. I'm gonna edit my original post.
