MotoGP 2011 (125, Moto2, and MotoGP)

[plate88]

Goooooooo Elbowz!!!!!!

Been following Spies' career for quite a while now and glad to see him get his first GP win.👍

 

[prisonermonkeys]

As if I needed a reason to intensely dislike Casey Stoner - and let's be perfectly honest here: I really don't - he's just given me one. Yes, you're reading that right: Stoner genuinely believes that the only reason why Ducati hired Valentino Rossi - one of the most successful and natraully-talented men in the sport's history - was because Stoner left the team for Honda.

 

[Neal]

Maybe he should stick to riding bikes very fast and leave the mind games to Rossi!

 

[YellowG1]

As if I needed a reason to intensely dislike Casey Stoner - and let's be perfectly honest here: I really don't - he's just given me one. Yes, you're reading that right: Stoner genuinely believes that the only reason why Ducati hired Valentino Rossi - one of the most successful and natraully-talented men in the sport's history - was because Stoner left the team for Honda.

The 2010 Rossi wasn't exactly the Rossi of 2001-5. I think Rossi probably would've ended up at Ducati in any event, but had Stoner stayed, I doubt there would've been as much drive to sign a premier rider. So there's no confusion, Valentino Rossi is the best MotoGP rider of all time but it's a little hero worship to assume there was no correlation whatsoever between Stoner departing for Honda and Rossi coming to Ducati.

 

[adamp93]

The 2010 Rossi wasn't exactly the Rossi of 2001-5. I think Rossi probably would've ended up at Ducati in any event, but had Stoner stayed, I doubt there would've been as much drive to sign a premier rider. So there's no confusion, Valentino Rossi is the best MotoGP rider of all time but it's a little hero worship to assume there was no correlation whatsoever between Stoner departing for Honda and Rossi coming to Ducati.

This, Rossi would inevitably end up at Ducati there's no question of it, but would he go while Stoner is still there, no. There is no way Rossi would go to Ducati and try to learn to ride the bike while the only person who can ride the thing is still there beating him regularly.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

So there's no confusion, Valentino Rossi is the best MotoGP rider of all time but it's a little hero worship to assume there was no correlation whatsoever between Stoner departing for Honda and Rossi coming to Ducati.

True, but my issue with Stoner is in the way he presents it. He just comes across as enormously big-headed.

 

[Mike Rotch]

True, but my issue with Stoner is in the way he presents it. He just comes across as enormously big-headed.

Just like his 'dear 9-time world champion, you're ambition outweighed your talent' quip.

I mean, seriously Mr single-title-holder? I cant stand Stoner.

 

[adamp93]

While we're Stoner hating I might change the subject. Toby and Jules just pointed out that Marc Marquez is 2nd in the Moto 2 championship, in his debut season, when he didn't score until Le Mans, fantastic.
They also asked for each rider's theme tune, discuss.
Toni Elias

 

[Neal]

While we're Stoner hating I might change the subject. Toby and Jules just pointed out that Marc Marquez is 2nd in the Moto 2 championship, in his debut season, when he didn't score until Le Mans, fantastic.

And he's fastest in FP1...

MotoGP FP1 times below

1 Marco SIMONCELLI San Carlo Honda Gresini 1'48.987
2 Casey STONER Repsol Honda Team 1'49.027 0.040 / 0.040
3 Andrea DOVIZIOSO Repsol Honda Team 1'49.088 0.101 / 0.061
4 Jorge LORENZO Yamaha Factory Racing 1'49.251 0.264 / 0.163
5 Ben SPIES Yamaha Factory Racing 1'49.364 0.377 / 0.113
6 Colin EDWARDS Monster Yamaha Tech 3 1'49.810 0.823 / 0.446
7 Dani PEDROSA Repsol Honda Team 1'50.104 1.117 / 0.294
8 Nicky HAYDEN Ducati Team 1'50.203 1.216 / 0.099
9 Hiroshi AOYAMA San Carlo Honda Gresini 1'50.629 1.642 / 0.426
10 Alvaro BAUTISTA Rizla Suzuki MotoGP 1'50.658 1.671 / 0.029
11 Cal CRUTCHLOW Monster Yamaha Tech 3 1'50.683 1.696 / 0.025
12 Randy DE PUNIET Pramac Racing Team 1'50.729 1.742 / 0.046
13 Valentino ROSSI Ducati Team 1'50.780 1.793 / 0.051
14 Hector BARBERA Mapfre Aspar Team MotoGP 1'51.153 2.166 / 0.373
15 Toni ELIAS LCR Honda MotoGP 1'51.868 2.881 / 0.715
16 Karel ABRAHAM Cardion AB Motoracing 1'51.876 2.889 / 0.008

 

[hornet_burnout]

And he's fastest in FP1...

MotoGP FP1 times below

1 Marco SIMONCELLI San Carlo Honda Gresini 1'48.987
(...)

Now if he could only get carefully into T1 in top 5, and then steadily apply that pace throughout the race, taking no big chances, he'd emerge in 1st position with a 5 or 10 second lead at the end.

 

[Neal]

Now if he could only get carefully into T1 in top 5, and then steadily apply that pace throughout the race, taking no big chances, he'd emerge in 1st position with a 5 or 10 second lead at the end.

Pigs might fly...or in the case of Simoncelli the other riders he crashes into!

 

[YellowG1]

Now if he could only get carefully into T1 in top 5, and then steadily apply that pace throughout the race, taking no big chances, he'd emerge in 1st position with a 5 or 10 second lead at the end.

If only 6's were 9's... but seriously, maybe this will be the race where Simoncelli finally puts together a decent result. You can't teach speed, but a rider can develop consistency. I still remember Stoner DNF'ing, what, 5-6 times when he was with LCR Honda? Admittedly, it wasn't borderline recklessness on his part the way it might be with Simoncelli, but the premise is still the same.

 

[J-PaP]

If only 6's were 9's... but seriously, maybe this will be the race where Simoncelli finally puts together a decent result. You can't teach speed, but a rider can develop consistency. I still remember Stoner DNF'ing, what, 5-6 times when he was with LCR Honda? Admittedly, it wasn't borderline recklessness on his part the way it might be with Simoncelli, but the premise is still the same.

It was 6 times in 2006. He dnf'd 5 last year.

 

[YellowG1]

Stoner on pole... no surprises there. Spies second, Simoncelli third. Pedrosa middle of the pack in eighth. Rossi twelfth... the GP11.1 needs a LOT of work.

Pos Rider Team/Bike Time Gap
1. Casey Stoner Honda 1m48.034s
2. Ben Spies Yamaha 1m48.479s + 0.445s
3. Marco Simoncelli Gresini Honda 1m48.485s + 0.451s
4. Andrea Dovizioso Honda 1m48.694s + 0.660s
5. Jorge Lorenzo Yamaha 1m48.756s + 0.722s
6. Colin Edwards Tech 3 Yamaha 1m48.974s + 0.940s
7. Cal Crutchlow Tech 3 Yamaha 1m49.021s + 0.987s
8. Dani Pedrosa Honda 1m49.398s + 1.364s
9. Nicky Hayden Ducati 1m49.509s + 1.475s
10. Hector Barbera Aspar Ducati 1m49.663s + 1.629s
11. Karel Abraham Cardion Ducati 1m49.678s + 1.644s
12. Valentino Rossi Ducati 1m49.902s + 1.868s
13. Hiroshi Aoyama Gresini Honda 1m50.156s + 2.122s
14. Alvaro Bautista Suzuki 1m50.460s + 2.426s
15. Randy de Puniet Pramac Ducati 1m50.651s + 2.617s
16. Toni Elias LCR Honda 1m50.742s + 2.708s

What're the odds that Simoncelli even finishes this race?

 

[MarinaDiamandis]

Rossi twelfth... the GP11.1 needs a LOT of work.

Yup, with such limited testing, it wouldn't be unfair to rule Rossi out of the rest of the 2011 season. Obviously they're trying to salvage things for next season, 4th place for Rossi just isn't good enough! VA VALE!

 

[hornet_burnout]

The rain messed it up, times and positions could be better.

Hope it doesn't rain tomorrow, and most importantly that Sic doesn't take out Spies in the 1st corners.

Cal is starting to enter my favorites... Didn't know him (and still don't) very well, but he has a beautiful riding style IMO, is fast, and seems nice.

 

[hornet_burnout]

As for the race (double posting, since it's a different subject), and trying not to spoil it, these are the things I found worthy of notice:

Lorenzo at his best. Good bike, and a perfect intelligent race from him.

Stoner complaining (getting usual)... apparently they made a mistake in tire pressure. But I find it interesting that it only affected performance later in the race, not right from the beginning as he said. Sounded a lot like a sore looser.

Good result and performance from Dovi.

Simoncelli was extremely careful at the beginning and perfect (in aggressiveness) throughout his battle with Spies.

Rossi was on a charge. He was pushing that Ducati, learning and becoming faster lap after lap. Great result, considering.

But this was the best moment IMO:
http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/JbnR6T0A_pY/

Spies comes from behind, brakes late and on the outside of Simoncelli. My thoughts went from:
1 He's stronger on the brakes, he's gonna try and pass across Sic's front and this is going to end badly... (Sic/Pedorsa clash came to mind)
2 Sic is defending beyond bike/rider braking capabilities and this is gonna end badly... (Rossi/Stoner crash came to mind)
3 AWESOME SPIES! Just outsmarted Sic!

The way I see it, after Sic closed the inside line in the straight, he just decided to "push" Sic from the outside. He was expecting him to (among other possible scenarios that run through their minds in these moments) go wide defending. And he intended to make that cross behind him into the apex as soon as he saw him braking sideways. Beautifully done, and on purpose.

On a less positive note, Hayden had a good pace but messed it up. Cal can't seam to deal with the front of his bike. Destroyed the front tire last race, and today he abandoned in fear of falling (shoulder injury - smart decision) from low front end grip. If he doesn't adapt, he won't finish a race

 

[Mike Rotch]

Great MotoGP and Moto2 races 👍 Had to laugh at the commentators describing as the Moto2 battle as 'a knife fight in a telephone booth'!

I was super impressed with Bradley Smith on a underdog machine hanging with Bradl and Marquez (who seemed to have straight line speed in buckets). Iannone again galloped to the front from nowhere. Why cant he just qualify at least in the top 10?!

Also stoked to see Stoner burn his tyres out (tyre pressure..blah ) and Lorenzo cut him up and then and Dovi mug him.

 

[YellowG1]

As for the race (double posting, since it's a different subject), and trying not to spoil it, these are the things I found worthy of notice:

Lorenzo at his best. Good bike, and a perfect intelligent race from him.

Stoner complaining (getting usual)... apparently they made a mistake in tire pressure. But I find it interesting that it only affected performance later in the race, not right from the beginning as he said. Sounded a lot like a sore looser.

Good result and performance from Dovi.

Simoncelli was extremely careful at the beginning and perfect (in aggressiveness) throughout his battle with Spies.

Rossi was on a charge. He was pushing that Ducati, learning and becoming faster lap after lap. Great result, considering.

But this was the best moment IMO:
http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/JbnR6T0A_pY/

Spies comes from behind, brakes late and on the outside of Simoncelli. My thoughts went from:
1 He's stronger on the brakes, he's gonna try and pass across Sic's front and this is going to end badly... (Sic/Pedorsa clash came to mind)
2 Sic is defending beyond bike/rider braking capabilities and this is gonna end badly... (Rossi/Stoner crash came to mind)
3 AWESOME SPIES! Just outsmarted Sic!

The way I see it, after Sic closed the inside line in the straight, he just decided to "push" Sic from the outside. He was expecting him to (among other possible scenarios that run through their minds in these moments) go wide defending. And he intended to make that cross behind him into the apex as soon as he saw him braking sideways. Beautifully done, and on purpose.

On a less positive note, Hayden had a good pace but messed it up. Cal can't seam to deal with the front of his bike. Destroyed the front tire last race, and today he abandoned in fear of falling (shoulder injury - smart decision) from low front end grip. If he doesn't adapt, he won't finish a race

Great win for Lorenzo, but Stoner was smart to limit the damage rather than take an unnecessary risk to hold on for the win. The Honda is still hands down the superior bike--Lorenzo's going to basically have to ride 110% all year and count on a few DNFs from Stoner.

And great pass by Spies. He got that one on guile rather than out-and-out speed. 👍

 

[Neal]

Very good race and glad to see Stoner having a less than perfect day, I rate him highly but no one wants to see one rider dominate every race.

The pass Spies made on Sic was brilliant, he needs elbow sliders!

 

[hornet_burnout]

I think the Yamahas can tilt way more than the other bikes, and both their drivers are able to make the most of it. Both Lorenzo overtakes happened where no one else dared to do it, and Spies is getting used to it as well.

They can brake later because they can brake further into the corners, and carry more speed over them without destroying the front tire I think. Different bikes, different lines, excellent riders, equals great races.

 

[YellowG1]

I think the Yamahas can tilt way more than the other bikes, and both their drivers are able to make the most of it. Both Lorenzo overtakes happened where no one else dared to do it, and Spies is getting used to it as well.

They can brake later because they can brake further into the corners, and carry more speed over them without destroying the front tire I think. Different bikes, different lines, excellent riders, equals great races.

I don't think it's so much a question of lean angle. The Yamaha still has superb front end feel (and Lorenzo can run it really really deep) but I tend to believe Stoner when he says it was a tire pressure issue. The Honda seems to do everything just about as well as the Yamaha.

The problem (for Yamaha) is that the Honda can definitely dig its way out the corners noticeably better than the Yamaha, which translates into superior top speed on the straights.

 

[hornet_burnout]

I don't think it's so much a question of lean angle. The Yamaha still has superb front end feel (and Lorenzo can run it really really deep) but I tend to believe Stoner when he says it was a tire pressure issue. The Honda seems to do everything just about as well as the Yamaha.

The problem (for Yamaha) is that the Honda can definitely dig its way out the corners noticeably better than the Yamaha, which translates into superior top speed on the straights.

I have to agree. It's a very good assessment. They just dive into to the corners so committed and inclined, that the Yamahas look like they can take so much more speed and inclination.

 

[YellowG1]

I have to agree. It's a very good assessment. They just dive into to the corners so committed and inclined, that the Yamahas look like they can take so much more speed and inclination.

Well, I think Emmett & Harris said the Yamaha is suited to fast, flowing tracks like well... Assen and Mugello and the Honda is good for stop & start tracks like Estoril and Catalunya. Problem is, of the rest of the tracks on the calendar, I'm not sure which ones left are fast & swoopy, except San Marino? Maybe Laguna Seca?

 

[JohnBM01]

We're halfway through the calendar, so how about a little progress report? What are your picks for...

• Most impressed?
• Least impressed?
• Most improved?
• On the rise?
• On the decline?

That relates to all three levels of MotoGP, so feel free to mix up the commentary if you so choose. So if you wish to talk about the season so far, feel free to chat.

 

[YellowG1]

We're halfway through the calendar, so how about a little progress report? What are your picks for...

• Most impressed?
• Most improved?
• On the rise?
• On the decline?

That relates to all three levels of MotoGP, so feel free to mix up the commentary if you so choose. So if you wish to talk about the season so far, feel free to chat.

• Most impressive? Stoner for sure, even though he hasn't won in a couple weeks! Honorable mention to Lorenzo for managing to get a couple wins even though he really has to ride the wheels off the Yamaha to do so.
• Least impressive? Pedrosa, though this is really more Simoncelli's fault than anything else, since this looked like Pedrosa's best chance yet to win it all. Still, once again, Pedrosa has missed significant time due to injury that may torpedo his chances for a championship.
• Most improved? Despite his crashing out of, ohh I dunno, 75% of the races he's been in (not intended to be a factual statement), I would put Simoncelli here. His qualifying pace is outrageously quick and once he can figure out how to put it together for a full race distance, I think he will push Dovizioso out of his seat if he can be more consistent.
• On the rise? I say Spies here. He's starting to put it together and has had a good run as of late, though definitely not quite the 'fifth alien' just yet.
• On the decline? I would say Rossi, though it's more the awful Ducati than poor form. Not sure how many more years Rossi will put up with a clearly inferior bike that (to me) is not meaningfully closing the gap to Yamaha and Honda.

 

[hornet_burnout]

Well, I think Emmett & Harris said the Yamaha is suited to fast, flowing tracks like well... Assen and Mugello and the Honda is good for stop & start tracks like Estoril and Catalunya. Problem is, of the rest of the tracks on the calendar, I'm not sure which ones left are fast & swoopy, except San Marino? Maybe Laguna Seca?

I think Laguna is nor swoopy, nor fast. I only know it from gaming, but it barely has a straight, and has monster brakings. But apart form that and Estoril (where I've actually ridden on), don't know the tracks that well

 

[YellowG1]

Sachsenring Free Practice 1 - Simoncelli on top, strong showing by Nicky

Pos Rider Team/Bike Time Gap
1. Marco Simoncelli Gresini Honda 1m22.823s
2. Casey Stoner Honda 1m23.004s + 0.181s
3. Jorge Lorenzo Yamaha 1m23.046s + 0.223s
4. Nicky Hayden Ducati 1m23.205s + 0.382s
5. Andrea Dovizioso Honda 1m23.355s + 0.532s
6. Karel Abraham Cardion Ducati 1m23.416s + 0.593s
7. Hector Barbera Aspar Ducati 1m23.433s + 0.610s
8. Randy de Puniet Pramac Ducati 1m23.534s + 0.711s
9. Ben Spies Yamaha 1m23.558s + 0.735s
10. Colin Edwards Tech 3 Yamaha 1m23.594s + 0.771s
11. Dani Pedrosa Honda 1m23.604s + 0.781s
12. Alvaro Bautista Suzuki 1m23.989s + 1.166s
13. Cal Crutchlow Tech 3 Yamaha 1m24.162s + 1.339s
14. Valentino Rossi Ducati 1m24.512s + 1.689s
15. Hiroshi Aoyama Gresini Honda 1m24.620s + 1.797s
16. Toni Elias LCR Honda 1m26.060s + 3.237s
17. Loris Capirossi Pramac Ducati 1m26.334s + 3.511s



Free Practice 2 - More Simoncelli

Pos Rider Team/Bike Time Gap
1. Marco Simoncelli Gresini Honda 1m22.225s
2. Jorge Lorenzo Yamaha 1m22.320s + 0.095s
3. Dani Pedrosa Honda 1m22.432s + 0.207s
4. Casey Stoner Honda 1m22.542s + 0.317s
5. Andrea Dovizioso Honda 1m22.654s + 0.429s
6. Nicky Hayden Ducati 1m22.882s + 0.657s
7. Ben Spies Yamaha 1m22.894s + 0.669s
8. Randy de Puniet Pramac Ducati 1m23.037s + 0.812s
9. Alvaro Bautista Suzuki 1m23.261s + 1.036s
10. Karel Abraham Cardion Ducati 1m23.352s + 1.127s
11. Colin Edwards Tech 3 Yamaha 1m23.431s + 1.206s
12. Valentino Rossi Ducati 1m23.533s + 1.308s
13. Hector Barbera Aspar Ducati 1m23.625s + 1.400s
14. Cal Crutchlow Tech 3 Yamaha 1m23.760s + 1.535s
15. Hiroshi Aoyama Gresini Honda 1m23.906s + 1.681s
16. Toni Elias LCR Honda 1m24.304s + 2.079s
17. Sylvain Guintoli Pramac Ducati 1m25.964s + 3.739s

 

[Mike Rotch]

Excellent 125 race. Dead heat for 1st place

Winner had to be declared on fastest lap in the race as the photo couldn't separate them.

 

[boiltheocean]

What a race! Big congratulations to Lorenzo for pulling off that move after his mistake. Huge well done to Bautista too!