Obama Presidency Discussion Thread

[Omnis]

you can bet your ass that we'll see a continuation of more New Deal-type policies.

No we won't. Why? Because we're bankrupt. Those programs are bankrupt.

 

[YSSMAN]

Anyone see the McCain-Palin appearance on NBC tonight? Thoughts?

My initial impression is that they looked tired and uncomfortable, but other than that, it was business-as-usual for the GOP nominees. I'm looking forward to more of it later in the week, but so far the questions have pretty much been softballs.

 

[Solid Fro]

O'Reilly hits the target, dead on.

 

[FoolKiller]

I was wondering if anyone else saw the reports of CNN taking the National Review story completely out of context to throw Palin off like that. It was blatantly cheap. I think she handled it well though when she said, "Who wrote that piece?" You could tell the interviewer was immediately hiding something when he stumbled on that and said, "Um, I don't know. I just have this quote here."

 

[Kent]

That's right foolkiller. Further, to make the interviewer look worse... Who quotes someone without knowing who's being quoted?
I'd say someone from that interview is stupid, incompetent, and under-qualified but it isn't Palin. CNN. :yawn:

 

[Keef]

Yeah, that was blatant. I don't spend enough time on the big network to judge their perceived corruptness or what have you, but after seeing just that one piece, CNN's trustworthiness has just gone out the door in my eyes. They'll certainly not be getting any views from me. I'll stick to YouTube.

I don't see many people within the media that actually tell the truth, or at least try too. I like Bill O'Reilly, and I like Mike McConnell and Bill Cunningham (thought I think he's been too anti-Obama lately; he's got a history of causing a ruckus) and John Stossel seems to do a great job in his features. Does John show up on the big networks very often? It'd be nice to watch his show if he has one.

This is a link to Bill Cunningham's podcast from the other day concerning Obama's birth certificate and whatnot. He speaks with a guy named Dr. Jerome Corsi, who right now is in Hawai'i researching Obama's birth certificate history.:http://a1135.g.akamai.net/f/1135/18...k_Radio&PCAST_TITLE=Bill_Cunningham_On_Demand It works for me, and if it doesn't work for you, go here and click on the cast from 10/22/08, hour 2.

So, is this whole birth certificate thing not a big deal anymore? Was it a big deal? Is it still? Willie would certainly not be talking about outdated news or news that was fake. He's like the Bill O'Reilly of talk radio. And obviously this is worth talking about to him.

EDIT: Here's another podcast with Eddie and Tracy that I posted in the presidential debate thread. It's an interview with Bob Barr. Short, but interesting. Barr is always interesting.

 

[Omnis]

Can't wait for someone to edit out Bill'O saying that the press is corrupt. (we are corrupt!)

 

[YSSMAN]

Everyone always complains about the press being corrupt, when every damn outlet is just as guilty as the other. Like I've said before, you're often going to get the best coverage from outside the US (mostly from the BBC), but you've gotta cherry-pick your way across the networks, cable operations, newspapers and internet sites. Everyone has a lean, its your job to spot it and choose to agree with it or not.

 

[Solid Fro]

So, is this whole birth certificate thing not a big deal anymore? Was it a big deal? Is it still? Willie would certainly not be talking about outdated news or news that was fake. He's like the Bill O'Reilly of talk radio. And obviously this is worth talking about to him.

It never was a big deal. It was only a rumor with no evidence behind it, so most Conservative blogs never ran with it. The Obama campaign finally released his certificate and that pretty much ended the story.

On a side note: I am Spar... Joe!!!

 

[FoolKiller]

John Stossel seems to do a great job in his features. Does John show up on the big networks very often? It'd be nice to watch his show if he has one.

He regularly works for ABC's 20/20, which airs on Friday nights.

 

[Giancarlo]

O'Reilly hits the target, dead on.

I can only disagree with the whole bit about Palin's clothing. Um, that is a very big deal.

To consider yourself a part of "middle-class working America," and to claim that you are "going through the exact same issues, unlike the Washington elite" just like the rest of us -- then spend more on clothing in two months than working class citizens make in two years -- is called hypocrisy. It's building up a false image. It's not a partisan matter.

Why didn't O'Reilly get flustersed over that too? Then he mentions media biase? Oh, lol.

 

[McLaren]

I can only disagree with the whole bit about Palin's clothing. Um, that is a very big deal.

To consider yourself a part of "middle-class working America," and to claim that you are "going through the exact same issues, unlike the Washington elite" just like the rest of us -- then spend more on clothing in two months than working class citizens make in two years -- is called hypocrisy. It's building up a false image. It's not a partisan matter.

Why didn't O'Reilly get flustersed over that too? Then he mentions media biase? Oh, lol.

Because Palin didn't pay for her clothing out of her own pocket, the RNC did.

Palin gives her take on the spree.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081024/ap_on_el_pr/palin_clothing

 

[YSSMAN]

Because Palin didn't pay for her clothing out of her own pocket, the RNC did.

Thats the problem though, the RNC shouldn't be paying for it either, especially when it is well-known that McCain doesn't hold a candle to Obama and the Democrats when it comes to campaign funding. I mean, c'mon, I wish I could pick up the hotline and talk to Dick DeVos here in Grand Rapids... I'd be furious if I knew they were throwing money around like that. Hell, now we're hearing stories about the McCain-Palin campaign spending $22K on makeup in the first two weeks of October, what gives?

If this is supposed to be the choice that is fiscally responsible, cutting spending, and being closer to "average Joe" than anyone else, I don't think the way they're operating their campaign is a good sign as to how things would go in the White House.

 

[FoolKiller]

Hell, now we're hearing stories about the McCain-Palin campaign spending $22K on makeup in the first two weeks of October, what gives?

If you were married that would make total sense to you.

 

[Solid Lifters]

Interestink...

http://dockets.justia.com/docket/court-paedce/case_no-2:2008cv04083/case_id-281573/

 

[Giancarlo]

Because Palin didn't pay for her clothing out of her own pocket, the RNC did.

Palin gives her take on the spree.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081024/ap_on_el_pr/palin_clothing

So? Does that make a difference?

I punch babies at the local hospital every Thursday night. But i didn't used to, dontchaknow!

 

[Omnis]

I'd like to see the poll redone after Nov. 4th. It'd be interesting to compare who people say they'll vote for and whether or not they actually voted that way (or voted at all).

 

[Joey D]

Just to show that both sides of the fence have loonies on them.

Woman admits making up attack linked to McCain sticker, police say

A woman who told police she was assaulted by a man angered about a John McCain bumper sticker on her car admitted she made up the report, the Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, assistant police chief said Friday.

The 20-year-old from Texas told investigators a man approached her Wednesday night at an ATM in Pittsburgh's East End, put a blade to her neck and demanded money, Pittsburgh Police Department public information officer Diane Richard said.

She said she gave him $60 and stepped away from him, Richard said.

She further said the man "punched her in the back of the head, knocking her to the ground, and he continued to punch and kick her while threatening to teach her a lesson for being a McCain supporter," according to a police statement.

The woman also told police her attacker "called her a lot of names and stated that 'You are going to be a Barack supporter,' at which time she states he sat on her chest, pinning both her hands down with his knees, and scratched into her face a backward letter 'B' on the right side of her face using what she believed to be a very dull knife."

At the time, Richard said, "We, the police, cannot substantiate this yet. This is what she told police."

The woman refused medical attention, Richard said, although she told the investigating officer she would see a doctor Thursday.

Richard said the woman described her alleged attacker as an African-American, 6 feet 4 inches tall with a medium build and short dark hair, wearing dark clothing and shiny shoes.

Before the revelation that the report was false, McCain spokeswoman Jill Hazelbaker said that McCain and running mate Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin "spoke to the victim and her family after learning about the incident."

The Obama campaign also had issued a statement wishing the woman a "speedy recovery."

 

[Solid Fro]

The New York Times gushed over Michelle Obama's wardrobe and she's not even running. Don't even get me started about that spiffy black jacket Obama keeps wearing.

Maybe all presidential candidates should go naked.

I'll let Palin wear her snowmachine pants and valley trash t-shirt because, y'know... she's really is white trash, not a vice-president nominee.

 

[Tornado]

The New York Times gushed over Michelle Obama's wardrobe and she's not even running. Don't even get me started about that spiffy black jacket Obama keeps wearing.

Maybe all presidential candidates should go naked.

I'll let Palin wear her snowmachine pants and valley trash t-shirt because, y'know... she's really is white trash, not a vice-president nominee.

^ That. Do you really think that power suits, pant suits and the like are cheap? Middle class people probably can't afford them, no, but then again they don't have to. Its really a non issue unless you want all public officials to start wearing Carter sweaters or something.

 

[Keef]

If this is supposed to be the choice that is fiscally responsible, cutting spending, and being closer to "average Joe" than anyone else, I don't think the way they're operating their campaign is a good sign as to how things would go in the White House.

You do realize what you buy for the President, right? One of us is a hypocrite, and it might be both of us.

EDIT : People in the public eye must look the part. For instance, Ron Paul has a fat wife, therefore he did not get the republican nomination. Now, before all you guys start screaming at me, you know that "hollywood" plays just as big a role as the actual facts, if not bigger, to all these idiot Americans that ended up getting us sensible people stuck with the worst candidates of the hole bunch that tried. My mind absolutely exploded when The People failed to elect pretty-boy Mitt Romney to the republican ticket. Absolutely exploded. I thought "Holy Jesus, Americans did not act like Americans. What is this world coming to?!" Now I sit here and think to myself "Holy Jesus, Americans acted like Americans. What is this world coming to..." I've been thinking of moving to England where all the people have been persecuted by the government for so long that they've simply stopped bitching about it.

 

[Philly]

Not really on topic but I was looking through my recently acquired Washington Voter's guide and found it interesting that both socialist parties are mentioned 4th and 5th in it, both coming before the Libertarian party. Perhaps Seattle's liberal politics have a role in that.

 

[YSSMAN]

^ That. Do you really think that power suits, pant suits and the like are cheap? Middle class people probably can't afford them, no, but then again they don't have to. Its really a non issue unless you want all public officials to start wearing Carter sweaters or something.

I think the big difference here is that much of what Michelle and Barack have been wearing appear to be a part of their own personal wardrobe, not something new off-the-rack at Nieman Markus. They have done a great job of wearing clothes that otherwise appear to be "normal" to most people, not anything that wouldn't otherwise be available at Macy's or Joseph A. Bank. I mean, c'mon, we can even compare shoes to see a clear difference...

Obama's re-soled favorites

VS

McCain's $520 Italian imports

RE: Keef

Yes, we're both being a bit hypocritical, but its also an important discussion... Where do we draw the line at "looking good" versus what is "realistic," and furthermore, how will the public perceive it? I don't think I'd want to see either candidate get up on stage at any point wearing an Old Navy tee shirt and a pair of Levis to show how "down to Earth" they are (although, the thought is funny), as I would expect them to be a bit "flashy" with their suits and dresses. Nevertheless, there is a limit at which either should be showing off, and my arguement would generally be that if they are to represent the people, they should be wearing clothes that otherwise would be slightly above normal for the rest of us.

 

[Solid Lifters]

With all this childish talk about clothing and shoes, I thought I remind people of the important stuff...


Quotes from: "Dream of My Father"


From Dreams of My Father: 'I ceased to advertise my mother's race at the age of 12 or 13, when I began to suspect that by doing so I was ingratiating myself to whites.'

From Dreams of My Father: 'I found a solace in nursing a pervasive sense of grievance and animosity against my mother's race.'

From Dreams of My Father: 'There was something about him that made me wary, a little too sure of himself, maybe. And white.'

From Dreams of My Father: 'It remained necessary to prove which side you were on, to show your loyalty to the black masses, to strike out and name names.'

From Dreams of My Father: 'I never emulate white men and brown men whose fates didn't speak to my own. It was into my father's image, the black man, son of Africa , that I'd packed all the attributes I sought in myself , the attributes of Martin and Malcolm, DuBois and Mandela.'



Quote from: "Audacity of Hope"


From Audacity of Hope: 'I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction.'



Amazes me how so many people can choose to vote for this despicable racist. Plus, that last line is pretty scary knowing how many Muslim states plan to test Obama's commitment to being 'peaceful' to all Muslims, both good or bad.

 

[McLaren]

So? Does that make a difference?

Yes, it does. You made it sound like she paid for it herself. And if you read the link I posted, she reports it's exaggerated.

RE: YSSMAN's post comparing shoes, so what? You're pointing out McCain's $520 shoes, but I've yet to hear you condemn Edward for his $400 haircuts.

 

[Solid Fro]

With all this childish talk about clothing and shoes, I thought I remind people of the important stuff...

Amazes me how so many people can choose to vote for this despicable racist. Plus, that last line is pretty scary knowing how many Muslim states plan to test Obama's commitment to being 'peaceful' to all Muslims, both good or bad.

Don't forget about that Obama's grand mother is the "typical White person", or Obama's reverend of 20 years screaming "Hillary ain't never been called a N*gger", or Pfleger's "I'm White and I'm entitled" screech, or Obama having a funny name nor "looking like those other presidents on those dollar bills".

"Oh, did I mention he's black?"

Thanks Solid, you got me reved up. I can go on all day about how Obama wants to control your thermostat. Forcing your children to learn Spanish. Making sure your tires are inflated. Claiming President Bush isn't his president. Expecting you to be bitter, clinging to your guns. "Spreading the wealth around." Oh, and saying our military is air raiding villages and killing civilians.

 

[Omnis]

I can't believe some of you guys and the media have descended into bickering about what the candidates wear. It's sad.

 

[Pupik]

Not really on topic but I was looking through my recently acquired Washington Voter's guide and found it interesting that both socialist parties are mentioned 4th and 5th in it, both coming before the Libertarian party. Perhaps Seattle's liberal politics have a role in that.

It's more likely in the order that they were approved by the Board of Elections for the county and/or state. Many third-parties have to work hard to be on the ballot (each state has their own rule, guidelines, and even fee schedules), so some qualify earlier than others.

For example, the Libertarian Party candidate was 4th on the ballot in '04, and they were way down the list this time around in my county. On another local race (I forget which) two years ago, the Libertarian candidate split the (D) and the (R).

I can't believe some of you guys and the media have descended into bickering about what the candidates wear. It's sad.

Spot on.

It's not as if they're not trying to dress for the job; I expect the leader of the country to look good. And to put it another way, who doesn't dress up for their own interview? That's what the campaign process is all about. Do you honestly think the people who go to the $1000-dinners from boosters and supporters from either party wear jeans and T-shirts when they arrive?

 

[Joey D]

Palin is "going rouge" according to a McCain aide. Now I don't know how true this is or how sound the source is, but if it is true then the GOP is nothing more then a joke now. Personally Palin is what turns me off from McCain, I like McCain about as much as Obama, which really isn't saying much but throw Palin in there and I just hate what that administration would become.

Anyway, read and make up your own mind.

Palin's 'going rogue,' McCain aide says
With 10 days until Election Day, long-brewing tensions between GOP vice presidential candidate Gov. Sarah Palin and key aides to Sen. John McCain have become so intense, they are spilling out in public, sources say.

Several McCain advisers have suggested to CNN that they have become increasingly frustrated with what one aide described as Palin "going rogue."

A Palin associate, however, said the candidate is simply trying to "bust free" of what she believes was a damaging and mismanaged roll-out.

McCain sources say Palin has gone off-message several times, and they privately wonder whether the incidents were deliberate. They cited an instance in which she labeled robocalls -- recorded messages often used to attack a candidate's opponent -- "irritating" even as the campaign defended their use. Also, they pointed to her telling reporters she disagreed with the campaign's decision to pull out of Michigan.

A second McCain source says she appears to be looking out for herself more than the McCain campaign.

"She is a diva. She takes no advice from anyone," said this McCain adviser. "She does not have any relationships of trust with any of us, her family or anyone else.

"Also, she is playing for her own future and sees herself as the next leader of the party. Remember: Divas trust only unto themselves, as they see themselves as the beginning and end of all wisdom."

A Palin associate defended her, saying that she is "not good at process questions" and that her comments on Michigan and the robocalls were answers to process questions.

But this Palin source acknowledged that Palin is trying to take more control of her message, pointing to last week's impromptu news conference on a Colorado tarmac.

Tracey Schmitt, Palin's press secretary, was urgently called over after Palin wandered over to the press and started talking. Schmitt tried several times to end the unscheduled session.

"We acknowledge that perhaps she should have been out there doing more," a different Palin adviser recently said, arguing that "it's not fair to judge her off one or two sound bites" from the network interviews.

The Politico reported Saturday on Palin's frustration, specifically with McCain advisers Nicolle Wallace and Steve Schmidt. They helped decide to limit Palin's initial press contact to high-profile interviews with Charlie Gibson of ABC and Katie Couric of CBS, which all McCain sources admit were highly damaging.

In response, Wallace e-mailed CNN the same quote she gave the Politico: "If people want to throw me under the bus, my personal belief is that the most honorable thing to do is to lie there."

But two sources, one Palin associate and one McCain adviser, defended the decision to keep her press interaction limited after she was picked, both saying flatly that she was not ready and that the missteps could have been a lot worse.

They insisted that she needed time to be briefed on national and international issues and on McCain's record.

"Her lack of fundamental understanding of some key issues was dramatic," said another McCain source with direct knowledge of the process to prepare Palin after she was picked. The source said it was probably the "hardest" to get her "up to speed than any candidate in history."

Schmitt came to the back of the plane Saturday to deliver a statement to traveling reporters: "Unnamed sources with their own agenda will say what they want, but from Gov. Palin down, we have one agenda, and that's to win on Election Day."

Yet another senior McCain adviser lamented the public recriminations.

"This is what happens with a campaign that's behind; it brings out the worst in people, finger-pointing and scapegoating," this senior adviser said.

This adviser also decried the double standard, noting that Democratic nominee Sen. Barack Obama's running mate, Sen. Joe Biden, has gone off the reservation as well, most recently by telling donors at a fundraiser that America's enemies will try to "test" Obama.

Tensions like those within the McCain-Palin campaign are not unusual; vice presidential candidates also have a history of butting heads with the top of the ticket.

John Edwards and his inner circle repeatedly questioned Sen. John Kerry's strategy in 2004, and Kerry loyalists repeatedly aired in public their view that Edwards would not play the traditional attack dog role with relish because he wanted to protect his future political interests.

Even in a winning campaign like Bill Clinton's, some of Al Gore's aides in 1992 and again in 1996 questioned how Gore was being scheduled for campaign events.

Jack Kemp's aides distrusted the Bob Dole camp and vice versa, and Dan Quayle loyalists had a list of gripes remarkably similar to those now being aired by Gov. Palin's aides.

With the presidential race in its final days and polls suggesting that McCain's chances of pulling out a win are growing slim, Palin may be looking after her own future.

"She's no longer playing for 2008; she's playing 2012," Democratic pollster Peter Hart said. "And the difficulty is, when she went on 'Saturday Night Live,' she became a reinforcement of her caricature. She never allowed herself to be vetted, and at the end of the day, voters turned against her both in terms of qualifications and personally."

I am not in any way saying this is true or trying to pass this off as fact, I'm merely posting an article on the subject because if it is true then it's important. I'm sure it will all be exposed in the next 10 days if it is.

 

[Tornado]

I really wish the McCain camp hadn't turned to the first women they could find when they tried to pull the "Grrl Power" card.