Islam - What's your view on it?

[TenEightyOne]

You know the funny thing about Hadith...many of them don't actually have strong supporting evidence if the actual Hadith was actually the words and actions of the prophet Muhammad himself.

How is that relevant to the New Testament... oh, wait

 

[kennylmao]

Yes, I read it. Some surveys show very different levels - around the level that Americans-in-general were at 15 years ago.

Source please.

Farting out "99%" is just nonsense.

You're right, the guy was wrong. Just did some simple math and it's actually 96.62% who think homosexuality is morally wrong, not 97% - 99%.

 

[TenEightyOne]

You're right, the guy was wrong. Just did some simple math and it's actually 96.62% who think homosexuality is morally wrong, not 97% - 99%.

Hmm, I get 85% just from those figures but there you go. Only 35% of Americans surveyed in 2014 thought that homosexuality was morally acceptable, I'll find you an older source that shows that percentage was much lower in the early 90s.

 

[fumunaplz]

Hmm, I get 85% just from those figures but there you go. Only 35% of Americans surveyed in 2014 thought that homosexuality was morally acceptable, I'll find you an older source that shows that percentage was much lower in the early 90s.

There is nothing wrong with thinking something is morally unacceptable, there is something very wrong with breaking the law over it.

 

[mister dog]

Must have been posted already here, but anyway here it goes:

 

[TenEightyOne]

There is nothing wrong with thinking something is morally unacceptable, there is something very wrong with breaking the law over it.

I don't disagree.

 

[mister dog]

How would you guys feel about Sharia law in the UK in the future? Hypothetically speaking.

 

[ukfan758]

How would you guys feel about Sharia law in the UK in the future? Hypothetically speaking.

No religion should be able to impose their own beliefs on a whole nation. This also goes to Christianity, which unfortunately has significant influence on US law.

 

[mister dog]

No religion should be able to impose their own beliefs on a whole nation.

People tend to look at this as a minority opinion at the moment, but with an ever increasing Muslim population in European countries (due to child birth and immigration), there might come a time where the calls for Sharia law will become louder and louder.

 

[novcze]

Speaking of radical islam in the UK ...

Al-Qaeda terror magazine Inspire urging lone wolf attacks downloaded 55,000 times in UK

... and this was 1.5 years ago

 

[novcze]

How would you guys feel about Sharia law in the UK in the future? Hypothetically speaking.

this video is horrifying, religious nutjobs at their best ... you know what would be even more horrifying, if these muslims are moderates we all hearing about.

 

[Exorcet]

There is nothing wrong with thinking something is morally unacceptable, there is something very wrong with breaking the law over it.

I would think that morality would take a higher precedence than law. Don't let the law stop you from doing what is right.

Of course, if you are going to do something, you should be very sure that what you're doing is right.

 

[dxm8975]

How would you guys feel about Sharia law in the UK in the future? Hypothetically speaking.

To me it appeared like they are calling for establishing the Sharia law in the UK because the incumbent mayor of London is of Pakistani origin... ? Or simply for the fact that the country is getting more and more immigrants from Middle East, even though UK ain't part of EU anymore... ?

Hm so sickening to hear that I dare to say either way, why don't they just try to orient themselves to the local customs / society or at the least to the local communities, it's so wayward and makes zero sense to implore them to make the whole nation / society more comfy for the immigrants with different cultural backgrounds and religious belief, not for their own people I guess...

 

[LeMansAid]

Speaking within the context of better deterrents for crime, at 2mins 19secs - "I'd rather have my hand cut off, than three years in prison". She's an idiot on likely a few levels, not least of which the one where she presented a self-defeating argument.

this video is horrifying, religious nutjobs at their best ... you know what would be even more horrifying, if these muslims are moderates we all hearing about.

A fair question. Though I think that Islam needs reformists, and not moderates, anyway. If I subscribed to the religion, I would see myself as part of the rot if I wasn't pressing for a sweeping change in the all too archaic views of so called moderates.

 

[Scaff]

No religion should be able to impose their own beliefs on a whole nation. This also goes to Christianity, which unfortunately has significant influence on US law.

In the UK (in relation to that video) no religion has the ability to do so (impose). Idiots asking for something and it actually happening are two very different things.

However religion can and does influence all factors of life, in the UK the main influence is still from Christianity (however to a lesser degree that the US)

To me it appeared like they are calling for establishing the Sharia law in the UK because the incumbent mayor of London is of Pakistani origin... ?

Which is not going to get them very far.

Or simply for the fact that the country is getting more and more immigrants from Middle East, even though UK ain't part of EU anymore... ?

Umm the UK is still a member of the EU at present, not that it matters a bit as Immigrants from the Middle East have nothing to do with the EU.

Hm so sickening to hear that I dare to say either way, why don't they just try to orient themselves to the local customs / society or at the least to the local communities, it's so wayward and makes zero sense to implore them to make the whole nation / society more comfy for the immigrants with different cultural backgrounds and religious belief, not for their own people I guess...

Why do you assume that you can apply such a statement globally? Many (and I know quite a few) do, and do so without having to lose self identity.

A rather large difference exists between keeping your own cultural identity (which is fine) and attempting to impose it on others (which is not), as such the former is perfectly acceptable and the latter is not (and would in most cases ens up breaking the law).

 

[novcze]

A fair question. Though I think that Islam needs reformists, and not moderates, anyway.

No doubt about it. But reformation of islam is completely different can of worms ...

If I subscribed to the religion, I would see myself as part of the rot if I wasn't pressing for a sweeping change in the all too archaic views of so called moderates.

You might consider the possibility that people like you are not attracted to a religions like islam so what would you do is somewhat irrelevant

 

[Exorcet]

You might consider the possibility that people like you are not attracted to a religions like islam so what would you do is somewhat irrelevant

There is the case of being born into a religion though. I never decided to be Christian, I was born into it and just took it as normal until I thought about it and threw it away. That provided ample time for someone like me, who is not a fan of religion, to be pretty religiously minded.

In any case, the religion will evolve with time. It's something all religions do and it's one reason why I don't lump all followers of religion into the same box necessarily.

 

[novcze]

There is the case of being born into a religion though. I never decided to be Christian, I was born into it and just took it as normal until I thought about it and threw it away. That provided ample time for someone like me, who is not a fan of religion, to be pretty religiously minded.

You threw it away, which is what like-minded people will probably do in similar situation. It's far more rational thing to do than fight an uphill battle and be reformist and hope for a sweeping change.

 

[TenEightyOne]

No doubt about it. But reformation of islam is completely different can of worms ...

And it's happening and continues to happen. So what?

people like you

Out of interest, how would you describe "people like him"?

 

[ECGadget]

How would you guys feel about Sharia law in the UK in the future? Hypothetically speaking.

That is an interesting question. And to answer it you'd need to understand what Shariah law is. On my part? I wouldn't want it in the UK as a whole. But there are sections that work and are around. Examples: Wills, Marriage ceremonies, funeral rituals, certain types of banking etc. But as a whole, would not, could not and should not work in the UK.

 

[Carbonox]

That is an interesting question. And to answer it you'd need to understand what Shariah law is. On my part? I wouldn't want it in the UK as a whole. But there are sections that work and are around. Examples: Wills, Marriage ceremonies, funeral rituals, certain types of banking etc. But as a whole, would not, could not and should not work in the UK.

Aren't the current, secular laws good enough as it stands?

BTW, I don't understand why marriage or funeral rituals would ever need to be legislated, unless I'm missing something.

 

[mister dog]

That is an interesting question. And to answer it you'd need to understand what Shariah law is. On my part? I wouldn't want it in the UK as a whole. But there are sections that work and are around. Examples: Wills, Marriage ceremonies, funeral rituals, certain types of banking etc. But as a whole, would not, could not and should not work in the UK.

I think it's a matter of take it or leave it (not only partially), and the thing that's worrisome is that many Muslims would love to see it happen, even if it's totally incompatible with a modern secular society.

It's basically a return to the law of the middle ages.

And it's happening and continues to happen. So what?

Where would that be? I can't recall any reformation of Islam. Even the call to it could get you killed by the fanatics...

 

[ECGadget]

Aren't the current, secular laws good enough as it stands?

BTW, I don't understand why marriage or funeral rituals would ever need to be legislated, unless I'm missing something.

Shariah in itself is not exactly the laws people call up. It is far more in depth (so in depth that I'll never really be able to explain it) but as with Islam itself it covers a lifestyle, not just matters of faith. An example would be something like how contractual agreements should all be written down and these are binding. Or that in a marriage ceremony there are certain obligations from both parties that need to be fulfilled as of due course. Stuff like that.

@mister dog it is a little confusing that many would love to see it, when if you ask them what Shariah is they'd not be able to give a whole answer, nor would they be able to explain how it can be applied.

 

[mister dog]

@mister dog it is a little confusing that many would love to see it, when if you ask them what Shariah is they'd not be able to give a whole answer, nor would they be able to explain how it can be applied.

True but they would still want it regardless though as demonstrated in the video i posted. Anyhow like i said it's medieval law and things like chopping of limbs, decapitating, hitting people with a stick and stoning them for silly reasons are part of it.

 

[Scaff]

Aren't the current, secular laws good enough as it stands?

BTW, I don't understand why marriage or funeral rituals would ever need to be legislated, unless I'm missing something.

So you can't marry your cat or leave a corpse in the street?

 

[Carbonox]

So you can't marry your cat or leave a corpse in the street?

I understood that more as in regulations to how a ceremony can be carried out. Nothing that extreme though.

 

[mister dog]

So you can't marry your cat or leave a corpse in the street?

 

[Dennisch]

leave a corpse in the street?

Sure you can, just don't leave any evidence on the scene.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Shariah in itself is not exactly the laws people call up. It is far more in depth (so in depth that I'll never really be able to explain it) but as with Islam itself it covers a lifestyle, not just matters of faith. An example would be something like how contractual agreements should all be written down and these are binding. Or that in a marriage ceremony there are certain obligations from both parties that need to be fulfilled as of due course. Stuff like that.

@mister dog it is a little confusing that many would love to see it, when if you ask them what Shariah is they'd not be able to give a whole answer, nor would they be able to explain how it can be applied.

If all of Shariah Law can be contained within the confines of statues and common law already in existence, no problem. If it isn't a issue of legality but of custom or tradition like how meat is slaughtered then it's not even an issue, do whatever you want. If Shariah law contradicts or contravenes existing laws, no dice. No religion or group of any kind should have laws separate unto itself that are not in line with the existing law of that particular country.

 

[LeMansAid]

That is an interesting question. And to answer it you'd need to understand what Shariah law is. On my part? I wouldn't want it in the UK as a whole. But there are sections that work and are around. Examples: Wills, Marriage ceremonies, funeral rituals, certain types of banking etc. But as a whole, would not, could not and should not work in the UK.

Sharia Law, and all other religious rules and guidelines, have no place in governance, anywhere.... ever. Now, Sharia's laws? That could be different. If there's a good idea there, I'd have no qualms with a government using it, while divorcing it completely from it's genesis (you see what I did there?). It's not just the issue of what the laws are, but also the issue of their raison d'etre. The minutest hint of a "Because God" rationale is an immediate strike out. If a law can't stand up to 100% secular scrutiny, it's off the consideration list. It is the only moral option for people of any religion, and for people of no religion.

Sharia Law? Kill it with fire. Sharia's laws? Show us what you've got.