Just Raced Under The New Algorithms and Rules

[Sven Jurgens]

It still has some things to iron out. Today on Bathurst I'm coming down the hill side by side. I have the speed advantage yet the car next to me goes too close to the edge, loses control, swerves into me then off the road. I get SR down and 5 sec penalty while all I did was drive in a straight line on the left side of the road.

 

[Draggon]

I dared venture to Monza tonight, just to see how things were going. The car in front of me misjudged the braking of the car in front, hit him, and caused a chain reaction with me getting caught up in it. I got no penalty except for losing a second or two while I recovered. I got a small bump up in SR and the clean race bonus at the end. Amazing. That's the very first time that's happened without the game blaming me.

I think the few races earlier in the day a Bathurst were better than I remember except for one fool that rammed everyone in front of him. Had a few light brushes with the wall and only a hard hit gave me a penalty.

 

[Robben]

I dared venture to Monza tonight, just to see how things were going. The car in front of me misjudged the braking of the car in front, hit him, and caused a chain reaction with me getting caught up in it. I got no penalty except for losing a second or two while I recovered. I got a small bump up in SR and the clean race bonus at the end. Amazing. That's the very first time that's happened without the game blaming me.

I think the few races earlier in the day a Bathurst were better than I remember except for one fool that rammed everyone in front of him. Had a few light brushes with the wall and only a hard hit gave me a penalty.

What's your DR/SR?

 

[GTFraker]

I guess the penalty system is not perfect yet. Look at the pen i got in this race. Slight bump on Snow after he got a bit sideways, and boom, 3 seconds. Chance of winning the race almost over, especially with a M4 just behind me saving fuel like there's no tomorrow with not a lot of performance lost from it.

Before this race i did the nations one on the oval. I bumped and got hit at least 5 times, got no pen and even received a clean race bonus in the end.

Pens are better but really inconsistent.

Far be it from me to give you advice, but you should have reacted accordingly instead of risking bumping him in the back. What if he had lost control of his car leaving you no room to take evasive actions resulting a big hit which have given you even a bigger penalty.

 

[HellzFire]

Far be it from me to give you advice, but you should have reacted accordingly instead of risking bumping him in the back. What if he had lost control of his car leaving you no room to take evasive actions resulting a big hit which have given you even a bigger penalty.

Fair observation. I dont usually keep that close to people but you gotta take into perspective as well that i'm following one of the fastest players in the world. If i lift everytime he goes sideways he will ran away from me. I also had a very fast M4 right behind me. Lifting couldve cost me 2nd place there.

He did a couple of mistakes in this race and i did lift and brake to avoid crashing.

I had a previous race before that one where i bumped accidentally harder than this bump and got no penalties. I was sure nothing would happen so i could stay as close as possible to him. But then, got a pen.

 

[GT_Alex74]

Before 1.13, I noticed the game really didn't like t-boning crashes, even if the guy just spun in front of you, or even if the guy pushed you on grass and you came back into him spinning. I think the game interprets every nose-to-door contact as a divebomb or corner cutting terrorist attack by default.

 

[GTFraker]

Fair observation. I dont usually keep that close to people but you gotta take into perspective as well that i'm following one of the fastest players in the world. If i lift everytime he goes sideways he will ran away from me. I also had a very fast M4 right behind me. Lifting couldve cost me 2nd place there.

He did a couple of mistakes in this race and i did lift and brake to avoid crashing.

I had a previous race before that one where i bumped accidentally harder than this bump and got no penalties. I was sure nothing would happen so i could stay as close as possible to him. But then, got a pen.

I understand your dilemma as I noticed the guy in the back who was on the prowl the whole time, still, when the lead car makes such mistake he is going to lose more time recovering than you lifting a moment to adjust; case in point as you managed to pass him on the same lap.

Close racing is fun and also highly risky, remember last year's incident between Lewis and Vettel? Basically what you experienced here, with the exception that Vettel lost pieces of his end plate after the hit.

 

[Draggon]

What's your DR/SR?

My DR is B, and SR B. My SR went to A after the Monza race I mentioned, but then dropped to B with a win at Brands Hatch because of a bump with the car in front. Based on that being an otherwise perfectly clean race, I'd agree that penalties are more severe in A and S. But the people I raced with last night seem more aware of the penalty system now.

 

[phil_75]

Well i thought it was supposed to be fixed?
Just done 2 races, timer still goes up which means still slow moving obstacles on track and still get penalties for others hitting you.

Was excited to get back after abandoning it for a week but more dissapointment. (This is SS too)

 

[fastone371]

I do not think they made an improvement with the changes. I normally do not fight for position, if the guy behind me is faster and pulls up beside me I will let him by unless its for 1st with a 1/2 lap to go maybe. I try to race without crashing into people, I go as fast as I can trying not to make mistakes, I dont try to run race laps at qualifying pace, I wait for those in front of me to make mistakes so I can get by, it happens frequently. On Sunday I managed to work my way down from a B/S to a C/B, got back to C/S till 1 race this morning. I started Monza in the rear, 12th place, 2 laps in I am passing the 7th place car when he turns into my side and I end up in the sand with a penalty. On the 4th lap I am passing the same person again when he drives into the side of me yet again and I spin with another penalty. Now I am a C/A again, swell. Mind you, this person I took my time passing because he couldnt drive a straight line on the straights, I have no idea why people that drive that bad try to fight for position. With the new SR settings how are you supposed to pass these "wiggle wagons" without getting an SR penalty? I dont care too much about my finish position but I want to get by the cars holding me up, I usually only pass them when I get a great run on them so i spend as little time beside them as possible. I will go back to starting in the rear and attempting clean races till my SR goes back up, even starting on the pole the risk is far too high that the second and 3rd place cars want to pass at the first corner and cause a big wreck. GT needs a class to teach drivers that just because you can put your front bumper next to the the car in front that it doesnt mean its a good idea. There are places to attempt passes and places not to, if you dont have the needed momentum to make a complete pass before a chicane that means its a bad idea. 2 cars going into a chicane will only end in penalties for both unless they are very lucky.

 

[ReDone75]

It's the same here. Today I degraded from B/S to C/D in 5 races. I always do everything to play fair. I kept on racing today to get my B/S back after I got an A status for SR, but every race it got worse. I seriously think about selling my PS4 and go back to PC to race at Iracing or raceroom. The new system is pretty ****ed up if you ask me, since I am a 100% fair play racer. Why dont they use a damage system to get rid of asshole drivers. It's already in the game. When you go in to the pit there's already the head that says repair damage. I don't mind degrading, because I make stupid mistakes, but what happend today is just BS.

 

[GHendrixxson]

This is beyond ridiculous now.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

It's the same here. Today I degraded from B/S to C/D in 5 races. I always do everything to play fair. I kept on racing today to get my B/S back after I got an A status for SR, but every race it got worse. I seriously think about selling my PS4 and go back to PC to race at Iracing or raceroom. The new system is pretty ****ed up if you ask me, since I am a 100% fair play racer. Why dont they use a damage system to get rid of asshole drivers. It's already in the game. When you go in to the pit there's already the head that says repair damage. I don't mind degrading, because I make stupid mistakes, but what happend today is just BS.

Wouldn't a damage system get rid of you as well? The victim is usually off worse when you get pushed into a wall or punted into the car in front of you. Nudging people off track will only increase with damage.

 

[ReDone75]

Wouldn't a damage system get rid of you as well? The victim is usually off worse when you get pushed into a wall or punted into the car in front of you. Nudging people off track will only increase with damage.

That's partly true, but finishing a race and even get a top 5 finish is almost impossible with a damaged car. Off course it will effect me too when I get hit, but in the long term the fair racers will get better ratings. That's what I meant by getting rid off. They won't last very long and thus in the end there will be more fair playing racers.

I had good hope for GT with there new system, since I was a fan of the game since childhood. I never played retail racing games online because of the way people behave. I did play iRacing and raceroom though. It was fun playing these games online, because almost every player tried to avoid accidents, because of the damage system they use. I rather finish last in a good and fair race, then become first at some carnage race.

Like in real life accidents do happen, but when my hard work for a higher rating can be undone in 5 races, because people can't act like the intelligent species we are supposed to be, the system doesn't work.

If you look at my stats, it just doesn't at up.
I sincerly hope I get my ratings up tonight, but if not I will say goodbye.

http://www.kudosprime.com/gts/stats.php?profile=1719240

 

[Sven Jurgens]

That's partly true, but finishing a race and even get a top 5 finish is almost impossible with a damaged car. Off course it will effect me too when I get hit, but in the long term the fair racers will get better ratings. That's what I meant by getting rid off. They won't last very long and thus in the end there will be more fair playing racers.

I had good hope for GT with there new system, since I was a fan of the game since childhood. I never played retail racing games online because of the way people behave. I did play iRacing and raceroom though. It was fun playing these games online, because almost every player tried to avoid accidents, because of the damage system they use. I rather finish last in a good and fair race, then become first at some carnage race.

Like in real life accidents do happen, but when my hard work for a higher rating can be undone in 5 races, because people can't act like the intelligent species we are supposed to be, the system doesn't work.

If you look at my stats, it just doesn't at up.
I sincerly hope I get my ratings up tonight, but if not I will say goodbye.

http://www.kudosprime.com/gts/stats.php?profile=1719240

GT5 had rooms with permanent damage. Most people never ended those races, it was not fun. Someone crashes into you, accident or on purpose, your race is over. Especially at lower DR where people still struggle to stay on the road at speed damage will only make the game worse. Dragon trail Sea side, no one might reach the finish line. Monza, pole might escape, the rest stays at T1.

Fair races are very much possible in GTS and the penalty system is slowly improving. Going over to damage will make things worse as even a bit of lag from one player can end your race. I've gotten far less penalties lately from people crashing into me. With damage most of those incidents would have been the end of my race, at least for being competitive in the rest of the race.

I've never played iRacing or raceroom though. My only experience with damage is with Forza and GT5 and in both it only made things worse. Well rally games have damage but trees always have the right of way

 

[TamasToth]

I'd just fed up 1 day before the last patch, left Suzuka with bad feelings, stolen points. Yesterday I simply not felt that I have to be a test dummy again. Today, as race C was Suzuka, I gave it a try. Maybe in some aspects the system is better, but basically this penalty system is still a joke. I mean a bad one.
Got penalty in T1 when my chaser turned tighter and we had to turn side-by-side. Neither me nor him wasn't agressive or unfair, we left room for each other, but somewhere we slightly touched. Nothing happened to our race lines, I was happy he didn't pushed me wide off, and he could be happy with the inner race line, kept clean for him. I was quite cautious, he had a tad better exit speed, so I lifted off a bit and let him turn into the next in front. We could go on with smile on our face - but I received a penalty. Don't know about him.
In the hairpin, we were 3 in a row, I was in the middle. Got touched from behind and me touched the car in front - but it was so light, that noone left his line (in a hairpin!), everybody went on without even being upset. (I thought every of us was cautious and fair.) Unless I got a penalty again...

Next race, in the pre-race warmup(!) a little Einstein was bombing me from behind. Didn't realize any penalty.
The race was eventless, the 1st guy from pole was quick enough, we had a gap between 1-2s all the way, no contact. The 3rd, behind me, did some mistake in the first lap, so there was a huge gap behind me. I am never close to track limits, didn't realize any penalty, didn't contacted anybody. But it was not declared a clean race (by the stewards ). Literally It wasn't, because of the idiot at warmup, but I don't think this "clean race" has to work this way.

Sorry for being so long. In short: I don't like it, still can not declare it as ready and working well.

 

[Mirror_man]

Guys... Just got reports from several Portuguese players, that several GTS players are "profiting" from the Ghosting issue... by simply putting their car doing spins right in any place of the track (preferably on the finishing/starting line) and as their car ghosts.. it can´t be hit.. nor will hit any one. and so they keep doing it.. until race runs out. and BOOM!!!!...THEIR SR BLASTS UP!!

 

[Alpha Cipher]

Guys... Just got reports from several Portuguese players, that several GTS players are "profiting" from the Ghosting issue... by simply putting their car doing spins right in any place of the track (preferably on the finishing/starting line) and as their car ghosts.. it can´t be hit.. nor will hit any one. and so they keep doing it.. until race runs out. and BOOM!!!!...THEIR SR BLASTS UP!!

Sorry for stereotyping but why is it always the Portuguese that find these? They also found the pit glitch afaik
In essence though, it's the same as riding at the back and driving really slowly to farm SR. And it doesn't really stop them from tanking their DR. But nevertheless, and interesting find

 

[Robben]

Sorry for stereotyping but why is it always the Portuguese that find these? They also found the pit glitch afaik
In essence though, it's the same as riding at the back and driving really slowly to farm SR. And it doesn't really stop them from tanking their DR. But nevertheless, and interesting find

It is interesting until the car doesn't ghost properly and someone gets a penalty for hitting them

 

[ReDone75]

I got my SR up by not qualifying and tthen run a smooth clean race. Off course finishing last or 3 places up, but it got me back to SR S. it did cost me some DR points, but I will et them back soon enough now there are more S drivers around the track.

 

[TheGeologist]

Guys... Just got reports from several Portuguese players, that several GTS players are "profiting" from the Ghosting issue... by simply putting their car doing spins right in any place of the track (preferably on the finishing/starting line) and as their car ghosts.. it can´t be hit.. nor will hit any one. and so they keep doing it.. until race runs out. and BOOM!!!!...THEIR SR BLASTS UP!!

How is that possible? Don't you only get green Srs for every sector?

 

[Mirror_man]

It is interesting until the car doesn't ghost properly and someone gets a penalty for hitting them

This also happened!!! Reported by an SS Portuguese Player! As the car remained on the same place (more or less) doing so through all the race time.. and in one lap at at least, the spinning car did´nt ghost properly!!

 

[Mirror_man]

How is that possible? Don't you only get green Srs for every sector?

if you do it upon the finish line you may be actually passing through 2 Sectors!!!! In each full spin... Maybe that´the catch!!!

The place where this situation is reported, is mostly on that spot... Finish/Starting Line (which is the limit for 2 sectors... the 1st and the last of each race..)

 

[Robben]

How is that possible? Don't you only get green Srs for every sector?

Still a clean race though, so presume this is why.

This also happened!!! Reported by an SS Portuguese Player! As the car remained on the same place (more or less) doing so through all the race time.. and in one lap at at least, the spinning car did´nt ghost properly!!

Yeah, happened to me on BB at the weekend... guy was driving around in circles as he gave up racing, I drove through him and he didn't ghost. Got a 10 second penalty. The ghosting is set to happen too late.

 

[GT_Alex74]

There's so many "exploits" to get SR back to 99 anyway, they should just reset SR (and maybe DR as well) before the official FIA championship, and have like 5 or 10 placement races where they're matched to people with a similar qualifying time. The game could then analyse the driver's behavior and number of incidents during those races and give a SR score accordingly (could also do that for DR as well).

Then, make it so your SR score can't improve much or at all when there's no car around you (like a 1.5 - 2 sec gap). Also, increase the SR points range, at least put it on a 0 to 999 scale. SR S would be like 950 to 999. Range of SR penalties would go from -5 pts to -50 or even -100 pts to punish things from small cuts to big hits sending someone offtrack or deliberate offenses. One lap battling with one or several other cars without incident would grant you like +5 pts, a lap all alone without any cut or wall hit would grant you +1 pt. Also, have people getting a time penalty after the finish line if they racked a big negative score, like -100 pts, and a DQ if they get like -150 or -200 pts.

With this system, a clean racer can have some small incidents or even a big one in a race, and remain SR S if the rest of the race was clean, but he won't have that margin for the next race so he will have to pay more attention. Someone who bumps another car every single corner or throws someone out in the sand every race or two would not be able to remain SR S or get back to it without being more careful in battle. People would not be afraid to actually battle and overtake, even if the SR penalties were to be a bit more sensitive, but that would stillmake them think about divebombing or pushing people wide.

I think I'm going to work that idea further and build a table with all ranks and points, and "test" it by watching a series of replays.

 

[Lord Grey]

Then, make it so your SR score can't improve much or at all when there's no car around you (like a 1.5 - 2 sec gap).

That is a good idea.

 

[fastone371]

The new system really sucks. I have been skipping qualifying to start at the rear. Today I followed a car for 2 laps who was much slower just waiting for the right time to pass. I got him on the straight and drove away but had to take evasive action for a spin in front of me then the guy I followed for 2 laps torpedos me at the apex of the next corner, he was way off line and would have probably pushed up right off the track at apex if I was not there, but I ended up with a 4 second time penalty and he got no penalty. Then I got 2 more penalties because cars near me had bad interweb connections and started "blinking" all over the course until they were in my car with me and I got penalties for both, WTF?????? I could probably qualify on pole or near front 3 spots in these races but then you risk the first corner carnage with drivers flying the Brazilian flag. To be fair though I have had as much trouble with drivers flying the flag of Canada the last couple days. Why do these idiots fight for positions at the back of the field? I usually wait till they drive off track to pass because it will happen but after you pass a car or 2 you need to watch your mirror because while waiting to pass the next car the cars in the back will dive bomb me or try to go 2 wide thru a chicane, really???

 

[Robben]

The new system really sucks. I have been skipping qualifying to start at the rear.

Well, don't do this. The back is much worse than the front.

 

[TamasToth]

This whole "profiting from the Ghosting issue" -thing is a nonsense. And that is just another prove that a penalty system can not work without analyzing the movements for some time pre/post any event. Making donuts can be a good fun but theres no place for that in a race. This movement can be easily identifyed - DSQ. And so on, analyzing movements and results after a contact could help fairly judge penalties, not just dumbly sprinkle away to everybody was ever around.

 

[fastone371]

Well, don't do this. The back is much worse than the front.

I know what you mean by bad drivers at the rear. Im not trying to get to the front, only trying to pass the cars that go off or are incredibly slow, Im trying to get clean races in. Now the I am stuck in the SR/B group the problem with starting at the front is I always seem to be in the group that want to win the the race at the first corner of the first lap, there is almost always massive carnage, especially if the drivers have green home country flags. I will go for pole and cross my fingers tonight I guess.