Mon 20:00-21:30 UK time - PC2 - Hosted by @IfAndOr - Please refer to new threadPS4
- Thread starter Sick Cylinder
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- 5,284
- Sick_Cylinder
- 5,284
- Sick_Cylinder
Important Information - Final Round !
Silverstone GP - Double Points !
Go on Green !
Everyone uses BMW ! (Edited: BMW No. column added to left hand side of above sheet)
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- 6,521
- Shropshire
- IfAndOr
Ohh! Should be interesting.
Ooohhhh! Should be even more interesting.
Number 99 is nice I think.
I hope everyone (maybe) liked the variations of wetness at Oulton. They were probably a bit of a surprise - representing the British weather!
John's pictures of Oulton are over on the Wednesday thread. To view them...
...click - HERE
Edit: Oh they are below as well now!
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- 3,277
- Whitehaven Cumbria Englan
- johnwells69
Race Photos.
- 6,521
- Shropshire
- IfAndOr
Didn't see that yesterday. Just before race noticed my subscription has expired. Bought 12 months for 42£ on cdkeys.com
- 6,521
- Shropshire
- IfAndOr
I believe you then gain access again to any games you had before. It worked like that when I let mine lapse once before. You get mails from Sony asking "why have you left?" They never offered a discount though!
By the way I'm glad you liked the rain and snow.
(In some ways it's more realistic not knowing what the weather is going to be like)
- 125
- Home Paddock
- tympache
I believe you then gain access again to any games you had before. It worked like that when I let mine lapse once before. You get mails from Sony asking "why have you left?" They never offered a discount though!
By the way I'm glad you liked the rain and snow.
(In some ways it's more realistic not knowing what the weather is going to be like)
Thanks for clarifying!
As for weather, I'd suggest to set up weather to reflect as closely as possible the forecast for that day and location where we're racing. Easy to look up on weather.com, To add even more realism also enable corresponding season of the year (i.e. fall for now).
- 125
- Home Paddock
- tympache
Actually, I was genuinely worried when I realized we were racing in rain. I had clicked that "Ready To Race" button too soon and didn't give myself a chance to make sure I had wet tires on the wheels. Glad that it was taken care of automatically! I'm also surprised I haven't lost my position. Even more incredible is the fact that I didn't punt Sick this time! lol
- 3,277
- Whitehaven Cumbria Englan
- johnwells69
Made this Joey Dunlope helmet in MotoGP19.
- 129
- Berlin
After a lengthy absence due to vacation and occasional thesis writing, I was back in the race seat, and oh boy did weather god @IfAndOr have something in store for us. Watch below!
Ah, Oulton Park! Haven't raced here since the very early races of my career in the Ginetta Junior Series. I qualify right in the middle of the pack in 6th position on a dry track. The session switches to the race and I'm barely able to see the track through the pouring rain
Is it day or night? I can't really tell. But it's the same glorious British weather for everyone, and the last wet race proved to be lots of fun, so let's go!
The start goes smoothly and I'm almost caught out by how much grip the wet weather tires offer. @Napalm_LT seems to have had too much confidence in them, going wide but catching the car superbly round Cascades corner.
On lap 2, I can just see @richroo losing it in the Shell Oils Corner to relinquish 3rd place to my teammate @Don Mejillone, who seems so content with his Mercedes AMG, he didn't want to trade it for the Opel. Imagine explaining that to our team sponsors! Seemingly having lost a little bit of focus, @richroo punts the inside bollard through the Britten's chicane so that me and @Napalm_LT, who is hot on my heels, slip through. With him having the better exit, I have to defend my position hard into the next chicane. I break as late as possible and lock my front wheels, but manage to (just) get through the corner in one piece and in front. @Napalm_LT is much faster than me, but the conditions are treacherous and a lock-up going in to the last corner gives me some breathing space and loses him a position to @IfAndOr.
I manage to stretch the gap a little, until I get overconfident coming into Cascades corner on lap 4, spin the car and lose 3 places...
Now, @richroo in front of me acts as a guide through the spray and I follow him until, at the 1st corner on lap 6, he aquaplanes through the impressive lake that has formed around the right inside curb. You can see me have funky slides all through the race, whenever I hit it 
Having lost guidance, I don't know where to go anymore. A patch of grass next to the Britten's chicane peaks my interest, I quickly sample the surface quality and overall wetness level, and am glad that my guide has returned in front of me when I return to the race track 
However, @richroo is keen on proving that the mid-corner lake through turn 1 can, in fact, be driven through. As a result, I retake the position 
The weather has cleared considerably now, so maybe I don't need guidance anymore? Apparently I still do, because I run wide just a couple of corners later through Island Bench and hand the position back. The following lap, @richroo is badly hampered lapping somebody on the pit straight and I see a gap opening ... but take my foot of the gas. Taking a man's position while he is lapping somebody isn't the polite way to do it anyway
It is great fun to follow closely through the spray, and we both catch up with @IfAndOr. @richroo passes him with ease, but a couple of slow down penalties and off-track moments set me back with sizeable gaps to the drivers both in front and behind me. So it's just me against the weather, right? This is the moment when it starts to snow, and I love it!
Not because it's easy, mind you, as I have a hard time judging when and how much snow/wet is on the racing line, but for it's unpredictability. Well played, master of the clouds @IfAndOr. I wouldn't mind more like that to come 
Ah, Oulton Park! Haven't raced here since the very early races of my career in the Ginetta Junior Series. I qualify right in the middle of the pack in 6th position on a dry track. The session switches to the race and I'm barely able to see the track through the pouring rain
Is it day or night? I can't really tell. But it's the same glorious British weather for everyone, and the last wet race proved to be lots of fun, so let's go!The start goes smoothly and I'm almost caught out by how much grip the wet weather tires offer. @Napalm_LT seems to have had too much confidence in them, going wide but catching the car superbly round Cascades corner.
On lap 2, I can just see @richroo losing it in the Shell Oils Corner to relinquish 3rd place to my teammate @Don Mejillone, who seems so content with his Mercedes AMG, he didn't want to trade it for the Opel. Imagine explaining that to our team sponsors!
Seemingly having lost a little bit of focus, @richroo punts the inside bollard through the Britten's chicane so that me and @Napalm_LT, who is hot on my heels, slip through. With him having the better exit, I have to defend my position hard into the next chicane. I break as late as possible and lock my front wheels, but manage to (just) get through the corner in one piece and in front. @Napalm_LT is much faster than me, but the conditions are treacherous and a lock-up going in to the last corner gives me some breathing space and loses him a position to @IfAndOr.I manage to stretch the gap a little, until I get overconfident coming into Cascades corner on lap 4, spin the car and lose 3 places...
Now, @richroo in front of me acts as a guide through the spray and I follow him until, at the 1st corner on lap 6, he aquaplanes through the impressive lake that has formed around the right inside curb. You can see me have funky slides all through the race, whenever I hit it Having lost guidance, I don't know where to go anymore. A patch of grass next to the Britten's chicane peaks my interest, I quickly sample the surface quality and overall wetness level, and am glad that my guide has returned in front of me when I return to the race track However, @richroo is keen on proving that the mid-corner lake through turn 1 can, in fact, be driven through. As a result, I retake the position The weather has cleared considerably now, so maybe I don't need guidance anymore? Apparently I still do, because I run wide just a couple of corners later through Island Bench and hand the position back. The following lap, @richroo is badly hampered lapping somebody on the pit straight and I see a gap opening ... but take my foot of the gas. Taking a man's position while he is lapping somebody isn't the polite way to do it anyway It is great fun to follow closely through the spray, and we both catch up with @IfAndOr. @richroo passes him with ease, but a couple of slow down penalties and off-track moments set me back with sizeable gaps to the drivers both in front and behind me. So it's just me against the weather, right? This is the moment when it starts to snow, and I love it!
Not because it's easy, mind you, as I have a hard time judging when and how much snow/wet is on the racing line, but for it's unpredictability. Well played, master of the clouds @IfAndOr. I wouldn't mind more like that to come
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- 5,284
- Sick_Cylinder
Although a nice idea, it isn't really feasible - each weather round involves hours of testing (there are many trial runs experimenting with dates for tyre temperature, weather acceleration, weather slots, cloud and many other variables including for example puddles / track suitability) - I am very grateful to @IfAndOr for the huge amount of work he puts into these rounds - good weather effects don't come about by chance!
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- 125
- Home Paddock
- tympache
Hm, I'm afraid I'm not following. Please, bear with me. I understood everything you said but.. I thought it was pretty straightforward. I mean, okay, even if you test how cars behave what does that give you as a host of a lobby in terms of settings for the race? Can you actually control what tire temperatures are set to for every car in the race or, for example, where puddles are going to appear? I thought most of those things were not configurable. Just select the right type of tire for the weather conditions and that's it. As for suitability.. how can it not be suitable if that real-life location has a specific weather forecast that we reproduce in the game (e.g. overcast, fog, rain) so we end up simulating what's actually happening on the track on that day?
- 6,521
- Shropshire
- IfAndOr
That's the main reason Monday was a little more extreme than usual. The Escorts on Wednesday are very skittish when it's wet and would have been all over the place using the same settings, so it stayed dry.
Yes and no sort of.
I'll explain later with an edit - I'm just off out. 👍
Right here you go. Since it turned out to be rather long I'll add it in here...
The tweaking is done to try and get a good 30 minute race with the various driving talents we have in our group. Plus not all cars (and their tyres) behave quite the same (the Escorts!). Also some tracks are better suited to wet conditions than others (less large puddles and aquaplaning).
Although you could use the real date and weather on the day the results might not actually allow for an enjoyable race. A full race on a cold track in continuous rain might turn into a rally cross event.
Although you might not realise it's happening in the background PC2s weather effects are better with a bit of management I find.
I'll use Monday has an example of what I used and why.
Here's the settings.
Date. 1/4/?? - Sick fills the year in.
Spring
Time. 10.00
Acceleration. 2x
Weather 4 slots
Fog with rain / Heavy Cloud / Snow / Medium Cloud
Speed. 5x
(Starting with rain forces wet tyres to be fitted from the start)
The date was set to allow the track temperatures be warm enough to stop the track getting too wet but not hot enough to dry it out completely when there's no precipitation. The time (sun position) was set likewise with a little acceleration to give a slight variation in the lighting. The temperatures also reduced puddle formation.
The weather although it looked extreme was quite well managed. The fog and rain is actually the same amount of water as just rain, it's just the fog swirling around makes you think it's wetter than it actually is. It also helps keep a higher track temp than just rain alone, which proved beneficial. The heavy cloud reduced the track temp after the rain and prevented it drying out completely. The snow was added for a surprise effect (instead of further rain). With the the date and time settings I used the snow had much the same affect as light rain since it melted rapidly - the track temps actually increased during the snow!
Using x5 acceleration makes each slot last approximately 12 minutes (except slot 1 which is often shorter because it's already running when you start) which is enough to give some variation during our race. It was also short/long enough to manage the wetness of the track during the dry period (combined with the time & date). Using x5 also somewhat controls the speed of the formation of puddles. If you noticed the puddle at the first corner didn't really appear until after a few laps, I didn't want it there at the start and it causing a crash! x2 and real time, which we both sometimes use, is even better at puddle control. The 4th slot (medium cloud) is there to prevent the fog and rain from cycling around again. There's a randomness built in to the progression that sometimes can cause the timing to be earlier, I'd use 3 slots otherwise. Sync to race is a possibility but that changes the transition timings.
And just for reference here's Wednesday's BSCC to see the difference.
Date. 1\8\??
Summer
Time. 17.00
Acceleration. 5x
Weather. 4 slots
Hazy / Medium Cloud / Light Cloud / Light Cloud
Speed 5x
No rain! It's set in mid summer to keep the tyres nice and warm. It's set later in the day with a faster acceleration to get the sun to go down but not be continually in the drivers eyes - the date was also part of this.
The weather while not so elaborate as Monday is designed to give some lighting variation while the sun is lowering and to keep track temperatures fairly constant. The track temp only lowered by 5°C during the race. Much the same reasons has above for the 5x speed.
Although I've used the 1st of the month for both of these races that can also vary to get the sun (and moon!) into a suitable position!
Although you could use the real date and weather on the day the results might not actually allow for an enjoyable race. A full race on a cold track in continuous rain might turn into a rally cross event.
Although you might not realise it's happening in the background PC2s weather effects are better with a bit of management I find.
I'll use Monday has an example of what I used and why.
Here's the settings.
Date. 1/4/?? - Sick fills the year in.
Spring
Time. 10.00
Acceleration. 2x
Weather 4 slots
Fog with rain / Heavy Cloud / Snow / Medium Cloud
Speed. 5x
(Starting with rain forces wet tyres to be fitted from the start)
The date was set to allow the track temperatures be warm enough to stop the track getting too wet but not hot enough to dry it out completely when there's no precipitation. The time (sun position) was set likewise with a little acceleration to give a slight variation in the lighting. The temperatures also reduced puddle formation.
The weather although it looked extreme was quite well managed. The fog and rain is actually the same amount of water as just rain, it's just the fog swirling around makes you think it's wetter than it actually is. It also helps keep a higher track temp than just rain alone, which proved beneficial. The heavy cloud reduced the track temp after the rain and prevented it drying out completely. The snow was added for a surprise effect (instead of further rain). With the the date and time settings I used the snow had much the same affect as light rain since it melted rapidly - the track temps actually increased during the snow!
Using x5 acceleration makes each slot last approximately 12 minutes (except slot 1 which is often shorter because it's already running when you start) which is enough to give some variation during our race. It was also short/long enough to manage the wetness of the track during the dry period (combined with the time & date). Using x5 also somewhat controls the speed of the formation of puddles. If you noticed the puddle at the first corner didn't really appear until after a few laps, I didn't want it there at the start and it causing a crash! x2 and real time, which we both sometimes use, is even better at puddle control. The 4th slot (medium cloud) is there to prevent the fog and rain from cycling around again. There's a randomness built in to the progression that sometimes can cause the timing to be earlier, I'd use 3 slots otherwise. Sync to race is a possibility but that changes the transition timings.
And just for reference here's Wednesday's BSCC to see the difference.
Date. 1\8\??
Summer
Time. 17.00
Acceleration. 5x
Weather. 4 slots
Hazy / Medium Cloud / Light Cloud / Light Cloud
Speed 5x
No rain! It's set in mid summer to keep the tyres nice and warm. It's set later in the day with a faster acceleration to get the sun to go down but not be continually in the drivers eyes - the date was also part of this.
The weather while not so elaborate as Monday is designed to give some lighting variation while the sun is lowering and to keep track temperatures fairly constant. The track temp only lowered by 5°C during the race. Much the same reasons has above for the 5x speed.
Although I've used the 1st of the month for both of these races that can also vary to get the sun (and moon!) into a suitable position!
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- 5,284
- Sick_Cylinder
Remember for tonight - Go on Green, All use BMW, Final Round - Double Points !!!
BMW Race Numbers shown in left hand column
Good luck to all !!!
BMW Race Numbers shown in left hand column
Good luck to all !!!
- 125
- Home Paddock
- tympache
I have two words: Weather God.
lol but seriously thank you for taking the time to explain.
Speaking of which, how much time do you spend on this tweaking and testing? I'd guess it requires quite a bit of time and effort.
Also, I'm wondering how exactly do you know all this? You talk very specifically, including knowing track temperatures during the race. Is it part observing (e.g. noticing formation of puddles) and looking at info on the HUD (I remember there's a HUD view with a ton of information that I never use... so I guess that's where you would look up current track and tires temperature?)
- 6,521
- Shropshire
- IfAndOr
Well for it to work over a 30 minute race I have to run it over those 30 minutes. If it doesn't work as intended (rarely does 1st time) I adjust settings and run it again. And again. Then if I think I can improve things further there's more adjustments and it's run again. Repeat until happy-ish!
It's got faster as I've become more used to the options, I can achieve what I'm trying to create with less or shorter races. I must point out that once I've sorted out handling (track, puddles etc) I don't always drive every every test race, when it comes to lighting I often let the AI race around and watch them.
Pretty much as you say, it's from time spent on PC2 and observation. Plus I'm a bit of a nerd when it comes to fiddling with options and settings. I actually enjoy it.
Anyway I think today's race is going to be in the dry.
- 278
- Netherlands
- Don-Mejillone
@Don Mejillone, who seems so content with his Mercedes AMG, he didn't want to trade it for the Opel ! Did I had to drive the Opel WiSchmo !?
Yes now I see it race 5-6-7 i had to do it.... shame on me
Tonight BMW I saw just now...
Yes now I see it race 5-6-7 i had to do it.... shame on me
Tonight BMW I saw just now...
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- 125
- Home Paddock
- tympache
Sigh.
What a great start on my part. @WiSchmo I probably caught you off guard jumping in front of you like that.
But then it all went down the drain...
@John Wells I think you hit me pretty good on the left side. I couldn't save the replay again (hadn't removed the old replays) so not sure what really happened there but it seemed like I kept a decent distance from you on a straight and the next thing I know – BAM! – you rammed into me and I was given 30 seconds penalty.
As usual, rear-ended @Sick Cylinder. I don't know how the man doesn't take it personally because I hit mostly him almost every time we race
To completely destroy any chance of me retaining P11 my rig malfunctioned and at one moment when I pressed clutch pedal it actually interpreted it as PS button so I was taken to the main PlayStation screen while my car kept rolling at 150+ kph speed without a driver at the wheel.
Good race with Sick and John, though. I think I overtook each of you twice?
What a great start on my part. @WiSchmo I probably caught you off guard jumping in front of you like that.
But then it all went down the drain...
@John Wells I think you hit me pretty good on the left side. I couldn't save the replay again (hadn't removed the old replays) so not sure what really happened there but it seemed like I kept a decent distance from you on a straight and the next thing I know – BAM! – you rammed into me and I was given 30 seconds penalty.
As usual, rear-ended @Sick Cylinder. I don't know how the man doesn't take it personally because I hit mostly him almost every time we race
To completely destroy any chance of me retaining P11 my rig malfunctioned and at one moment when I pressed clutch pedal it actually interpreted it as PS button so I was taken to the main PlayStation screen while my car kept rolling at 150+ kph speed without a driver at the wheel.
Good race with Sick and John, though. I think I overtook each of you twice?
- 3,277
- Whitehaven Cumbria Englan
- johnwells69
- 125
- Home Paddock
- tympache
Unfortunately, I can't see the replay as my save space for PC2 was full so I couldn't save it. Really, just curious to know what happened and why I was given a +30s penalty for (seemingly) doing nothing wrong. No blame or hard feelings lol
