Oversteer on corner exit

[wmwolverines]

I'm getting a lot of this in most of my mid-engine cars and can't seem to tune it out. Lotus Elise, McLaren MP4-12C, Ford GT 40 to name a few. Any ideas on fixing it other than less throttle on corner exit? I'm a joypad player so its difficult to precisely control throttle with the buttons or triggers.

 

[wmwolverines]

FWIW I use soft sport tires on most of my vehicles other than some high powered racing or supercars I'll give racing hard tires... I also don't use any driving aides like traction control, stability control, anti-spin, active steering, etc.

 

[KingSakery]

I´m a DS3 user too and this was my solution
Install a LSD.
Initial Torque: 20-30 (depending on preferences)
Acc: 30-40 (depending on preferences)
Brake: 10-20 (depending on preferences)

Play a bit with it and you´ll get the oversteer away (its still there, but reduced).
Furthermore a FC Suspension can help you too

 

[dj-smurph]

Have tried applying the throttle in a more progressive way MR cars are more prone to oversteer but it's all about throttle control only full power once all the wheels are straight.

 

[magburner]

It's definitely an LSD problem. I never used to drive MR cars because I would have the same thing happen to me. Fiddle about with the LSD, and you will find a good setting to negate the effects of oversteer. 👍

 

[HKS racer]

@ OP are you talking about online tunes or offline tunes? I ask you this because in some cases cars react very different in online lobbies. Try to set rear LSD to 5,5,20 this will help, let me know.

 

[scarslasher]

Ah, this should come in handy for my '06 Ford GT.

 

[Poppins]

I personally wouldnt lower it to 5/5/20 as that is very open under acceleration

try something more along the lines of ~15/20/10

 

[Rotary Junkie]

I personally wouldnt lower it to 5/5/20 as that is very open under acceleration

try something more along the lines of ~15/20/10

I'd go as low as 5/5/5. And have, in fact. It may be "very open" but that's a good thing when you're dealing with cars that normally try to kill you the second you look at the throttle.

 

[Poppins]

Yeah but its better to just learn throttle control and keep it a bit more locked and use that to your advantage under straight line accel.

I know what you mean though, if its really that insane for someone then by all means open it up and drive like that for a while, maybe lock it more once you get more used to the car but throttle control is whats really needed.


EDIT: and btw i set every cars braking lsd to a default of 10 so im able to turn while braking.

 

[HKS racer]

Yeah but its better to just learn throttle control and keep it a bit more locked and use that to your advantage under straight line accel.

I know what you mean though, if its really that insane for someone then by all means open it up and drive like that for a while, maybe lock it more once you get more used to the car but throttle control is whats really needed.


EDIT: and btw i set every cars braking lsd to a default of 10 so im able to turn while braking.

But OP still need to say us what he want to do. Is it an online tune where every kind of tuning and driving skills should be involved? Or it's just a request to improve the stability in some way, without much effort, my advice was intended for the second possibility. It will help car handling but if you wonna win races online you need some more, not only LSD settings. That's for sure. So I could agree with you when trying to advice advanced settings but we need to know what he really want

 

[sanmusa]

Try putting soft tires in the rear and medium tires in the front, this helped my Miura and Rufs a lot.

 

[Poppins]

That just ends up hindering cornering though

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Try putting soft tires in the rear and medium tires in the front, this helped my Miura and Rufs a lot.

That's a massive band-aid.

All you're doing there is reducing front grip to make the lack of rear grip less obvious. Result? Slower car.

 

[Poppins]

Yeah just play with the LSD, maybe loosen the rear a bit. A bit of toe in at the back tends to help it not go crazy too.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Is it bad I've seen cases where rear toe-out keeps snap-oversteer away?

 

[Poppins]

umm I cant really say I havent played with it too much but Im pretty sure rear toe out GIVES you snap oversteer, I know it gives you oversteer in general and makes it able to get sideways easier so Id assume so.

but like I said I havent played with it too much, Ive always attributed snap oversteer to the rear anti roll bars being too stiff. I just loosen them a notch and maybe add a bit of spring rate to make up for the smushiness but I find the ARB is what makes you catch really hard and then snap the other way.

 

[budious]

I would think toe should follow in the direction of the load bearing tire, since front outside and rear inside handle the cornering forces, shouldn't Toe-In front and Toe-Out rear provide the most benefit?

 

[Poppins]

its best to have no toe on front or rear for cornering, because no matter what if you have it set in or out one tire is going to drag more then the other during cornering

toe in on the front makes it understeer more and not be as sensitive to small changes and for the rear it doesnt really affect understeering too much but having it set positive in the rear makes you oversteer under throttle and makes it want to go sideways really easy even on straight stretches

i literally set it the same for every single car

-0.10/+0.20

 

[wmwolverines]

Typically toe-in in the US is described as a negative whereas in the game its described as a positiv; correct? I put a lot of toe-in in the rear to help with corner exit oversteer and didn't help near as much as it should. I don't like using 'extreme' settings and agree with the above that using too high of a setting upsets other things I don't want to upset...

Yes, I know more precise throttle control is the answer to my issues (difficult w/ DS3) though it should be possible to get on the accelerator more quickly than I'm able to with my MR cars. With racing softs, most of these cars are plenty good with corner exit but no tire like racing softs exist in real life. IMO racing mediums have more grip than whats any actual IRL racing tire really has...

I haven't found a lot of difference in the tunes/handling of cars online and offline, not that I've noticed but I tend to drive different cars online than I do offline...

Opening up the differential (5-5-5) usually gives me much less grip while I need more; maybe I don't understand the LSD settings well (I thought I did) but most FR/AWD/FF cars I can certainly setup very well. I'll certainly experiment with it but its worth a try... Probably will try that (5-5-5 LSD) before I try higher LSD settings which makes my car harder to turn, which I don't really want. Pretty sure I'll have to up my initial torque awfully high if KingSakery is correct. With FR and AWD vehicles my initial torque is rarely over 12 or 14 with a high powered car, maybe moderately to high powered MR cars need a figure in the twenties...

My deceleration setting is usually in the 8-12 range for all cars with few exceptions. My acceleration setting varies greatly depending on how much grip I need WHILE cornering while accelerating. Varies mostly on how much power the car has; the higher power the car has, the higher the value usually. Only caveat is if I have a 'race' car with lots of downforce, allows me to use a lower ACC setting.

Thanks everyone above for your advice. I'll get back to you hopefully tonight if I have time to tune these vehicles. Another vehicles I have corner exit issues is the Ferrari F430 Scuderia, its long wheelbase I think lessens the issue but its still there.

 

[cjs959]

its best to have no toe on front or rear for cornering, because no matter what if you have it set in or out one tire is going to drag more then the other during cornering

Not correct, Neutral isn't the best toe settings specifically for cornering. You want a little bit of Toe out on the front tires for cornering (your inside tire when turning will have a smaller turning radius than the outside, this improves cornering).

To help fix your oversteer i would suggest (like everyone above) to play with your LSD. If you have a fully adjustable suspension i would suggest two adjustments, first increase your rear camber a little bit (I usually have my camber settings around 1.2 front, and 2.0 Rear). Having a little more camber in the rear will help keep the rear of the car planted during cornering. You can also soften up your rear sway bar and spring rate settings giving you more grip in the rear.
Hope this helps

 

[Disavowed]

Most cars have rear toe-in because of the stability it provides in cornering. Think "safe mode". I don't know if GT5 models this but unless your car's suspension uses ball joints instead of rubber (or polyurethane) bushings, rear wheel drive cars' rear wheels have a natural tendency to toe-in under power. The only cars that I've seen run toe-out in the rear are drift cars and FF cars to help kill the understeer.

Giving the rear wheels some toe-in will help stabilize the car during corner entry but it also has a tendency to destabilize the car when powering out of a corner especially when the rear end breaks loose. Excessive rear toe-in is what causes the car to snap the other way when you are trying to correct a slide.

As for the front tires, FF cars usually run with some toe-out in the front because of the same reason MR and FR cars run with toe-in in the rear tires. When you accelerate a FF car, the front tires will have a tendency to toe-in. MR and FR cars usually have some toe-in in the front tires because tire friction will cause them to toe-out a little. Again, I have no idea if GT5 actually models all this.

As a general rule, giving the front tires some toe-out will help you turn into corners faster. Toe-in at the rear will help keep your car stable on corner entry and mid corner but be careful not to use too much as it will make the car harder to control once it starts to slide. As always, toe-in or toe-out will not help your car grip more but will help stabilize it.

 

[KingSakery]

@wmwolverines:
With the FC Suspension I try to create a corner-willingness (hope you understand ). And with the LSD I try to reduce the Oversteer, because of DS3

The rear of my cars is a little bit higher => better cornering
The rear springs are stiffer => better cornering
negative Toe front an rear -0.20/-0.15 => better cornering (for me)
Rollbares 4/4
Dampers compression 4/4 => Tires will not loose track
Dampers extension 9/9 => ^

And for me this works very good. All cars corner like I want and if they are FR/MR they got very controlable oversteer.

FF-LSD: 5-10-5 because I don´t like understeer
AWD LSD
Front like FF cars
Rear 20-30-10 or 10-20-10 (first: high power second: low power)

 

[Poppins]

its best to have no toe on front or rear for cornering, because no matter what if you have it set in or out one tire is going to drag more then the other during cornering

Not correct, Neutral isn't the best toe settings specifically for cornering. You want a little bit of Toe out on the front tires for cornering (your inside tire when turning will have a smaller turning radius than the outside, this improves cornering).

To help fix your oversteer i would suggest (like everyone above) to play with your LSD. If you have a fully adjustable suspension i would suggest two adjustments, first increase your rear camber a little bit (I usually have my camber settings around 1.2 front, and 2.0 Rear). Having a little more camber in the rear will help keep the rear of the car planted during cornering. You can also soften up your rear sway bar and spring rate settings giving you more grip in the rear.
Hope this helps

Having a bit of toe out is good as I do it for every car but it does technically make one tire drag a bit. Toe out just makes it alot more sensitive to minute changes in steering angle.

 

[wmwolverines]

Didn't get a whole lot of laps in but did find increasing initial torque drastically helped my corner exit issues considerably. Some of my MR cars ended up with initial torque values in the 40's, most were in the 24 - 36 range...

My Lotus Evora, Lotus Elise, Ferrari F430 Scuderia is what I worked on and all improved a great deal, allowing me to accelerate a lot quicker out of corners and made my lap times more consistent and probably slightly quicker. Thanks for your help guys, need to continue to tune these MR cars as they still aren't where I'd like them to be... Somewhat recently I decided to use sport softs on all my cars instead of racing softs, which imo turn a lot of lousy drivers into decent drivers while teaching good drivers bad habits that you can't get away with more realistic tires... On racing softs and even racing mediums, you can make even poor tunes work well as the tires grip incredibly...

Interested in those people above who recommended rear toe-out (negative) to fix corner exit oversteer, this is the exact opposite of what I'm usually recommended. Going to have to play with this too I guess.

 

[sanmusa]

That's a massive band-aid.

All you're doing there is reducing front grip to make the lack of rear grip less obvious. Result? Slower car.

The Rufs and Miura I tuned that way understeer less with medium tires on the front than with soft tires. I am beginning to wonder whether PD did not model cars with staggered tire sizes correctly. It almost seems that you have to make the front tires grip less to properly simulate the smaller tire size. My Rufs now have predictable turn in, mild correctable oversteer and very stable cornering.

 

[budious]

The Rufs and Miura I tuned that way understeer less with medium tires on the front than with soft tires. I am beginning to wonder whether PD did not model cars with staggered tire sizes correctly. It almost seems that you have to make the front tires grip less to properly simulate the smaller tire size. My Rufs now have predictable turn in, mild correctable oversteer and very stable cornering.

I have noticed similar with using Race Hard front and Race Medium rear on my GT500 endurance tunes, I prefer that tire setup for longevity on the NSX cars. I don't think it has to do with wheel size, only that the rear of the car has stronger grip where it needs it to keep the tail from sliding around with the extra weight of a RR drive car. I had not thought to try it with sport tires on the RUF but I will check it out later.

 

[Poppins]

using different tires is just plain bad and shows you dont know how to tune.

 

[budious]

using different tires is just plain bad and shows you dont know how to tune.

Maybe for tire wear off but this statement is ignorant in light of using tire wear on. I recently made the following observations for GT500 NSX:

Race Hard - lasts longer than medium/soft as a front tire under heavy braking forces.

Race Medium/Soft - lasts longer than a hard as a drive tire since as tire tread decreases wheelspin becomes more prevalent, the more wheelspin occurs, the faster the tire deteriorates. Softer compound continues to grip the surface much longer as diameter of the tires shrinks.

Race Intermediate - good replacement for the front race hard in light rain with some surface accumulation occurring, race medium/soft still provides best acceleration grip in light rain.

Race Rain - good replacement for the front race hard in heavy rain with full surface accumulation occurring, race soft still provides best acceleration grip in heavy rain.

 

[Poppins]

Using racing softs all around yields the same results as racing hards but with less cornering force.



I honestly think using Racing Intermediates works very good for general driving as they are pretty much racing tires with some treads cut in em, Id say a "high performance" sports soft.

I just always set my cars with the same tires front and back no matter what because not doing that gimps my driving and makes my suspension ****ed up, id rather just leave them the same and use the other tuning abilities to change it to handle nicely

Thats all Im saying, using a harder tire on the front is just gimping yourself and you should just tune it out instead.

Oversteer on corner exit? softer rear? harder front? loosen the ARB in the back a bit? a bit of toe in helps stabilty in the rear, dropping the ride height (if the rear is higher then the front) helps oversteer as well.