mister dog
(Banned)
- 8,396
- Spain
- misterdog
- misterdog7
Mass shooting in San Bernadino, California
- Thread starter Johnnypenso
- 222 comments
- 10,323 views
- 17,158
- United Kingdom
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Terror. It doesn't appear to be a lone wolf with a grudge or gone over the edge, it looks more like an organized attack with a planned getaway. The choice of facility may have had less to do with what was there as opposed to an on ramp to a major highway with a 4 leaf clover being less than a mile away.
EDIT:
There's also a local airport about 4kms away:
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- 17,158
- United Kingdom
Not so sure I agree, what use is killing no specific demographic nor generally high populace area simply because of a tactical getaway advantage? If they'd have just wanted terror, there's a 5 guys, a Home depot, and a couple of other restaurants within a much closer distance to the junction... just as easy to get a body count, and more effective at punching Joe Bloggs in the fear gut as a specialty venue like the regional centre.
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Defenseless office workers. Large gathering in a single room. Probably no guns allowed on site. A choice of escape routes, either north then west, or directly south, both a minute or less away. A Home Depot parking lot is total chaos and more of a chance of being caught off guard from an unknown angle etc.
It's possible they had some connection to the facility but I'd be they didn't. Pure speculation at this point obviously.
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Update...suspects are cornered not far from the scene and exchanging gunfire with the police.
- 17,158
- United Kingdom
Obviously, but you'd easily get 20 people in one of those restaurants, and if they were packing serious weaponry and some armour, how worried would they be about small arms fire as retalliation, given they could have had the element of surprise at at least two venues. Not saying I'm right, but if terror was my game, I'd rather hit a social point than a local council or specialist patient one.
- 2,107
- Massachusetts
- CreamyNute11a
Im watching right now, they have at least one on the ground, surrounded, the SUV is stopped, and the back window has been shot out.
EDIT: Police are approaching in multiple armored vehicles
EDIT 2: SUV is completely blocked in
At least 14 dead and 14+ wounded is waht im seeing
EDIT: Police are approaching in multiple armored vehicles
EDIT 2: SUV is completely blocked in
At least 14 dead and 14+ wounded is waht im seeing
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Apparently 1 suspect dead, 1 in custody and 1 wounded and in unknown condition in the surrounded SUV.
Update: Potentially all 3 dead.
Update: Potentially all 3 dead.
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- 2,107
- Massachusetts
- CreamyNute11a
Now begs the question, is this part of a terror organization/isolated extremists, or organized loonies?
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- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
Maybe not, but the gun lobby is far too reliant on the No True Scotsman defence - sure, there were bad guys with guns, but there were good guys with guns, then it wouldn't be a problem because no true Scotsman (or in this case, patriotic, freedom-loving American) would shoot innocent, defenceless people. Ignorong the fact that the bad guyys got their hands on guns, thus disproving the lonbyists' argument, surely those patriotic and freedom-loving Americans could do more to prevent them from getting the guns in the first place? It's a logical fallacy and a sick joke of its own.
- 2,107
- Massachusetts
- CreamyNute11a
Apperently there is still one suspect in the black SUV
- 21,261
- United States
Time to throw around generalizations I see.
- 17,158
- United Kingdom
Or any other combination thereof, and anything inbetween.
- 4,464
- Azle, TX
- supermanfromazle
- SanjiHimura
Bomb squad robot is apparently on the shootout scene. Apparently there is a bomb in the SUV.
- 3,207
You misinterpreted my comment. My comment wasn't a statement on relaxed gun ownership laws, it was a response aimed at those who pushed gun ownership in the Paris attacks thread. The point is that civilians carrying guns are neither a deterrent nor a hindrance to planned terrorist activities.
My sympathies go out to those affected by this tragedy.
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
- 17,158
- United Kingdom
Wait, Bloodeagle said it was a fella called Farboud... so it must be the muslamic jihadi's.. right???
/sarcasm /generalisation /giving a crap about what people think, the media, the reasons or even the state of society these days. When are we going to have had enough, any of us?
/sarcasm /generalisation /giving a crap about what people think, the media, the reasons or even the state of society these days. When are we going to have had enough, any of us?
- 2,359
- Ventura, California
I said I didn't want to jump to conclusions but I was listening to the police scanners as the situation was unfolding. That name was mentioned about 30 times as a person of interest and now apparently they are saying he was an employee at Inland Regional Center who was acting suspiciously and left work early about 30 minuted before the suspects opened fire. I'm sure the suspects are just freedom loving Americans though who would turn in their guns if Lord Obama asked them to. Speculation happens on forums. It's sad how people can't wait for the blood to dry and the bodies to cool before they push an agenda though. My thoughts are with the victims.
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
- 17,158
- United Kingdom
Don't take it personally, I intentionally didn't 'tag' you because I appreciate your stance, in no small manner thanks to your experience. I needed a suitable jumping off point for my faux tags that people in this thread might recognise. The combination of disgust and apathy I've found myself feeling towards this event is surprising, maybe Paris was the last straw for me, but I'm sick of the reading the same crap over and again.
- 40,808
No I didn't. You in fact reiterated the exact sentiment I took issue with in your explanation for why I misunderstood. I'm well aware what happened in the Paris thread, because that "if everyone was armed everywhere things would be fine" silliness was what I was mocking in the very first response to this thread. I did it because before posting in this thread I had already heard over an hour of people calling into the local radio show asking why none of the people who were in that building were armed even after it was announced what the building was used for.
Read the passage you quoted from me more closely. This sentiment here:
Could very well be meaningless for this specific attack, because it operates on the (in my opinion fairly large, but someone actually from California would undoubtedly have a better idea) assumption that a California center for developmentally/mentally disabled people run by the state government is a place where "civilians carrying guns" is allowed in the first place. And if it isn't, like I suspect to be the case (but again, someone please correct me because I'm going off of how New York runs similar places), then your point doesn't apply to this attack anymore then when RC45 graced the Paris thread to say everyone who is "brave enough to not be a victim" should carry handguns to stop attacks while neglecting to realize that a couple guys with handguns would mean nothing against multiple people with fully automatic AK47s and suicide vests spray firing into a crowd in the dark.
Put another way, if someone snapped and shot up a hunting lodge or gun store or bad neighborhood in South Central, yeah, "good thing that armed populace was around to deter this attack" is perfectly on point satire targeted at the common opinion after every one of these things that guns being present would deter the tragedy. If in fact it comes out that these three guys shot up another Gun Free Zone with this attack just like several other high profile incidents of people shooting up Gun Free Zones specifically because they know they are gun free (which is another common opinion after a place gets shot up because the places that get shot up do tend to be Gun Free Zones of some sort), lacing your point with that much sarcasm just makes you look ignorant of what American gun laws actually are when you're making the exact same argument that the people you're mocking do.
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- 1,971
- Seattle, WA
The Black Market in France is very robust and getting illegal firearms is rather easy, this is what the investigations have turned up in the Paris aftermath. Now imagine what the Black Market in the US is like......
These people aren't buying AK47's at gun shops.....but go on you fools, beat that drum while the bodies are still warm.....classless...
Sorry but I take offense at some of these comments, there is a time and a place to debate everything, but I don't think it's a very good idea while the blood of innocent victims is still drying, in other words, too soon.
These people aren't buying AK47's at gun shops.....but go on you fools, beat that drum while the bodies are still warm.....classless...
Sorry but I take offense at some of these comments, there is a time and a place to debate everything, but I don't think it's a very good idea while the blood of innocent victims is still drying, in other words, too soon.
- 3,207
Did you want me spell it out for you? The point is that civilians carrying guns are neither a deterrent nor a hindrance to planned terrorist activities because terrorists that have the intent of causing maximum damage will go after places where gun toting civilians will either not be present or will be unable to use their own weapons effectively. Terrorists that desire much attention and/or high body counts won't attack NRA meetings or shooting ranges, that'd be daft, they'll go after "soft targets" with sufficient firepower to overwhelm the security that is present. Johnny Vigilante won't foil any terrorist attacks, not because he is not able, he may very well be, but because well-prepared terrorists likely won't give him an opportunity to do so. If Johnny is present at the California center for developmentally/mentally disabled people run by the state government, he will be unarmed and unable to confront any potential terrorists. If Johnny is attending an indoor concert in Paris (or Utah or wherever), he will be unarmed and unable to confront any potential terrorists. That's the point. Hence, "civilians carrying guns are neither a deterrent nor a hindrance to planned terrorist activities".
- 1,971
- Seattle, WA
