Photo mode

[Majin SSJ Eric]

Well, Live, Cobra did always say that they were "in-game" graphics so technically he was right all along. You and everybody else assumed they were developmental pics done on a PC. Correct me if I'm wrong, but photo mode is still in-game, is it not? Maybe it's the other way around and Cobra owned all of us........

 

[Soman]

Its in game but its not while you play, it renders a frame and thus making it look "nice/nicer"

 

[Majin SSJ Eric]

But it is in-game, which is what cobra said. I'm sure I can find a hundred threads where everybody blasted cobra, saying that all of the pics were dev pics done on some kind of super computer; that the ps2 could never achieve such hi-res in any mode. Well, as I said, cobra was right. I also seem to recall those same people flaming cobra saying that the ps2 could never render the entire Nurb as well..........

 

[Soman]

It probably was a confusion by what "in game" meant, it was not in game as in game play, these pics are the ps2 rendering that single frame byitself over a much longer period of time then the ps2 does to frame 30 fps or so.

EDIT: Those pics are not in race games, and if they are then they are later "refreshed"

 

[Majin SSJ Eric]

You're missing the point here. I'm not saying that the pics are "in-gameplay" (considering that they are all external pics of cars going around the track, how could they be). I'm saying that they are pics using the GT4 in-game engine and that they were not "dressed up" with the aid of computers outside the ps2 (which was what everybody was intimating). Again, when cobra said the graphics were in-game, he had to mean replays (because you can't drive the car from those views) and the photo mode uses the in-game replay engine, just in higher res.

 

[Dave A]

Cobra was referring to mid race graphics, I'm sure he would even come here and admit to that, but I'm willing to accept that in a way he was right that they are part of the game, he was wrong though in the context, but I was wrong saying they wern't done on the PS2 and assuming they were PC artwork.

 

[Dave A]

As for the Nurb, no one flamed Cobra, KY said himself that he couldn't do long tracks like LeMans and the Ring obviousely he later found a way.

 

[Majin SSJ Eric]

It would also appear that cobra was right about the human element as well (E3 showed that KY and the gang were indeed spending alot of time and programming on human physics with 3D spectators, pit crews, and drivers). Just food for thought the next time anybody wants to call cobra an idiot.

At least Live can admit that he was partially incorrect, which is more than I can say for alot of people around here......

 

[T5-R]

Ah but Majin, the spectators might be 3D but they are very low poly. Not the CGI Movie quality render spectators that cobra claimed would be ingame.

Be interesting to see if in GT4 we'll see full grids of open top cars(of the normal detail) with 3D animated drivers.

Oh, did I forget to mention cars falling down the fully 3D Grand Canyon?

 

[code_kev]

It would also appear that cobra was right about the human element as well (E3 showed that KY and the gang were indeed spending alot of time and programming on human physics with 3D spectators, pit crews, and drivers). Just food for thought the next time anybody wants to call cobra an idiot.

Majin, WHY would they give low poly spectators any physics? It's not like run them over or anything The will have premade animations that kick in as you get close. Human element....*shakes head*, I guess the pit crew in GP4 on the pc had the human element then because they move haha, human element...sounds like some crap a sony exec would say to get fanboys all excited.

And majin, there's a difference between IN GAME and INGAME with no interactivity, no other cars, no real track etc etc. Remember the t rex demo on the ps1?

 

[GTXLR]

Oh, did I forget to mention cars falling down the fully 3D Grand Canyon? [/B]

Dont be too harsh on this point.
Kaz did say that this was a possibility, when questioned about damage, he said no but a possibility that you would drive of the edge.
Obviously he changed his mind.

PD obviosuly like doing things the hard way, in that all the human elements from spectators and drivers, will not feature any motion capture tech, but a modelled human physics engine, to simulate the movements.

I dont think we will see any moving 3d spectators on the circuit based tracks ala dirt and rally tracks, but probably 3d pit crews.

 

[code_kev]

The official list of games with the human element...

"








"

 

[T5-R]

Originally posted by GTXLR
Dont be too harsh on this point.
Kaz did say that this was a possibility, when questioned about damage, he said no but a possibility that you would drive of the edge.
Obviously he changed his mind.

Yes but I don't know if you remember, cobra said not only was the canyon *completely* 3D to the very last detail at one point. He also said he'd seen a video of a car falling down a cliff

He admitted his mistake, which is fair enough, wouldn't of mentioned it but Majin seems oblivious.

 

[code_kev]

Majin is just trying to prove everyone wrong, trying to be smart...

"oh technically cobra was right blah blah blah"

....and failing. btw can some one tell me what this "human element" actually is?

 

[T5-R]

The human element is:

























Bollocks, much like the 'Emotion Engine' tripe that Sony bollocked about implying the PS2 was intelligent/had built in AI systems. Which was again complete bollocks. All they really meant was it had a CPU which was quite good at the time. (But as anyone remembers from the launch, not that good, several magazines called some launch games as looking like PSX games )

Physics for human characters in the game? For the drivers maybe, but for all others they'll just be animations. There isn't any need for physics for specators/pit crews, unless you run em over like code_kev said.

 

[GTXLR]

Human element.
is bringin people to life (simulated of course) and feature more in the GT series, instead of just being car/track/lighting interaction, its Cars/Tracks/Lighting/People interaction.

The Physics engine for all the human elements is for the movement of limbs animation for the spectators, to make them look better, more realistic, however the drive physics we have to be a little more complex to allow for body movement related to the motions of the vehicle.

 

[code_kev]

Bringing people to life...thats so vague...so , as T5 put it, bollocks. I can name xbox/pc games with human like AI, does that mean the xbox/pc has the human element too? Come on, lay off it, it's crap and you know it is. The ps2 has no special AI or physics function. And the fact that the spectators move when your near isn't exactly amazing AI, chances are the game has place markers on the road that force the animation to kick in when your close.

 

[T5-R]

Well what they probably mean, is just better animated characters closer to the track/player & maybe basic pit communication with pit crew animations. But they won't be intelligent. Its not like you'll be able to stop in the pit & have a chat to a mechanic over a beer

 

[PjotrStroganov]

Originally posted by T5-R
Well what they probably mean, is just better animated characters closer to the track/player & maybe basic pit communication with pit crew animations. But they won't be intelligent. Its not like you'll be able to stop in the pit & have a chat to a mechanic over a beer

One word: Marketing!

 

[askia47]

Originally posted by code_kev
Bringing people to life...thats so vague...so , as T5 put it, bollocks. I can name xbox/pc games with human like AI, does that mean the xbox/pc has the human element too? Come on, lay off it, it's crap and you know it is. The ps2 has no special AI or physics function. And the fact that the spectators move when your near isn't exactly amazing AI, chances are the game has place markers on the road that force the animation to kick in when your close.

the ps2 will show its strongest features near the end of its life, soon games like Kill Zone will be almost Xbox quality. I wanted you to know that, as it was discussed on G4 tv. its not as strong as xbox put its still here isnt it?

the human element in GT4 is basically something that youll see but not interact with. the only thing youll interact with or see is the pit crew.

 

[Dave A]

The human element to me is just a fancy name for PD puttiong more attentioninto human models in the game such as better looking crowds and a pit crew we don't seem to know anything about yet and the cars drivers ect.

 

[code_kev]

So then anything that looks remotely human is the fabeled "human element" ? What a load of tosh, I can't believe that there are actually people dumb enough to buy that crap. So does sonic have the hedgehog element?

The fact that games get better as the console ages is NOTHING to do with this, it's the same with every console, compare early ps2 games to the ones now, to begin with DC games were better! Same with GC, same with Xbox etc etc etc. And killzone..

panzer orta has the human element too, it has people running about on the air ships . Go on, prove me wrong.

 

[PjotrStroganov]

Originally posted by live4speed
The human element to me is just a fancy name for PD puttiong more attentioninto human models in the game such as better looking crowds and a pit crew we don't seem to know anything about yet and the cars drivers ect.

Talking about hitting the nail on the head.

 

[GTXLR]

Originally posted by live4speed
The human element to me is just a fancy name for PD puttiong more attentioninto human models in the game such as better looking crowds and a pit crew we don't seem to know anything about yet and the cars drivers ect.

Precisley.
Improving the Human element of GT series.
They simply adding much more Presence of people in the series.
They already expanded the Cars, Physics and track elemnts of the game, The human element of the crowds crew and drivers is just another element that has recieved improvement for gt4, over the Flat Packed Cardboard Cutouts of previous GT.

 

[askia47]

Originally posted by live4speed
The human element to me is just a fancy name for PD puttiong more attentioninto human models in the game such as better looking crowds and a pit crew we don't seem to know anything about yet and the cars drivers ect.

right on target

 

[askia47]

Originally posted by code_kev
So then anything that looks remotely human is the fabeled "human element" ? What a load of tosh, I can't believe that there are actually people dumb enough to buy that crap. So does sonic have the hedgehog element?

The fact that games get better as the console ages is NOTHING to do with this, it's the same with every console, compare early ps2 games to the ones now, to begin with DC games were better! Same with GC, same with Xbox etc etc etc. And killzone..

panzer orta has the human element too, it has people running about on the air ships . Go on, prove me wrong.

well in the gt series you felt as though you were racing by yourself and not with other humans. of course that makes sense because your playing the computer, but PD is trying to give the driver a sense "company" if you will, so the experience isnt boring. so instead of seeing card board cut outs you see actually see people moving.

that is all.

 

[code_kev]

So you mean making the graphics better, because that's all i t seems to be to me.

 

[askia47]

well the graphics of the spectators, at least making them move

 

[code_kev]

So making spectators move is the human element? So sega rally 2 has the human element?

 

[PjotrStroganov]

They have also updated the ai in the game. This could also be a part of the concept "human element".

Further, it is just a fancy word for something that is implemented in the industry for years allready.