La Sarthe and Spa ,weather report and other " stuff "

[smoothbore12]

I was going to continue on with the high speed testing but now thinking to just testing for best economy.

It will be great if you can discover another 10 laps car .
Doing less than that isn't so helpful since the weather is almost dry ( for now ).

I forgot to mention, one of my runs that i didn't complete had a small film on rain at the track but didn't continue since i was for sub 34 run .
Other than that nothing , not even moisture.

 

[jrbabbitt]

@smoothbore12
Winner winner, chicken dinner...
With the SF23 at FM6 I was able to pull off the 10 lap no pit race, and win.

I had .2 laps left in tank and my tyres were almost unused. The hardest part was catching the Toyota and after I just followed him in slipstream. Normally the Toyota goes to pit in 6th lap (sometimes on 7th) but this time he jumps in at the end of the fifth(?). Another small piece of info is his driving is not consistent as sometimes he will drive at steady pace and then he will get a burst of speed and pull away.
I have noticed that If you do slipstream behind him, do not bump him as this will make him speed up and pull away and I believe that if he is bumped by the other AI he will speed away also...
All in all it's fun with the faster cars.

@smoothbore12
Funny how you posted above as I was writing this up

 

[smoothbore12]

@smoothbore12
Winner winner, chicken dinner...
With the SF23 at FM6 I was able to pull off the 10 lap no pit race, and win. View attachment 1344547
I had .2 laps left in tank and my tyres were almost unused. The hardest part was catching the Toyota and after I just followed him in slipstream. Normally the Toyota goes to pit in 6th lap (sometimes on 7th) but this time he jumps in at the end of the fifth(?). Another small piece of info is his driving is not consistent as sometimes he will drive at steady pace and then he will get a burst of speed and pull away.
I have noticed that If you do slipstream behind him, do not bump him as this will make him speed up and pull away and I believe that if he is bumped by the other AI he will speed away also...
All in all it's fun with the faster cars. View attachment 1344548
@smoothbore12
Funny how you posted above as I was writing this up

Did you do any fuel saving method ?

I was thinking also about those cars yesterday as and X19 also if they are able to make it.
At least the first one was answered by you.
Great work.

 

[jrbabbitt]

Did you do any fuel saving method ?

Yes, sort of, I start on FM6 and stay there, and coast a little before the turns but mostly slipstream since I can catch the Toyota and we know he usually pits around 6-7 so there is some fuel saved.
Am making a spreadsheet of economy testing... will continually post the table of cars.

 

[kartrcr08]

Decided to take a break from the 34 minute stress, oh so close.. Went for a leisurely stroll through the French countryside in the 919 with only economy and CRB in mind. FM6 and RH for the no stop win and my first CRB . Had 2.5 laps of fuel left and the RH tires could probably do 30-40 laps. With a manual transmission and a little coasting the 919 should no stop on FM4, maybe even FM3 and can make RM last the 10 laps.

 

[kjb]

Decided to take a break from the 34 minute stress, oh so close.. Went for a leisurely stroll through the French countryside in the 919 with only economy and CRB in mind. FM6 and RH for the no stop win and my first CRB . Had 2.5 laps of fuel left and the RH tires could probably do 30-40 laps. With a manual transmission and a little coasting the 919 should no stop on FM4, maybe even FM3 and can make RM last the 10 laps.

That's a good idea. After I stopped worrying about the the money from this race and I just enjoy the race.

 

[smoothbore12]

Decided to take a break from the 34 minute stress, oh so close.. Went for a leisurely stroll through the French countryside in the 919 with only economy and CRB in mind. FM6 and RH for the no stop win and my first CRB . Had 2.5 laps of fuel left and the RH tires could probably do 30-40 laps. With a manual transmission and a little coasting the 919 should no stop on FM4, maybe even FM3 and can make RM last the 10 laps.

So 919 can do 10 laps FM6 and AT ? Or need a bit of fuel saving and at FM6 ?


Chasing the sub 34 is very stressful indeed, you must go flat out , ignore the 0.500 penalties ( its a luxury you can afford ) and stay on the road .
Also you need " warm " fingers if you're controller user .
Took me some days to do it cause i wasn't familiar with such high speeds .

 

[jrbabbitt]

On my search of different cars to use I jumped into my Ferrari 330 P4 and it just could not catch the Toyota, I did get p2 and it actually rained on track that I had to pit for IMs. One more interesting tidbit, if you are still racing on track past 40 minutes, it will get dark fast...

 

[smoothbore12]

I use SF23 today but needed some fuel savings on last laps .
No penalties,no mistakes but one hit little bit harder than usual in the back of a damn NSX ( what else ?) cost me CRB😕

Might not have the top end speed but its amazing how you pass the last part , absolutely flat out !!!!

 

[kartrcr08]

So 919 can do 10 laps FM6 and AT ? Or need a bit of fuel saving and at FM6 ?

Yes, 919 no stop FM6 and AT, I did a little coasting and had over 2 laps of fuel left. Just tried it again and forced myself to use MT, very awkward for me, went with RM tires, easy no stop again but FM4 first 6 laps then FM3 to the end. Fast lap 3:32 and total race time 36:27 on a no stop.

 

[smoothbore12]

Yes, 919 no stop FM6 and AT, I did a little coasting and had over 2 laps of fuel left. Just tried it again and forced myself to use MT, very awkward for me, went with RM tires, easy no stop again but FM4 first 6 laps then FM3 to the end. Fast lap 3:32 and total race time 36:27 on a no stop.

So might do a non stop race at FM6 and FM5 ( few laps at the end maybe ).

 

[kartrcr08]

So might do a non stop race at FM6 and FM5 ( few laps at the end maybe ).

Exactly and RM easily last 10 laps. The only change I made tuning wise was total minimum down force, everything else the same. It's pretty amazing the difference MT makes in fuel economy, I guess I've always known that's the case but it's so difficult.

 

[smoothbore12]

Exactly and RM easily last 10 laps. The only change I made tuning wise was total minimum down force, everything else the same. It's pretty amazing the difference MT makes in fuel economy, I guess I've always known that's the case but it's so difficult.

I use medium rpm turbo same settings i had i use in sub 35 run and racing gearbox,but....... I needed 1.8 fuel to end at FM6 and non stop.

So i put out the turbo ,put normal gearbox and was with 0.2 at the end with all the way FM6 ,AT and no savings.
Was 36.01 race , fast lap 3.34 high but i was careless anyway , just wanted to see if he can do it and he did it.

Of course using MT you can save tremendous amount of fuel but that's wasn't the case in my run.
Had lower hp and the aero in front was at 902 and minimum at the rear .

Its very comfortable and relax drive anyway .

 

[jrbabbitt]

here are some of the cars tested with economy in theory, with that OP Toyota it's not easy finding a car under the Gr.2 field to do both win and not have to pit every 3 laps...

CAR	PP	HP	LAPS @ FM6	AERO	TYRE WEAR	FAST LAP	TURBO
SF19 Super Formula / Honda	899.1​	639​	9​	1250 / 1600	LIGHT / LIGHT	3'51.633	NORMAL
SF23 Super Formula / Honda	899.99​	625​	10​	1249 / 2000	LIGHT / LIGHT	3'51.533	NORMAL
RED BULL X2019 Competition	900​	804​	6​	830 / 1500	LIGHT / LIGHT	3'40.518	NONE
MERCEDES CLK-LM '98	841.74​	842​	7​	600 / 800	LIGHT / MEDIUM	3'55.158	MEDIUM
McLAREN F1 GTR - BMW '95	770.65​	789​	5​	400 / 650	MEDIUM / HEAVY	3'57.409	HIGH

 

[kartrcr08]

So i put out the turbo ,put normal gearbox and was with 0.2 at the end with all the way FM6 ,AT and no savings.
Was 36.01 race , fast lap 3.34 high but i was careless anyway , just wanted to see if he can do it and he did it.

The 919 can no stop win on hard difficulty, AT or MT. FM6 for AT, FM4 for MT and RM will easily last 10 laps. And it's such a comfortable car to drive.

 

[jrbabbitt]

I guess all my selections for cars will have to be high end, nothing vintage, and List only the winners did I come across if I lose a race. It doesn't go on the list. If it's a close race, I may try it again.
I will start with all of my Gr.2 Cars and work from there....

 

[kartrcr08]

Hard mode no stop winners so far:
919 ; FM6 and AT with RM , race time 35:37, average lap time 3:33.7
787B ; FM6 and AT with RM, race time 37:03, average lap 3:42.
Need to save fuel with 787B and hope you catch P.Urra on a slow day like I did, 37 minutes is very slow for hard, although I did block him a bit and only won by three seconds.

 

[kartrcr08]

I guess all my selections for cars will have to be high end, nothing vintage, and List only the winners did I come across if I lose a race. It doesn't go on the list. If it's a close race, I may try it again.
I will start with all of my Gr.2 Cars and work from there....

You do your list the way you want to do it, it's great data! I wouldn't have tried the 787B with out your list. But you said it yourself, that OP Toyota makes it tough!

 

[jrbabbitt]

I just had a scary situation, I jumped back into the 30 minute race. I was having a good time and I had gotten used to no rain on the ten lap race and forgotten that I have to check for rain. OMG I'm glad I caught it in time or else I would have been stuck out on track on slicks in heavy rain.

 

[jrbabbitt]

@bigmull
Today I had taken my 300SL (W194) '52 and did everything I could to improve it's performance and with 229hp I was surprised to get the speed I did.
Ran the 30 minute race as I didn't have the power to run against Gr.2 cars and got as high as p14 at the end of lap 1 running full out on FM1 which only allows me 3 laps of fuel before I will have to pit.
I had luck on my shoulder as it just started raining as the end of lap 3 came upon me, swapped into IM tyres and filled my tank and upon exit of pits the rain was heavy and up almost to stage 3 on wetness meter. Other cars of the AI didn't change into wets and I was able to pull up to p2 by the end of lap 4 and passed into p1 when Lead was in pits.
Because of my overall low speed I only had to hold on to P1 for two more laps as the clock ran out on lap 6 and I claimed a win 🏆

 

[kartrcr08]

Today I had taken my 300SL (W194) '52 and did everything I could to improve it's performance and with 229hp I was surprised to get the speed I did.

Inspiration for a new goofy self imposed challenge. Revisited the 30 minute version yesterday and had a blast, wait, what, I have to pay attention to the weather again, I can't go through Porsche at 250kph? So the 300SL gave me the idea for another WTC700 challenge. This is not a "speed" challenge, but I'm setting it for hard mode only. What is the lowest HP able to win on hard? Not lowest PP just horsepower. The reason for "hard" mode is the AI being more consistent and needing to maintain a relatively decent pace to win. FYI typical AI fast lap on hard, 4:12 +/- 2 seconds. I've got some ideas... Prediction, well under 200hp.

 

[kartrcr08]

Prediction, well under 200hp.

I'm an idiot Renaming this challenge to slow and tidy and get lucky with rain challenge!

 

[jrbabbitt]

This is not a "speed" challenge, but I'm setting it for hard mode only. What is the lowest HP able to win on hard? Not lowest PP just horsepower. The reason for "hard" mode is the AI being more consistent and needing to maintain a relatively decent pace to win. FYI typical AI fast lap on hard, 4:12 +/- 2 seconds. I've got some ideas... Prediction, well under 200hp.

I don't do hard setting but I will give this a try, and with reservations that if I have issues I will revert to my usual (easy)

 

[smoothbore12]

Inspiration for a new goofy self imposed challenge. Revisited the 30 minute version yesterday and had a blast, wait, what, I have to pay attention to the weather again, I can't go through Porsche at 250kph? So the 300SL gave me the idea for another WTC700 challenge. This is not a "speed" challenge, but I'm setting it for hard mode only. What is the lowest HP able to win on hard? Not lowest PP just horsepower. The reason for "hard" mode is the AI being more consistent and needing to maintain a relatively decent pace to win. FYI typical AI fast lap on hard, 4:12 +/- 2 seconds. I've got some ideas... Prediction, well under 200hp.

Can't " see " a car with 200 or even less power that can do laps close to 12's -14,s and need one stop perhaps to win this.
Since rain involve might something " small " do the trick but in dry race can't see how that is possible.

 

[Tired Tyres]

I've had two dry races at Le Mans weather and penalty race, and did 8 laps in each with my group C Jaguar. Dipped under 4 minutes for my fastest lap this morning as well.

 

[smoothbore12]

Inspiration for a new goofy self imposed challenge. Revisited the 30 minute version yesterday and had a blast, wait, what, I have to pay attention to the weather again, I can't go through Porsche at 250kph? So the 300SL gave me the idea for another WTC700 challenge. This is not a "speed" challenge, but I'm setting it for hard mode only. What is the lowest HP able to win on hard? Not lowest PP just horsepower. The reason for "hard" mode is the AI being more consistent and needing to maintain a relatively decent pace to win. FYI typical AI fast lap on hard, 4:12 +/- 2 seconds. I've got some ideas... Prediction, well under 200hp.

Did some quick research today and i found only one that can win at 200hp or lower at hard level and dry race .
Honda 2&4 .
Just took it for a spin in easy level at 204 hp and was able to move around 3.12 or less ( had penalties and rain ) and at FM1 can pull 4 laps .
Perhaps might need some fuel saving at one lap but anyway you don't need two stops as the AI need and you don't have to change tyres ( RS ).
RBR junior has more hp so i put it out .

Other than that can't see any other but might be something am not aware of.

 

[kartrcr08]

Did some quick research today and i found only one that can win at 200hp or lower at hard level and dry race .
Honda 2&4 .

The only other one that might be able to dry race win is the old Honda F1 (no stop). The "trick" to really low HP will be rain strategy, and luck. The two Hondas might be the only ones around 200hp. The lowest I've gone so far is 187hp with the 2&4, early rain and last 5 laps on inters and FM 5.

 

[smoothbore12]

The only other one that might be able to dry race win is the old Honda F1 (no stop). The "trick" to really low HP will be rain strategy, and luck. The two Hondas might be the only ones around 200hp. The lowest I've gone so far is 187hp with the 2&4, early rain and last 5 laps on inters and FM 5.

I guess you did that at non stop race ( from FM5 ) and the rain helped a lot .
Of course at hard level AI can't caught out at rain and take advantage since you can't pass them and be Infront early.
Although a full dry race would be perfect for a final conclusion but its hard to get weather as you want it.

I don't think I'll follow to this one but its good to know its possible with so low hp .

 

[smoothbore12]

Well temptation is tempting 🤣

Wanted to do my daily run i said what the froyd let's do this and i was damn lucky have no rain with my first attempt!!!!

Since @kartrcr08 did it at 187 hp with rain i set it at 186 😂 but i wanted to be dry and was dry .

I lower a bit the gearbox to have 6th gear charging and did first lap Only at FM2 to ensure 4 laps first stint and FM1 all the way to the end.

By lap

The final

Verdict

Since only one pitstop needed plus you don't change tyres ( a small gain there ) is possible and at lower hp ,how low ?
Depends how much alien someone hides inside him but am earth resident 😂

Edit
Am still wondering why i keep the ballast since without it would be even lower in hp but ....... I leave that to someone else .

 

[kjb]

Well temptation is tempting 🤣

Wanted to do my daily run i said what the froyd let's do this and i was damn lucky have no rain with my first attempt!!!!

Since @kartrcr08 did it at 187 hp with rain i set it at 186 😂 but i wanted to be dry and was dry .
View attachment 1346823
View attachment 1346824

I lower a bit the gearbox to have 6th gear charging and did first lap Only at FM2 to ensure 4 laps first stint and FM1 all the way to the end.

By lap
View attachment 1346825
View attachment 1346826
View attachment 1346827

View attachment 1346828
View attachment 1346829
View attachment 1346830

The final
View attachment 1346831


Verdict

Since only one pitstop needed plus you don't change tyres ( a small gain there ) is possible and at lower hp ,how low ?
Depends how much alien someone hides inside him but am earth resident 😂

Dude you are maybe 25 -50 % alien to me 🤣 🤣 as I am a below average driver so you look really fast to me almost suprehuman