New WRS Racing Division??

[FinaL ExaM]

I don't think the new D2 subdivision would be necessary. And your argument here eventually ends with 100 divisions each containing 3 drivers that always get podium spots. I don't think so. There is a distinct difference between breaking up division 1 and breaking up Division 2.

 

[Hugo Boss]

We need those drivers to give their opinion then. I can imagine they'll vote for a D2 subdivision if D1 will be split. If they won't, I'll leave myself out of the discussion from then on.

 

[FinaL ExaM]

There has been no such proposition for a split Division 2. Forgive me but i also find it odd that the proposition to create an elite division doesn't have any effect on you since you come in first or second every time you race and yet you are the strongest against it. On top of that you are now the mouthpiece for Division 2 which, once again, has absolutely no bearing on you. I was just wondering how much of your argument was actually on behalf of the series and how much of it was for your vanity. I don't know about the heavy phsycological stuff but It almost seems to me that what's really important to you here is make sure i know who's "boss". Pun intended.

With regard to your smoke screen of my proposition creating a need for Division 2 to be split as well, Division 2 is much more closely contested. If you check the history of division 2, there is a much larger variety of podium finishers Than division 1.

In the weeks since Sphinx has become the admin, week 93 till present, Division 1 has had 9 different podium finishes, a number atificailly inflated by GTManic and Kart38 reachin the podium in the one week they raced. Division 2, on the other had 10 different podium finishers and the only reason there wasn't more was that I took a podium place every week because like you, I belonged in a faster division.

Logically speaking, if I won Division 2 just about every week and I was moved to a faster division, wouldn't you also have to be promoted to a faster division since your result is also almost always a win? It's the last logical progression to add the ultimate elite division for the Division 1 racers who are just obviously in a faster class. I don't forsee any addition Divisions being necessary because I'm pretty confident there isn't another racer in the world fast enough to be in a class above you skillwise.

All of this is further evidence that you are arguing for the sake of squashing this newbie's rebellion against the status qou without really researching your argument or thinking it out logically. I do appreciate your helping me and everybody else last week and you really seem like an OK guy so please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[kennythebomb]

There has been no such proposition of a split Division 2. I do find it odd however that the proposition to create an elite division doesn't have any effect on you since you come in first or second every time you race and yet you are the strongest against it. On top of that you are now the mouthpiece for Division 2 which, once again, has absolutely no bearing on you. I was just wondering how much of your argument was actually on behalf of the series and how much of it was for your vanity. I don't know about the heavy phsycological stuff but It almost seems to me that what's really important to you here is make sure i know who's "boss". Pun intended.

I do appreciate your helping everybody last week and you really seem like an OK guy so please correct me if I'm wrong.

While I agree that this has absolutely no bearing on him, I think he mentioned in an earlier post that he wants it to be fair for all drivers. The reasoning he laid out was that if we split D1 to give people like me a chance to fight for a podium, then D2 should be split to give the middle/tail end of D2 a chance to fight for a podium.

However no one in D2 has voiced that concern yet, so although it would be 'fair' it would be unnecessary.

As to Hugo's true intentions, I don't know whether or not he is trying to put you in your place but it doesn't seem that way to me.

 

[Metar]

I also find it odd that the proposition to create an elite division doesn't have any effect on you since you come in first or second every time you race and yet you are the strongest against it.

That's because winning Div0 or Div1 won't matter to him


I find, re-sorting the divisions will only create a mess. It might benefit low-Div1ers, or low-Div2ers, but it will certainly be a lot of trouble for everyone - not to mention messing things up for mid-Div2 and regular Div3 drivers. The division-system, together with the promotions, have kept things balanced so far - and I see no reason for it to be changed. I think I have the right to speak for myself, seeing as I'm a usually low-Div2 driver, who's chances for a gold are very low (this week's performance was due to setup and time invested), so I'm not one who actually benefits from the current system - I'm in a similar position as the low-Div1 drivers, just slower. I feel like it's enough of an honor to be in a higher division - at least, enough to know that podiums don't really matter.

Let's take me, FE as examples:
When I joined, I was an average Div3 guy. Barely scraping a silver, but never got a bronze until I made a very quick last-second effort (3 laps done, 2 minutes before the deadline). However, I slowly improved, getting a win here and there, mostly due to a slow field (Week 71) or hard efforts (71 & 75, though 75 was just a hard-fought gold). The big improvement started on Week 78 - from that point on, I won every week I competed in, mostly winning by more than a second (except on short courses). Simply enough, like Jetboys now is (though, I was slower than he is), I was too quick for Div3. So I was promoted. (And unlike JetBoys, I'm having trouble keeping up)
Now, same goes for FE - he probably didn't spend much time in the qualifier, or just got a bad result, and landed in Div2. From that point, he won many races - andby quite a margin. Again - too much for Div2, and the promotion didn't take long.

As a final, short sum-up: Silvers and bronzes in Div1 will always be more satisfactory, IMO, than a Div2 podium. Same goes for Div2/Div3 promotees.

I just typed a really long post, and then lost it, so here's the sum-up

 

[FinaL ExaM]

As a final, short sum-up: Silvers and bronzes in Div1 will always be more satisfactory, IMO, than a Div2 podium. Same goes for Div2/Div3 promotees.

Yes, I could not agree more that Division 1 Silvers and Bronzes are infinitely more satisfactory. The problem is that you are arguing in a vacuum here sir. You're arguing based on the existing structure and not taking into account a valuable reality with regard to this issue; The problem, which apparently just isn't being heard, is that those medals are simply unavailable to many Division 1 racers regadless of thier efforts. This is the whole reason this idea came up in the first place.

 

[FinaL ExaM]

Now, same goes for FE - he probably didn't spend much time in the qualifier, or just got a bad result, and landed in Div2. From that point, he won many races - andby quite a margin. Again - too much for Div2, and the promotion didn't take long.

Thank you Gingiba for inadvertantly reinforcing my argument. As I just mentioned in the very post you are rebutting, If it is standard practice to quickly promote drivers that obviously belong in a faster class, why is it so far fetched that the few Division 1 racers who are just as obviously superior be promoted to the Elite class they obviously belong in??

 

[Kelly]

There has been no such proposition for a split Division 2.

Division 2 is much more closely contested. If you check the history of division 2, there is a much larger variety of podium finishers Than division 1.


Logically speaking, if I won Division 2 just about every week and I was moved to a faster division, wouldn't you also have to be promoted to a faster division since your result is also almost always a win? It's the last logical progression to add the ultimate elite division for the Division 1 racers who are just obviously in a faster class. I don't forsee any addition Divisions being necessary because I'm pretty confident there isn't another racer in the world fast enough to be in a class above you skillwise.

Totally agree! 👍

Doesn't mean I disagree with anyone elses points, but to me you hit the nail on the head right there. If others don't see that then I suggest everything should just stay the same. I don't want to see a div 2 split, there's no need.

 

[Sphinx]

FE,
What you propose argues against every OLR challenge that has ever come before. By suggesting that everyone in a division should have a fair crack of the whip is laughable. The solution is simple, improve your driving skills and chase for that podium that you desire so much, or quit the WRS and join a challenge that will enable you to get the praise that you believe you deserve.

Here’s a link to Ron’s [High Speed Ring]-TOURING CARS vs RACE vs JGTC:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=92539
Perhaps you could contact Ron and ask him if there is anyway that he can sort it so you can compete for a top place on the leaderboard. Maybe asking Ron for a faster car than the other competitors may help. I'm sure ron would laugh at you for even suggesting such a thing.

Also, If you know anything about the English Football Premiership (I'm sure you don't, but I'll say it anyway) then you will know that not all clubs in that division stand much chance in competing for the 1st, 2nd & 3rd places. Maybe they should split the Premiership into two to allow those lesser teams the chance for a podium, or maybe those teams should just improve themselves and earn the place like everyone else has in the past.

 

[Metar]

^ Ouch. Jerry moved back in, guns blazing

But, softened down a bit, that's my basic opinion - and 3 divisions is still better than the single one that's common in most leagues.

And, to add another analogy - F1. Half the field there doesn't stand a chance for a victory, be it the car's fault (As is evident in this year's Melbourne qualifying, Ferrari's superior cars beat Alonso's driving) or the racer's. Do they quit?
(Bad analogy - they sell the group)

 

[Sjaak]

All of this is further evidence that you are arguing for the sake of squashing this newbie's rebellion against the status qou without really researching your argument or thinking it out logically. I do appreciate your helping me and everybody else last week and you really seem like an OK guy so please correct me if I'm wrong.

You are wrong.

When div.1 will be split,why not div.2?
Hugo had a valid point.

When Hotboi and Holl01 took every victory in div 1 for more then a year,I noticed no complains about that,only admoration.
So when it was allright back then, why isn't nowadays?

For me there is no need to divide any divisions.

 

[Mr P]

Here’s a link to Ron’s [High Speed Ring]-TOURING CARS vs RACE vs JGTC:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=92539
Perhaps you could contact Ron and ask him if there is anyway that he can sort it so you can compete for a top place on the leaderboard. Maybe asking Ron for a faster car than the other competitors may help. I'm sure ron would laugh at you for even suggesting such a thing.

Not sure how I would reply to a request like that? but I at least like to think I am not beyond reasoning or discussion instead of making my mind up before the debate has taken its course

My advice is to drop this subject FE you are falling on deaf ears now and its starting to look long winded. It's just a game after all and to squeeze every drip out of a debate for a simple passtime is just too much.

I wasn't going to reply in here again but when I see my name 4 times in one post I obviously have to stick my head in.

Back to my corner ...

 

[Sphinx]

Not sure how I would reply to a request like that? but I at least like to think I am not beyond reasoning or discussion instead of making my mind up before the debate has taken its course

This isn't about that at all, Ron

For some reason, my loyalty to you and the respect I have for you led me to give one of your online friends a second chance. I know that sounds stupid now, but that’s how I saw it at the time. Now, when a GTP banned user comes back with a different username, one would think that he/she would keep their head down and tow the line so not to attract attention. That’s the thing you see, attention is what this person is seeking, always has done and always will do, regardless of being banned here or not.

I put myself on the line by giving MaxE a second chance and all he did was throw it in my face. I’m sorry but he is not racing here anymore. He’s had his chance but blew it by continuing this charade and his gradual display of hatred towards Hugo that is common knowledge if it were known that FinaL_ExaM is actually MaxE.

 

[Mr P]

This isn't about that at all, Ron

For some reason, my loyalty to you and the respect I have for you led me to give one of your online friends a second chance. I know that sounds stupid now, but that’s how I saw it at the time. Now, when a GTP banned user comes back with a different username, one would think that he/she would keep their head down and tow the line so not to attract attention. That’s the thing you see, attention is what this person is seeking, always has done and always will do, regardless of being banned here or not.

I put myself on the line by giving MaxE a second chance and all he did was throw it in my face. I’m sorry but he is not racing here anymore. He’s had his chance but blew it by continuing this charade and his gradual display of hatred towards Hugo that is common knowledge if it were known that FinaL_ExaM is actually MaxE.

I dont see what your allowing Max E / FE to race in the WRS has to do with me? I knew nothing about FE being Max until about 2 weeks ago and to my knowledge he has been racing here for weeks! ... Infact you knew before me if you will think back to when you hinted to me via msn? .. anyway I wont have any of this mess shifted onto my back for having an opinion ... Thats all my part in this thread was and nothing else, sorry to agree with Max or whoever on this subject. Ok off to get my popcorn now 👍

 

[Sphinx]

Who knew first is irrelevant, but seeing as you are trying to record history here then it's only right to say that you know very well who guessed it first.

 

[Mr P]

If it's irrelevant then why make a point of it to me? I'm just about done with this pointless debate! ... or is it an argument?