Poison Fire USA

  • Thread starter Zardoz
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23 "sub-critical" tests, 113 nuclear warheads fired outside the continental U.S., and 1033(!) warheads fired inside the lower 48, 99% of those in Nevada. Now I'm not turning into a democrat, but damn! That's a lot of blowsplosions. I realize it was necessary, otherwise we might be speaking Russian right now, but I had no idea testing went on into the early 90s. And what exactly are these "sub-critical" tests? Bunker Busters and the like? And who the hell decided to blow a load on Mississippi's face?
All I know is that, even if I were allowed, I wouldn't spend much time at Nellis, I might come home glowing at night. Chicago is a pretty rough place, too, though I'm not sure why. Is that where Enrico Fermi and Einstein did their work? I think it was. I declare Kentucky the least radioactive state of all.
I'm not sure if it makes me proud; if it were a video of a B-52 taking it to 'em it'd put a big smile on my face, but I don't know about all that nuclear testing. I'm glad we did it, though, because Russians write their "N"s backward. That's just F'ed up.
 
keef
...and 1033(!) warheads fired inside the lower 48, 99% of those in Nevada. Now I'm not turning into a democrat, but damn! That's a lot of blowsplosions...
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Amen, bro. Good Lord, just watch the ani! Its unreal!

It really makes you think twice about hitting Vegas for a weekend...
 
Did the Nuclear Sub count top out at 190? :eek: You don't want to fight the U.S. Navy.......
 
So, with all that nuclear testing and work going on why can't we get away from oil, coal, and gas for electricity?

keef
I declare Kentucky the least radioactive state of all.
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Yeah, but we put coal out like it's nobody's business. I should grab a picture of the stuff coming out of the power plants. If I could email smell I would do that too.

FPS_nOOb
Proud...? Sad... that's more like it.
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You really don't get objectivism do you? He was referring to the technological advancement of mankind. The fact that we have the ability to do that is a testament to the power of the mind.

You must realize that what you witnessed was a technological stepping stone towards something bigger and better. What we have learned and are still learning from nuclear fission experiments will teach us things that will help us to develop new and cleaner technologies such as possibly nuclear fusion or cold fusion.

Before you can create something beautiful you must make a big mess.
 
FoolKiller
...Before you can create something beautiful you must make a big mess.
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Well, okay, point taken.

However, did we have to make quite such a mess in southern Nevada? I mean, its like they had some excess bomb material, and they looked at each other and said "What'll we do with all this stuff?"
 
I love the implication that all radioactive material is deadly, everywhere, no matter how well contained, designed, used, etc. Gotta love those little death's heads marking anywhere there is a lab that works with radioactive material.

Have these people ever heard of radon? #1 radioactive cause of health issues or death, by a huge margin... and completely natural in origin.
 
Zardoz
Well, okay, point taken.

However, did we have to make quite such a mess in southern Nevada? I mean, its like they had some excess bomb material, and they looked at each other and said "What'll we do with all this stuff?"
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Read up on how it works.
http://www.nv.doe.gov/default.htm

Not a lot to mess up.
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/nf474.jpg
From 43,000 feet up.
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/EM4894_42.jpg

Imagine the power that made this. (100kt bomb)
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/nf121.jpg
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/nf1569.jpg
Looks kind of like this. It isn't the mushroom cloud we imagined. Just a column of dirt and dust.
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/p2746.jpg
It works like this.
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/nf3579.jpg


keef
And what exactly are these "sub-critical" tests? Bunker Busters and the like?
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Non-explosive environmental testing of plutonium so that we can better maintain the reliability of our nuclear facilities.

It looks like this. 2/22/2006
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/di060310004.jpg
They cover it with cement and gravel to prevent radiation leaks.
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/YL9B4471.jpg
Who dropped their pencil?
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/YL9B4367.jpg

You are thinking of BEEF (Big Explosives Experimental Facility), which is on the same property.
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/A950616.jpg
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/A950966.jpg



We are all thinking of this:
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/Ekm109.jpg
This was codename Mike in 1952, the largest explosion ever recorded. It was 3.7 miles wide. "The particular test island of the atoll completely disappeared." :eek:
http://www.nv.doe.gov/library/PhotoLibrary/I-52-07.JPG

I can't find any atmospheric stuff in Nevada after the 1950s. I'm not looking too hard either. I do have to work too you know.
 
Duke
...how well contained, designed, used, etc...
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That's a major issue:

EXCLUSIVE: ABC Investigation Finds Gaping Lapses in Security at Nuclear Reactors

ABC News shared its findings with the schools and the NRC in advance so that security lapses could be addressed before the findings were reported publicly. The findings could be valuable in helping to correct any problems, said Roy Zimmerman, director of the Office of Nuclear Security and Incident Response for the NRC.

The commercial nuke industry went ballistic over this, of course. They went completely nuts after ABC broadcast its "Radioactive Road Trip" segment on Primetime Live, claiming fakery and trick video editing. I saw the broadcast. Some of the facilities were essentially wide open. You could stroll in.

Point is, we're obsessed with terrorism, and wetting our pants over the threat of "dirty bombs" and radioactive material being spread in populated areas, yet it takes a news organization to discover how lax security is at so many nuke facilities. Excuse me, but what is keeping the NRC wonks so busy that they can't push security of commercial and university nuke facilities to the top of their list? ABC News had to do this work for them?

Our tax dollars at work...
 
Zardoz
Actually the Russkies hold that title with the mighty "Tsar Bomba":
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Upon rereading they were discussing the fireball only. "biggest ever produced" is the wording.
 
I wonder what kind of damage a fresh-for-2006 nuclear bomb could yield. I know we haven't teseted any since the early 90s, but I bet we could make something pretty insane, even without practice. Of course, all the tests we've previously done were single warheads, weren't they? We can mount about 20 warheads on the end of a rocket and have them all hit different targets. Imagine if all 20 or so went off at eh same time in the same place. Kowabunga. I bet the U.S. has over 1,000 warheads, too, so if we decided we didn't like the moon anymore, well, we could get rid of it.:lol:
 
keef
...I bet the U.S. has over 1,000 warheads...
Click to expand...

usnuclearwarheads19452002graph.jpg
 
Reading about the Tsar Bomba really makes you feel small. It also scares the crap out of me that they actually tested it.

Having said that, i really want to find more pics, or even a video of it in action. I wan't to know what that much energy looks like.
 
FoolKiller
You really don't get objectivism do you? He was referring to the technological advancement of mankind. The fact that we have the ability to do that is a testament to the power of the mind.

You must realize that what you witnessed was a technological stepping stone towards something bigger and better. What we have learned and are still learning from nuclear fission experiments will teach us things that will help us to develop new and cleaner technologies such as possibly nuclear fusion or cold fusion.

Before you can create something beautiful you must make a big mess.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah... we've really benefitted from this. :rolleyes:
 
Yes, Nevada desert.

Because that's where they test their bombs. Funnily enough. ;)
 
FPS_nOOb
Oh yeah... we've really benefitted from this. :rolleyes:
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Hmm, based on the smiley I am guessing that was heavy with sarcasm so I will respond as such.

Benefits of nuclear technology and reasearch:

1) Energy production
2) Medical technology
3) Agriculture
4) Manufacturing


A bomb in the desert isn't to see if the bomb works but to get readings from the reaction to be used in research. I don't know if you noticed on the website I posted but the Nevada Nuclear Test Site is run by the Department of Energy (DOE) and not the Department of Defense (DOD).

A nuclear test is kind of like a space shuttle mission. They don't just go up and give the space station some supplies. Data for hundreds of experiments is being collected. We aren't blowing them up because we are bored with fireworks. Multiple experiments are getting their data from it.

Your problem is that you see a nuclear test and you instantly think bombs because Americans love playing with bombs.

Can you seriously tell me that you think nothing good came from nuclear technologies?
 
FoolKiller
...Can you seriously tell me that you think nothing good came from nuclear technologies?
Click to expand...

Its the old blessing/curse debate that's been going on since the beginning of the atomic age. We all know what radiation and nukes can do, but we're going to be very grateful for the existence of nuclear power plants as this century progresses. Expect a flurry of nuke plant construction to commence in the near future as oil and gas begins to run seriously short.
 
Zardoz
Its the old blessing/curse debate that's been going on since the beginning of the atomic age. We all know what radiation and nukes can do, but we're going to be very grateful for the existence of nuclear power plants as this century progresses. Expect a flurry of nuke plant construction to commence in the near future as oil and gas begins to run seriously short.
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Yeah, while looking up the list of non-weapon nuclear uses I found an article about the new designs that prevent Chernobyl-like events in the event of an accident and how the plans are drawn up and ready to build once the NIMBYs back off.
 
Cool, anti-meltdown technology. I always thought the way to prevent that was to not do something you weren't supposed to do. Just follow the rules, you know? But if they can make a technology that really does prevent it, well, that's just fine and dandy with me.
If they can come up with this and people get less pissy about nuclear waste, maybe somebody could finally implement my, and many others', idea of nuclear powered cruise ships. I'd be fine with it. I'm sure you've seen all the diesel smoke coming out of those enourmous exhaust stacks. Now you'd just see steam, and they could put a little distillation plant on board to clean the salt out of the ocean water, so they'd have a nearly endless supply of H2O to cool the mug down.
But maybe they should test it on cargo ships first. Of course, many of our Navy ships are nuclear powered, so we know it works. If cruise ships get accepted, maybe we could put a little dinky reactor on freight trains. Then you probably wouldn't need more than one locomotive to move the big loads because nukes can make tremendous amounts of electricity and the amount can be regulated, so you could use a little for a small load and a lot for a big one. Maybe we could slap a ginourmous bank of lithium batteries on the back of the train to soak up some electricity and then tranfer it into a city's power grid when the train is loading/unloading its cargo. The ships could do that, too. We could have nuclear powered passenger trains. But not cars, that's just not cool. Once we cancel out the oil needed for all these ships and trains, we may have enough left to ditch the hydrogen we'd be using by then and switch back to good ol' internal combustion. I like the sound. I'm sure you do, too.
Anyone else have ideas for nuclear application?
 
keef
Cool, anti-meltdown technology. I always thought the way to prevent that was to not do something you weren't supposed to do. Just follow the rules, you know? But if they can make a technology that really does prevent it, well, that's just fine and dandy with me.
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I think it's more about containment in the event of an accident of some form. Essentially if there is a situation no one get shurt unless they were standing in the reactor. If they're doing that then they deserve to be incinerated.

But not cars, that's just not cool.
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What's wrong with a car that's powered by 1.21 gigawatts? I've been waiting for that since the early 80s. The only other source of that much power would be a lightening strike, but you never know when or where one is going to happen. :sly:

Just imagine a Mr. Fusion hooked on to your house or car.
 
Power is nice. But 1,622,000 hp is a bit much. And it wouldn't make any noise. None. Can you imagine how boring Gran Turismo, or just driving in general, would be without any bbrrrrrrrrrrrrrr (boxer) or Vvvrrrraaawwwweeeeeeee (exotic) or weeeeeee weeeeeeee (supercharger whine) or vrrrrmmmmmmmmmmmmm (350Z) or brrrrraaawwwwwww (big V8) or vvvvvvvvvvvvvvv chhh! (tuner with blow-off) or mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm (RX-8) or bbrghrbgrhgrhhgrbhrbhrgbrgbhrghb (that crappy Plymouth K-car with a rusted-out muffler. You know the one.)
Seriously, try to imagine life with silent cars. I know some are extrememly annoying, like that Plymouth, but even without that you'd have nothing to laugh at while driving. Most people don't give a crap about sound or driving exitement, but I think most members of this forum do. I vote NO to nuke cars. And airplanes shouldn't get it either, unless they switch to flying wing designs, because the nuke would have to go in the fuselage and it'd take upa lot of seats.
 
keef
Power is nice. But 1,622,000 hp is a bit much. And it wouldn't make any noise. None. Can you imagine how boring Gran Turismo, or just driving in general, would be without any...
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I agree. I was being silly. For my opinion on alternative fuel vehicles needing the sounds check the Sorry We Used All Your Oil thread.

bbrghrbgrhgrhhgrbhrbhrgbrgbhrghb (that crappy Plymouth K-car with a rusted-out muffler. You know the one.)
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Are you talking about the Plymouth Horizon/Dodge Omni? I had a 1985 Horizon as my first car. The rusted out muffler fell of and blew out my rear passenger tire in one move. Ah, the good ol' days.

Seriously, try to imagine life with silent cars. I know some are extrememly annoying, like that Plymouth, but even without that you'd have nothing to laugh at while driving. Most people don't give a crap about sound or driving exitement, but I think most members of this forum do.
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I agree sound is definitely important in a car and if I can't hear a rev I am unhappy. My brother thinks it is showing off by letting his Prius run silently.

That reminds me, I saw Failure to Launch (I'm married. What can you do?) and the only thing that really got me laughing was when his friend drove his Prius up behind him slowly so the engine shut off and was only using the electric motor and then clipped his leg with the bumper.



However I am sure they could find a way for a nuclear powered car or plane to make noise. The goal would be to have a generator extremely small, although I believe that to be highly unlikely. They could have the engine combining oxygen and hydrogen to make water in a way to make an explosive noise. I've seen it done in a lab and the sound was pretty loud.
 

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