Islam - What's your view on it?

[aadil717]

Well I didn't give them death threats etc. just because I'm Muslim doesn't mean I will always act or behave in the same way another Muslim will.

Where the incidents in the Middle East happened they do abide by Sharia do they not? So I was just explaining that they have more reasoning to be offended and protest (some did protest in the totally wrong way).
But their beliefs there are technically the law their too, I think. That's all I was saying. I'm not justifying it completely just giving an explanation for why their actions would be like this.

And about the apology; that's on a personal level. Like if someone was in front of me in person and offended me.
If they don't apologise or at least stop then I realise that they will probably continue to offend so I wouldn't want anything to do with them.
And just to clarify I'm not demanding or forcing for an apology, just simply asking - they have the option to refuse - and then that's fine as I won't associate myself with them anymore; simple as that.

 

[Famine]

I'm still not talking about the specific instances of idiots being idiots and bombing/killing/rioting in the name of being offended. I'm just talking about holding others to the standards of your belief set despite them not subscribing to it.

And just to clarify I'm not demanding or forcing for an apology, just simply asking - they have the option to refuse - and then that's fine as I won't associate myself with them anymore; simple as that.

IMO its very wrong to be making fun of The Prophet Muhammed (PBUH) and I would protest against anything like this if it happened in my home town, even country

What's the goal of the protest then? To let the know they broke a rule of yours that they're not constrained by? Are there really no better ways of doing that than turning up, mob-handed, outside their offices?

It's your belief that Muhammed shouldn't be mocked (or, since the Qu'ran states all prophets are equals, Isaac, Abraham, Moses, Jesus...). It's not necessarily the belief of anyone else. Others are not to be held to your beliefs as you are not to be held to the beliefs of others.

 

[Sphinx]

And about the apology; that's on a personal level. Like if someone was in front of me in person and offended me.
If they don't apologise or at least stop then I realise that they will probably continue to offend so I wouldn't want anything to do with them.
And just to clarify I'm not demanding or forcing for an apology, just simply asking - they have the option to refuse - and then that's fine as I won't associate myself with them anymore; simple as that.

I've had first hand experience of offending someone (a Muslim). I simply flew my nations flag within the very nation it represents during the countries national day. I refused to take it down and apologise for the offence as demanded by him.

I guess he put me on ignore thereafter because he didn't ever speak to me again. It wasn't you, was it?

 

[Blitz24]

I've had first hand experience of offending someone (a Muslim). I simply flew my nations flag within the very nation it represents during the countries national day. I refused to take it down and apologise for the offence as demanded by him.

That's the bigger problem I have with Islam (and its one of the only problems I have with it) the fact that non-believers have to conform to their law and their feelings outside of a country that is ruled by them. I find Sharia law to be dangerously encroaching on people's liberties and freedoms. If you are in country X and country X isn't ruled by religion Y, then there really shouldn't be an enclave or any portion of country X that is subject to a law created by country Y unless it is only subjugated upon people who all hold the same belief. Accusing or charging someone in country X for violation of religion Y is beyond ridiculous.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

That's the bigger problem I have with Islam (and its one of the only problems I have with it) the fact that non-believers have to conform to their law and their feelings outside of a country that is ruled by them. I find Sharia law to be dangerously encroaching on people's liberties and freedoms. If you are in country X and country X isn't ruled by religion Y, then there really shouldn't be an enclave or any portion of country X that is subject to a law created by country Y unless it is only subjugated upon people who all hold the same belief. Accusing or charging someone in country X for violation of religion Y is beyond ridiculous.

This, and the trend with Islam in non Islamic country is they always demand autonomy in the end, a region of their own with their own Sharia law, then gradually put effort to change the said country's law to their own through assimilation, whether the other religions in the country want it or not. Look at some South East Asian countries in the past 10 years. Indonesia with Aceh, the tensions in Philippines, Thailand, etc.

Non muslims should take note of these and be aware of the issues that comes.

 

[aadil717]

I guess he put me on ignore thereafter because he didn't ever speak to me again. It wasn't you, was it?

No it wasn't.

BTW: I take it he burnt your house down afterwards, didn't he?

 

[Mark T]

People that are offended by the Prophet drawings offend me. I demand that that they stop being offended immediately and never become offended by the drawings again. if you continue to be offended I will burn your house down.

Alternatively I could avoid reading or looking at anything that portrays people being offended by the Prophet drawings and videos.

 

[ShobThaBob]

ITT we learn that Isalimic society/culture does not believe in freedom of speech.

 

[sumbrownkid]

ITT we learn that Isalimic society/culture does not believe in freedom of speech.

Culture nor Islam has anything to do with freedom of speech. The governments that run the lands Islam is dominant in do not support freedom of speech.

We Americans should know this, as our government conveniently supported these type of governments for years. Shah of Iran? Saddam? Mubarak?

@Famine: You're right that we cannot apply the rules and laws we ascribe to, to someone else that does not believe in our rules and laws. But the issue is that this anger by Muslim is misguided.

The Prophet himself was the target of assassinations, humiliations, mockery, and contempt. But yet he managed to keep his head high and move on. He retaliated only when he had to.

Muslims tend to forget that the Prophet himself said that he is not superior to any Prophets that preceded him. In fact, he reminded people that he was just another man, whose blood was spilled and tears were shed just like anybody else.

The people that do get offended should not take it so personally. They should remember that religion is a personal matter.

That Danish guy has a false idea of Islam, but I'm not gonna lose sleep over it. We have over 1400 years of history to prove him wrong. All he has is a crude drawing.

 

[ShobThaBob]

Culture nor Islam has anything to do with freedom of speech. The governments that run the lands Islam is dominant in do not support freedom of speech.

There are similar demonstrations and reactions from Muslims in countries where Islam is not the dominant religion. The beliefs of those people simply do not correlate and are not compatible with one of the most basic rights we have here in America.

 

[Blitz24]

There are similar demonstrations and reactions from Muslims in countries where Islam is not the dominant religion. The beliefs of those people simply do not correlate and are not compatible with one of the most basic rights we have here in America.

Its not always the governments. Sometimes it is also the imams who try and excise power through this method.

 

[sumbrownkid]

There are similar demonstrations and reactions from Muslims in countries where Islam is not the dominant religion. The beliefs of those people simply do not correlate and are not compatible with one of the most basic rights we have here in America.

Which they are doing peacefully for the most part.

Islam and basic rights are not at odds like you think it is. If Islam gave women the right to property then the notion of basic rights being incompatible is hogwash and typical Western confusion.

Americans don't understand that Muslims don't hate your rights or freedoms. They just hate it when someone happens to mock them or their way of life.

 

[ShobThaBob]

Which they are doing peacefully for the most part.


Americans don't understand that Muslims don't hate your rights or freedoms. They just hate it when someone happens to mock them or their way of life.

I'm pretty sure everyone hates being mocked, that isn't unique to any ethnic or religious groups. Besides, what are they protesting against? Usually, when you're protesting something, you want something to stop. Right?

 

[sumbrownkid]

I'm pretty sure everyone hates being mocked, that isn't unique to any ethnic or religious groups. Besides, what are they protesting against? Usually, when you're protesting something, you want something to stop. Right?

That is a good question. What exactly are they protesting against?

At this point it's just spontaneous anger at the "heresy" they see being shoved at them.

To me it's just ignorance+frustration+nothing else to do.

They would be better served to just ignore any malicious attacks and live about their lives.

 

[ShobThaBob]

Well, the answer is actually much simpler than that. They're protesting the mocking of their religious symbol. They do not believe people should be allowed to say such things about something they believe is holy. That's why people are dying over it and it has spread worldwide - the sentiment isn't something that's localized and attributed to one specific government conditioning the people.

 

[sumbrownkid]

^But the sentiment is, for the most part, localized in the Mideast region.

Muslims in Western countries for the most part again, don't seem too bothered to go protest everyone and everything at the moment.

It's probably because they have it much better where they are instead of in the Mideast. That, and they have a 9-5 job to get to.

 

[OwensRacing]

^But the sentiment is, for the most part, localized in the Mideast region.

Muslims in Western countries for the most part again, don't seem too bothered to go protest everyone and everything at the moment.

It's probably because they have it much better where they are instead of in the Mideast. That, and they have a 9-5 job to get to.

What do you mean by the bolded text?

 

[sumbrownkid]

What do you mean by the bolded text?

Burning flags and trashing embassies. Going "I hate America yada yada yada" and what not.

So far Muslims in the Western world look disinterested, at least what I've seen on the news and personally over here in Florida.

 

[ShobThaBob]

I wouldn't really consider France, Indonesia, and the Philippines to be the Mideast region, and exactly what I meant when I said that it was a belief not heavily impacted by government enforcement.

 

[sumbrownkid]

At least in France they haven't burned embassies or chanted death to america.

Or have they?

I don't know, apparently saying death to america is the hip thing to do.

What Muslim people need to do though, is chill out, smoke a blunt, and play some video games.

 

[Dennisch]

In France, they will burn a white flag.


Also.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 27 (1 members and 26 guests)

 

[OwensRacing]

Burning flags and trashing embassies. Going "I hate America yada yada yada" and what not.

So far Muslims in the Western world look disinterested, at least what I've seen on the news and personally over here in Florida.

Are you saying there will be a moment when Muslims in the western world start to protest?

Just not now?

 

[JediRage]

Non muslims should take note of these and be aware of the issues that comes.

I don't know what the heck is going on in Britian, but articles like this have already started cropping up in its major news publications.

 

[OwensRacing]

I don't know what the heck is going on in Britian, but articles like this have already started cropping up in its major news publications.

They really trying hard to sell the story a silly film caused all this. LoL oh the sheep will graze on anything Mainstream media feeds them.

Research Iceland's debt forgiveness. Then ask yourself why the major media outlets chose to ignore this. They don't want anyone getting any bright ideas. This kind of thing is a huge dent into those Central Banks.

What banks? Federal Reserve for starters is not Goverment owned. That is a private banking institution. Same group owns major banks in almost all countries.

Now they got one going in Lybia too. research it.

The. Maybe you will grasp that news is programming of humans. That is all banker controlled.

Money IS the root of all evil.

Sorry if that is off topic but seems its vital part of the scam being pushed onto people by these higher ups.

This scam has playing religions on each other. Holy wars are bad bad bad.


Divide and Conquer mean anything? Note how much push there is on race and religion in the major media. This is to force division.


We are all humans. We all need food and water. We need sleep. We need each other. For the love of all things please put your personal crap aside and work together.

 

[Scaff]

I don't know what the heck is going on in Britian, but articles like this have already started cropping up in its major news publications.

Its mainly a counter to the campaigns the far right (mainly EDL and BNP) have been running to try and claim that all Muslims are pedophile rapists, not exactly a difficult claim to dismiss by anyone with a modicum of intelligence and not one supported by any actual real data. However the far right and minority groups are currently engaged in a major war of words, with claim and rebutal being made almost daily.


Only today the BNP effectively restarted their holocaust denial phase again...

http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/blog/article/2177/bnp-returns-to-antisemitic-conspiracy-theories

....its pretty much a cycle of mainly inaccurate and/or heavily distorted claims by the far right that has been going on since I was a student (25 years ago) the only difference now is that both sides have a better tool to communicate with (the same one we are using right now).

Holy wars are bad bad bad.

Holy wars are like fighting over who's imaginary friend is best, something adults shouldn't be doing.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Are you saying there will be a moment when Muslims in the western world start to protest?

Just not now?

Perhaps, depending if the issue was really bad, such as segregating Muslims from public places, but I doubt it will ever come to that point.

So far, Muslims over here don't seem too angry like those guys in the mideast. Because over here we understand any opinion, no matter how wrong, misconstrued, or shaky, has the right to be at least heard.

You can consider me among those Muslims who really just don't give a 🤬 about some cheap Youtube video.👍

 

[Blitz24]

Its mainly a counter to the campaigns the far right (mainly EDL and BNP) have been running to try and claim that all Muslims are pedophile rapists, not exactly a difficult claim to dismiss by anyone with a modicum of intelligence and not one supported by any actual real data. However the far right and minority groups are currently engaged in a major war of words, with claim and rebutal being made almost daily.


Only today the BNP effectively restarted their holocaust denial phase again...

http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/blog/article/2177/bnp-returns-to-antisemitic-conspiracy-theories

....its pretty much a cycle of mainly inaccurate and/or heavily distorted claims by the far right that has been going on since I was a student (25 years ago) the only difference now is that both sides have a better tool to communicate with (the same one we are using right now).



Holy wars are like fighting over who's imaginary friend is best, something adults shouldn't be doing.

Is there irony that this is the same thing that fuels some Islamic Holocaust deniers?

 

[JediRage]

Its mainly a counter to the campaigns the far right (mainly EDL and BNP) have been running to try and claim that all Muslims are pedophile rapists, not exactly a difficult claim to dismiss by anyone with a modicum of intelligence and not one supported by any actual real data. However the far right and minority groups are currently engaged in a major war of words, with claim and rebutal being made almost daily.


....its pretty much a cycle of mainly inaccurate and/or heavily distorted claims by the far right that has been going on since I was a student (25 years ago) the only difference now is that both sides have a better tool to communicate with (the same one we are using right now).

One does not have to project extremist views to counter extremist views.

 

[Scaff]

One does not have to project extremist views to counter extremist views.

I must confess I didn't see anything in the link you posted that was much more than historical debate over a myth, I wouldn't count it as extremist at all.

 

[JediRage]

I must confess I didn't see anything in the link you posted that was much more than historical debate over a myth, I wouldn't count it as extremist at all.

What's the myth you are referring to?

Look, I don't want to put you in the difficult situation of having to moderate the discussion (or **** storm) that would ensue by opening that article for debate. So you really don't have to answer that question. In any case, almost all possible viewpoints have been covered in its comments section unless the ones less favourable to the author's views have been moderated by the newspaper.

The only reason I brought up the article was to highlight the extent to which the media will go to push agendas that restrict liberalism in the first place. It's even more ironic when women that possibly may be mothers write such articles and 'recommend' it.

If you have a problem with people in the 'far right' that is fine. It doesn't mean you have to lose your moral compass just to spite them.