[POLL] United States Presidential Elections 2016

[CodeRedR51]

As I have stated over my two posts on the matter, we have one presidential front runner who DID leak classified materials in Hillary Clinton, and is not being properly investigated for the matter, and you have one front runner who said open sourced materials being targeted like a criminal in Ted Cruz. The biggest benefactor in all of this is Marco Rubio, who just so happened to have Senator Burr on speed dial most likely, and will issue attack ads against Cruz on the subject VERY shortly.

The fact that NONE of the NSA official's testimony was either classified nor redacted really does speak on Rubio's problem, actually. This whole gambit will most likely backfire.

Anyone find this mess, absolutely hilarious? These people are trying to run this country...

 

[Johnnypenso]

Anyone find this mess, absolutely hilarious? These people are trying to run this country...

These people actually are running the country:
December 16th John Kerry says U.S. not seeking regime change in Lybia

Secretary of State John F. Kerry made headlines Tuesday by asserting after meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin that the U.S. and its allies “are not seeking so-called regime change” in Syria — a departure from years of rhetoric from President Obama and other top U.S. officials demanding Mr. Assad’s ouster. Many saw Mr. Kerry’s remarks as a recognition of the key role of Mr. Putin, whose military forces have escalated their support for the regime in Syria.

December 17th the U.S. Ambassador to the U.N. says Assad has to go

On Wednesday, U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Samantha Power seemed to walk back Mr. Kerry’s comments, asserting that the administration’s position on Mr. Assad has not changed.

“There is going to have to be a political transition and Assad will have to go,” Ms. Power said in New York, where Friday’s meeting of the International Syrian Support Group...

 

[Swagger897]

These people actually are running the country:
December 16th John Kerry says U.S. not seeking regime change in Lybia

December 17th the U.S. Ambassador to the U.N. says Assad has to go

She's needs smitted..

 

[A2K78]

Along with Clinton and Sanders this poll pretty much demonstrate how clueless the average American is about the Federal Reserve. And for the record, the Fed should've raise the rate not only a long time ago, but in reality allow rates to rise.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/12/16/americans-views-of-fed-depend-on-their-politics/

and for the record, Bernie Sanders is completely wrong....

http://www.commondreams.org/news/20...calls-fed-rate-hike-bad-news-working-families

right now its only bad for the average American because the Fed completely distorted the market with its stupid manipulation of the interest rates.

 

[Swagger897]

Along with Clinton and Sanders this poll pretty much demonstrate how clueless the average American is about the Federal Reserve. And for the record, the Fed should've raise the rate not only a long time ago, but in reality allow rates to rise.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/12/16/americans-views-of-fed-depend-on-their-politics/

and for the record, Bernie Sanders is completely wrong....

http://www.commondreams.org/news/20...calls-fed-rate-hike-bad-news-working-families

right now its only bad for the average American because the Fed completely distorted the market with its stupid manipulation of the interest rates.

He's doing that to get votes. The sentiment right now is to feel like America is crap, when the numbers don't lie, and in fact show the opposite. There are far greater things going on right now, then what few individuals whose complaints reach millions.

 

[Sanji Himura]

The first post-debate polling is up:

National
Source: PPP (D)
Trump: 34%
Cruz: 18%
Rubio: 13%
Bush: 7%
Carson: 6%
Christie: 5%
Fiorina: 4%
Huckabee: 4%
Kasich: 2%
Paul: 2%
Graham: 1%
Santorum: 1%
Pataki: 0%

Polling method: Likely Republican Voters (Poll Results Here .PDF Warning)

New Hampshire
Source: Boston Herald
Trump: 26%
Cruz: 12%
Rubio: 12%
Christie: 11%
Bush: 10%
Kasich: 8%
Fiorina: 6%
Carson: 5%
Paul: 3%
Huckabee: 0%
Graham: 0%
Santorum: 0%
Pataki: 0%

Polling Method: Likely Republican Voters (Poll results here. .pdf warning)

 

[TenEightyOne]

The first post-debate polling is up

Cruz looks very strong there, especially held against a Trump. Bush looks far weaker there than I expected.

If the Republicans don't choose to have a big Trump (and I find it hard to imagine they would) then Cruz would be the front-runner if those figures extrapolated*, surely?

*Admittedly only about 500 samples in the PPP figures

 

[Sanji Himura]

Actually, you don't have to guess. One of the questions in the PPP poll, flat out gives you the choice between Ted Cruz and Donald Trump and asks you to pick. Even though Cruz is trailing under those circumstances by a point (well within any conceivable margin of error), there are 16% undecided between the two.

EDIT: I may have spotted the issue within the PPP poll. The last question asking for the respondent's age.

18-45: 23%
46-65: 47%
65+: 31%

This could be a big drain on the Republicans come November again. They are not getting the youth vote.

 

[TenEightyOne]

This could be a big drain on the Republicans come November again. They are not getting the youth vote.

Although... that part of the survey is pre-determined by who's selected to question (or by who chooses to respond), it isn't necessarily a gauge of the interest in voting.

One of the questions in the PPP poll, flat out gives you the choice between Ted Cruz and Donald Trump and asks you to pick.

That was one of the points I was referring to. If Trump isn't considered as a candidate then the remainder of the figures (seemingly) put Cruz in a very positive position.

 

[Danoff]

This could be a big drain on the Republicans come November again. They are not getting the youth vote.

They never do. Most voters are older though. 18-30, for example, most of whom don't bother to vote, is a substantially smaller pool than 30-100, many of whom vote with a passion.

 

[Sanji Himura]

Sanders campaign caught stealing private Hillary Clinton campaign data. DNC suspends Sanders from accessing his own database. Sanders sues DNC in federal court. The aid responsible? Admitted to the theft:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/18/polit...dnc-suspension0809AMStoryLink&linkId=19691240

$.02: This is interesting, especially since that Sanders is leading in New Hampshire, and is perceived as the more trustworthy candidate (as CNN points out). Can the perception change for Sanders change now that he was caught in a Watergate-like scandal?

 

[Johnnypenso]

Sanders campaign caught stealing private Hillary Clinton campaign data. DNC suspends Sanders from accessing his own database. Sanders sues DNC in federal court. The aid responsible? Admitted to the theft:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/18/polit...dnc-suspension0809AMStoryLink&linkId=19691240

$.02: This is interesting, especially since that Sanders is leading in New Hampshire, and is perceived as the more trustworthy candidate (as CNN points out). Can the perception change for Sanders change now that he was caught in a Watergate-like scandal?

"I am certainly unaware and without question would never condone such behaviour among my campaign staff. Any actions, be they illegal or otherwise, that involved the unauthorized access to data, was done without my knowledge." - Future statement from Bernie Sanders

 

[CodeRedR51]

Sanders campaign caught stealing private Hillary Clinton campaign data. DNC suspends Sanders from accessing his own database. Sanders sues DNC in federal court. The aid responsible? Admitted to the theft:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/18/polit...dnc-suspension0809AMStoryLink&linkId=19691240

$.02: This is interesting, especially since that Sanders is leading in New Hampshire, and is perceived as the more trustworthy candidate (as CNN points out). Can the perception change for Sanders change now that he was caught in a Watergate-like scandal?

The person responsible was fire immediately. Sucks, but doesn't change my perception of the guy.

 

[Johnnypenso]

The person responsible was fire immediately. Sucks, but doesn't change my perception of the guy.

The guy that was fired also said,

Josh Uretsky, Sanders' national data director who was fired Thursday by the campaign for accessing the database, told CNN Friday that he was not trying to look at Clinton's data and denied that voter file information had been downloaded. "We knew there was a security breach in the data, and we were just trying to understand it and what was happening," Uretsky said. He said that none of the data the Sanders campaign accessed on Wednesday "left the system that day" and denied that he or his staff "downloaded any individual level voter file data."

So the guy who was fired denies all the accusations leveled at him and now has no access to the information to be able to clear his name. Is that what we can look forward to with a President Sanders? Being fired for political reasons and not given any chance to clear your name, potentially ruining the rest of your career? If Sanders was really for the "little guy" as he claims, he should have suspended this guy with pay until a full investigation was completed. Instead he makes the same decision that any Republican or Democrat would make.

 

[HELLAFLUSH240SX]

Sanders campaign caught stealing private Hillary Clinton campaign data. DNC suspends Sanders from accessing his own database. Sanders sues DNC in federal court. The aid responsible? Admitted to the theft:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/18/polit...dnc-suspension0809AMStoryLink&linkId=19691240

$.02: This is interesting, especially since that Sanders is leading in New Hampshire, and is perceived as the more trustworthy candidate (as CNN points out). Can the perception change for Sanders change now that he was caught in a Watergate-like scandal?

Terrible choice of words as you make it seem like they broke in to get info on Hilary voters. The database was opened for everyone to look at everyone's info and they just so happened to look at Hilary's data. You can't even prove Bernie told them to do so nor did zbernie do it himself. If Bernie loses to Hilary, she will win the presidency no doubt. The woman card is just too large and she says things that make her seem more progressive than she is.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Terrible choice of words as you make it seem like they broke in to get info on Hilary voters. The database was opened for everyone to look at everyone's info and they just so happened to look at Hilary's data. You can't even prove Bernie told them to do so nor did zbernie do it himself. If Bernie loses to Hilary, she will win the presidency no doubt. The woman card is just too large and she says things that make her seem more progressive than she is.

What do you think would happen if the "woman card" was out of the picture and it was Hillary vs. Carly?

 

[Swagger897]

What do you think would happen if the "woman card" was out of the picture and it was Hillary vs. Carly?

Hillary would still win it just due to her popularity and the name is registered with every voter just about...

 

[TenEightyOne]

The woman card is just too large

That seems a strangely dismissive thing to say when you consider that 50% of the US population have never been represented by somebody of their own gender.

 

[Sanji Himura]

Terrible choice of words as you make it seem like they broke in to get info on Hilary voters. The database was opened for everyone to look at everyone's info and they just so happened to look at Hilary's data. You can't even prove Bernie told them to do so nor did zbernie do it himself. If Bernie loses to Hilary, she will win the presidency no doubt. The woman card is just too large and she says things that make her seem more progressive than she is.

You misread my entire post. I didn't say that Bernie himself ordered the theft, just that his campaign was caught stealing data. The man responsible was fired like a hot political potato, the campaign was suspended from accessing its own database by the DNC, and that should be the end of it. It was the Sanders campaign that made it a federal court case.

 

[Swagger897]

stealing data

Still, nothing was stolen.

 

[Robin]

Edit

 

[Adamgp]

Lindsey Graham is out:

https://www.yahoo.com/politics/lindsey-graham-drops-out-of-2016-race-144556467.html

 

[Sanji Himura]

That was unexpected, but predictable. He is going to try to retain his Senate Seat.

 

[Sanji Himura]

Still, nothing was stolen.

According to documents obtained by ABC News, at least four Sanders campaign staffers accessed Clinton's data and saved it during the two months that the Sanders campaign said that the glitch had occurred.

If the Sanders campaign used that data improperly, it's theft.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/dnc-...ans-bernie-sanders-campaign/story?id=35841222

 

[TenEightyOne]

According to documents obtained by ABC News, at least four Sanders campaign staffers accessed Clinton's data and saved it during the two months that the Sanders campaign said that the glitch had occurred.

If the Sanders campaign used that data improperly, it's theft.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/dnc-...ans-bernie-sanders-campaign/story?id=35841222

This is all an odd story. The DNC admit that a mistake in the database software (more likely in the privs setup, actually) allowed the cross-campaign viewing of data. Sanders' campaign was one of those that reported the problem to the DNC. The basic voter data for each "Clinton" entry was viewable by every other campaign (and vice versa), the viewing of further data is down to the "mistake" by NGP. That's all in your link.

If the Sanders campaign used that data improperly (as you note), it's theft. Simply seeing, using or acting otherwise upon the data in the context of the Sanders campaign would not be theft. That's the case in law and, undoubtedly, in the NGP contract and the disclaimer used in the data collection.

You seem determined to prove that this was a criminal act of some kind but circumstances have to go way beyond the current situation (eg data theft, financial fraud) for the use of this data to be criminal.

 

[Sanji Himura]

This is all an odd story. The DNC admit that a mistake in the database software (more likely in the privs setup, actually) allowed the cross-campaign viewing of data. Sanders' campaign was one of those that reported the problem to the DNC. The basic voter data for each "Clinton" entry was viewable by every other campaign (and vice versa), the viewing of further data is down to the "mistake" by NGP. That's all in your link.

If the Sanders campaign used that data improperly (as you note), it's theft. Simply seeing, using or acting otherwise upon the data in the context of the Sanders campaign would not be theft. That's the case in law and, undoubtedly, in the NGP contract and the disclaimer used in the data collection.

You seem determined to prove that this was a criminal act of some kind but circumstances have to go way beyond the current situation (eg data theft, financial fraud) for the use of this data to be criminal.

Not at all. Sanders is claiming to run a pretty clean campaign here. I'm just proving that when given the opportunity, Sanders is as big of a hypocrite as the rest of them.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Not at all. Sanders is claiming to run a pretty clean campaign here. I'm just proving that when given the opportunity, Sanders is as big of a hypocrite as the rest of them.

So he hasn't stolen anything? I'd add that it seems unlikely that only his staffers were tempted to look at the data when it was opened up to all campaigns.

 

[Sanji Himura]

Fox Business Debate Details Post:

The upcoming debate to be held on FOX Business network revealed this evening their qualifications to make the "Adult Table" debate. To make the cut, a candidate must place in the top six nationally OR place in the top five in Iowa or New Hampshire. All polling data would be based on the five most recent polls recognized by FOX News.

To qualify for the "Kiddie Table", a candidate must register at least one percent in any of the five most recent national polls.

According to Politico, if the debate were to be held at post time, the tables would be set like this:

[Adult Table]
Donald Trump
Ted Cruz
Marco Rubio
Ben Carson
Jeb Bush
Chris Christie

[Kiddie Table]
Rand Paul
Jon Kasich
Carly Fiorina
Mike Huckabee
Rick Santorum
George Pataki

 

[Swagger897]

please, Chris needs to be rolled off the stage....

 

[huskeR32]

Whether your claim that "it isn't being properly investigated" is true or not

It isn't.

This is going to go down the same road that Benghazi did; when investigations don't turn up what the right-wing masses hope to find, they just declare the investigation faulty and scream for a redo. It's getting old.

--

Not at all. Sanders is claiming to run a pretty clean campaign here. I'm just proving...

Let's be clear: you're not proving anything, you're speculating.

...that when given the opportunity, Sanders is as big of a hypocrite as the rest of them.

IF the data was used improperly and IF Bernie explicitly ordered it done, then sure. As the facts currently sit, neither of those IFs have been anywhere near conclusively shown. So at the moment, the "hypocrisy" you seem so desperate to pin on him doesn't really exist.